Callibretto
Member
I'm still waiting someone to make suikoden-esque rpg with persona 3/4 dating sim element,
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Zeboyd Games announces Cosmic Star Heroine (Suikoden/PhantasyStar-inspired Unity RPG)
- Thread starter cj_iwakura
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Survival Of The Fittest
Banned
Not also inspired by Legend of Dragoon and Wild Arms and Breath of Fire and Baten Kaitos and Zelda and Mario not interested
chickdigger802
Banned
let's just say, some mario rpg style timing mechanics is something that can loosen my wallet strings really quickly 
PlanetSmasher
Banned
I think the reason Suikoden II is still my favorite RPG of all time is that it has both very pleasant, charming moments and the brutal, harshness of reality mixed into one. It's the kind of story that isn't a pastel pink anime tale where everything will be alright and the power of friendship conquers all.
If you want a good example of why Suikoden II is masterful storytelling, I would recommend going back and re-watching the scene at Matilda Castle. You know which one I'm talking about. If your game hits a level of drama that even approaches the latter acts of Suikoden II, I'd probably buy it on every platform it was available on.
Chrono Trigger: Characters with strong personalities, and a world that could change and build up / erode as you performed actions. I also liked Ozzie, Flea, and Slash; the kind of fun, Doronjo gang-style enemies that feel like they could have a game on their own. Much like Ultros, you only take them seriously, when they have your team on the ropes. Otherwise, you feel "who let these clowns in here?"
Suikoden 2: New castle themes for each stage of castle, and the fact that things changes while you were away. It really punctuated the "we've been away for a long time!" feeling, to get back, and see that life was moving on without you. Few other RPGs did this in such a grand way. Not only did main characters have relationships, but so did the background people. Clive, Persmerga, Luc, Vicki... they all had these little sidestories that made you want to take a break in the gameplay, and have an anime-filler episode dedicated just to them.
Phantasy Star IV: Dem cinematics. I dare say PSIV was as moving as any of Square's CGs, because they were just done so well! Motion-Manga before such a thing was common. One background character arc I'll always remember was that of the Worm Ranch owner in Mile. The town tells you the rumors of Birth Vallery, and the destroyed town near it, while scared of seeing their own town destroyed by the growing desert. However, they have tried to make the best of the situation, made clear by one man opening a Sand Worm ranch. He put all his family dreams on running this ranch, even though it's a bit of a crazy idea. But it's one of few things to do, in this dying land. One day, the Land Worm grew too big, and you had to go and put it down, as a guild quest... sad enough, since this had been his dream. Ultimately though, the Black Energy Wave destroys Mile, killing everyone. It's not enough quicksand was threatening to destroy them, but then something entirely unexpected comes and takes their lives.
You'd followed those people from rumors, to guild assistance, to unexpected death; they were only bit parts, but you felt the weight of what happened, because your life had been intertwined with theirs.
Phantasy Star II mention: I love the autonomous nature of Shir in PSII. The way she'd just disappear, steal some stuff from a shop, and then show up "at home" with new items.. I loved how much it supported the "thief" idea. Wasn't even story related all the time, she just did as she wanted! I rather like "outside of the players control" bonuses like this, as they really seem to strengthen the characters personalities and individuality.
I think the biggest thing I take from Phantasy Star, that barely even exist in many other RPGs, is the well-run line of Lineage and Death. Phantasy Stay killed off Alys (and Nei) way before Aerith was slain by Sephy,. And PS3 introduced a lot of significance to the bloodlines, which are continually hinted at in future games, even in PSO's weapon selection. The idea that many heroic groups, just like your own, had fought similar supreme beast, and had similar adventures, was a strong one. Getting to see children and centuries-later descendants take up weapons and ideals similar to those of the past, help make the games feel like they actually had a history, as opposed to the "All final fantasies are their own timelines" approach.
A single game parallel to this would be to have a character die, and then have one in their line take up their position in party. A child dying too soon, only to be replaced by their Uncle, or something to that effect. It really helps sell the gravity of the situation to the gamer, and makes it feel like anyone could see death at any time, which makes the stakes much more real.
This guy has a lot of good ideas!
Robert at Zeboyd Games
Banned
Some amazing feedback here. I have a lot to think about.
Game sounds hot, love Phantasy Star. I'm very skeptical of Kickstarter, but I'll buy it when it drops.
let's just say, some mario rpg style timing mechanics is something that can loosen my wallet strings really quickly
Haha, yeah, this is very true. Valkyrie Profile X SMRPG button timing used for special attacks would make it a battle system unlike any other!
Haha, thanks! I also really like a lot of what Lin Siniang brought up; I'm not as much a fan of silent protags (I was just as affected by Rika pulling Chaz to the side, and speaking to him on the night of Alys burial, as I would have been if Chaz was silent Mr. Projection), but everything else rings quite true.
Some amazing feedback here. I have a lot to think about.
Robert at Zeboyd Games
Banned
I agree that silent protagonists can be done well, but that's not something that we're planning for this game. In fact, I was actually thinking of making the main character also double as the narrator which I don't think has been done in this kind of RPG before.
PlanetSmasher
Banned
You really should've spoilered those images, man. Not everyone has played that game, and that scene is one of the most powerful scenes in RPG history.
The super-subtle animations on the sprites as they react to what happened are what sell that scene. Riou's stunned silence, Joei's hand visibly shaking from pure rage...it's absolutely amazing.
Robert at Zeboyd Games
Banned
Oh yeah, FFX does the whole main character as narrator bit. Surprised I forgot about that seeing as how I'm eagerly looking forward to finally playing the International version when the HD version comes out on Vita later this year.
FrontalMonk
Banned
feels more PS1 than PS4, but still the same vein and I like it.
Yup, there is something beautiful about letting "body language" and overall animation let you fill in the blanks of "words" with the mind. It's very 8/16bit, and really puts the responsibility of thinking of that characters voice as one's own. It's a great aspect, and I love that it puts the spotlight on animation, and action.
PSIV also impressed me with it's "main" character being an assistant at games into, though. I loved all the moments he had, where he commented on what big-girl-on-Motavia Alys was doing. It's almost like he and I became friends, as we laughed about crazy lady Brangwin over there. And there was something so cool about him telling me, the player, that I should stop trying to look in people cabinets and personal drawers, lol.
Quite like the idea. Is that more of a "character recollects previous events, reflecting on what's occurring" or "comments on events, as they happen, letting the player know how she feels"? I could see either lending a unique voice to the work.
Would you believe I haven't beat IV either? :/ I've been close! And have restarted on nearly every version available! I never officially beat II either, but I let my friend borrow my copy, and then spoke him through THE WHOLE GAME as I read an FAQ to him over the phone, over days and days of time. So I really, REALLY feel like I beat it, since I... kinda... did?
I didn't say I loved Phantasy Star for its art style, and I don't.
Man it must be pain in the ass to play the game while staring the art that you don't like.
I have to explain myself - most of my early impressions of gaming art were from box covers. The North American versions of PS titles had cover art that looked nothing like what the actual style of the game and I always chalked it up to graphical limitations. I actually like anime - it's just that I didn't realise that PS had an anime-based style. Subsequently, it didn't play a factor in my enjoyment of the game since I appreciated the series for other elements. When I saw Zeboyd ape the art design, I was disappointed since it seemed like a grab at low-hanging fruit, i.e. pandering to the weeaboos. I admit it was a knee-jerk reaction, and a presumptive one at that.
Aside: When my eyes got sore from staring too long at the dungeons in PS1, I would simply close my eyes and let Uwabo's tunes wash over me. That was bliss.
chickdigger802
Banned
please please please don't fall into the trap of promising a scifi rpg thingy, but in the end its just a scifi skinover a traditional fantasy setting story.
aka, i'm a scifi super spy, but i still needa do this block puzzle to progress. I'm still fighting slimes. And those guys are still knights, but now have laser swords instead.
You know, I don't think there has been any turn based rpgs that haven't adapted a halo style regenerating shield into combat... that's an idea
"spy headquarters"
take the concept of suikoden, but add elements that the scifi genre gives you... so instead of a HQ somewhere, make it a giant flying cloaked mobile based you can call up anywhere, a la SHIELD helicarrier.
Embrace the scifi is just what i'm sayin
aka, i'm a scifi super spy, but i still needa do this block puzzle to progress. I'm still fighting slimes. And those guys are still knights, but now have laser swords instead.
You know, I don't think there has been any turn based rpgs that haven't adapted a halo style regenerating shield into combat... that's an idea
"spy headquarters"
take the concept of suikoden, but add elements that the scifi genre gives you... so instead of a HQ somewhere, make it a giant flying cloaked mobile based you can call up anywhere, a la SHIELD helicarrier.
Embrace the scifi is just what i'm sayin
Confidence Man
Member
I want wrap-around planets.
Robert at Zeboyd Games
Banned
I hate it when Star Ocean games do that so we definitely won't fall into that trap.
Oh, seeing as we're talking about a Galactic government - how will alien races be represented? One thing I really hated about the Mass Effect series was how quickly humans permeated throughout the galaxy and how swiftly colonization occurred. Over the course of 25 years after first contact (35 after FTL), they become the dominant force in the galaxy.
Essentially, I'd like to see a little diversity and more interesting representations of sci-fi species. Maybe some Toriyama-esque stuff that isn't just cannon fodder or background art filler.
Essentially, I'd like to see a little diversity and more interesting representations of sci-fi species. Maybe some Toriyama-esque stuff that isn't just cannon fodder or background art filler.
BassForever
Member
Day 0 looks fantastic I need a new retro style phantasy star
Yeah, but on the other hand, I hope it doesn't sounds like a Genesis
Hey, genesis music sounds great when the composers know what they're doing. Of course the problem is, you either know what you're doing, or your soundtrack and sound effects sound like farts.
cj_iwakura
Member
If you think this is pandering, you haven't been too caught up on what the average JRPG art looks like nowadays. This is miles above it.
Silent protagonists can be fun, but as others have said animating them well is still important. I remember that Breath of Fire 3 did this pretty well. Ryu starts off as an inexperienced kid and you can tell that he doesn't want to fight. This is shown in how he looks away when he attacks and waves his sword around. This changes later on and you can tell he's got more skill and confidence.
Simple things like that can enhance a character for sure, despite being mute.
Simple things like that can enhance a character for sure, despite being mute.
Hours Left
Member
Sci-fi Suikoden? Sounds awesome.
Ruud_Luiten
Member
My Vita is ready!
Robert at Zeboyd Games
Banned
What kinds of kickstarter rewards would you like to see? What (if any) stretch goals would you like?
Impeccable
Member
I don't know how it works - but a push for reaching the limits of a Platinum?
Possible NG+
Endless Roguelike dungeon after you beat the game ala Lufia 2?
Some of these don't have to be stretch, just some random ideas.
"Bromides"
--- Artwork done by outside artist as a bonus (it'd be fun to see other indies show your characters in their personal spritework)
2p Mode (Lunar on PS1 / FFVI style)
--- It's fun to share an RPG with someone together, and let them handle the upkeep of certain characters! (Offline only)
Online Item Trading?
--- It might be fun. Not a huge concern, but could be a nice bonus.
Plays! Cooking Contest! Miss Macross Beauty Pageant!
--- I loved the plays, cooking, bathouse (toasty status achieved) and other little stuff of Suikoden. Would be great to see things like that here. Totally need a space beauty pageant, too! (no, not really, but...)
Sidescrolling Shooter? Mini-games in general
--- Totally optional minigames would be great.
One on One duels!
--- Would possibly call for new, big sprites, and unique backgrounds. Loved these in Suikoden, too.
Character Novelizations:
--- Similar to the stories in Lost Odyssey. Could be backstory for each of the main, or even sub, characters, findable and unlockable throughout the game.
Unlockable Comic pages:
--- Another premium collectable that could be in the game.
"What If?" Stories
--- Remake small segments of the game to have different outcomes, different genders for the characters, or to swap the good and badguys!
Bonus Characters / Heroes of Legend
--- Mysterious guest characters, from... whatever you can convince to let you have a guest star? I hear Chrono isn't doing much... and looks like a not-likely-to-sue palette swap of himself now-a-days...
Battle Arena
--- Didn't all the best RPGs have SOMETHING like this, somewhere?
Action RPG Mode
--- The ultimate pie-in-the-sky stretch goal, this bonus mode would change the entire game from turn-based combat, to quick running and slashing! would be the weirdest thing ever. Would you like some Secrets of Mana with your Phantasy Star?
i'd love to have access to a private forum that details what you are working on and perhaps gets to alpha test the game from time to time. A full nondisclosure agreement needed of course.
as for stretch goals, it's hard to decide until we know exactly what you are planning to put in there from the start. But stuff like hidden bonus characters, perhaps of characters from your other games, or even complete guest characters could be fun.
As the other person mentioned a co op mode like some of the FF games have where you can set up a second player to control certain characters can be fun, it would allow me and my wife to play it together like we played FF5 and FF9 together.
Beyond that perhaps if you are planning DLC for the game, have certain DLC be stretch goals where everyone who pledges high enough to get the game will get them for free if you reach that goal, while after the game launches the DLC will be a few bucks each (if i recall right you said CSH was going to be either $10 or $15 instead of your normal dirt cheap prices)
How about a fake cartridge shaped like either a Genesis or SNES game with the cover art, probably want to do box and color manual at that point too. Vinyl soundtrack maybe?
I like this, but not as just a paper weight. Is there any chance you could actually get something running on the SNES or Genesis? Not necessarily the game itself, but maybe a digital bonus art book or the OST in MIDI form? Maybe a mini game or two? Digital Encyclopedia of Important Stuff?
stretch goal? some sort of player housing/spaeship/home base. you can find little things in the world to put / decorate your place, maybe do quets to upgrade/add rooms that give you buffs or minigames something.
-Additional side quests and optional dungeons that are sprinkled throughout the whole game for rewards and items you cannot get by simply playing through the main story.
-Additional PS4 style cinematics in general. Loved the hell out of them. The only thing in that era of gaming that i feel is in the same neighborhood is the tecmo theater games like ninja gaiden.
To be fair, Star Ocean games don't exactly pretend otherwise, what with their frequent use of the "sci-fi party has bad thing happen and ends up stranded on fantasy planet" trope. I don't think they've ever hidden the fact that they're, well, space opera.
More on topic, I will admit that the pitch caught my eye as a Suikoden junkie and someone long overdue to play through the Phantasy Star series. I'll be keeping an eye on this one.
cosmicblizzard
Banned
Too much to ask for a Wii U stretch goal?
But seriously, I can't think of anything. Maybe more sidequests or something? Really, I'd just want extra funds to go to making the game bigger. Maybe a world map with flying vehicles at some point if that wasn't already part of the plan (or not if it changes things).
This sounds like way too much work. I'd rather they put that into improving what they already have.
Robert at Zeboyd Games
Banned
Just posted an article about some of the lessons we've learned from our previous RPGs and how we hope to implement those lessons into Cosmic Star Heroine.
http://zeboyd.com/2013/07/01/lesson...-their-impact-on-cosmic-star-heroines-design/
http://zeboyd.com/2013/07/01/lesson...-their-impact-on-cosmic-star-heroines-design/
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