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Forza Horizon demo impressions

Shaneus

Member
All things considered though, this is still a much better time for me than TDU and TDU2, but I did expected more Forza to shine through, especially with all assists off. So yeah, disappointed, but it seems like an excellent game in its own right.
Pretty much. I was expecting an obvious connection between Forza Motorsport and Forza Horizon, but it seems like the only thing connecting them is the name and car models. If it was genuinely the FM feel but with an open environment (or even a slightly restricted "open" one like Horizon or Burnout Paradise) I would've been pretty well fine with it. But the issue people have with sound is like a metaphor (or simile) for the whole package... it just feels muted and without any real connection compared to FM4.
I suppose I have different standards with open world racers with longer straighter tracks. I found it to be pretty easy to take corners in the demo and would say I liked the handling. The last game I remember (like this) that had what I consider to be bad handling was NFS hot pursuit. I found it hard to take the tighter corners and react to stuff.

I don't feel any need to compare it to Forza 4 as it's a totally different type of game. That might not be the right attitude (maybe I should be holding the devs to a higher standard) but I've played most of the sims and more arcadey racers and that is the criteria I've subconsciously developed.
I was comparing it because all indications leading up to the game's release indicated that they were basically borrowing the entire driving/physics/tyre model from FM4, adding 50 new surfaces (or whatever) and making it "open" world. Make it casual by integrating the festival feel, but turn casual gamers into car lovers by having the driving be as realistic as possible.
Normally I wouldn't think of expecting an open-world game to have something close to realistic, but the game was begging for it. That it's turned into another title that appeals in no way whatsoever to appreciators of realism gives me another reason to skip it completely.

I've also seen some fanboys (on other forums - and I mean fanboys in the sense that they are saying anyone with anything negative to say is basically a dickhead :/ )) say it is basically TDU with great handling. While I never got on with the handling in the TDU games, they at least feel properly open. This game feels incredibly restrictive compared to TDU.

For example, the advertising hoardings you can hit. I would have much preferred them hiding things behind houses etc and having to actually go find them.
I've found the closest game to compare it to is Burnout Paradise. But even then, even though there's the same amount of restriction relative to the environment size as Horizon, it doesn't feel as restrictive because the vast majority of the game is set in metropolotain areas... not the countryside where there are rolling hills that just BEG to be driven over.
 
I was comparing it because all indications leading up to the game's release indicated that they were basically borrowing the entire driving/physics/tyre model from FM4, adding 50 new surfaces (or whatever) and making it "open" world. Make it casual by integrating the festival feel, but turn casual gamers into car lovers by having the driving be as realistic as possible.
Normally I wouldn't think of expecting an open-world game to have something close to realistic, but the game was begging for it. That it's turned into another title that appeals in no way whatsoever to appreciators of realism gives me another reason to skip it completely.
Exactly. I actually really dig this game and will have no problem picking it up (have had it pre-ordered forever now), but the reason I thought it was going to be Forza 4 physics in an open world (or the open road) is because every single one of the dev interviews and videos described it that way. Even the latest dev diary brings up the physics half a dozen times.

But yeah, if I pretend its a second cousin to Forza (and squint a bit) I can see some genetic resemblance. Regardless, I'm digging it. You have a reason to use the brakes, you get cockpit view and a manual gearbox, drifting is easier than Forza 4 but not without its own risks, we get a day/night cycle, dirt and lush environments (and filled with little touches like the falling leaves and flocks of birds) and a nice mix of closed events and free roaming goodness. It seems big enough to allow you some nice free roams, but small enough to allow you to learn areas intimately. I'll have to play some more of the retail game to see whether I end up feeling too restricted, but so far it feels OK size-wise and fucking stellar for an "arcade" racer. I'm in.

One thing I think should be standard in open world games is to name your streets and roads. Give us the option to have text as we get on a road or trail or enter a city or farm that names the place for us. Think GTA4 and Burnout Paradise. It makes it easier to keep track of things and navigate for the player, while also making it easier to talk about the game and locations on places like GAF or between friends online. Its seemingly a low hanging fruit that carries a lot of upsides, and I don't know why I don't see more of it, especially here.
 

mujun

Member
Exactly. I actually really dig this game and will have no problem picking it up (have had it pre-ordered forever now), but the reason I thought it was going to be Forza 4 physics in an open world (or the open road) is because every single one of the dev interviews and videos described it that way. Even the latest dev diary brings up the physics half a dozen times.

I have to admit I'm pretty much numb to what people say in dev diaries and other such marketing.

A bad thing, I know :p
 

Mascot

Member
Quick comments as I'm late for work:

Tried the demo last night and found it a bit boring, to be honest. The 'race' against the plane was mildly interesting, but as we know it's not really a race, it's a time trial that happens to have a plane occasionally buzzing you. Maybe the full game has better variety, but I found myself missing the cop chases, spike strips and EMPs from NFS and the fuck-off collapsible buildings in Split/Second. I know Horizon isn't supposed to compete with those OTT arcade racers, but it is still an arcade racer so comparisons are inevitable, and Horizon feels a bit empty because of it.

Handling was OK, a bit floaty, a bit lacking sensation of weight and grip, but still above average for an arcade racer.

A lot of comments about the graphics are a little puzzling as well. AA is nice, but overall the game has a very cartoony look to me. I was half expecting to see Wile E Coyote jump out from behind one of the orange rocks. There's some awful LOD pop-in on occasion as well. And don't get me started on whether 30fps can ever look as good as 60.

Car sounds were totally underwhelming too. Very disappointing, especially with Nick Wiswell at the controls. I guess the producers wanted the emphasis to be on the music, but it's a shame the muffled car sounds don't sharpen and beef up when the music is (inevitably) turned off.

So: not terribly impressed, to be honest. And I'm still at a loss why the Forza brand is being plastered all over Horizon, apart from the obvious cash-in reasons. I'll pick this up in a few months for £15, but the demo confirmed my suspicions that Most Wanted has me Most Interested.
 

Reiko

Banned
Quick comments as I'm late for work:

Tried the demo last night and found it a bit boring, to be honest. The 'race' against the plane was mildly interesting, but as we know it's not really a race, it's a time trial that happens to have a plane occasionally buzzing you. Maybe the full game has better variety, but I found myself missing the cop chases, spike strips and EMPs from NFS and the fuck-off collapsible buildings in Split/Second. I know Horizon isn't supposed to compete with those OTT arcade racers, but it is still an arcade racer so comparisons are inevitable, and Horizon feels a bit empty because of it.

Handling was OK, a bit floaty, a bit lacking sensation of weight and grip, but still above average for an arcade racer.

A lot of comments about the graphics are a little puzzling as well. AA is nice, but overall the game has a very cartoony look to me. I was half expecting to see Wile E Coyote jump out from behind one of the orange rocks. There's some awful LOD pop-in on occasion as well. And don't get me started on whether 30fps can ever look as good as 60.

Car sounds were totally underwhelming too. Very disappointing, especially with Nick Wiswell at the controls. I guess the producers wanted the emphasis to be on the music, but it's a shame the muffled car sounds don't sharpen and beef up when the music is (inevitably) turned off.

So: not terribly impressed, to be honest. And I'm still at a loss why the Forza brand is being plastered all over Horizon, apart from the obvious cash-in reasons. I'll pick this up in a few months for £15, but the demo confirmed my suspicions that Most Wanted has me Most Interested.

I think it's the bloom, piss filter, and saturated colors adding to the cartoon look.
 
Quick comments as I'm late for work:

Tried the demo last night and found it a bit boring, to be honest. The 'race' against the plane was mildly interesting, but as we know it's not really a race, it's a time trial that happens to have a plane occasionally buzzing you. Maybe the full game has better variety, but I found myself missing the cop chases, spike strips and EMPs from NFS and the fuck-off collapsible buildings in Split/Second. I know Horizon isn't supposed to compete with those OTT arcade racers, but it is still an arcade racer so comparisons are inevitable, and Horizon feels a bit empty because of it.

Handling was OK, a bit floaty, a bit lacking sensation of weight and grip, but still above average for an arcade racer.

A lot of comments about the graphics are a little puzzling as well. AA is nice, but overall the game has a very cartoony look to me. I was half expecting to see Wile E Coyote jump out from behind one of the orange rocks. There's some awful LOD pop-in on occasion as well. And don't get me started on whether 30fps can ever look as good as 60.
Car sounds were totally underwhelming too. Very disappointing, especially with Nick Wiswell at the controls. I guess the producers wanted the emphasis to be on the music, but it's a shame the muffled car sounds don't sharpen and beef up when the music is (inevitably) turned off.

So: not terribly impressed, to be honest. And I'm still at a loss why the Forza brand is being plastered all over Horizon, apart from the obvious cash-in reasons. I'll pick this up in a few months for £15, but the demo confirmed my suspicions that Most Wanted has me Most Interested.

Hope your buying your NFS on PC, all the console demos have looked pretty choppy.
 

Arucardo

Member
I started the game at 900 (SEN OFF) but down to SEN 720 to have a better conrol, especially on gravel

Aren't 900 and SEN OFF two different things? Unless something's changed on the 360 mode with the latest beta firmware you're supposed to do this:

Start the 360 with the power button first, then sync the wheel with the SEN set to 900 (not OFF, it's used on PC so it doesn't interfere with the steering range set from the driver level). Then when you're in-game you can decrease the range for quicker steering. This is how it worked in F4 at least.
 

Majanew

Banned
Really don't know why they felt the need to stick the Forza name on this.

Game is ok, but I need to read up on what the full game offers as far as modes go. The graphics are great and jaggy free. The lighting is much better than FM4, but the car audio is as weak as FM4. Seriously, I use a 7.1 receiver, and once again, the engines sound weak because my subwoofer goes unloved.
 

Mascot

Member
Really don't know why they felt the need to stick the Forza name on this.

Game is ok, but I need to read up on what the full game offers as far as modes go. The graphics are great and jaggy free. The lighting is much better than FM4, but the car audio is as weak as FM4. Seriously, I use a 7.1 receiver, and once again, the engines sound weak because my subwoofer goes unloved.
I totally disagree about the lighting looking better that FM4. It looked very flat to me, especially at night.
 

Krilekk

Banned
Pardon my language, but someone's gotta tell Helios so he can tell T10/PG:

99% OF EUROPEAN CAR OWNERS/ENTHUSIASTS USE HORSEPOWER, FOR FUCK'S SAKE!

STOP! USING! KW! IN! YOUR! GAMES! YOU! DUMB! TWATS!

The European Union banned the use of HP some years ago, KW is correct.
 

Majanew

Banned
I totally disagree about the lighting looking better that FM4. It looked very flat to me, especially at night.

FM4's lighting looks too unnatural and the contrast is off. And there's no night racing in FM4 to compare. ;)
Plus, FH has some godray love going on.
 

Reiko

Banned
FM4's lighting looks too unnatural and the contrast is off. And there's no night racing in FM4 to compare. ;)
Plus, FH has some godray love going on.

Man I wish we would get a glimpse of FM5 soon. 60fps Night Racing done right with no compromise.
 

pswii60

Member
there's nothing I loathe more than a 30FPS racing game.

This. Many games benefit from 60fps, but there are three genres where 30fps is a huge no-no IMO: 2D platformers, fighting games and racing games. It's why I never touch a Codemasters console racing game.

Having said that, I'm yet to try this demo. It's downloading now and I'll be open minded.
 

Mascot

Member
Sorry, forgot to mention earlier: even if the audio, lighting, graphics, handling, FFB, event variety, map size, free roaming etc etc were all absolutely perfect, the RUBBER-fucking-BANDING would still kill this stone-cold dead for me. It's HORRENDOUS. Mario Kart's lawyers must be wringing their hands with glee.
 

Reiko

Banned
This. Many games benefit from 60fps, but there are three genres where 30fps is a huge no-no IMO: 2D platformers, fighting games and racing games. It's why I never touch a Codemasters console racing game.

Having said that, I'm yet to try this demo. It's downloading now and I'll be open minded.

You're missing out on one of the greatest racers this gen... PGR4.

The fidelity in the environments is still unmatched.

30fps is good when done right with motion blur.
 

kyo27

Member
FM4's lighting looks too unnatural and the contrast is off. And there's no night racing in FM4 to compare. ;)
Plus, FH has some godray love going on.

The lighting in FM4 looks much more dynamic. Horizon looks a bit flat in that department, especially in the cockpit view. I agree with the other person who said the game looks cartoony. Its similar to the visual style in PGR games that gave that a slightly cartoony look. The only visual advantage it has over FM4 is the AA.
 

Arucardo

Member
You're missing out on one of the greatest racers this gen... PGR4.

The fidelity in the environments is still unmatched.

30fps is good when done right with motion blur.

I'm used to having 120 fps/hz in most games now and I still don't go apeshit over 30fps games, even when it's a racing game. I'm much more bothered by lack of anti aliasing and screen tearing.

Ofc if there's a choice to be made I'll go with PC 100% of the time but if a current gen console exclusive racing game decides to go for 30 fps it's not an instant deal breaker for me.
 

TJP

Member
Tried the demo for well over an hour; FH looks much like Dirt 3, party/race atmosphere akin to Dirt 2, handling is fine for an open world arcade racer and the audio sadly is very subdued especially the engine even with the radio turned down. Overall I found the demo gameplay not gripping enough for me to buy at release but I'm sure it'll sell rather well.

You're missing out on one of the greatest racers this gen... PGR4. The fidelity in the environments is still unmatched.
I like this post very much and agree 1,000,000 %.
 

jyoung188

Member
Sorry, forgot to mention earlier: even if the audio, lighting, graphics, handling, FFB, event variety, map size, free roaming etc etc were all absolutely perfect, the RUBBER-fucking-BANDING would still kill this stone-cold dead for me. It's HORRENDOUS. Mario Kart's lawyers must be wringing their hands with glee.

Well, that's all I needed to read, it looks like I'll be skipping this. I fucking hate rubber banding.
 

Mascot

Member
Did anyone else find that the muted engine sounds made it hard to judge exactly when to change gear? The lack of aural atmosphere is bad enough, but there are also good practical reasons why the sound needs tweaking in this department.
Edit: maybe the devs assume the vast majority of people use automatic gears in arcade racers, which is probably true.
 

KaYotiX

Banned
Man I wish we would get a glimpse of FM5 soon. 60fps Night Racing done right with no compromise.

im guessing it will be at E3 with the new Xbox. Prolly a launch window game.

ANyways, Horizons is pretty good. Enjoying the demo alot. This and NFS will be the only racers this year on my plate.
 

Arucardo

Member
Well, that's all I needed to read, it looks like I'll be skipping this. I fucking hate rubber banding.

Really? This one thing that's been in EVERY arcade racer (I'd love to get examples of successful games this gen that didn't have it) this gen is enough to make you skip it without considering the rest of it?

Also, in most cases demos tend to have easier AI than the final game (makes the rubber banding more obvious)
 

Mascot

Member
Tiny detail, but one that jumped out at me: if you are going to show close-up views of the speed cameras, then at least have models that do them justice. The low-poly ones in FH are pulled straight from a PSOne game.

Yeah, I know - nitpicking now. But they were quite jarring.
 

Majanew

Banned
You're missing out on one of the greatest racers this gen... PGR4.

The fidelity in the environments is still unmatched.

30fps is good when done right with motion blur.
The motion blur is one of the things I hated about PGR4. The way it causes that shimmering kind of effect on the environment when turning got on my nerves. Ugh, thinking about that crap will make me go on an anti-motion blur rant. 30fps is blurry enough, no need adding even more blurring.

I'll probably pick up Horizon when it's $20. Unless Xbox 8 is out by time that happens -- then I won't care about this gen anymore. :p
 

saladine1

Junior Member
Finally got to play the demo..thoughts

Handling......is great!
I don't know where the floaty complaints come from but I don't agree and the cars feel weighty, at least compared to other games out there. It's familiar with some tweaks for the better. The handbrake is responsive, more-so than in FM4 imo.
The rumble is very low. Needs to be stronger especially whilst transitioning from asphalt to dirt. Needs more rumble whilst on dirt too..

Graphics are awesome. Looks very pretty. The backdrops/vistas look pleasing,reminds me of the vistas in NFS Run. Cars in Autoshow look beautiful as well.
The headlight effects at night are nicely done, although the actual night sky isn't the best imo.
UI is slick, obviously Dirt like, which isn't bad in anyway.
I really like the crowds,cameramen,girls, confetti, and all the rest of the effects that add to the immersion to the festival feeling, nicely done.

The difficulty options are so welcome. There's nothing worse than feeling like your the only person racing. Horizon feels much better in that regard compared to FM4.
The racing was fun and the open road is a breath of fresh air.

Sound is FM but toned down way too much. I understand that they are trying to focus on the music and such but DAMN, needs more volume!
It's muted beyond belief especially when other cars are around.
The aggressive down shifts are tamed, the high rpm scream from Fm4 is toned down.
The turbo spooling and BOV is low compared to NPC's. You can hear their cars spooling from a mile away!
In FM4, upgrades do raise the volume/aggressiveness of the audio so hopefully this is the case for Horizon.
Doppler effects sound a little better in Horizon and so does the reverb. Going through the tunnels sounded awesome!
I beg of you Playground Games/Turn 10, please raise the volumes of the cars. Give us some options to gain control over the mix. I beg of you!!!


If purists go into this game expecting absolute sim, the you will be disappointed. If you go in expecting satisfying handling, great visuals and a festival atmosphere to race in, then you will enjoy it.

All in all, a solid demo and definitely a buy.




PS. FIX THE SOUND.
 

derFeef

Member
Yea the engine sounds are really muffled, anyone tried fumbling around with tuner/sound settings? Maybe channels are missing, or something?

Mascot's really trying to tear this game a new one, lol.

What? you don't want those highly detailed reallife speedcameras?

speed-camera.jpg
 

Mascot

Member
Hope your buying your NFS on PC, all the console demos have looked pretty choppy.
That's disappointing to hear. I still don't understand why Criterion dropped the Burnout Paradise engine: rock-solid 60fps with total v-synch and full AA, loads of AI vehicles, gorgeous lighting, and coping with cities and open vistas with consummate ease. Hot Pursuit was such a visual downgrade.

Mascot's really trying to tear this game a new one, lol.
Lol, sorry..! I'll reign myself in a bit now.

What? you don't want those highly detailed reallife speedcameras?

speed-camera.jpg
Much better! ;)
 

GlamFM

Banned
Really liked the Demo. Day 1 for sure.

Only thing I am really disappointed in is the open world feeling.

I could cruise around in TDU2 for hours - this one, not so much.
 

Arucardo

Member
Lol, sorry..! I'll reign myself in a bit now.

Nah, don't worry about it. Valid criticism is always good for discussion and needs to happen for the devs to do something about it. (Unless it's Xanadu and his baiting, heh)

Really the only thing I'm worried about right now from all the impressions is the sound complaints but if the quality of the recording is there (which I'm sure it is since I highly doubt they reworked/re-recorded all the engine sounds and etc. from F4) it looks like something that could be fixed before launch or with a patch soon after release. Could be just a matter of boosting one channel of audio.
 

eso76

Member
Finally got to play the demo..thoughts

Handling......is great!
I don't know where the floaty complaints come from but I don't agree .

i think it's just the lack of rumble.
like i said earlier, it's not just a matter of intensity, it's the complete lack of any feedback when you expect your pad to vibrate.
Being used to Fm3 and 4 this is distracting, a huge part of the feeling that your car is connected to the ground is lost because of that.

Hopefully this can be patched in later.

unrelated: i'm not sure how well i want horizon to do saleswise.
I'm afraid it doing too well might make Microsoft think of keeping dirt and night racing exclusive to the new series, so that there's less overlapping between motorsports and horizon.
 

saladine1

Junior Member
i think it's just the lack of rumble.
like i said earlier, it's not just a matter of intensity, it's the complete lack of any feedback when you expect your pad to vibrate.
Being used to Fm3 and 4 this is distracting, a huge part of the feeling that your car is connected to the ground is lost because of that.

Hopefully this can be patched in later.

unrelated: i'm not sure how well i want horizon to do saleswise.
I'm afraid it doing too well might make Microsoft think of keeping dirt and night racing exclusive to the new series, so that there's less overlapping between motorsports and horizon.

There's no doubt that the feedback NEEDS to be fixed. It just doesn't feel right at all.

lol, it wouldn't surprise me if MS/Turn 10 do keep dirt,night exclusive to Horizon.
Seriously though, don't do it MS/Turn 10, just don't.
 

Mascot

Member
unrelated: i'm not sure how well i want horizon to do saleswise.
I'm afraid it doing too well might make Microsoft think of keeping dirt and night racing exclusive to the new series, so that there's less overlapping between motorsports and horizon.
Take it to extremes: if Horizon outsells FM4 for a fraction of the development budget (source: pure speculation, but I imagine FH was much cheaper to make) then MS might make the commercial decision to ditch Forza Motorsport altogether. Unlikely I guess, but a scary thought nonetheless.

I've no idea how FH is going to Metacritic. I'm guessing around 80%..?
 
You're missing out on one of the greatest racers this gen... PGR4.

The fidelity in the environments is still unmatched.

30fps is good when done right with motion blur.

I was very late to the 360 party, but I'm still playing PGR4. Definitely one of my favorite racing games I've ever played (and I'm old, so that goes back to Turbo on Colecovision).
 

Mascot

Member
I was very late to the 360 party, but I'm still playing PGR4. Definitely one of my favorite racing games I've ever played (and I'm old, so that goes back to Turbo on Colecovision).
As an Intellivision owner at the time, Colecovision looked like science fiction witchcraft to me. So jealous.
 

The_Monk

Member
I might play it just a little bit today but then I'm done. I wanna save it for the full game which is close to releasing so I can play it fresh.

Not playing any racing game for a while also helps me keeping a fresh game time when I play this, can't wait.

(Oh how crazy I would have gone if this game had rain, mud & snow...)
 

v1oz

Member
The game handles alot like Forza 4 with some tweaks to make it more of an arcade racer. The Forza games have always felt slippery like the cars have no weight to them. The handling is definitely not as tight as something like Burnout.

I like the trance/pop music soundtrack. Its a change from the typical rap or rock music we usually get in these trendy street racers.
 

eso76

Member
There's no doubt that the feedback NEEDS to be fixed. It just doesn't feel right at all.

lol, it wouldn't surprise me if MS/Turn 10 do keep dirt,night exclusive to Horizon.
Seriously though, don't do it MS/Turn 10, just don't.

i don't know, i can picture Dan saying that "night and dirt don't fit our vision of motorsport, who wants to race with such hazards when we can have a perfectly smooth tarmac and sunny days forever ! - oh, but if you happen to like them, then you should also buy that other game we co-develop with the folks at playground lol!-"
 
Take it to extremes: if Horizon outsells FM4 for a fraction of the development budget (source: pure speculation, but I imagine FH was much cheaper to make) then MS might make the commercial decision to ditch Forza Motorsport altogether. Unlikely I guess, but a scary thought nonetheless.

I've no idea how FH is going to Metacritic. I'm guessing around 80%..?

consider this though, without FM4, Horizon wouldn't be a fraction of FM4's budget because there wouldn't be any assets/code whatever to borrow from the Forza series.
 

The_Monk

Member
Another thing, with two weeks for the game to be released does fellow GAFFers believe that changes will be made? I mean how much can/will they change so close to the release date?

Maybe it's just me but it seems that it will not happen so close to the release date right? When is the game going Gold? Can we expect the demo to be the very final version of the game?
 

Mascot

Member
consider this though, without FM4, Horizon wouldn't be a fraction of FM4's budget because there wouldn't be any assets/code whatever to borrow from the Forza series.
There are no cars left to model - they've all been done already..! (except open wheelers, natch).
 

Reiko

Banned
i don't know, i can picture Dan saying that "night and dirt don't fit our vision of motorsport, who wants to race with such hazards when we can have a perfectly smooth tarmac and sunny days forever ! - oh, but if you happen to like them, then you should also buy that other game we co-develop with the folks at playground lol!-"


Come on... Turn 10 needs an incentive for gamers to differentiate FM4 from FM5.

Night racing and weather is an easy target. They no longer have the lack of ram and power excuse this time.
 

saladine1

Junior Member
Another thing, with two weeks for the game to be released does fellow GAFFers believe that changes will be made? I mean how much can/will they change so close to the release date?

Maybe it's just me but it seems that it will not happen so close to the release date right? When is the game going Gold? Can we expect the demo to be the very final version of the game?

They can easily patch in some tweaks post launch.
 
As an Intellivision owner at the time, Colecovision looked like science fiction witchcraft to me. So jealous.

LOL, it was definitely awesome. Plus, it had both Nintendo and Sega games before they had their own systems.

Back on topic, someone mentioned that this game reminded them of PGR4. I think I need to download the demo now.
 

diffusionx

Gold Member
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