Riposte
Member
No, that's stupid. It is impossible to not "play" an interactive story. Most interactive story games are simply role-playing games without combat systems.
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We need to kill gameplay says Ex-People Can Fly dev
- Thread starter BlackJace
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No, that's stupid. It is impossible to not "play" an interactive story. Most interactive story games are simply role-playing games without combat systems.
This is the key point. Today a lot of games are made to cater to a wide audience, meaning it has to be all things to all people. Aka watered down garbage.
Aquamarine
Member
NOVEMBER 8, 2012
The Astronauts developer Adrian Chmielarz, former dev of People Can Fly, explains why developers should “kill gameplay” in order to create a more memorable experience in videogames.
I hate these pretentious jerks.
Having fun is a much more profound experience than something "deeply emotional." Hell, I don't even know what "deeply emotional" really means, as the way games affect people is subjective.
The Astronauts developer Adrian Chmielarz, former dev of People Can Fly, explains why developers should “kill gameplay” in order to create a more memorable experience in videogames.
I hate these pretentious jerks.
Having fun is a much more profound experience than something "deeply emotional." Hell, I don't even know what "deeply emotional" really means, as the way games affect people is subjective.
jediyoshi
Member
There's nothing more internet than people asking questions about other people's statements, and then remarking on what they perceived because of how it's framed anyway.
Apparently the word "niche" doesn't exist in the gaming industry anymore.
Barkley's Justice
Member
as long as i can control an avatar and press X, X, X and talk to npcs and climb ledges, we good. just sell me that game and i'll buy it over and over no matter what it is called...wait a sec...
Dog Problems
Banned
While I'm with him on wanting more "deeply emotional" games, I don't think Walking Dead is a good example of what to aim for. The story and characters are good but there's too little gameplay and I don't feel like there are enough choices given at a time. I guess it's a good starting point, though.
But there's a balance somewhere that needs to be met between "deeply emotional" and still having traditional gameplay elements. I feel like Braid achieved it.
But there's a balance somewhere that needs to be met between "deeply emotional" and still having traditional gameplay elements. I feel like Braid achieved it.
I wasn't disagreeing with you.
The reason your acquaintance likes MGS4 is everything I dislike about that game.
Rickenslacker
Banned
Ding ding ding. Keep it all as context for what you're doing, but not the driving motivation to play. Sometimes you don't even need that much.
hey_it's_that_dog
benevolent sexism
Having read the whole original piece, I think he's smarter than the excerpts from the OP make him appear. The claims he makes are well in line with the psychology of attention, cognition, and memory.
I recommend people actually read it. The headline does it a disservice.
I recommend people actually read it. The headline does it a disservice.
Tony Redgrave
Member
We do understand, he wants to eliminate the dichotomy between pure gameplay and cutscenes, that's a commendable goal but I doubt most people will agree with this because as of now, every game that tries to do this is more of an interactive movie than a game.
It would've been fine if he said more developers should put emphasis in finding a new concept that blends gameplay and storytelling better, but he said we must "kill gameplay" which doesn't come off as a very goo idea.
"Lately"? The guy said back in 2007 that "Halo 3 is objectively a terrible game" and in the same interview that Call of Duty 4 SP campaign is one of the greatest in games ever.
thetrin
Hail, peons, for I have come as ambassador from the great and bountiful Blueberry Butt Explosion
Really, when you think about it, his entire statement is flawed by virtue of his definition of gameplay. You don't need a fail state for something to be a game, and you don't need to necessarily achieve something for it to be gameplay.
Because it didn't sell, and that crushed him. Hell, it crushed all of us.
LordMuffin
Member
So, since they can't nail the balance between gameplay and storytelling they decide to cut the former out of the equation instead of getting better at it, makes no sense whatsoever. Sounds a lot like Aesop's "Non dum matura est".
This, a million times this. Most emotionally packed game I've ever played, made the sadness and resignation of the characters palpable, also reflected in the city becoming more and more desolated. Game makers need to come to terms with their own insecurities towards the movie industry, videogames deserve their own way of approaching the player and there's much more potential than the mere audiovisual experience to be tapped.
This, a million times this. Most emotionally packed game I've ever played, made the sadness and resignation of the characters palpable, also reflected in the city becoming more and more desolated. Game makers need to come to terms with their own insecurities towards the movie industry, videogames deserve their own way of approaching the player and there's much more potential than the mere audiovisual experience to be tapped.
To me it sounds more like if people want to present a good story, they should focus on the story and not the mechanics, not that game mechanics/gameplay should be eliminated from all games.
The way it's written though is kind of confusing.
If he wanted to eliminated all "gameplay" and focus on presentation instead, then I stand by my original statement in telling him to get the hell out of here.
The way it's written though is kind of confusing.
If he wanted to eliminated all "gameplay" and focus on presentation instead, then I stand by my original statement in telling him to get the hell out of here.
QisTopTier
XisBannedTier
Those are not deeply emotional games, well unless the emotion is FUCK YEAH
The first quote is actually giving a nod to them in a sense.^^^
Riposte
Member
Reading the whole thing, he just comes off as someone who has a very poor working theory of what videogames are and likes the navel-gaze about it. Saying "gameplay" over and over, then poorly defining it, sort of gives you an earlier indication of that.
Do you have a point somewhere in this?
Do you have a point somewhere in this?
FutureZombie
Banned
So you have an idea for a game about nothing. They say, what's your game about. You say nothing.
Everyone's doing something. We'll do nothing.
Don't get me wrong, there's definitely a place for games that tend more toward the interactive fiction side of things. The runaway success of Telltale in recent years is proof of that.
What bothers me is how "epic story" now seems to be considered an integral component of a good game. Far too often, a big story's demands in writing, voice acting, etc. are draining resources that could be put to use improving the underlying game.
Well actually, no it can't. There are a lot of popular interactions in games that aren't gameplay.
Yes but I don't think play and gameplay are synonymous. You can interact in various different ways with a videogame and not have one bit of it be gameplay.
Meccanical
Member
cj_iwakura
Member
Didn't it sell like a million copies?
Those are not deeply emotional games, well unless the emotion is FUCK YEAH
FUCK YEAH! is the best emotion, that's why video games exist.
This is one of the main reasons I enjoyed Borderlands.
What story? There's only dialogue about you rampaging the shit out of Pandora. That's it. A bit of context on what you're doing like the intro of the DLC's and bam, you're playing.
I got a chuckle of people who complained about the "poor writing" and "dumb story". Not every videogame needs a story.
Tony Redgrave
Member
Read the source, and I reaffirm my statement, by this guy's definition games should be movies, then what's the point?
QisTopTier
XisBannedTier
Yes, but that's not an Emotional game. When people say stuff like that they normally mean a rollercoaster of feelings and stuff and overly strong attachment to the characters. Funnily enough the only games I got any feeling like that was the mgs series and some japanese visual novels which I wouldnt really count as a game for the most part. :lol
Chet Rippo
Member
What about sports games? Do they not have gameplay?
Tokubetsu
Member
You would.
Trent Strong
Banned
Most triple A games are practically $60 movies at this point. It won't be long before every video game is nothing but cut scenes with a few QTE's thrown it.
So? I'd rather have memorable experiences that arise from a mechanically sound game than play something that was engineered to make me feel a certain way.
The latter is just... Cheap. It's the kind of thing Red Letter Media points out in the Plinkett review of Avatar.
Bad thread title causing lots of people to knee-jerk react in here.
Platinum games actually prove his point entirely if you read the quotes in the OP. Bayo and Vanquish are fun as HELL and they have top-tier gameplay, but there is exactly zero emotional resonance in those games.
In comparison to his cited example of The Walking Dead game with stunted gameplay yet extremely high emotional peaks it makes complete sense to me. They are two different ends of a spectrum but not mutually exclusive.
Platinum games actually prove his point entirely if you read the quotes in the OP. Bayo and Vanquish are fun as HELL and they have top-tier gameplay, but there is exactly zero emotional resonance in those games.
In comparison to his cited example of The Walking Dead game with stunted gameplay yet extremely high emotional peaks it makes complete sense to me. They are two different ends of a spectrum but not mutually exclusive.
I'm already crying and immersing emotionally while playing FIFA. It involves yelling at my TV and shouting at virtual players, but still.
CambriaRising
Member
Both can exist in the same game.
hey_it's_that_dog
benevolent sexism
Do you have opinions about games? What's the biggest one you've done?
I disagree
Riposte
Member
If you were critical of what you wrote, you would have reconsidered this entire paragraph after thinking about writing the first sentence.
Also there is more to "fuck yeah"! (which itself could be several layers of different emotions) in these games.
But why is "emotional resonance" something that games need to strive for? He implies that anything else is just "passing time," and I couldn't agree with him less.
The problem is you are getting hung up on the game part too much. Clearly people get by with restricted or poor traditional gameplay given the vast amount of people that enjoy games like Planescape or Walking Dead.
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