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[Manmademan]

Look at something like Red Dead Redemption - it looked better than Alan Wake (360-exclusive 3rd person shooter that came out on the same day) and it looked better than Infamous 2 (PS3 exclusive open world third person game), so Rockstar definitely tried to push both machines but the PS3 just couldn't keep up. By then the Cell architecture had been already researched and demystified by devs.

Not that simple. the 360 was the lead platform for Red Dead- as it should have been as the 360 had much greater marketshare in the US where the majority of that title's sales would be.

Architectural differences between 360 and PS3 (mostly the unified to split ram situation) means that titles developed that way are going to see performance hits on PS3, versus titles that are natively developed around the PS3's strengths and limitations in the first place.

and yes, while infamous 2 is open world, that game didn't have anywhere NEAR the budget of Red Dead.

LA Noire on the other hand used a modified version of the same engine, Led on PS3 vs. 360, and was significantly better than the 360 version in terms of lighting and frame rate.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-la-noire-face-off?page=3

 

[SillyEskimo]

It...kinda did at the end of the day, but it took 'bout 7 years so it was a LONG day...

Gears of War: Judgement and Halo 4 were easily on the same level graphically as The Last of Us or anything else on the PS3. I own and played them all.

 

[$h@d0w]

Sources - Not one of them named.

If we're going to lambaste Albert for coming in here with cooked numbers we should at least hold Edge up to the same standard. 50% more powerful than the Xbox One? Says who? I need more than "source" or "developer".

Who do you believe, the PS4 loving journalists? or the Microsoft PR mouthpiece?

 

[EagleEyes]

Look at something like Red Dead Redemption - it looked better than Alan Wake (360-exclusive 3rd person shooter that came out on the same day) and it looked better than Infamous 2 (PS3 exclusive open world third person game), so Rockstar definitely tried to push both machines but the PS3 just couldn't keep up. By then the Cell architecture had been already researched and demystified by devs.

I wouldn't worry about trying to explain anything. Two developers just in the past couple months came straight out and said the 360 was the faster and more capable machine. People will point to a couple of PS3 exclusives that leveraged what the PS3 does well to prove their point that it was more powerful when it just wasn't the truth. People can't compare something like Uncharted or God of War which were tightly linear, single player only games to something like Red Dead or heck even Halo which had 4 player co-op and bigger sandbox areas with land and flying vehicles. Its impossible to try and compare these things but this is the internet and something has to be better then another.

 

[jaypah]

Eh, you put in "console" there as some sort of insurance didn't you.. "Lead console" makes no sense, neither does console exclusive multiplatform games. Seriously it would be the best for everyone that the most powerful system is "the lead platform".

Ouya?

 

[turk3y]

How is it going to run it better with weaker hardware and being somewhat harder to develop for than PS4? Are we back to assuming there's some kind of magic tome hidden in the XB1 that reveals the secrets of the universe?

Being harder does not limit potential, only requires more thought skill or effort, regardless Epic have intimate understanding of this sort of memory setup from the 360 when working on gears and as engine creators as by far the best folk to work with this sort of challenge.

Microsoft has cleverly partnered with engine producers so they can wrangle the best out the platform so other smaller developers who just want to take a pre baked platform don't have to.

Ryse will cement Xbox tweaks into the cryengine for example.

 

[UnnDunn]

Man, as long as Sony gets the online stuff right out of the gate this time around, it's going to be a bloodbath.

If they screw up the online again tho with slow downloads and an online infrastructure that isn't at least on par with EOL 360, they could still screw it up. We won't know either way until launch, it's definitely going to be a stressful ass November this year when it comes to gaming.

I think this is going to be a big factor. Xbox One has things like SmartMatch and multitasking to help streamline things. Sony hasn't said much about how their online service will work.

 

[Man]

"Nonetheless, at launch, PS4 will be the more capable console."

Xbox One chipset grows over time confirmed.

 

[greatestjediever]

this will get 10 quotes minimum

I'm counting 13 quotes so far! Prophet, why did you not predict 'Skins loss to the Eagles?

 

[The Elite]

Who do you believe, the journalists? or the PR mouthpiece?

Neither until they provide me factual information with a source that I can check myself.

 

[Deadly Cyclone]

Funny enough, if you replace "Xbox One" with "WiiU" you basically become Reggie.

Except we're not talking that monumental of a power difference, a generational one. It's a difference, but both systems will look "next-gen" whereas Wii U looks on par (maybe a bit better) than current gen.

 

[Nightengale]

Sources - Not one of them named.

If we're going to lambaste Albert for coming in here with cooked numbers we should at least hold Edge up to the same standard. 50% more powerful than the Xbox One? Says who? I need more than "source" or "developer".

If you want some guys fired for breaking NDAs, sure.
Go ahead and demand EDGE for it.

Or better yet, ask some GAFers who are in-the-know to spill the names.

Don't say stupid things when you know full well why these guys are anonymous.

 

[Zuhzuhzombie!!]

They really dont.

Is this early gen and late gen GT6 compared together?

 

[FinalStageBoss]

So some devs are actually going to try and downgrade the ps4 version for "political" reasons. Bullshit.

 

[Audible Phonetics]

Who do you believe, the PS4 loving journalists? or the Microsoft PR mouthpiece?

At the end of the article they clearly said MS could end up taking the lead. So how are they ps4 loving?

 

[Finalizer]

End cycle games for ps3 look almost on Par with what is launching for ps4.

GT6, Last of Us as example.

Seriously, this is the same stuff we went through during the beginning of the last console cycle. "There's barely a difference between Xbox and 360 games, might as well be Xbox 1.5 looool." And then GoW handily shut them up.

History repeats itself.

 

[SEGAvangelist]

Ouch. I hope all the info Edge has pointed to is dated. I do agree that 1600x900 shouldn't be a problem, but when even MS published games are having issues with performance (Dead Rising 3 fps, Killer Instinct 720p) it doesn't exactly instill confidence in the hardware.

 

[Metalmurphy]

Neither until they provide me factual information with a source that I can check myself.

We have factual information, they're called hardware specs.

 

[$h@d0w]

Neither until they provide me factual information with a source that I can check myself.

I like your response, healthy skepticism is good.

 

[DieH@rd]

Based on this and other articles, it seems clear to me that the PS4 will have better graphics than Xbox One going into the next generation. And that’s fine.

But it also seems clear that Xbox One will have better everything else than PS4. Specifically, better audio, better multiplayer, better gameplay, and an all-around better gaming experience.

/facepalm of biblical proportions

 

[twobear]

#DEAD

 

[Can Crusher]

/facepalm of biblical proportions

I heard the Xbox One version of Battlefield 4 and Watch Dogs has better gameplay and A.I, which is why they haven't shown them yet. They don't want to scare potential PS4 version buyers!

 

[BTM]

I'll just wait and see for myself if the difference in quality is actually that obvious.

 

[LordBaztion]

Well, this is more concrete but still is the opinion of one developer and the article expresely says it. Still subject to what they were trying to run and how.
However, at the end the optimization is a business decesion and I doubt publishers to take advantage of it until the second half of next gen.

 

[Zuhzuhzombie!!]

We won't see as drastic a difference mid to end Gen this time around as time passes

Every single generation.

 

[Deadly Cyclone]

If you want some guys fired for breaking NDAs, sure.
Go ahead and demand EDGE for it.

Or better yet, ask some GAFers who are in-the-know to spill the names.

Don't say stupid things when you know full well why these guys are anonymous.

His point stands though, for all we know EDGE could be making up this shit. Not saying they are, because EDGE generally does a decent job, but that's the issue with these anonymous sources, you can say basically anything and credit it to an anonymous source. E.G. "PS4 is 300% more powerful than Xbox One!" -Anonymous Developer we talked to.

 

[Bluekaveli]

You guys are gonna get eaten by that troll if you keep feeding him....



That was sarcasm? Fuck man, I can't even tell anymore

With the smiley face and the all caps it has to be. Then again every time I see that phrase I start laughing.

 

[Krakn3Dfx]

I heard the Xbox One version of Battlefield 4 and Watch Dogs has better gameplay and A.I, which is why they haven't shown them yet. They don't want to scare potential PS4 version buyers!

That must be true then.

 

[Radec]

They are busy TCOB.

 

[The Elite]

If you want some guys fired for breaking NDAs, sure.
Go ahead and demand EDGE for it.

Or better yet, ask some GAFers who are in-the-know to spill the names.

Don't say stupid things when you know full well why these guys are anonymous.

Don't write an article when you don't have one concrete source that I know.

What's wrong with questioning Edge?

 

[$h@d0w]

At the end of the article they clearly said MS could end up taking the lead. So how are they ps4 loving?

Sorry, "loving" is too strong, but I don't think you can deny that the article as a whole is pro PS4 because of it's superior specifications.

 

[Manmademan]

Sources - Not one of them named.

If we're going to lambaste Albert for coming in here with cooked numbers we should at least hold Edge up to the same standard. 50% more powerful than the Xbox One? Says who? I need more than "source" or "developer".

haven't been keeping up? This has been known for a while.

It's not just edge saying this, the same conclusions can be found from anandtech, n4g, etc.

On the graphics side it’s once again obvious that Microsoft and Sony are shopping at the same store as the Xbox One’s SoC integrates an AMD GCN based GPU. Here’s where things start to get a bit controversial. Sony opted for an 18 Compute Unit GCN configuration, totaling 1152 shader processors/cores/ALUs. Microsoft went for a far smaller configuration: 768 (12 CUs).

Microsoft can’t make up the difference in clock speed alone (AMD’s GCN seems to top out around 1GHz on 28nm), and based on current leaks it looks like both MS and Sony are running their GPUs at the same 800MHz clock. The result is a 33% reduction in compute power, from 1.84 TFLOPs in the PS4 to 1.23 TFLOPs in the Xbox One. We’re still talking about over 5x the peak theoretical shader performance of the Xbox 360, likely even more given increases in efficiency thanks to AMD’s scalar GCN architecture (MS quotes up to 8x better GPU performance) - but there’s no escaping the fact that Microsoft has given the Xbox One less GPU hardware than Sony gave the PlayStation 4. Note that unlike the Xbox 360 vs. PS3 era, Sony's hardware advantage here won't need any clever developer work to extract - the architectures are near identical, Sony just has more resources available to use.

Sony gave the PS4 50% more raw shader performance, plain and simple (768 SPs @ 800MHz vs. 1152 SPs & 800MHz). Unlike last generation, you don't need to be some sort of Jedi to extract the PS4's potential here. The Xbox One and PS4 architectures are quite similar, Sony just has more hardware under the hood. We’ll have to wait and see how this hardware delta gets exposed in games over time, but the gap is definitely there.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/6972/xbox-one-hardware-compared-to-playstation-4/5

and that's just talking about the GPU. doesn't get into the advantages of sony using 8 gigs of GDDR5 vs. 8 gigs of DDR3 + 32 megs of ESRAM in the Xbone.

 

[bonus_sco]

Guys I'm curious. How many actual developers do we have here (in this thread) that are commenting on these power differences? I mean the like actual videogame development experience (not fucking pong level coding lol), hands on.

I'll bite.

Articles like this are more or less pointless. You can't put a platform agnostic build onto any games console and expect it to just work.

By saying "platform agnostic"in this context they're basically saying they haven't used the esram. It's amazing that a game would run at 20 fps using just the DRAM on Xbox One.

Leaving a 200+ Gbps pool of memory untouched is a silly use case. No developer will ever ship a game without using that ESRAM. Comparing performance without it is a waste of time.

 

[King326]

Is this early gen and late gen GT6 compared together?

You have a terrifying avatar. But those are the new night racing footage gifs from Driveclub.

 

[Pain]

The difference between cross platform launch window games will be small, and improved graphics drivers plus the power of the cloud might yet tip the balance in Xbox One’s favour. Nonetheless, at launch, PS4 will be the more capable console.

So Xbones graphics driver can improve but be PS4s can't? They contradict themselves in that very article. Oh and the cloud lmfao.

 

[artist]

His point stands though, for all we know EDGE could be making up this shit. Not saying they are, because EDGE generally does a decent job, but that's the issue with these anonymous sources, you can say basically anything and credit it to an anonymous source. E.G. "PS4 is 300% more powerful than Xbox One!" -Anonymous Developer we talked to.

Edge has been the most accurate source pre-reveal of both PS4/Xbone, why start doubting them now? Because you dont like what they find and publish?

 

[TouchMyBox]

Proof is in the pudding. PS3 was supposed to make 360 look like Xbox 1.5.

We all know how that turned out

Except that was a completely different situation.

 

[Yoshi]

Your totally right. 9 times out of 10 tge cheaper console always outsells the competition.

.... oh right PS4 is cheaper as well.



Is this the first time the clearly more powerful system was also the cheapest? Seems like a bit of a historical abnormality

GameCube was cheaper than PS2.

 

[szaromir]

LA Noire on the other hand used a modified version of the same engine, Led on PS3 vs. 360, and was significantly better than the 360 version in terms of lighting and frame rate.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/di...ace-off?page=3

It also looked worse than RDR.

 

[The Elite]

haven't been keeping up? This has been known for a while.

It's not just edge saying this, the same conclusions can be found from anandtech, n4g, etc.

I am questuoining Edge's article specifically. Not what we've heard in general. If they say 50% faster in an article they need something concrete to back it up.

 

[Zombie James]

Dear devs,

Intentionally gimping games to make MS happy won't make me, the consumer, happy, and I'm the one buying your games (or not buying, if this is the case).

 

[Bluekaveli]

I heard the Xbox One version of Battlefield 4 and Watch Dogs has better gameplay and A.I, which is why they haven't shown them yet. They don't want to scare potential PS4 version buyers!

Truth fact? Or analysis opinion?

 

[Skeff]

I heard the Xbox One version of Battlefield 4 and Watch Dogs has better gameplay and A.I, which is why they haven't shown them yet. They don't want to scare potential PS4 version buyers!

Yea I heard that too, apparently games with Xbox marketing deals and that had their PC builds running at the Microsoft conference are being shown to the Media behind closed doors on PS4 so that it will be more of a shock when the XB1 version is released and is even better than PC.

Spoiler

sarcasm

Anyway PC versions should be lead platforms this Generation due to the x86 architecture and the wide range of effects used from the different PC graphical settings will be easy ways to push power on the more powerful console.

 

[Crimson_Gold]

GameCube was cheaper than PS2.

came out a year too late and with too few games against an established game library

 

[BruceLeeRoy]

Your changing the debate from total consoles sold to "Market excitement" , it doesnt change my original statement that the most powerful consoles have never sold the best. That does not mean ps4 won't sell the most , i expect it probably will but not for the fact that it is the most powerful system.

PS4 and Xbone are releasing A YEAR LATE after WiiU, it's hardly relevant though. People buy consoles to play the games that are available on them, are you actually claiming otherwise?

Wii was the ultimate example of the power of key games rather than the power of the console itself.

Of course a system needs games to succeed. That is the most fundamental aspect of any system. Your assertion that the power has nothing to do with that success is ridiculous though as it definitely plays a major part in the adoption of the console. If the Wii U had launched with Mario Galaxy 3 with visuals a significant leap above the PS3 and 360 things would have turned out much different during its launch period.

 

[Bluemercury]

It's funny who thinks that Xbox One is doomed because of less power. That's irrelevant for overall market, its all about the games.

Yeah too bad that MS doesn't have that many first party exclusives...

 

[Deadly Cyclone]

Edge has been the most accurate source pre-reveal of both PS4/Xbone, why start doubting them now? Because you dont like what they find and publish?

Hmm, most accurate? I don't think that's quite true. Also I think you took my point as me going against EDGE in this case, I don't think they are wrong here I was just giving the reason I dislike anonymous sources for big articles like this.

 

[Pain]

I wouldn't worry about trying to explain anything. Two developers just in the past couple months came straight out and said the 360 was the faster and more capable machine. People will point to a couple of PS3 exclusives that leveraged what the PS3 does well to prove their point that it was more powerful when it just wasn't the truth. People can't compare something like Uncharted or God of War which were tightly linear, single player only games to something like Red Dead or heck even Halo which had 4 player co-op and bigger sandbox areas with land and flying vehicles. Its impossible to try and compare these things but this is the internet and something has to be better then another.

PS3 and 360 just aren't directly comparable.

 

[Nightengale]

Don't write an article when you don't have one concrete source that I know.

What's wrong with questioning Edge?

Nothing, but these kind of articles hinge on only one thing, which is EDGE's journalistic credibility.

How much credibility you think they have is a different issue altogether.

It's fine to be skeptical, and don't trust EDGE word-for-word. But that's different from expecting them to reveal their sources. They won't, so these situations are a no-win situation.

The only credibility held by EDGE is that there's various sources that pretty much echo the same things being said by EDGE ( Adrian Chmielarz's dev-friends, etc ) Once again, their own credibility comes into question since they won't be revealing names either.

 

[Can Crusher]

Truth fact? Or analysis opinion?

I'm laughing like Ray Liotta right now.