Support NeoGAF

[LordCanti]

Kon? It's by OSHII, dude! And everyone knows all his movies are the same, so watch those.

Of that list, the only thing I wouldn't recommend is Sky Crawlers (which is dogshit).

I haven't seen Angel's Egg though.

Well I only seen a good bit of Season 2, is he still the hard ass bang all women, kill those who stand in his way type in Cagligristo? Also does Fujiko get into a cat fight with the other female lead? I too nervous if Miyazaki toned it down since he barely does pure male lead based work. I know that Season 1 was bad ass like the comics but I need to wait when Discotek releases the Season 1 DVDs.

I wouldn't say that it's any less violent than the TV show. Most of the TV show was him using his intelligence to outwit his opponents, and to steal things (usually from horrible people that deserved it).

 

[perfectnight]

Yeah thanks for correcting me. For some reason I thought it was by Kon.

Looks like I should watch Sky Crawlers by him. I think I've seen everything else

 

[Risette]

Looks like I should watch Sky Crawlers by him.

Don't

Sky Crawlers is... a thing. And not a good thing.

 

[Nonoriri]

Yeah thanks for correcting me. For some reason I thought it was by Kon.

Looks like I should watch Sky Crawlers by him. I think I've seen everything else

If nothing else Sky Crawlers is a truly fantastic sleeping aid.

 

[PdotMichael]

Hmm. I haven't seen a single one of Oshii's movies.

bad penguin!

 

[perfectnight]

lol now I'm even more interested. Ever since I watched Garzey's wing I've been looking for something to cover the hole that it left in my heart.

Is such a thing possible?

 

[gatotsu911]

To hell with you guys, I loved The Sky Crawlers. How can you guys like fucking Haibane Renmei and not Sky Crawlers?

@perfectnight: They don't like it because it's slow-paced, dreamlike and "artsy", and therefore "boring". It is not even remotely campy like Garzey's Wing. If you're looking for more of that dark, understated, surreal stuff it is definitely worth looking into. Just be warned that, yes, it is slow.

 

[Branduil]

lol now I'm even more interested. Ever since I watched Garzey's wing I've been looking for something to cover the hole that it left in my heart.

Is such a thing possible?

Sounds like you'd be more interested in Glass Fleet than Sky Crawlers.

 

[Instro]

lol now I'm even more interested. Ever since I watched Garzey's wing I've been looking for something to cover the hole that it left in my heart.

Is such a thing possible?

Nah sadly its on the boring side .

If your looking for Garzey's Wing type of "good", you might try Black Lion or Glass Fleet. Dubbed of course.

edit

Damn you Branduil!

 

[Risette]

To hell with you guys, I loved The Sky Crawlers. How can you guys like fucking Haibane Renmei and not Sky Crawlers?

I don't like Haibane Renmei (and neither does LordCanti going by his earlier posts in this thread) I couldn't even finish the first episode of Haibane Renmei.

 

[Nonoriri]

To hell with you guys, I loved The Sky Crawlers. How can you guys like fucking Haibane Renmei and not Sky Crawlers?

Things happen in Haibane Renmei.

 

[LordCanti]

If nothing else Sky Crawlers is a truly fantastic sleeping aid.

Just when you are about to fall asleep, a very well animated plane comes onto the screen and kicks your brain back into awake mode.

In other words, it doesn't even work as a sleep aid.

Things happen in Haibane Renmei.

They sure do.

 

[perfectnight]

Thanks guys. I will check those out.

ps

Rurouni Kenshin: Reflections



good

NO!

 

[Nonoriri]

Just when you are about to fall asleep, a very well animated plane comes onto the screen and kicks your brain back into awake mode.

In other words, it doesn't even work as a sleep aid.

Yeah shit, you've got a point there.

 

[Branduil]

I don't like Haibane Renmei (and neither does LordCanti going by his earlier posts in this thread) I couldn't even finish the first episode of Haibane Renmei.

Between this and the falling asleep during Ghibli films thing I'm beginning to think you have an attention-span problem.

 

[LordCanti]

How does one fall asleep during a Ghibli movie? There's always interesting things going on in the background of scenes, even if you aren't into what is happening in the movie.

 

[Risette]

Between this and the falling asleep during Ghibli films thing I'm beginning to think you have an attention-span problem.

But I like Ghost in the Shell 2: Innocence. (which is partially a Ghibli movie)

I only fell asleep to Spirited Away, btw.

 

[gatotsu911]

Things happen in Haibane Renmei.

Giant fucking air battles happen in Sky Crawlers. Sorry if the characters don't spend enough time doing mind-numbing odd jobs and baking cakes for one another.

 

[Nonoriri]

Giant fucking air battles happen in Sky Crawlers. Sorry if the characters don't spend enough time doing mind-numbing odd jobs and baking cakes for one another.

Those air battles don't really count as a thing, especially when between those a whole not of nothing is going on between very few, very dry and uninteresting characters who exchange some very uninteresting dialogue. But hey I like Tetsuya Nishio so it wasn't a total wash.

 

[Solune]

lol now I'm even more interested. Ever since I watched Garzey's wing I've been looking for something to cover the hole that it left in my heart.

Is such a thing possible?

It's everyone's dooty to watch Black Lion(dubbed). It's like the mountain giving birth to the planets.

 

[gatotsu911]

Those air battles don't really count as a thing, especially when between those a whole not of nothing is going on between very few, very dry and uninteresting characters who exchange some very uninteresting dialogue. But hey I like Tetsuya Nishio so it wasn't a total wash.

I found everything about it more interesting than Haibane Renmei TBH

 

[Wiktor]

NHK can certainly classified under slice of life, which is why its a rather ambiguous term to attach to shows.

Imo, it can't. It doesn't focus on anything really mudane and most of all it's very strong plot-wise. The show ends with characters in completely different place than when it began and all of them changed noticably becaue of what happened to them. This goes directly against slice of life.

 

[Mortrialus]

The hell is this? Either link me to them or quit making untrue assumptions.

You were in that last Evangelion thread. You and him both get way to offended over the idea that the creators of K-ON had some pretty insidious motives.

 

[Nonoriri]

I found everything about it more interesting than Haibane Renmei TBH

Well finding Haibane Renmei to be boring is a perfectly valid observation/critique. I'd say I prefer Haibane Renmei's encompassing attributes to Sky Crawlers.

You were in that last Evangelion thread. You and him both get way to offended over the idea that the creators of K-ON had some pretty insidious motives.

This is the part where you would show us your evidence of said insidious motives. I think that for example the fact that there isn't any "male gaze" or the like in K-On proves that just the opposite is true (this is dependent on what the criteria for insidious motives is though)

 

[Matt_C]

I wouldn't say that it's any less violent than the TV show. Most of the TV show was him using his intelligence to outwit his opponents, and to steal things (usually from horrible people that deserved it).

Hopefully Netflix would either carry the Sub or watch it at a Con/anime club. I do want to see it now since I loved the second season and the comics.

 

[Wiktor]

Those air battles don't really count as a thing, especially when between those a whole not of nothing is going on between very few, very dry and uninteresting characters who exchange some very uninteresting dialogue. But hey I like Tetsuya Nishio so it wasn't a total wash.

I wish somebody would translate the original novel series. I'm curious about how it stacks up to anima adaptation, especially since Oshi is known for taking huge liberties with source material.

 

[LordCanti]

Hopefully Netflix would either carry the Sub or watch it at a Con/anime club. I do want to see it now since I loved the second season and the comics.

Try to watch on Blu-Ray if you can. Since it was done on film, the jump is really noticeable.

 

[gatotsu911]

Well finding Haibane Renmei to be boring is a perfectly valid observation/critique. I'd say I prefer Haibane Renmei's encompassing attributes to Sky Crawlers.

I guess I like Sky Crawlers' darkness and observations on existential boredom. I found the montage late in the film expressing the circularity of the characters' everyday lives to be really beautiful and kind of profound.

Haibane Renmei I respect, but one of my big problems with it (aside from hardly anything happening) is that everyone in it was too damn nice, to everybody, all the freaking time. It wasn't very believable to me, and it particularly wasn't very believable once the show started trying to convince us of the darkness in their hearts. If you want to talk about darkness, you can't skirt around the subject. And if you don't want to talk about darkness, I think you're kind of dull. I think darkness is necessary to appreciate light.

 

[Nonoriri]

I guess I like Sky Crawlers' darkness and observations on existential boredom. I found the montage late in the film expressing the circularity of the characters' everyday lives to be really beautiful and kind of profound.

Haibane Renmei I respect, but one of my big problems with it (aside from hardly anything happening) is that everyone in it was too damn nice, to everybody, all the freaking time. It wasn't very believable to me, and it particularly wasn't very believable once the show started trying to convince us of the darkness in their hearts. If you want to talk about darkness, you can't skirt around the subject. And if you don't want to talk about darkness, I think you're kind of dull. I think darkness is necessary to appreciate light.

Ultimately I think I appreciate the vagueness attributed to said darkness, it doesn't really build to a tremendously worthwhile conclusion but the surrounding, overall atmosphere is generally enough for me to appreciate what they did there. Well that and the fact that I generally enjoyed the listless, mundane activities of characters in Haibane Renmei more than say those of Sky Crawlers. The format might have something to do with that as well, where I watched only one episode at a time, whereas I was stuck watching Sky Crawlers for a much longer period of time.

 

[Geneijin]

You were in that last Evangelion thread. You and him both get way to offended over the idea that the creators of K-ON had some pretty insidious motives.

Who was it that abandoned that discussion in the first place? Uh yeah, it was you. You bringing it up again is priceless coming for you. If you want to be stuck being narrow-minded, go ahead. Just don't think it's going to be uncontested.

Do you even want to have a discussion? Because you dropped out of the last two we had recently. Also, how does this response from you refute anything I asked you to do? Or is it that you're making an untrue assumption about him by association? Or even a personal attack on me?

It's actually you who's offended by having his opinions challenged than anything else.

This is the part where you would show us your evidence of said insidious motives. I think that for example the fact that there isn't any "male gaze" or the like in K-On proves that just the opposite is true (this is dependent on what the criteria for insidious motives is though)

This.

 

[Dr.Palutena]

Mugi > Mio>Ui > Yui = Ritsu >Sawako >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Azunyan

switch around ui and mio and thats basically me. and put an equal sign between yui and ritsu. Actually no let me just change it.

Also more on topic:
For the most Part I'm pro Dub or rather i'd take english over reading shitty fansubs and the like, except if the dub is really really bad. (Offical subs are on par with dubs though in my opinion)

I can't get into NGE solely cause of all the hype, I've seen a bit of it and i think its interesting but i prob will never appreciate it the same as if i hadnt spent years hearing about it.

 

[LordCanti]

Here's a new controversial opinion, based on my opinion that Cagliostro should be viewed on Blu-Ray:

If your show exists in an HD format in one place, and it's not out in another place, you are asking your fans to get it through some other means. I happened to import it, but not everyone is going to do that. Continuing to have the DVD out there for sale when there is a superior version is disingenuous at best.

(Cagliostro is on Blu-Ray in Japan, but only on DVD in the US)

 

[Salazar]

Regulus, Ritsu being that low is just crazy.

 

[Nonoriri]

Regulus, Ritsu being that low is just crazy.

It really is crazy.

 

[gatotsu911]

I mostly appreciated HR's ambiguity, but the uber-sweetness of the characters' behavior just made it kind of difficult for me to fully buy that there was some sort of profound darkness in their souls. I dunno. I guess it did a good enough job. I wasn't calling bullshit on it or anything while I was watching.

Sky Crawlers is definitely less character driven, but I find it more aesthetically compelling and I find the topics of the characters' dialogues a lot more interesting in general (even though I typically like themes of spirituality like the kind skirted around in HR). I guess ultimately in HR the characters just didn't seem enough like real people I could know for me to particularly care about them, while in The Sky Crawlers the uncanniness of the characters was sort of a point in itself. The way they struggled with their predetermined roles was provocative and their doubts about the way they are leading their lives and questions about how they fit into the grand scheme of the human race and ambivalence about the future were all things I could identify with personally, even though I'm not an eternally youthful child clone soldier or anything. I liked its thoughts about humankind and "civilized" society's relationship with war, too.

 

[Chet Rippo]

It really is crazy.

Well someone has to be at the bottom, or close to bottom in this case.

 

[Nonoriri]

Well someone has to be at the bottom, or close to bottom in this case.

That's what Ui, Azusa and Mio are for! :>

 

[dimb]

Have you seen any animated Lupin? His characterization in Cagliostro is pretty much the same as it is in the TV series. I'd say that Cagliostro is arguably the greatest animated version of Lupin.

I like Caligostro, but it is fairly white-washed compared to some of the other Lupin stuff I've seen.

I mean, the made for TV movies are more violent.

 

[Nonoriri]

I mostly appreciated HR's ambiguity, but the uber-sweetness of the characters' behavior just made it kind of difficult for me to fully buy that there was some sort of profound darkness in their souls. I dunno. I guess it did a good enough job. I wasn't calling bullshit on it or anything while I was watching.

Sky Crawlers is definitely less character driven, but I find it more aesthetically compelling and I find the topics of the characters' dialogues a lot more interesting in general (even though I typically like themes of spirituality like the kind skirted around in HR). I guess ultimately in HR the characters just didn't seem enough like real people I could know for me to particularly care about them, while in The Sky Crawlers the uncanniness of the characters was sort of a point in itself. The way they struggled with their "predestined" roles was provocative and their doubts about the way they are leading their lives and questions about how they fit into the grand scheme of the human race and ambivalence about the future were all things I could identify with personally, even though I'm not an eternally youthful child clone soldier or anything. I liked its thoughts about humankind and "civilized" society's relationship with war, too.

Well yeah, generally believability and in-universe consistency are important, I felt that there wasn't anything that made me disconnect heavily between the way the characters act and their underlying eventually exposed aspects. (or I suppose a lack thereof) though not everything benefits from ambiguity, I find that more often than not it ends up being more worthwhile than the opposite (i.e the meticulously explained) as mysteries tend to be more fun than realities.

 

[Jintor]

I have unopened copies of Summer Wars and the Girl Who Leapt Through Time sitting here and no urge to watch them

 

[Branduil]

I mostly appreciated HR's ambiguity, but the uber-sweetness of the characters' behavior just made it kind of difficult for me to fully buy that there was some sort of profound darkness in their souls. I dunno. I guess it did a good enough job. I wasn't calling bullshit on it or anything while I was watching.

Spoiler

Most of them didn't have "profound darkness in their souls," though. It was just Rakka and Reki, and there were hints at that from the beginning.

 

[Regulus Tera]

Regulus, Ritsu being that low is just crazy.

Tomboys are overrated.

 

[LordCanti]

I like Caligostro, but it is fairly white-washed compared to some of the other Lupin stuff I've seen.

I mean, the made for TV movies are more violent.

I guess I just don't really equate violence to Lupin in that way. To me, Lupin is more of the master of disguise, lockpicking, etc. He's not especially physically powerful, so he's got to rely on his wits. Yeah he shoots people (as does Jigen and Fujiko) but killing people is never the goal. He's only kind of a scumbag, and he fights against that side of himself (I seem to remember him stealing Christmas Presents from orphans or something, thinking they had diamonds or other treasure hidden inside. Upon learning the truth, he parachutes toys and stuff to kids.)

I guess I see him as more of a womanizing modern day version of Robin Hood.

 

[[Clark Gable]]

Most anime is no good, like a good 97% is garbage.

Moebros or Moe killed the industry.

The Yuri pandering that is going around the industry is the final nail in the coffin.

There will never be a golden age of anime ever again.

Anime stories today are written by deviants with fetishes that are disgusting.

Boobs everywhere, Boobs the anime. Panty shots, no story, all female cast, girl love, all contributing the the most unoriginal content in years.

They actually think little girls make the show better, every anime nowadays has no one that's actually an adult.

top ten list, that include k-on, idolmaster, strike witches, birdy, utena, salior moon, are jokes, and at most a troll.

Utena is the entire embodiment of what not to do when it comes to producing, directing, and writing an anime.

I wont pick up a show, or watch it, if it contains, yuri, shoujo ai, girl shipping, any hint of girl love period. This easily trims the fat on seasons.

 

[gatotsu911]

Spoiler

Most of them didn't have "profound darkness in their souls," though. It was just Rakka and Reki, and there were hints at that from the beginning.

I know, I was referring to them specifically. And while the darkness was hinted at, I just felt that there wasn't anything that made its presence truly convincing. Nothing really raw, is what I'm saying.

Also, it's 6 AM and I'm going to bed. Be checking back tomorrow.

 

[Kisaya]

I have unopened copies of Summer Wars and the Girl Who Leapt Through Time sitting here and no urge to watch them

... send them to me ...

Spoiler

you should really watch them though!!

 

[KidA Seven]

Most anime is no good, like a good 97% is garbage.

Moebros or Moe killed the industry.

The Yuri pandering that is going around the industry is the final nail in the coffin.

There will never be a golden age of anime ever again.

Anime stories today are written by deviants with fetishes that are disgusting.

Boobs everywhere, Boobs the anime. Panty shots, no story, all female cast, girl love, all contributing the the most unoriginal content in years.

They actually think little girls make the show better, every anime nowadays has no one that's actually an adult.

top ten list, that include k-on, idolmaster, strike witches, birdy, utena, salior moon, are jokes, and at most a troll.

Utena is the entire embodiment of what not to do when it comes to producing, directing, and writing an anime.

I wont pick up a show, or watch it, if it contains, yuri, shoujo ai, girl shipping, any hint of girl love period. This easily trims the fat on seasons.

.

 

[Mortrialus]

This is the part where you would show us your evidence of said insidious motives.

You say that as if K-ON wasn't transparently a cold, calculating attempt at selling as much merchandise as fucking possible.

I think that for example the fact that there isn't any "male gaze" or the like in K-On proves that just the opposite is true.

Moe rose as the dominant force in anime pretty much because of Key's visual novels/dating sims and KyoAni. The whole original point behind it was the idea that this character was this sweet, innocent and just for you.

Geneijin will invariably respond that "that isn't what moe is about!" To that I say, 'so what'? Even if moe, a term which is vague almost to the point of meaningless, isn't about that the explosion of it was.

If you think KyoAni is completely ignorant of that and isn't pandering to them every second of K-ON, I really don't know what to say. I mean do you seriously think the people in this company really only cared about making a show about girls having fun, and then they were shocked to find that the show was among the most popular among creepy Otaku? Fuck no. They meant to do that. Haruhi Suzumiya as a whole states that they are very much aware of it and K-ON shows just how much they're willing to pander to that part of the anime community.

K-ON is the Transformers 2: Revenge of the Fallen of anime just in terms of how much of a shallow, artless, tasteless, cash grab it is.

Who was it that abandoned that discussion in the first place? Uh yeah, it was you. You bringing it up again is priceless coming for you. If you want to be stuck being narrow-minded, go ahead. Just don't think it's going to be uncontested.

Do you even want to have a discussion?

Do you? Just earlier in this thread, I brought up legitimate, non-moe criticisms of K-ON, in particular, all the things they got wrong whenever the show focused on music, and there was almost always something critically wrong every time. Off the top of my head, I listed two that I thought were really egregious. Your response was to say "oh well the show isn't about that!" Okay. Why the fuck did they include it? If the music didn't matter, wasn't supposed to matter, and the staff didn't care enough to research anything about music and guitar? Why even have it? To sell CDs. Which is part of the problem with the show.

 

[Regulus Tera]

top ten list, that include k-on, idolmaster, strike witches, birdy, utena, salior moon, are jokes, and at most a troll.

Utena is the entire embodiment of what not to do when it comes to producing, directing, and writing an anime.

I wont pick up a show, or watch it, if it contains, yuri, shoujo ai, girl shipping, any hint of girl love period. This easily trims the fat on seasons.

I was wondering when this thread would actually deliver.

I wanna act all mad and shit but this is hilarious.

 

[Jintor]

... send them to me ...

Spoiler

you should really watch them though!!

I was out diving second-hand bookshops today with a friend and now I really want to just read books instead > >