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[F#A#Oo]

Who is at fault here?! Is it the retailers themselves, or have Nintendo not sent anything to them to use as POS or marketing?!

My sister works for Sainsbury and apparently there was next to nothing in marketing materials sent to her store (Ladbroke Grove, London).

Skylanders is being pushed big though apparently...

Also in terms of stocking the Wii U, her store received very low allocation...and it seemed to be more of the basic than premium. They still had a few basics all weekend apparently...and the demand was for the premium...which is kind of obvious I guess.

I think the UK as a whole got very small allocation...and it seems the basic is the SKU that is readily available...I mean Amazon UK didn't even sell-out of the basic right? When ever I checked it was Premium and Zombi U SKU's that were sold out.

 

[Pie and Beans]

So, as suspected, a drip feed of stock hoping for those "SOLD OUT" headlines that trash like MCV were already prepared to print before numbers were even a factor.

Except its backfired because its clearly not sold out. The same old tricks havent worked when people don't really give much of a mass market crap about this box yet.

 

[Bumhead]

a PS3 or 360 instead, and he said he will forward me the results so that will be interesting. Essentially he said a few locations are going to be doing questionnaires with PS3 12GB and Xbox 4GB buyers as to why they purchased those systems over a Wii U and asking Wii U purchasers why they bought a Wii U over a PS3/360.

Interesting, although I'm pretty sure price and value will feature prominently on a huge number of responses.

I can see the PS4 and 720 faring just as badly in terms of providing a price and value proposition, especially considering their expected higher price and the likelihood that both launching in Christmas 2013 will cannibalise their own sales. I think online, the importance on friends lists and social play, and ongoing franchises like FIFA and Call of Duty have dramatically changed the need to upgrade hardware. I think this generation has inflated expectations of just how many people are realistically in the market for new hardware, and a huge portion of the market that made the Wii, PS3 and 360 explode into a huge selling bubble is also more than happy to stick with their existing hardware and 2 or 3 £40 buys a year, rather than rush out for new hardware.

It's just an opinion, so who knows, everything could end up fine, but I suspect sales-age will have to seriously dial back its expectations for the upcoming gen. Especially around launch time.

 

[DSXBoy]

If Nintendo release a Wii U sports HD with online play, Sort out the slow menu and OS then I'll get a Wii U console. I am not interested in Wii fit U because it involves another peripheral (balance board), I want a sports game that uses just the Wii U Gamepad or the Wii remote plus.

 

[Neff]

Interestingly enough, saw this in the WiiU release thread.

Tesco done goofed

This alone will have impacted the UK sales noticably.

 

[grimshawish]

So, as suspected, a drip feed of stock hoping for those "SOLD OUT" headlines that trash like MCV were already prepared to print before numbers were even a factor.

Except its backfired because its clearly not sold out. The same old tricks havent worked when people don't really give much of a mass market crap about this box yet.

Yes. Nintendo did this with the Wii. Only reason Wii was successful.

Spoiler

We still doing this? Really?

EDIT: also on the lack of 'being in shop'.
http://www.play.com/ has a 3DS like launch for WiiU with nothing to suggest it is even out.
No WiiU section and no clear indication that the device is available. A quick search of their site shows it is available. Waste of time.

This won't really affect sales, not the best for marketing but more likely those shops sales; whilst Tesco shoppers might only pick up down the line.
Again none of this should affect the aggregate sales for the month - I would think.

Didn't say it was the only reason did I, so cool your sixshooter there Ace. Nintendo have done it quite a few times in the past (If I remember correctly, the N64 was some grade A bullshit), so have other hardware vendors, its a known added marketing tactic. Except it can backfire if even the small stock doesnt flash sell as has happened here.

Stocks have sold out. People don't comment on sell outs that much anymore; it is not a big marketing thing. Wii could have sold enormous amounts in its first year but it wasn't until the end that it really became available.

So no. I don't buy into this consipracy theory myself.

 

[Pie and Beans]

Yes. Nintendo did this with the Wii. Only reason Wii was successful.

Spoiler

We still doing this? Really?

Didn't say it was the only reason did I, so cool your sixshooter there Ace. Nintendo have done it quite a few times in the past (If I remember correctly, the N64 was some grade A bullshit), so have other hardware vendors, its a known added marketing tactic. Except it can backfire if even the first small stock batch doesnt flash sell fast enough as has happened here.

 

[zomgbbqftw]

So, as suspected, a drip feed of stock hoping for those "SOLD OUT" headlines that trash like MCV were already prepared to print before numbers were even a factor.

Except its backfired because its clearly not sold out. The same old tricks havent worked when people don't really give much of a mass market crap about this box yet.

Well it's worse than that, the Wii was drip fed because they just couldn't produce them fast enough. Back then Nintendo were geared up for ~ 7m shipments in the first year, they ended up shipping more than double the amount, getting that manufacturing online and into the channel is very difficult. From the day they ordered the units to meet the extra demand it would take 3 months to get the first units into western retailers by air freight and around 5 months by regular shipments. Nintendo were air freighting Wii shipments for around 3 months in the UK to meet demand!

 

[shinra-bansho]

So yeah I mean all I'm saying is its too early for some of the posts in this thread, or for the UK market to be used as a 'wider' point.
I agree my posts aren't saying anything new; am more just trying to keep clear facts/perspectives in the thread whilst giving my own view on things.

At the risk of also not saying anything new...

Simply the way I see it is, we know that demand was sufficient for at least 40K sales and supply was able to service that number. And while it was selling over the weekend, there hasn't been much to indicate it was sold out and generally unavailable to those that wanted it over the weekend.

So it's difficult to come to the ultimate conclusion that it would have sold substantially more if not for supply issues; when there are other issues (general awareness, state of the economy, etc.) that could have simply resulted in a more subdued launch.

It's probably too early for both positive and negative conclusions about the sales number to be drawn - but what are forums for if not drawing speculative armchair analysis/conclusions. And I guess I'm guilty of that too, erring on the side of skepticism.

 

[Pie and Beans]

Well it's worse than that, the Wii was drip fed because they just couldn't produce them fast enough. Back then Nintendo were geared up for ~ 7m shipments in the first year, they ended up shipping more than double the amount, getting that manufacturing online and into the channel is very difficult. From the day they ordered the units to meet the extra demand it would take 3 months to get the first units into western retailers by air freight and around 5 months by regular shipments. Nintendo were air freighting Wii shipments for around 3 months in the UK to meet demand!

Oh I remember it all well enough, certainly. The Wii was deffo more a case of manufacturing speed because Nintendo were hungry for that money when it was clear even before launch that demand was INSANE. Grown men running to E3 kiosks is dream product thirst scenario time.

Obviously however that isn't the case here when suddenly another 50,000 units materialise, because "oh we just hit the copy and paste button on the matter transmogrifier" in the same week.

 

[DSXBoy]

Originally Posted by Pie and Beans:
So, as suspected, a drip feed of stock hoping for those "SOLD OUT" headlines that trash like MCV were already prepared to print before numbers were even a factor.

Except its backfired because its clearly not sold out. The same old tricks havent worked when people don't really give much of a mass market crap about this box yet.
Yes. Nintendo did this with the Wii. Only reason Wii was successful.

Yes. Nintendo did this with the Wii. Only reason Wii was successful.

Spoiler

We still doing this? Really?

No!!!

The Wii was successful because it was easy for the casual gamer to use it's motion controlled Wii Remote with Wii Sports.
It was unique as the first home console with motion controls, plus Wii Fit came out when there was keep fit craze. For many it was a better option than paying £40 per month for the Gym.
Also it was an impulse buy at £179.99.

The shortages were caused because demand was huge, not the other way round.

 

[BGBW]

At least they got the headlines right?

 

[radcliff]

Can we have a thread dedicated to tracking what each studio is working on?

Game & Wario is 2013, which studio made that?

G&W is probably a collaboration between SPD 1 (Yoshi Sakamoto's group) and Intelligent Systems.

Wii U Sports will probably come from EAD 2 as they made Wii Sports and Wii Sports Resort.

Also, NST recently hired Hirokazu Yasuhara (Sonic co-creator) and according to our resident ninja, Nintendo has green-lit a game from NST.

 

[liger05]

Wait, in 2012 we still have people who still think Nintendo created some artificial demand for the Wii just to get headlines saying 'Wii sold out'?

 

[QaaQer]

Expected, but despicable.
This is one big cluster-fuck, expect departures a-plenty across the Nintendo board and PR teams over the next few months.

Not likely. Ninty is a Japanese company through and though.

 

[zomgbbqftw]

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=502618

Anyone doubting that the Wii U shortages are artificial should take a look at this thread. If they were having production shortages then they would be able to preload the patch very easily on newly shipped units. The reason they aren't is because they have a couple of million sitting in warehouses just outside of Shenzen and opening up the boxes to flash them would be very costly and time consuming.

 

[dc89]

My sister works for Sainsbury and apparently there was next to nothing in marketing materials sent to her store (Ladbroke Grove, London).

Skylanders is being pushed big though apparently...

Also in terms of stocking the Wii U, her store received very low allocation...and it seemed to be more of the basic than premium. They still had a few basics all weekend apparently...and the demand was for the premium...which is kind of obvious I guess.

I think the UK as a whole got very small allocation...and it seems the basic is the SKU that is readily available...I mean Amazon UK didn't even sell-out of the basic right? When ever I checked it was Premium and Zombi U SKU's that were sold out.

Yeah, there is an entire quarter of a fixture dedicated to Skylanders stuff in my local branch.

 

[PaulLFC]

Stocks have sold out. People don't comment on sell outs that much anymore; it is not a big marketing thing. Wii could have sold enormous amounts in its first year but it wasn't until the end that it really became available.

So no. I don't buy into this consipracy theory myself.

It depends on how you define "sold out". I'm sure it's sold out in some shops as in they have no stock, but demand certainly doesn't appear to be at PS2 / Wii levels (not that I expected it to be, far from it, but if they really did only ship 50k units I would have expected those to sell out given the numbers from past console launches).

 

[Haunted]

I would argue that the problem is that the Wii-U has all these 3rd party games for consoles that every harry, dick, and sally own. When the 360 launched, these were the first 'next-gen' games on the market. I think the PS3 faced a similar fate, but it may be compounded for the Wii-U based upon how established the market already is for these 3rd party titles.

TL;DR: No variety or uniqueness.

Yup, it's no coincidence that the 3 non-shovelware exclusives dominated the week 1 rankings.

People want new hardware for new games (ideally exclusives), not ports or multiplats.

 

[metalslimer]

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=502618

Anyone doubting that the Wii U shortages are artificial should take a look at this thread. If they were having production shortages then they would be able to preload the patch very easily on newly shipped units. The reason they aren't is because they have a couple of million sitting in warehouses just outside of Shenzen and opening up the boxes to flash them would be very costly and time consuming.

And here we go with this nonsense again. Hmm, or maybe instead flying into wild conspiracies they are just waiting until they actually hae everything in a much more stable state with the December update and probably a couple more future OS updates. But in you seem pretty invested in this idea.

 

[CrunchinJelly]

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=502618

Anyone doubting that the Wii U shortages are artificial should take a look at this thread. If they were having production shortages then they would be able to preload the patch very easily on newly shipped units. The reason they aren't is because they have a couple of million sitting in warehouses just outside of Shenzen and opening up the boxes to flash them would be very costly and time consuming.

It does seem odd how it's going to take a few months for the update to be included with the console.

You would think they would begin flashing the latest software immediately, so if they were selling through it should be available pretty soon.

 

[metalslimer]

If they begin flashing now, people are still going to have to download the December update. But of course they do have stock that's not going to Europe. There's a hefty amount that's being shipped to Japan. By the way I thought there was no shortage and it was all made up?

 

[Pie and Beans]

And here we go with this nonsense again. Hmm, or maybe instead flying into wild conspiracies they are just waiting until they actually hae everything in a much more stable state with the December update and probably a couple more future OS updates. But in you seem pretty invested in this idea.

You realise that the vanilla Wii U OS doesnt support Wii backwards compatibility right? Thats a pretty important part of the console, theyre gonna want that to be flashed onto boxes as fast as possible to avoid customer grumbles at 1gb updates or for the occasional eskimo, no net access.

The reasonable explanation is that they've made a large amount of stock already and thus can't pick through and reflash. The nutty explanation is they're sitting on their thumbs and just deciding not to flash current slow yet fully featured OS. But it is Nintendo, so could be either way!!

 

[PaulLFC]

And here we go with this nonsense again. Hmm, or maybe instead flying into wild conspiracies they are just waiting until they actually hae everything in a much more stable state with the December update and probably a couple more future OS updates. But in you seem pretty invested in this idea.

So you call zomg's post "nonsense" then present a theory of your own with no facts to back it up?

It seems quite logical that they must have stocks already produced, otherwise I see no reason for the update not to be included. Why on earth would they "wait until it's had more updates" before including the first update? Did you even read the OP of the thread he linked to?

 

[grimshawish]

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=502618

Anyone doubting that the Wii U shortages are artificial should take a look at this thread. If they were having production shortages then they would be able to preload the patch very easily on newly shipped units. The reason they aren't is because they have a couple of million sitting in warehouses just outside of Shenzen and opening up the boxes to flash them would be very costly and time consuming.

Obviously they have them in warehouses.
Shops don't have infinite amount of stock space; especially around Christmas.

Meanwhile those months of stock are from periods without any sales; production building up.
This is there to last those months.

 

[Yopis]

Everyone makes fun of the Vita sales because since launch it has tanked world wide and continues to shamble along with dire sales in every region, approaching a full year after launch.

The Wii U might yet do the same yet, and if it does people will make fun just as much, but Day One sales are an irrelevance to that either way. We just don't know how the U will do based even on these eyebrow-raisingly bad numbers.

Sad sales equal quality to so many people. Guess mcdonalds is the greatest place to eat in the world. Oh yeah cod is the highest quality game available in the world.

 

[metalslimer]

So you call zomg's post "nonsense" then present a theory of your own with no facts to back it up?

It seems quite logical that they must have stocks already produced, otherwise I see no reason for the update not to be included. Why on earth would they "wait until it's had more updates" before including the first update? Did you even read the OP of the thread he linked to?

The part of his post I thought was nonsense was the artificial shortage bullshit that gets propogated way too much around here. Yes they have made a lot of systems in storage, they have been making these things for months. Whether they get shipped to the UK or somewhere else is up to Nintendo to decide. With people saying there is massive amount of stock everywhere, the idea of a shortage seems crazy to begin with.

Sad sales equal quality to so many people. Guess mcdonalds is the greatest place to eat in the world. Oh yeah cod is the highest quality game available in the world.

What a new and witty post. I haven't seen this statement 10000000 times before.

 

[zomgbbqftw]

Obviously they have them in warehouses.
Shops don't have infinite amount of stock space; especially around Christmas.

Meanwhile those months of stock are from periods without any sales; production building up.
This is there to last those months.

I'm not saying it's a problem. I'm just pointing out that Nintendo crying shortages for poor sales is clearly bullshit. Any shortages at retail exist because Nintendo intended them to exist.

 

[PaulLFC]

The part of his post I thought was nonsense was the artificial shortage bullshit that gets propogated way too much around here. Yes they have made a lot of systems in storage, they have been making these things for months. Whether they get shipped to the UK or somewhere else is up to Nintendo to decide. With people saying there is massive amount of stock everywhere, the idea of a shortage seems crazy to begin with.

Going by reported numbers they sent the UK between 45,000 and 55,000 units. That is below even the launch sales figures of the vast majority of consoles, and reportedly was the entire stock. So they do appear to be restricting supply for one reason or another, and given that they likely have stocks since they aren't re-flashing the firmware for a while, it would seem that reason is an attempt to create demand and thus, headlines.

 

[metalslimer]

I'm not saying it's a problem. I'm just pointing out that Nintendo crying shortages for poor sales is clearly bullshit. Any shortages at retail exist because Nintendo intended them to exist.

Blame retailers not Nintendo then because they can't sell to retailers because they don't want them. I'm not even saying demand is strong.

Going by reported numbers they sent the UK between 45,000 and 55,000 units. That is below even the launch sales figures of the vast majority of consoles, and reportedly was the entire stock. So they do appear to be restricting supply for one reason or another, and given that they likely have stocks since they aren't re-flashing the firmware for a while, it would seem that reason is an attempt to create demand and thus, headlines.

Well obviously they sent more than that because apparently stock is overflowing out of every store.

 

[PaulLFC]

Well obviously they sent more than that because apparently stock is overflowing out of every store.

Or they sent the reported numbers but didn't sell through the stock. I said it was likely an attempt to create high demand, it doesn't mean the attempt worked.

 

[zomgbbqftw]

Blame retailers not Nintendo then because they can't sell to retailers because they don't want them. I'm not even saying demand is strong.

Retailers don't want them because demand is poor. Two of the three guys I spoke to said they had surplus stock and are considering delaying their reorders if sales don't pick up this week.

What I am trying to get across is that sales of 40,000 in the UK are poor, but the figure has nothing to do with production or stock shortages. The poor sales are because of a demand shortage not a supply shortage.

 

[farnham]

tbh my thought is that nintendo wants to sell big numbers in us and japan while europe is not on their priority list.

us is a big market and the first market where wiiu was launched.

in japan they have MH3GHD and DQX aside of mario wiiu and nintendo land so sales expectations are probably very high

 

[metalslimer]

Or they sent the reported numbers but didn't sell through the stock. I said it was likely an attempt to create high demand, it doesn't mean the attempt worked.

If they sent 55k the situation should basically be looking like a sellout right now.

tbh my thought is that nintendo wants to sell big numbers in us and japan while europe is not on their priority list.

Well it's obvious by now that the US is the number one priority. Apparently the advertising in Japan has barely started though.

 

[lunchwithyuzo]

2.5 - 1 is still a pretty pathetic attach rate. Wasn't the 360 around a 4 -1 ?

Dunno about UK, but for US NPD attach rates during launch week:

360: 3.8 - 1
Wii: 2.1 - 1 (NOT including Wii Sports, that would make it 3.1 - 1)
PS3: 1.2 - 1


Though you have to factor in 360, PS3 and Wii didn't also offer retail games digitally.

 

[PaulLFC]

If they sent 55k the situation should basically be looking like a sellout right now.

Why? It doesn't automatically sell units, it needs advertising, games, appeal, lots of factors contribute to a sale.

Evidently that mix isn't enticing enough yet to sell much more than around 40k units by estimates.

 

[Psychotext]

Informed Nintendo fans alone should easily cover those sorts of numbers.

 

[F#A#Oo]

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=502618

Anyone doubting that the Wii U shortages are artificial should take a look at this thread. If they were having production shortages then they would be able to preload the patch very easily on newly shipped units. The reason they aren't is because they have a couple of million sitting in warehouses just outside of Shenzen and opening up the boxes to flash them would be very costly and time consuming.

Spreading FUD...

This is not new...and is definitely not news. Nintendo typically doesn't update pre-loaded machines till months have passed preferring to get the updates done via software when you purchase games.

During the entire Wii life cycle Nintendo pre-loaded the lastest OS software like maybe 5 times...anytime you bought a Wii and brought it home it had updates outstanding.

That being said the update for the Wii U does seem pretty important and Nintendo should get that pre-loaded ASAP.

 

[zomgbbqftw]

If they sent 55k the situation should basically be looking like a sellout right now.

How? 40k sales over the weekend would imply 15k units left in the channel with no extra shipments. With 80-90k total expected by the end of this week it is definitely not a sell out.

Don't forget that the UK is much smaller than the US, so 15k in the channel in the US would be equivalent to a sell out while 15k here is not, it is just slightly below normal.

 

[zomgbbqftw]

Spreading FUD...

This is not new...and is definitely not news. Nintendo typically doesn't update pre-loaded machines till months have passed preferring to get the updates done via software when you purchase games.

During the entire Wii life cycle Nintendo pre-loaded the lastest OS software like maybe 5 times...anytime you bought a Wii and brought it home it had updates outstanding.

It is a huge update that enables so many features of the Wii U. This is not a small time security patch or to fix some savegame error. It is how the Wii U should have launched. In fact Sony also had a day zero patch in the US and Japan that enabled the PSN store, it rolled out on shipped devices in February 4 months after launch because Sony overestimated demand and produced too many. Nintendo have done the same here. It's no big deal, Sony overcame that and so will Nintendo, it's the denial of Nintendo fans which is quite sad.

 

[AranhaHunter]

in japan they have MH3GHD and DQX aside of mario wiiu and nintendo land so sales expectations are probably very high

I'm actually really curious to see how this will do.

If 720/PS4 launch with GTAV and COD:MW4 as their main games in the west, which would be 6 month - 1 year old 360/PS3 games, would they do extremely well in America/EU? Sure it would sell, but I'm not convinced it would be this huge system seller we are expecting it to be.

 

[radioheadrule83]

It is a huge update that enables so many features of the Wii U. This is not a small time security patch or to fix some savegame error. It is how the Wii U should have launched. In fact Sony also had a day zero patch in the US and Japan that enabled the PSN store, it rolled out on shipped devices in February 4 months after launch because Sony overestimated demand and produced too many. Nintendo have done the same here. It's no big deal, Sony overcame that and so will Nintendo, it's the denial of Nintendo fans which is quite sad.

the insistence of detractors and FUD spreaders is equally sad. The truth will out in a matter of weeks about how its doing, but its only been 4/5 days, there are credible sources citing low shipments, and we already have people who want to talk doom and think they know it all.

 

[AranhaHunter]

the insistence of detractors and FUD spreaders is equally sad. The truth will out in a matter of weeks about how its doing, but its only been 4/5 days, there are credible sources citing low shipments, and we already have people who want to talk doom and think they know it all.

Reggie said it would take months.

 

[Spiegel]

I'm actually really curious to see how this will do.

If 720/PS4 launch with GTAV and COD:MW4 as their main games in the west, which would be 6 month - 1 year old 360/PS3 games, would they do extremely well in America/EU? Sure it would sell, but I'm not convinced it would be this huge system seller we are expecting it to be.

It's more like GTAV, MW4, Gran Turismo 6, new Sony IP or GTAV, MW4, Halo 5, new MS IP

 

[lunchwithyuzo]

360 also had an early (day one?) 512MB patch in the US, can't remember what it did. At any rate, it's better than waiting 3 months for what should've been day one like with 3DS.

 

[AranhaHunter]

It's more like GTAV, MW4, Gran Turismo 6, new Sony IP or GTAV, MW4, Halo 5, new MS IP

I'm specifically talking about the 2 biggest 3rd party franchises. I think you are comparing NSMBU to GT6 and Halo 5 which is fair, but I'm also not sure what new IP you're talking about, I guess Nintendo Land?

EDIT: The reason I didn't mention or am not that interested in seeing how the the Ninty franchises do in the Japanese launch is because they have universal appeal and they launched in the west with those same games.

 

[F#A#Oo]

It is a huge update that enables so many features of the Wii U. This is not a small time security patch or to fix some savegame error. It is how the Wii U should have launched. In fact Sony also had a day zero patch in the US and Japan that enabled the PSN store, it rolled out on shipped devices in February 4 months after launch because Sony overestimated demand and produced too many. Nintendo have done the same here. It's no big deal, Sony overcame that and so will Nintendo, it's the denial of Nintendo fans which is quite sad.

The console's were made months ago...Nintendo is not going to recall them just to flash the OS...

Nintendo has been here before and the updates should go on future software for those without internet access...the rest will just have to make do with Nintendo's gimped servers.

Just checking your post history you've posted alot in this thread and alot of your posts seem to lean towards making negative posts...

You don't own a Wii U yet have such a high interest in posting negatives...I don't think it's Nintendo fans in denial here...

 

[SmokyDave]

You don't own a Wii U yet have such a high interest in posting negatives...I don't think it's Nintendo fans in denial here...

What would zomg be denying?

 

[PaulLFC]

The console's were made months ago...Nintendo is not going to recall them just to flash the OS...

... which was his point. Instead of jumping to "Stop doom mongering!" you should actually read his post. They have consoles which it would cost too much to recall and reflash, so only updating in a month or two indicates that they are waiting until these stocks are depleted and the update will exist on newly produced units.

 

[shinra-bansho]

citing low shipments

...only works as a qualifier for this low a sell-through if it was essentially sold out, which it doesn't appear to have been. As already pointed out.

If some of the numbers being thrown around for launch shipment numbers, 50K, 55K, are correct, that doesn't make the sell-through good relative to past launches. If anything it let's us know that demand wasn't sufficient to sell-through even this small a shipment.