-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Antaganism towards "Always Online"
- Thread starter Mibu no ookami
- Start date
Drizzlehell
Banned
I don't think lack of internet connection is such a huge problem as it used to be, at least around where I live. People who legitimately choose to hoard plastic in their houses in form of useless game boxes, or people who never stop bitching about what might happen to your Steam or console libraries, are the kind of people who never go outside because they're worried they might get hit by a lightning. And even if the internet goes out every once in a blue moon for like an hour - pick up a fucking book or go walk your doggie. It's not the end of the world.
Like, seriously, I've been collecting games in my digital libraries for over 15 years, and guess what - the only ones that I ever ended up not being able to play are some MMOs or always-online games that simply got shut down because developer was too cheap to maintain the servers and they didn't update the game to be playable offline or released a source code so that dedicated communities could keep the game alive themselves. They just hoard those IPs in their vaults like Scrooge McDuck just in case they might find a reason to revive them, even though they never will.
So on one hand, I don't think it's reasonable to worry about your digital libraries, especially on platforms like Steam who basically sleep on mountains of money and will never go away unless an extinction-level event happens on Earth. But on the other hand, I think that any online game should ALWAYS be released to the public if the publisher decides to abandon it, or at the very least updated to retain some form of offline functionality. Not shot in the back of the head and thrown in a fucking ditch next to a bunch of other games that were killed by EA and the likes of them.
Like, seriously, I've been collecting games in my digital libraries for over 15 years, and guess what - the only ones that I ever ended up not being able to play are some MMOs or always-online games that simply got shut down because developer was too cheap to maintain the servers and they didn't update the game to be playable offline or released a source code so that dedicated communities could keep the game alive themselves. They just hoard those IPs in their vaults like Scrooge McDuck just in case they might find a reason to revive them, even though they never will.
So on one hand, I don't think it's reasonable to worry about your digital libraries, especially on platforms like Steam who basically sleep on mountains of money and will never go away unless an extinction-level event happens on Earth. But on the other hand, I think that any online game should ALWAYS be released to the public if the publisher decides to abandon it, or at the very least updated to retain some form of offline functionality. Not shot in the back of the head and thrown in a fucking ditch next to a bunch of other games that were killed by EA and the likes of them.
Last edited:
Fuz
Banned
You have backup copies, for example.
FlaffySheeby
Neo Member
Yup, you are correct that hardware can fail too. I'm not really going to argue emulation because MMOs have private servers too. It just "feels" like an offline game would last longer. I don't really have proof, honestly haha.
One other thing however (maybe it's different topic entirely), Live Service Games are common examples of a single player game being turned into an "always online experience". Most of them are seemingly harmless, maybe something like Monster Hunter. But my biggest concern with a game like that is the development time being sunk so deeply into a game for usually just cosmetic microtransactions. Imagine us getting a brand new game instead of them hounding everybody with crossovers and pretty hats! They're all pretty successful if they can focus exclusively on cosmetics, so I guess hats off to them. But I'd definitely prefer the development time being used elsewhere.
Hendrick's
If only my penis was as big as my GamerScore!
If these countries are too poor to have internet, what makes you think they have game consoles?In the time of Google there are still stupid question like this. Educate yourself a bit, your country is not the Globus is just a small part of a huge planet that has 8 billion people. Out of that 8 billion people most are poor and don't have access to luxuries, yes internet is luxury for some. Now open your browser because in your house that have so many internet cables but apparently you still don't have access to Google search then copy and paste this link, this will give you an idea where the is internet available : https://www.itgsnews.com/mapping-internet-maps/
Last edited:
Vick
Member
No, nobody expect servers to be available for life.. which is exactly the point.
How could you be okay with every single game ever made before the PS4/One generation being forever unplayable?
Pure insanity.
Jim Ryan other Clone
Banned
I have migrated and have very good financial stability now but i come from poor background and thread like this are moronic for me. When i was young my parents did not have the luxury to buy me console so i as a teenager had to work for almost two years to get my playstation 2. (Then put a Chip on it to play cracked games) many people have to put money on the side for couple months to by items you and me (now) can enter and buy from the local electronic store. Then buy one or two games per year. They are not allowed to enjoy life or whoever is living on west side of the world has the right to have entertainment?
calistan
Member
My internet is top notch but less than an hour ago I had this happen and lost my progress in Hitman *again* because of the stupid, pointless, fuckwittery that is their always online policy.
It's probably my favourite game ever, but my god, which dumb bastard thought it was a good idea to force singleplayer Hitman to be permanently online? Pressing retry makes this dialogue box vanish immediately, but if you were in the middle of moving the character and pressing a button, you'll hit the 'go to menu' option before you even see the message.
Always online is only suitable for multiplayer games. This shit is unforgivable - developers seem to forget it's a big part of what killed Sim City.
It's probably my favourite game ever, but my god, which dumb bastard thought it was a good idea to force singleplayer Hitman to be permanently online? Pressing retry makes this dialogue box vanish immediately, but if you were in the middle of moving the character and pressing a button, you'll hit the 'go to menu' option before you even see the message.
Always online is only suitable for multiplayer games. This shit is unforgivable - developers seem to forget it's a big part of what killed Sim City.
Last edited:
rofif
Can’t Git Gud
I am trying to be 100% physical on ps5 aside from Some good deals on psn.
And yeah, I have hundreds of games on gog and steam but it is what it is. Steam game on pc you have some control over. Not like you do on consoles
Talkin Hawkin
Banned
I pay a business for a product. What benefit do I gain as a customer for always online for single player games? None. It makes my product worse, yet I pay the same price for it.
And without discussing politics. Sometimes all of the servers get blacked out by major companies because of a real life social movement, which means I can't play my games. I'm a basement dwelling nerd gamer, IDGAF about the real world, which is why I spent so much of my life on computers. Why should someone else dictate when I can or cannot play a game based on social/political factors? This ain't China.
And without discussing politics. Sometimes all of the servers get blacked out by major companies because of a real life social movement, which means I can't play my games. I'm a basement dwelling nerd gamer, IDGAF about the real world, which is why I spent so much of my life on computers. Why should someone else dictate when I can or cannot play a game based on social/political factors? This ain't China.
Havoc2049
Member
I don't see the point in complaining about this problem when it comes to MMOs and online multiplayer games. When I get into these games, I fully expect that the servers will be shut down sometime in the near or distant future, depending on the popularity of the game or the platform I'm playing them on. It's sad when it happens, but it is the nature of the genre. Remember the good times and move on. If the game has a hardcore following, then you may see some fan servers, which is just a cool bonus, but not expected.
wvnative
Member
It seems to me like people in the gaming community love to make hay over the most random of things, but before I call this random, I really want to better understand it.
My consoles are connected to via ethernet cables... they're always online. This is absolutely not a big deal to me. My PC is similarly always online (ethernet). My Macbook is always online (ethernet/wifi). There is nothing internet connected in my house that isn't always connected.
Which makes me wonder, what is with the vitriol towards things requiring an internet connection? Is there a legitimate concern here or is this just one more thing to get angry over?
*antagonism
If a game that is single player friendly, yet requires an internet connection, than that game will one day be permanently lost to time. It's a massive blow to game preservation. How would you feel if a game you paid for became unplayable because it's servers have been shut off even though it had single player content?
Schmendrick
Member
Always online adds a giant and completely avoidable layer of possible issues to the gaming experience.
Servers have an issue? You can't play.
Internet on your side or server side has an issue? You can't play.
You have to travel a lot? Good luck....
Etc.
To have to deal with this shit just to play solo locally is infuriating.
Servers have an issue? You can't play.
Internet on your side or server side has an issue? You can't play.
You have to travel a lot? Good luck....
Etc.
To have to deal with this shit just to play solo locally is infuriating.
Last edited:
Superkewl
Member
I'll let you know when it actually happens to me...
gaming_again
Member
I can’t believe people are making a ‘who plays old games anyway?’ argument on a gaming forum of all places lmao.
Razvedka
Banned
Imagine you bought a car that required a constant connection to a cell tower. Spotty connections result in it being inoperable. That by itself is irritating, but let's say you've 24/7 perfect connection anywhere you like to travel.It seems to me like people in the gaming community love to make hay over the most random of things, but before I call this random, I really want to better understand it.
My consoles are connected to via ethernet cables... they're always online. This is absolutely not a big deal to me. My PC is similarly always online (ethernet). My Macbook is always online (ethernet/wifi). There is nothing internet connected in my house that isn't always connected.
Which makes me wonder, what is with the vitriol towards things requiring an internet connection? Is there a legitimate concern here or is this just one more thing to get angry over?
*antagonism
Now imagine a couple years later. Let's say 8-10 years. The car manufacturer announces they are "no longer supporting" your vehicle. It no longer matters if you've perfect connection to cell towers. The company kills your car remotely and you can no longer use it for anything.
Some might accuse me of hyperbole, but I'm choosing a car as a physical real world example. It's tangible, a thing that occupies space. It isn't just software. In this metaphor the car could be a game that requires a 24/7 internet connection, or the game console itself (which may in the future also require such a constant connection to do anything).
This is the "as a service" future, where you don't ultimately own anything and the goods you purchase might not work based on external factors (poor internet, their servers are down, etc)- but absolutely have obsolescence built on a timer. Someday the plug is getting pulled on that "service" and your software or device is worthless.
Tell’em Keb
Member
I see both sides, but it doesn’t bother me if a game is always online. If I want it, I’ll buy it. If the devs have some nefarious intentions, I still don’t care. I stop playing all games at some point or another, regardless of internet access, power outages, declining player base, etc. Life throws curves, and I adjust to it. I used to rage over the issue du jour, but now, I’d rather just move on. I’ve been gaming since ‘86, I’m 42. This stuff just isn’t that big of a deal - to me.
PS - my internet is shit and constantly goes out during any sort of wind or storm. I just switch over to a title that will work in that situation and return to the other when I can. I may be seen as ambivalent….but I don’t care, and I like it that way.
PS - my internet is shit and constantly goes out during any sort of wind or storm. I just switch over to a title that will work in that situation and return to the other when I can. I may be seen as ambivalent….but I don’t care, and I like it that way.
cireza
Member
Good on you I suppose.
I choose to completely turn-off my console to avoid wasting more resources than I already waste, so when I turn it on, I don't want to have to deal with a ton of useless updates. Because they are useless to me. Why should I have applied tenths of 40 GB updates for Halo MCC if I am not going to use it anyway ? I should only update before I play it, if it actually brings something of interest. The experience I want is the 8/16 bits consoles experience : turn it on, play instantly. And this is the correct word : instantly. No bullshit.
Thus, I only need to put my console online when I want to download an update or a new game, no reason to be forced into having to connect all the time, or even every week. No reason to have it "in stand by but actually on" with internet packages moving around all the time for nothing. If I don't need it, why should I be forced in doing so ? This is even more stupid with single player games that require being online. Makes absolutely no sense.
Last edited:
Mibu no ookami
Member
I guess this is the boat I'm in.
I'm not into the issue du jour as you put it.
You look at reviews on Steam and you see the same thing... Oh you installed this application that has zero impact on me and that I could just uninstall in the time it took for me to write this review, but I asked for a refund instead of playing the game I wanted to play and wanted to leave you feedback instead.
I think some people just want to be heard and that's fair enough as well.
I think there are some egregious corporate decisions, I just don't know if this is one of them. Appreciate everyone's input on this, it's largely answered my original question
Mibu no ookami
Member
That's a great point. I think it's clear that we're really different types of people. I would want the game updated so when I do want to play, that I don't have to wait at all.
Consoles are always in stand by and always connected to the internet.
March Climber
Member
The way the OP posts sounds like someone who would be content in doing other things if all video games were inaccessible tomorrow. On a gaming enthusiast forum full of people who would not feel the same way, that way of thinking can be seen as benign.
This is an assumption I’m making based on how they’re posting. The alternative is that OP is simply a contrarian or shit stirrer, which would be more boring because we already have tons of those.
This is an assumption I’m making based on how they’re posting. The alternative is that OP is simply a contrarian or shit stirrer, which would be more boring because we already have tons of those.
Saber
Gold Member
It's because of people acting like that, sweeping bad practices to the carpet that we have games Anthen, Battlefront 2, EA sports games, etc.
Companies aways tries to take advantages of those who are fooled by their wording strategies. Its a similar case with the word "free", where its used as an excuse to woop the shit out with cancer mechanics. Also the fact that people can only see their own countries is alarming, this tells they can no longer see outside of their own country bubble. World is bigger than that.
Companies aways tries to take advantages of those who are fooled by their wording strategies. Its a similar case with the word "free", where its used as an excuse to woop the shit out with cancer mechanics. Also the fact that people can only see their own countries is alarming, this tells they can no longer see outside of their own country bubble. World is bigger than that.
Last edited:
Talkin Hawkin
Banned
This is a brilliant point. The majority of modern day gamers fall into this category and have made the hobby worse for all.
hyperbertha
Member
but what if a game you were looking forward to suddenly reveals itself as online only live service with mtx? like Suicide Squad did just yesterday?
daffyduck
Member
But then it would be "bbbbut he wasn't actually going to buy that game anyway". That's often a defence for "always online" in threads like this.
March Climber
Member
I suppose. It has definitely had a factor and pulled the curtain back on the hobby and industry to the point where the amount of ways publishers want to make a quick buck on the average consumer are very, very apparent and in your face.
I think most of the industry’s end goal is trying to make most video games(even the long ones) feel like 80s and 90s arcades again. By that I mean short bursts of fun to where you have to pay more money to actually go forward or win. Most of them even start very easy and straightforward, like arcade games, and then they ramp up the length or difficulty(or both) to where you feel like you need to spend tons of small increments of money to solve either problem.
Mibu no ookami
Member
I won't buy it if I don't want to.
Mibu no ookami
Member
I never bought Anthem or Battlefront.
I haven't bought an EA Sports game in over 10 years.
I mostly let my wallet do the talking for me.
MMaRsu
Banned
Any always online game wont be playable in 10 years, no more nostalgia for that old game you used to love, its a useless coaster now
-tetsuo-
Unlimited Capacity
Most gamers dont care about always online games because they are already always online with everything else in their life. They aren't worried about losing access to old games because they don't play them. They play what is popular and what is available to them and never think one thought about what time the treoretical end of digital store fronts will come. People are already having a field day shitting on Suicide Squad, saying it looks awful but at the same time there will be some outcry 10 years from now when they shut the service down? lol please
Last edited:
Mibu no ookami
Member
Any examples of this?
Mibu no ookami
Member
I don't want to play that game now let alone in 10 years.
I didn't play Gotham Knights either or Arkham games after City.
KingXtreme81
Member
Honestly, if you cannot figure this one out for yourself, there is no helping you. It is, in fact, a bad practice; whether it’s your internet access, or game preservation, or a simple want to not be fucking spied on/sold to, all are valid. If you don’t get that, you’re the problem.
gaming_again
Member
The point is what happens in future if games go in this direction.
GT7 being the prime example of a decent test case.
Mibu no ookami
Member
Yeah, because these people who complain about everything including costs of games are buying multiple copies... That is entirely uncommon.
Are you able to play NES games on any modern consoles (directly)? SNES? N64? Gamecube? Wii?
Like I just don't get this sense of entitlement for forward compatibility.
And when it comes to maintaining old systems, I've yet to see any prominent games locked out.
Mibu no ookami
Member
Are people out there playing GT5 right now? Like I just feel like this is disingenuous as there is little reason to play the older version of Gran Turismo games.
No one is out there saying, let me boot up Madden 98.
Trogdor1123
Member
First of all, I need to be offline in my submarine. Have you seen that terminator movie with Christian Bale? No thank you Mr. Terminator (I’m watching you now op)
Next, I’m good to go with it when it adds value. If something benefits from it, sign me up. But games that have it for “reasons”, that is stupid and ensures that one day you won’t be able to play the game you paid for…
Next, I’m good to go with it when it adds value. If something benefits from it, sign me up. But games that have it for “reasons”, that is stupid and ensures that one day you won’t be able to play the game you paid for…
01011001
Banned
oh god! it was Jim Ryan all along!
GT4 is arguably the best game in the series. just like Forza 4 imo is still the best game in that series, or Forza Horizon 1 and 2 having many things that are superior about them compared to 4 or 5.
Forza 5 was a complete shitshow for example compared to 4, 6 was pretty meh and 7 was meh.
Last edited:
manfestival
Member
I have had quite a few situations where my internet cut off. I learned from that moment to set everything to a setting where I could offline play if possible. Too many people are living such cozy lives that they forget other situations exist
Bonsaibäumchen
Member
Dude I'm living in Germany, Munich and even I have way to often internet issues.
Its way worse for people in rural areas though. France has also really shitty internet coverage be it cable or wireless.
There are millions of gamers that can't be always online. Its simple as that.
And even if I could be, theres simply no reason why there shouldn't be an option to play singleplayer games offline.
ResilientBanana
Member
So how did you post here?
01011001
Banned
so either you are trolling or you are really too stupid to understand what is said...
gaming_again
Member
Ok this is where I tap out lol. The difference in our views on games is too fundamental.
Last edited:
My internet is third world country tier level of bad, so while my systems are connected online all the time, doesn't mean I'd want to play a Single Player game, but not be able to because I need internet connection (when internet goes down), for reasons unknown to me
I like the option tho, if the game gives me an incentive to be connected every time, that would be good and would have no problems
I like the option tho, if the game gives me an incentive to be connected every time, that would be good and would have no problems
I routinely boot up Gran Turismo 1-4. I don’t much care for 5, 6, or Sport.
I also still on occasion play NFL Arena on PS2, NBA Street 2, and Need For Speed Underground’s 1, 2 and Most Wanted among other “sport” games.
There are plenty of reasons to go back and play these “older” games. From the atmosphere, pacing of unlocks, quality driving models, enjoyable soundtracks, and excellent aesthetics and the culture they create.
I know plenty that boot up old Madden games, NASCAR games, wrestling games, etc. just because games today have become increasingly generic and lack a unique personality and design doesn’t mean they always did.
Always Online serves no one any good outside of the publisher. Much like DRM, it is only ever a net negative for the consumer.
Last edited:
Reizo Ryuu
Member
Honest question, don't you think y'all are an extreme minority of an already niche subsection of enthusiast videogame players? If I would look at the entire demographic of "gamers", behaviour as you describe just seem like outliers.
