Support NeoGAF

[ColonelColon]

i mean in a pc..
How would a radeon 1800xt run battlefield 3 to get things in perspective ?

what would the equivalent of x360 gpu do with battlefield 3 though ?


also, is there a chance everything here is on a single die and how much would that influence performance ?

I think the X1950XTX might be closer to being the PC's equivalent to the Xenos GPU. That being said, Battlefield 3 isn't playable on the X1950XTX since the PC version requires DX10 hardware and operating system. Radeon HD 4650 (DX 10 level card) is roughly comparable in performance to the X1950XTX and I think the game runs just as well (on console equivalent settings; 720p and Low) if not better on that card than it does on consoles, at least in single player. Still, there are other games (such as Witcher 2, strangely enough) that will run better on console hardware than they do at minimum settings on PC hardware that should exceed console hardware by a slight margin.

 

[phosphor112]

 

[alexandros]

Still, there are other games (such as Witcher 2, strangely enough) that will run better on console hardware than they do at minimum settings on PC hardware that should exceed console hardware by a slight margin.

Witcher 2 has been heavily modified in order to run on 360, it's not the same game so it's not that easy to compare.

 

[CrunchinJelly]

They are making Ryse which is a kinect game so it might as well be not a game. Lol.

I dunno about Ryse, it's been in development so long and switched teams so maybe it's different to what they initially showed. Might even be Kinect + half of the supposed controller.

 

[Can Crusher]

The obsession some have in mocking "special sauce" is getting a little desperate.

I mean how much can it really bother you? It's just a nickname for a couple of units that are going to be assisting the GPU.

How many times do you make fun of it until it starts looking off on you?

 

[alexandros]

Radeon HD 4650 (DX 10 level card) is roughly comparable in performance to the X1950XTX and I think the game runs just as well (on console equivalent settings; 720p and Low) if not better on that card than it does on consoles, at least in single player.

Yup, that it does. Here's a video of Battlefield 3 running on a 4650 at low settings and 720p. According to the uploader, the game runs at 45 fps without Fraps.

Dat PC optimization

 

[iamshadowlark]

The obsession some have in mocking "special sauce" is getting a little desperate.

I mean how much can it really bother you? It's just a nickname for a couple of units that are going to be assisting the GPU.

How many times do you make fun of it until it starts looking off on you?

There's no obsession, its just a pretty bad name. And no one knows what it does.

 

[phosphor112]

The obsession some have in mocking "special sauce" is getting a little desperate.

I mean how much can it really bother you? It's just a nickname for a couple of units that are going to be assisting the GPU.

How many times do you make fun of it until it starts looking off on you?

It's a terrible nickname. Plain and simple. "Special Sauce." Why can't we call it the "unknown chip?" As opposed to something completely stupid.

I'm not that old, but I've been working on computers in my past time for years. I've always tried to follow technology, but never once did I ever hear anything as stupid as "special sauce."

 

[JaggedSac]

I think the idea is the equivalent of head-tracking, but for audio. Granted, I don't know if that's what it does, but I've heard crazy things about the audio hardware in Durango (and I don't imagine the capability is much different for Orbis, since apparently I have to say that now).

I would be curious to know from people here what would make them want a new, more powerful kinect. Like, what features would sell you on it.

- Hopefully they will have a telescoping lens so it can change depending on the needs of the room.

- Primesense has created a new sensor with supposedly better algorithms, so hopefully the noise is reduced somewhat with that. And it is smaller so perhaps MS can reduce the size of the Kinect, but this is probably determined more by the array of mics.

- 720p@60fps depth data at the least. Currently the accuracy is 10cm at 4m so this should help that tremendously.

- A split apart controller so with the usual sensors that support 1 hand, 2 hand, no hand gameplay. Seems so obvious to do it this way.

- 4 skeletal systems at a time, this would obviously require more room and a wider fov.

- Better skeletal system tracking. Faster data should help with this as well as hand held controllers which will alleviate some occlusion scenarios.

 

[somuchwater]

It's a terrible nickname. Plain and simple. "Special Sauce." Why can't we call it the "unknown chip?" As opposed to something completely stupid.

I'm not that old, but I've been working on computers in my past time for years. I've always tried to follow technology, but never once did I ever hear anything as stupid as "special sauce."

It's a common phrase that refers to a crucial, small but generally unknown or secret component. It's not specifically used in relation to technology, but I dunno why everyone is getting bent out of shape about it.

 

[phosphor112]

It's a common phrase that refers to a crucial, small but generally unknown or secret component. It's not specifically used in relation to technology, but I dunno why everyone is getting bent out of shape about it.

Then call it the "unknown chip" or the "chip we don't know about yet"?

Special sauce is a stupid name with stupid implications regarding it's capabilities. It's not a magic chip. At all, so people need to get off its nuts and stop pretending it will level the playing field just because it's "special."

 

[Sydle]

It's a common phrase that refers to a crucial, small but generally unknown or secret component. It's not specifically used in relation to technology, but I dunno why everyone is getting bent out of shape about it.

Fear of the unknown. The only ones bent out of shape about it are those that NEED to know that Orbis has the upper hand.

 

[iamshadowlark]

It's a common phrase that refers to a crucial, small but generally unknown or secret component. It's not specifically used in relation to technology, but I dunno why everyone is getting bent out of shape about it.

I've literally never heard it used for anything, outside of food. It sounds stupid really.

I've must've missed where the rumored Xbox chip is because I thought it was only PS4 rumored to have the extra compute chip, per the DF leak.

 

[Reiko]

Then call it the "unknown chip" or the "chip we don't know about yet"?

Special sauce is a stupid name with stupid implications regarding it's capabilities. It's not a magic chip. At all, so people need to get off its nuts and stop pretending it will level the playing field just because it's "special."

It's not special. It's just MS solution to adding more to the graphical output without breaking bank on a GPU.

The Cell for all intents and purposes was magical since it heavily helped out the weaker RSX.

 

[Boss Man]

The obsession some have in mocking "special sauce" is getting a little desperate.

I mean how much can it really bother you? It's just a nickname for a couple of units that are going to be assisting the GPU.

How many times do you make fun of it until it starts looking off on you?

To be fair, listing "secret sauce" in specs while comparing consoles is pretty desperate as well.

 

[Brad Grenz]

The obsession some have in mocking "special sauce" is getting a little desperate.

I mean how much can it really bother you? It's just a nickname for a couple of units that are going to be assisting the GPU.

How many times do you make fun of it until it starts looking off on you?

The mockery has only been proportional to the blind faith being placed in it.

 

[phosphor112]

I've literally never heard it used for anything, outside of food.

I've must've missed where the rumored Xbox chip is because I thought it was only PS4 rumored to have the extra compute chip, per the DF leak.

It's not even common in that regard. I've only heard it maybe a handful of times when regarding food.

 

[Can Crusher]

It's a terrible nickname. Plain and simple. "Special Sauce." Why can't we call it the "unknown chip?" As opposed to something completely stupid.

I'm not that old, but I've been working on computers in my past time for years. I've always tried to follow technology, but never once did I ever hear anything as stupid as "special sauce."

Because you're on the internet and your nickname is "phosphor112", the other guy is "iamshadowlord" and I'm "Can Crusher".

It's a metaphor. It's not hard to understand, what is hard to understand is how it would bother anyone.

To be fair, listing "secret sauce" in specs while comparing consoles is pretty desperate as well.

Sure. It's desperate.

There's no obsession, its just a pretty bad name. And no one knows what it does.

Exactly man. What does special sauce do in the real world? It means nothing too aside from that it's supposedly an important piece of the puzzle(in that case a dish). It's a perfectly valid metaphor.

Then call it the "unknown chip" or the "chip we don't know about yet"?

Special sauce is a stupid name with stupid implications regarding it's capabilities. It's not a magic chip. At all, so people need to get off its nuts and stop pretending it will level the playing field just because it's "special."

So that's what bothers you? Jesus man, who gives a shit if other people are pinning hopes on the fact that we don't know everything about these consoles.

Is it any better to be you? To have your mind decided, when in fact you know nothing about development for these consoles? You're in a different boat, but cruising the same waters really.

 

[DBT85]

I envision a time where any game with a deficiency against the other console is just going to have a gif for the key fault with "Special Sauce" as the caption.

 

[JaggedSac]

I thought it was understood that "special sauce" was to be replaced by "wizard jizz".

 

[szaromir]

It's not special. It's just MS solution to adding more to the graphical output without breaking bank on a GPU.

What would it do though? I can imagine assisting in non-gaming tasks, but why split rendering pipeline into several chips?

 

[phosphor112]

Because you're on the internet and your nickname is "phosphor112", the other guy is "iamshadowlord" and I'm "Can Crusher".

It's a metaphor. It's not hard to understand, what is hard to understand is how it would bother anyone.

My name is phosphor, but I'm not implying I'm phosphorescent, or glow in any way. It's a stupid and "dumbed down" nickname for something tech related.

 

[Reiko]

What would it do though? I can imagine assisting in non-gaming tasks, but why split rendering pipeline into several chips?

I don't think it's being split. The device should be unified with everything else.

I dunno what it does, but it should be enough to make both consoles a wash in power.

 

[Plinko]

I will admit I find the "special sauce" phrase irritating as well.

 

[GarthVaderUK]

If you missed Proelite's posts on the Data Move Engines, here you go:
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=46710115&postcount=1247
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=46710204&postcount=1255
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=46712530&postcount=1487

 

[somuchwater]

It's not even common in that regard. I've only heard it maybe a handful of times when regarding food.

This is getting silly, but because you haven't heard a phrase, it doesn't mean it isn't common. It aptly describes the thing in question: an unknown quantity that makes an important difference.

 

[Alx]

The most amusing thing is, didn't the "special sauce" phrase come from a Eurogamer article about Orbis and its coprocessors ?

 

[CrunchinJelly]

If you missed Proelite's posts on the Data Move Engines, here you go:
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=46710115&postcount=1247
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=46710204&postcount=1255
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=46712530&postcount=1487

Is Proelite an insider or a Chinese whisperer?

 

[JaggedSac]

If you missed Proelite's posts on the Data Move Engines, here you go:
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=46710115&postcount=1247
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=46710204&postcount=1255
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=46712530&postcount=1487

For the lazy:

He is massively wrong.

4xMove engines have nothing to do with Kinect. They're straight up graphical performance enhancers.

GPU and CPU load.

It's a pretty important piece of silicon.

The Data Move engine is pretty important since there are 4 of them. Each one doing different things to help the GPU.

I expect we will get more details the closer we get to launch.

 

[Karma]

Then call it the "unknown chip" or the "chip we don't know about yet"?

Special sauce is a stupid name with stupid implications regarding it's capabilities. It's not a magic chip. At all, so people need to get off its nuts and stop pretending it will level the playing field just because it's "special."

You seem afraid that the 720 might be equal to the PS4. Why does it upset you so much?

 

[phosphor112]

This is getting silly, but because you haven't heard a phrase, it doesn't mean it isn't common. It aptly describes the thing in question: an unknown quantity that makes an important difference.

LOL, just because it's a phrase used in the English language, doesn't make it, by any means, common.

You seem afraid that the 720 might be equal to the PS4. Why does it upset you so much?

I like your "U mad bro?" post.

 

[szaromir]

I don't think it's being split. The device should be unified with everything else.
I dunno what it does, but it should be enough to make both consoles a wash in power.

TBH it's it's hard to imagine some 'special sauce' or 'wizard jizz' overcoming such a massive difference in power of shader units. Who said the consoles are a 'wash'?

 

[Can Crusher]

My name is phosphor, but I'm not implying I'm phosphorescent, or glow in any way. It's a stupid and "dumbed down" nickname for something tech related.

It doesn't matter. You're still using it.

I'm sure those who say "special sauce" aren't expecting the hardware to come with culinary sauce inside....

"U mad bro?"

Well that's a shame, I actually thought you were more level headed.

 

[onQ123]

The most amusing thing is, didn't the "special sauce" phrase come from a Eurogamer article about Orbis and its coprocessors ?

I don't think so because when I read that article & seen the word being used the 1st thing that popped in my head was "hear we go again" .

 

[Reiko]

TBH it's it's hard to imagine some 'special sauce' or 'wizard jizz' overcoming such a massive difference in power of shader units. Who said the consoles are a 'wash'?

RSX was weaker than the Xenos. The CPU on the PS3 did the heavy lifting.

Crazy huh? Wizard Jizz and all that jazz.

 

[JaggedSac]

I'm sure those who say "special sauce" aren't expecting the hardware to come with culinary sauce inside....

Speak for yourself.

 

[Pistolero]

I dunno what it does, but it should be enough to make both consoles a wash in power.

How convenient! Just enough sauce on the plate to level the playfield. Not enough to surpass Orbis, and obviously more than it would have taken to trail behind it. The right amount of sauce...
That is magical!

 

[iamshadowlark]

Exactly man. What does special sauce do in the real world? It means nothing too aside from that it's supposedly an important piece of the puzzle(in that case a dish). It's a perfectly valid metaphor.

Eh it could totally just mean something that they've never saw before. Its importance could still be anywhere.

I don't think it's being split. The device should be unified with everything else.

I dunno what it does, but it should be enough to make both consoles a wash in power.

You mean the "data move engine" ? If so thats quite a reach.

 

[derFeef]

Is Proelite an insider or a Chinese whisperer?

A guesser, more likely.
Happy to be wrong though.

 

[phosphor112]

It doesn't matter. You're still using it.

I'm sure those who say "special sauce" aren't expecting the hardware to come with culinary sauce inside....



Well that's a shame, I actually thought you were more level headed.

That was his post. I've addressed my issue, but he came up with a "u mad bro" post.

EDIT: Also, Proelite has refereed to it as a data mover engine. Just call it that. I'm fine with that.

 

[Karma]

What would it do though? I can imagine assisting in non-gaming tasks, but why split rendering pipeline into several chips?

So they can easily remove some for their cheaper disc-less 720 system.

 

[Reiko]

How convenient! Just enough sauce on the plate to level the playfield. Not enough to surpass Orbis, and obviously more than it would have taken to trail behind it. The right amount of sauce...
That is magical!

I'm just taking comments from a Ubisoft developer on NeoGAF.

 

[meta4]

My name is phosphor, but I'm not implying I'm phosphorescent, or glow in any way. It's a stupid and "dumbed down" nickname for something tech related.

It doesn't matter. You're still using it.

I'm sure those who say "special sauce" aren't expecting the hardware to come with culinary sauce inside....



Well that's a shame, I actually thought you were more level headed.

LMAO!

 

[Reiko]

Eh it could totally just mean something that they've never saw before. Its importance could still be anywhere.




You mean the "data move engine" ? If so thats quite a reach.

Well by E3 we'll see how much of a reach it is.

Until then... It's Xbox 1.5 Part 2.

 

[somuchwater]

LOL, just because it's a phrase used in the English language, doesn't make it, by any means, common.

Sure - but because something isn't common, doesn't mean it isn't apt.

But now this is really getting ridiculous! I am super curious to find out details, though. It's always interesting to get a clear look at new hardware.

 

[meta4]

I'm just taking comments from a Ubisoft developer on NeoGAF.

I doubt a third party developer is going to say one system is better than the other. They are going to say we are excited to develop for both consoles and harness next gen power.

 

[REMEMBER CITADEL]

What would it do though? I can imagine assisting in non-gaming tasks, but why split rendering pipeline into several chips?

It was suggested that it was kind of an evolution of a blitter concept, only applied to the modern rendering pipeline. So it would help with the bandwidth at the very least, but we don't know, it's all just speculation at this point.

 

[Shao Kahn Brewing a Stew]

OMG What?! :lol

 

[Future PhaZe]

Consoles have never come even close to having this much RAM to work with.

Next gen should be amazing.

 

[Napoleonthechimp]

I can't believe people are still discussing a name that won't matter to anyone.