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No Dolby 5.1 support with Xbone optical port (surround headphone users beware!)

J

jmdajr

Member
borghe said:
a) wtf happened to Dolby? I mean that shit was standard for like 20+ years, and now with blu-ray all of the sudden everything is DTS.. Kudos to DTS I guess.

b) wow.. xbone not supporting Dolby 5.1 out of optical is sort of baffling. Not sure it will bone more AVR users than the Wii U situation, but yeah almost everyone with surround headphones is kind of screwed.
Click to expand...

I find this odd as well. I guess they just got over confident I don't know.

Are games using DTS for surround now also?
 
N

netBuff

Member
Mr Swine said:
Ok, but do both support Dolby Headphones? It's a great feature to down mix 5.1/7.1 surround sound to a stereo headphone
Click to expand...

You'll only be able to use Dolby Headphone audio with the Astro Mixamp on PS4, but not on Xbone.

If you have a receiver that has built-in DH support (like Marantz) you're good to go.
 
T

Tobor

Member
Yet another reason I'm glad I went with PS4.

I paid $300 for Astro A50s, I want to be able to use them properly.
 
Z_Y

Z_Y

Member
netBuff said:
This is for all audio, including game audio. With the HDCP restriction posted early (due to HDMI in) it also seems likely that DTS may be limited to stereo only as well.
Click to expand...

Wow...so there is no hope in the optical port ever outputting a 5.1 signal? the only way to get 5.1 via passthrough is over HDMI? And that is not even working at launch?? Well...this is a mess if all that is true. Talk about a hype deflation for me today. Think I'm going to pass for now.
 
S

suddenlyissoon

Member
Since the HDMI In port doesn't pass surround AND the optical out doesn't pass surround...how the hell are you even supposed to use your fancy AV equipment? They're basically forcing you in to either using the tv or not, and if you do, prepare for the sound to be really bad.
 
J

jmdajr

Member
suddenlyissoon said:
Since the HDMI In port doesn't pass surround AND the optical out doesn't pass surround...how the hell are you even supposed to use your fancy AV equipment? They're basically forcing you in to either using the tv or not, and if you do, prepare for the sound to be really bad.
Click to expand...

It doesn't????

edit: Well you will have to connect the optical out from the cable box to your receiver. I know some will let you mix and match hdmi/otical audio combinations. But yeah. Kinda sucks. Must be a mixing problem with all the app switching.
 
S

suddenlyissoon

Member
jmdajr said:
It doesn't????
Click to expand...

http://support.xbox.com/en-US/xbox-one/live-tv/digital-sound-not-working

From what I understand if you've got a STB/DVR that does Dolby Digital output and you plug it in to the X1, the X1 will downmix it stereo.

Alternatively, if you use the optical out on the X1, it still downmixes to stereo.

The only option if you want to use TV on the X1 AND still get dolby is to somehow rig your AV equipment. For example:

DVR HDMI out -> X1 HDMI in
AND
DVR Optical out -> AV receiver

X1 HDMI out -> AV receiver HDMI in

This setup will also force you in to changing input type on your AV receiver each time you wanted to watch TV (from HDMI sound to Optical In sound).

Please, I beg of anyone to prove me wrong. Being wrong in this case would make me so incredibly happy.
 
tfur

tfur

Member
suddenlyissoon said:
Since the HDMI In port doesn't pass surround AND the optical out doesn't pass surround...how the hell are you even supposed to use your fancy AV equipment? They're basically forcing you in to either using the tv or not, and if you do, prepare for the sound to be really bad.
Click to expand...

Is this true? What is the purpose of such an HDMI in port. I thought there are products that pass all content through HDMI.

How can you produce a product that cannot do these things? Why would you do that?
 
N

netBuff

Member
Considering that "just for good measure", Xbone's HDMI in is not only degrading audio, but also video quality I think this isn't exactly a product for audio-/videophiles.
 
J

jmdajr

Member
suddenlyissoon said:
http://support.xbox.com/en-US/xbox-one/live-tv/digital-sound-not-working

From what I understand if you've got a STB/DVR that does Dolby Digital output and you plug it in to the X1, the X1 will downmix it stereo.

Alternatively, if you use the optical out on the X1, it still downmixes to stereo.

The only option if you want to use TV on the X1 AND still get dolby is to somehow rig your AV equipment. For example:

DVR HDMI out -> X1 HDMI in
AND
DVR Optical out -> AV receiver

X1 HDMI out -> AV receiver HDMI in

This setup will also force you in to changing input type on your AV receiver each time you wanted to watch TV.

Please, I beg of anyone to prove me wrong. Being wrong in this case would make me so incredibly happy.
Click to expand...

No doubt not ideal but you can do it. Like I said it must be a mixing issue I don't know. Perhaps it just can't run a game and video cable signal in 5.1 at once.

Very disappointing. Hell I recently cut the cable cord and just do basic with hulu and netflix. I have no more cable box. But yeah must be an engineering/hardware/software issue. PS4 doesn't have HDMI in so can't even compare it to that.

Can that Google box support surround with the HDMI in? It probbaly does but it doesn't have to do as much stuff as Xbox 1.
 
S

suddenlyissoon

Member
jmdajr said:
No doubt not ideal but you can do it. Like I said it must be a mixing issue I don't know. Perhaps it just can't run a game and video cable signal in 5.1 at once.
Click to expand...

As others have said, there's apparently an option to enable "beta" surround mixing but it doesn't sound very good. I have no idea why someone hasn't said/done something about this before now.
 
S

Sillverrr

Member
What the hell? I'm very disappointed if true. I've been using a pair of Sennheiser HD 598's with an Astro Mixamp for ages, for both Xbox 360 and PS3. Way more comfortable and immersive than using my receiver's speakers.

Put up with it from the Wii U because Mario doesn't really require Dolby Headphone, but for cinematic games it'll be a loss. PS4 still has this feature, and my Xonar DX card achieves it for PC, so I really don't understand this.
 
J

jmdajr

Member
suddenlyissoon said:
As others have said, there's apparently an option to enable "beta" surround mixing but it doesn't sound very good. I have no idea why someone hasn't said/done something about this before now.
Click to expand...

I'm having a brain fart thinking of how the audio configuration would work if I was doing it without losing something in the equation.

Like I said some receivers can do funky things. Like assigning optical ports to certain hdmi inputs.

So can mix and match. But yeah not ideal. All in one has a way to go it seems.
 
M

MikeHattsu

Member
Z_Y said:
But what about TV passthrough with the audio output via optical? Fuck it, I'm drawing a picture:

That reads to me like even HDMI audio passthrough is downmixed to 2.0. Man...this unacceptable out of the gate. What kind of media box/all-in-one device would do this? i really wish Major Nelson would comment on this.
Click to expand...

I have no idea what that beta feature does, but currently if that FAQ that was linked is correct, then it will be stereo only for now.


netBuff said:
This is for all audio, including game audio. With the HDCP restriction posted early (due to HDMI in) it also seems likely that DTS may be limited to stereo only as well.
Click to expand...

Again, that HDCP thing is for DVD-Audio format discs, DTS 5.1 should work fine.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DVD-Audio
 
Z_Y

Z_Y

Member
suddenlyissoon said:
Look at this link.
http://support.xbox.com/en-US/xbox-one/live-tv/digital-sound-not-working
Click to expand...

HA! WTF? Welp...that about wraps it up for me and this XB1 experiment. The TV stuff was the main draw for me. I'm not paying $500 for subpar specs AND jumping through hoops just so I can continue enjoy surround sound via my STB thus totally borking the voice control features because my configuration needs altered..

netBuff said:
Considering that "just for good measure", Xbone's HDMI in is not only degrading audio, but also video quality I think this isn't exactly a product for audio-/videophiles.
Click to expand...

say-what.gif
 
N

netBuff

Member
BrickArmour said:
That link makes it sound like the problem is limited to pass through audio, not source audio coming from games.
Click to expand...

That link is talking about a different subject matter: It's about the fact Xbone will never pass through surround from HDMI in, no matter what audio output is selected.

This thread is about the fact not even game audio has Dolby Digital 5.1 support via the optical audio port, which is a huge problem for headphone users.
 
M

MikeHattsu

Member
BrickArmour said:
Beat option? WTF is this talking about?
Click to expand...

From the review in the OP:
The units we've been testing mess with the audio that comes from the cable box, and are currently only able to output surround sound if you dig into the menus and tick off a "Surround Sound (BETA)" option. Otherwise, it downmixes your cable's 5.1 surround to stereo.

Microsoft assures us that a non-beta option for surround audio throughput is coming, but it won't be there at launch.
Click to expand...
 
Z_Y

Z_Y

Member
BrickArmour said:
That link makes it sound like the problem is limited to pass through audio, not source audio coming from games.
Click to expand...

Well yea...that is the point though. They are selling this thing as this device that integrates nicely with your tv provider....except that it doesn't support surround sound. That's a pretty big deal to me and I'm sure many others who paid good money (and even more important...use up valuable living room space) for good surround sound.

In any event, I am dreaming up a config in my mind where I may be able to work this out. Not ideal though because I will still have to keep my receiver remote handy to switch inputs easily. BUT...I'm more concerned about this talk about video quality taking a hit when passed through the XB1. Where is this coming from? That would be awful. Awful, awful, awful.
 
B

BrickArmour

Member
old said:
This image
fUOuXv0.jpg
(taken from official launch thread http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=716786&page=143) says surround sound heaphone users should plug their surround sound headphones directly into their controller's 5.1 surround sound port.
Click to expand...

I have astros as well. This image seems to indicate that the mixamp is useless? we're getting DH from the controller. I actually would prefer the optical port just works for DD 5.1. I already have it all set up for that.
 
T

Totobeni

An blind dancing ho
so JVC su-dh1, TB Dss and Astro Mixamp users (and people with any Dolby Headphone devices) are screwed here. what the hell Microsoft is thinking?
 
D

DarkJC

Member
old said:
This image
fUOuXv0.jpg
(taken from official launch thread http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=716786&page=143) says surround sound heaphone users should plug their surround sound headphones directly into their controller's 5.1 surround sound port.
Click to expand...

The problem with this is you need a proprietary adapter which doesn't exist yet for any headphones. I'd like to know how they're going to handle this. The MixAmp for example requires a digital input like optical to receive a 5.1 signal -- is the controller port a digital out? If it is you need some kind of DAC in the adapter itself to turn it into an analog signal for the headphones.

Sounds like vague marketing speak until we know more details.
 
B

BrickArmour

Member
Z_Y said:
Well yea...that is the point though. They are selling this thing as this device that integrates nicely with your tv provider....except that it doesn't support surround sound. That's a pretty big deal to me and I'm sure many others who paid good money (and even more important...use up valuable living room space) for good surround sound.

In any event, I am dreaming up a config in my mind where I may be able to work this out. Not ideal though because I will still have to keep my receiver remote handy to switch inputs easily. BUT...I'm more concerned about this talk about video quality taking a hit when passed through the XB1. Where is this coming from? That would be awful. Awful, awful, awful.
Click to expand...

I don't think you'd need to set up your remote. You'd send optical out from your set top box to your receiver. Then, you'd just say some voice command and xbox would turn your command into an IR blast and switch your receiver for you. Right?
 
B

BrickArmour

Member
DarkJC said:
The problem with this is you need a proprietary adapter which doesn't exist yet for any headphones. I'd like to know how they're going to handle this. The MixAmp for example requires a digital input like optical to receive a 5.1 signal -- is the controller port a digital out? If it is you need some kind of DAC in the adapter itself to turn it into an analog signal for the headphones.

Sounds like vague marketing speak until we know more details.
Click to expand...

The mixamp takes in DD 5.1 and spits out stereo audio for the astros in the form of DH. My guess is that MS is saying they are now doing that processing for you inside the xbox one and that you can hook up an pair of heaphones to the controller and get DH.

I can't believe this isn't clear mere days before launch.
 
F

Fried Food

Banned
Fried Food said:
I never asked for HDMI-IN M$, please remove and give me my optical support

Wait! Isn't it possible the optical 5.1 output was missing was because Kotaku was using the HDMI INPUT? So if they didn't have anything plugged into the HDMI-IN there wouldn't be any need to restrict the optical-out for HDCP compliance. We need more info on what happens when you are not using the HDMI-IN port!!
Click to expand...

I'm not getting any more upset until this gets answered
 
C

CaVaYeRo

Member
First Wii U, now this. And this has optical output. Cannot understand it.

Feel sorry for my good old Denon, but I'm starting to think it's the beginning of an end :(
 
J

Jinko

Member
jmdajr said:
It doesn't????

edit: Well you will have to connect the optical out from the cable box to your receiver. I know some will let you mix and match hdmi/otical audio combinations. But yeah. Kinda sucks. Must be a mixing problem with all the app switching.
Click to expand...

Supposedly X1 has latency from using the HDMI input, wouldn't this cause an offset in audio and visuals ?
 
S

suddenlyissoon

Member
At least the Wii-U would push uncompressed audio straight to the receiver. That way, if you had a newer receiver it would still output surround.

Without this beta option enabled you're not even getting that from your HDMI In port.
 
Z_Y

Z_Y

Member
BrickArmour said:
I don't think you'd need to set up your remote. You'd send optical out from your set top box to your receiver. Then, you'd just say some voice command and xbox would turn your command into an IR blast and switch your receiver for you. Right?
Click to expand...

In theory that should work but they've never stated it would do anything other than volume, channel and power. I wouldn't be surprised if that is all it did to be honest.
 
B

buckeye4life

Banned
So I have a day one coming, but i use sennheiser pc360 with astro 5.8 mixamp. Your telling me that this will become useless with xbox one ? I hate to cancel my perorder, but playing games in my office with 2.0 sound is not going to cut it, especially for $500 bucks. Is this patchable ?
 
S

StalkerUKCG

Banned
So this is only on stuff using the hdmi pass through and not games right. If I played Graz 5 and output audio via optical then it will be 5.1 right?
 
Mengy

Mengy

wishes it were bannable to say mean things about Marvel
Tsundere said:
No, and apparently it degrades the picture quality as well.
Click to expand...

netBuff said:
Considering that "just for good measure", Xbone's HDMI in is not only degrading audio, but also video quality I think this isn't exactly a product for audio-/videophiles.
Click to expand...

Wait, why on Earth would an HDMI video signal out of the X1 be downgraded in any way? That simply can not be true....
 
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