Support NeoGAF

[bender]

IGN must see some value in the .1 scale because they did attempt to go away from it when Hil was the EIC.

http://www.ign.com/articles/2010/08/03/review-scale-changes-world-ends

Maybe they switched back because of audience feedback? The merits of their scale seems secondary to the topic at hand. Both parties could have handled themselves better. I don't understand why it is so hard to treat online as if you were talking to them in person.

 

[antitrop]

Yeah. Took awhile for me to get into his videos, but he really is a funny guy. Watch his ride to hell review. That slayed me.

 

[LX_Theo]

Yes, and the range is the problem, because the difference in that ranges between 81-84 and 85-89 is incredibly unhelpful unless you add numbers in the review and/or if you could articulate the difference between the reasoning behind it getting an 8.9 instead of a 8.7. Give the score and then just explain why it didnt get a 9 and instead got an 8(you can explain in words the short comings or what exactly it was missing to get a 8 instead of 9) but the differences of an 8.6 and a 8.7 from game to game does nothing but confuse the value of the numbering system. If they are afraid that people dont read the reasoning behind their scores, then dont use them, and if you think you need them to be successful, make the scoring system as pointless as possible(I guess you could argue IGN is doing that, but they dont act like that is what they are doing).

I'd imagine IGN would expect anyone who wants to interpret their scores as having read their rating system. And don't go back to the stupid couple 0.1s difference thing. I already addressed that isn't the point.

 

[Speedy Blue Dude]

I need to keep this thread in mind next week when I walk up to my Teacher about my grade.

"Come on! I have a 89%! I know that's a B+, but why don't you give me the A! It's only 1%! Come on!"

 

[KarmaCow]

I need to keep this thread in mind next week when I walk up to my Teacher about my grade.

"Come on! I have a 89%! I know that's a B+, but why don't you give me the A! It's only 1%! Come on!"

I've actually done this before and it worked.

Spoiler

Though it does depend on the prof.

 

[BarrettW]

Both babies, major difference being one is a reviews editor for one of the most prolific websites in the medium and one is essentially a comedian.

 

[Chaos17]

I need to keep this thread in mind next week when I walk up to my Teacher about my grade.

"Come on! I have a 89%! I know that's a B+, but why don't you give me the A! It's only 1%! Come on!"

You can't it will be unprofessional, lol.

 

[Einbroch]

I need to keep this thread in mind next week when I walk up to my Teacher about my grade.

"Come on! I have a 89%! I know that's a B+, but why don't you give me the A! It's only 1%! Come on!"

I did this all the time while I was in school. Teacher would either give me the A or make me write a one page paper or some other small assignment to get the A.

 

[antitrop]

I need to keep this thread in mind next week when I walk up to my Teacher about my grade.

"Come on! I have a 89%! I know that's a B+, but why don't you give me the A! It's only 1%! Come on!"

I agree with your point, I think that people are being willfully obtuse just to get in a typical "lol gamez juralism" jab.

 

[unbias]

I'd imagine IGN would expect anyone who wants to interpret their scores as having read their rating system. And don't go back to the stupid couple 0.1s difference thing. I already addressed that isn't the point.

You can understand why they have a game the score in the 8 range or the 9 range, but you cant really interrupt why it got a 8.9 vs a 9 or why it didn't get a 8.7. When you add a number, you are associating it with a defined value, when you do this it will be compared to other valued products. if one shooter gets an 8.7 and the other gets an 8.9 it is conceivable to assume the 8.9 is better, but in reality the 8.7 could actually be the better game, judged by a harsher critique. The numbering system is broke with these things and adding more complication to it doesn't make it better it makes it worse.

 

[LX_Theo]

I need to keep this thread in mind next week when I walk up to my Teacher about my grade.

"Come on! I have a 89%! I know that's a B+, but why don't you give me the A! It's only 1%! Come on!"

Heh, never really thought of that comparison. Good point.

You can understand why they have a game the score in the 8 range or the 9 range, but you cant really interrupt why it got a 8.9 vs a 9 or why it didn't get a 8.7. When you add a number, you are associating it with a defined value, when you do this it will be compared to other valued products. if one shooter gets an 8.7 and the other gets an 8.9 it is conceivable to assume the 8.9 is better, but in reality the 8.7 could actually be the better game, judged by a harsher critique. The numbering system is broke with these things and adding more complication to it doesn't make it better it makes it worse.

Its just as broke as any other system. Its ranges. The ranges get more specific. They use 0.1s to make it simpler to demonstrate those ranges. I already acknowledged the point that there it does create an issue when you get to the small differences. At the same time, is it better to get your opinion more specifically articulated through the score rather than generalize the opinion in a way that might not be accurate.

Either system makes sense for their purposes with their own flaws. Its as broken as ANY number based scoring system. Which was my point from the start.

 

[Archaix]

I need to keep this thread in mind next week when I walk up to my Teacher about my grade.

"Come on! I have a 89%! I know that's a B+, but why don't you give me the A! It's only 1%! Come on!"

If your teacher's grading system revolves mostly around choosing a completely arbitrary number with no specific guidelines or definitions to what that number means, you absolutely should do everything in your power to do just that.

 

[unbias]

I need to keep this thread in mind next week when I walk up to my Teacher about my grade.

"Come on! I have a 89%! I know that's a B+, but why don't you give me the A! It's only 1%! Come on!"

If you are doing a paper and it is a very subjective type of paper, and your professor gives you an 89, you should probably go try and get an A. I used to do it, and it worked more then once. Obviously if you are doing a math problem or something objectively right or wrong, that is different. We are not talking about objective numbering systems though.

 

[antitrop]

If your teacher's grading system revolves mostly around choosing a completely arbitrary number with no specific guidelines or definitions to what that number means, you absolutely should do everything in your power to do just that.

Have you ever written an English paper? Pretty much every paper I've ever written has come down to the teacher's "arbitrary" judgement of what score the paper deserves. It's not like they just take one point off for every typo or grammatical error. It's not that simple.

I see reviewing a video game very similarly.

 

[wildfire]

IGN must see some value in the .1 scale because they did attempt to go away from it when Hil was the EIC.

http://www.ign.com/articles/2010/08/03/review-scale-changes-world-ends

Maybe they switched back because of audience feedback?

Yes.

We did poll the public and staff before switching back to the 100-point scale

 

[Vilix]

Shame on IGN for acknowledging a YouTube psuedo-celeb. They deserve whatever negatives come from this.

Yep. All this has done is created a controversy that has given Angry Joe's channel more clicks.

 

[xkramz]

Could someone for the love of all that is good in this world explain to me the difference between an 8.9 and a 9.0?

Well if you hit a baseball and it's going way back, a home run would be 388ft but you only managed to hit it 387ft. I say that 1 feet is crucial. So I guess ign care a lot about their rating system. And a 0.1 would mean something completely different since it would then become a 9

 

[pooptest]

I miss the broken down review scores...

Sound: #/#
Gameplay: #/#
Video: #/#
Replay value: #/#
Overall: #/#
etc. which then went into detail why those scores were given.

 

[RPGCrazied]

What game is that from? MGS IV? That's another thing I love about Joe. He does cosplay in most of his reviews. Very high quality stuff.

 

[wildfire]

Yep. All this has done is created a controversy that has given Angry Joe's channel more clicks.

Well it also got a click out of me for IGN's site just to see how different their preview was from their review.

 

[antitrop]

What game is that from? MGS IV? That's another thing I love about Joe. He does cosplay in most of his reviews. Very high quality stuff.

Metal Gear Rising, one of his best reviews.

 

[MetroidPrimeRib]

Do we need anymore proof that the out of 10 scale is actually out of a hundred

 

[Rubius]

Angry Joe has to learn to handle situations like this better. Each time someone accuses him of something he overreacts like a kid. IGN guy is obviously a moron that has nothing better to do but come on Joe just put the guy in his place politely

Well is name is Angry Joe, not "Midly interested Joe". He's passionate and have a short fuse. Here his whole integrity was challenged by somebody who tried to argue that 8.9 and "Believe the Hype" were not signs that they pushed for the hype.

Do we need anymore proof that the out of 10 scale is actually out of a hundred

Titanfall "89.9/100"

 

[SmoothRunningGun]

Yep. All this has done is created a controversy that has given Angry Joe's channel more clicks.

Good for him. That ign dude went full sweet Billy.

 

[EL CUCO]

Man this thread has been an entertaining read. Almost like a Co-main event to when NPD's hit.

 

[Nipo]

I need to keep this thread in mind next week when I walk up to my Teacher about my grade.

"Come on! I have a 89%! I know that's a B+, but why don't you give me the A! It's only 1%! Come on!"

Grades aren't given they are earned. If a student asks me why they got an 89 instead of a 90 and I can't explain the reason I change the grade on the spot. Even qualitative assessments should be based on a transparent and explainable methodology.

 

[Gxgear]

Don't think Angry Joe did anything wrong here. IGN is the posterboy of throwing out high scores, he's just using the image IGN themselves have built up over the years to convey his message.

 

[antitrop]

Grades aren't given they are earned. If a student asks me why they got an 89 instead of a 90 and I can't explain the reason I change the grade on the spot. Even qualitative assessments should be based on a transparent and explainable methodology.

Are you implying that Ryan MacCaffery wouldn't be able to coherently explain why he gave the game an 8.9 instead of a 9.0?

Because I think that he could.

 

[Sethista]

There's a couple of wrongs from both sides on this:

• Quoting preview commentary that does not represent the game's final judgement is misrepresentative.
• 8.9 is essentially almost a 9. It's a very high score. Trying to argue otherwise is highly pedantic.
• Angry Joe's constant namecalling and colourful insults during the whole Twitter exchange paints a terrible picture of him. He's the one that needs to grow up.

Another casualty of people acting dumb on Twitter for the whole world to see. Merrhh.

Im sorry, but when a preview is this blatant bordering on orgasm for a game, it deserves to be called out. One of the main prolems with this review system is exactly this, reviewers play the game a week early, are all high on it, due to hype or reasons, and they praise it to high heaven. A month later, theres always a podcast or article or something talking about a month later, and they bring it down to earth and point out the flaws. Yeah, great, after hundreds of thousands already made their purchasing decision pootentially basing on that review. The structure is wrong, the amount of hype presented in the preview was wrong, and its time all sites that do it get called out on it.

I cite kotaku as one of the publications to follow on that regard. Their reviews are always at least trying to be even with their analysis even when is hard to find obvious faults.

 

[Ol No Bones]

The .1% makes all the difference. You people just don't get it.

 

[plasmawave]

Im sorry but I couldnt believe the dude picked me to get upset at over this. Then he puts the icing on the cake with this: https://twitter.com/DanStapleton/status/456764308811026432
"Fun math fact: IGN has 4x the YouTube followers Joe does."

Oh boy... that's pathetically hilarious.

 

[beast786]

I need to keep this thread in mind next week when I walk up to my Teacher about my grade.

"Come on! I have a 89%! I know that's a B+, but why don't you give me the A! It's only 1%! Come on!"

In my school if i got 8.9/10 it would be an round up 0.1 to A as 9.

 

[bender]

Yes.

Sorry, must have missed that earlier in the thread. Thanks!

 

[Parakeetman]

His hilarious review of mindjack made me actually buy the game.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eK4u4uezIPM

 

[antitrop]

In my school if i got 8.9/10 it would be an round up 0.1 to A as 9.

The only teacher in my high school that was willing to do that was the Gym teacher.

 

[Just_myles]

We should call their review system into question. I feel it is a bit on the psychological side for a game review. I would want a bottom line not a numeric. So basically an 8.9 is high 8, but not a 9.

I don't think they are running that kind of analysis that would merit this kind of point system. If there is some kind of documentation that proves me otherwise, I would love to read that literature.

I understand that this kind of point system has been around for decades but, maybe with this discussion we can look into why it is. Is there some kind of backend deal with publishers?

Back to the topic, Dan was way too aggressive and Joe should have called IGNS review methods into question.

 

[unbias]

Are you implying that Ryan MacCaffery wouldn't be able to coherently explain why he gave the game an 8.9 instead of a 9.0?

Because I think that he could.

Because he puts much more value in the mindset 9 represents... however it would probably much harder for him to argue why it got a 8.9 and not a 8.8.

 

[beast786]

The only teacher in my high school that was willing to do that was the Gym teacher.

God bless your Gym teacher.

 

[antitrop]

Because he puts much more value in the mindset 9 represents... however it would probably much harder for him to argue why it got a 8.9 and not a 8.8.

Yes, I do agree with that.

 

[wbEMX]

Are the guys at IGN seriously making a huge difference between a 8.9 and a 9.0? That alone shows how insane the rating systems at gaming outlets can get, imho.

 

[bender]

The only teacher in my high school that was willing to do that was the Gym teacher.

Not mine. Tuesdays and Thursdays were book days. Still made us dress out though.

 

[Sethista]

Are you implying that Ryan MacCaffery wouldn't be able to coherently explain why he gave the game an 8.9 instead of a 9.0?

Because I think that he could.

I think he could. but then, why dont IGN create a page to explain their reasoning fr their scores? What really matters in all of this is waht the publication sees as a 8, 8.5, 9.0, 5.0, whatever. If that is made clear, all we can do is agree or not with their assessment, and not call them out on a stupid 0.1 point that, for our understanding, means shit. If they do have a review guidelines page, I could not find it.

Hey, if he said that its 8.9 because he feels its just short of amazing, and point out the reason why its not amazing, would be good enough for me to understand. Not agree necessarily, but I would just shrug and move on.

 

[zhorkat]

I think he could. but then, why dont IGN create a page to explain their reasoning fr their scores? What really matters in all of this is waht the publication sees as a 8, 8.5, 9.0, 5.0, whatever. If that is made clear, all we can do is agree or not with their assessment, and not call them out on a stupid 0.1 point that, for our understanding, means shit. If they do have a review guidelines page, I could not find it.

Hey, if he said that its 8.9 because he feels its just short of amazing, and point out the reason why its not amazing, would be good enough for me to understand. Not agree necessarily, but I would just shrug and move on.

The review scale was linked earlier in the thead. As for the second part, I believe that's what the actual text of the review is for.

 

[BouncyFrag]

Are the guys at IGN seriously making a huge difference between a 8.9 and a 9.0? That alone shows how insane the rating systems at gaming outlets can get, imho.

This. Why is this a 24 page thread?

 

[LX_Theo]

This. Why is this a 24 page thread?

Because IGN hate and Angry Joe hate going against one another. Plus some people feel like defending both sides, at the same time.

 

[Axass]

This is the same guy who was asking to host Microsoft's E3 press conference, correct?

Indeed. Hilarious.

 

[Kintaro]

In my school if i got 8.9/10 it would be an round up 0.1 to A as 9.

No wonder schools have become a joke.

 

[Ol No Bones]

This proves how arbitrary and stupid the numbered review scores are.

 

[ScriptedReality]

I need to keep this thread in mind next week when I walk up to my Teacher about my grade.

"Come on! I have a 89%! I know that's a B+, but why don't you give me the A! It's only 1%! Come on!"

0.1%*
Fixed.

 

[Jigorath]

Wow this is fucking disgusting. There's a fine line between a preview and a paid advertisement. If I remember correctly he also declared all Titanfall criticism came from bitter Sony fanboys. Shouldn't a game reviewer have the slightest ounce of objectivity?