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[eiskaltnz]

Computer labs are places people spend a lot of time hanging out, doing assignments and group work. Australia, from my own experience, still has some serious racist attitudes towards their Indigenous population, and I can see why people thought the computer room was a good idea.

As people are stuck in the same room for a long time doing work I could see many racist attitudes coming out towards others in the room. This is a lot of what ifs but from my experience I could see this being a factor.

I just feel like a lot of people are coming into this thread and completely shitting on the idea without looking into why it was thought to be needed in the first place. This is a group of people who has been oppressed until very recently and as many others have said are still feeling this.

Making something for one group of people only can be seen as a bit of an issue and a simple change would be to make it the "Indigenous Computer Room" which has specific things only the indigenous people can take advantage of, but allowing anyone in, could work... Or it could end up fuelling the racists fire and just turning it into a terrible place to go.

 

[knkng]

So when you type this, do you see the problem? When one race has power, uses it to oppress or alienate, and is unavoidable?

If we were dropped into a place hostile or deeply unwelcoming, how would we feel trying to survive there?

Ok, but it's not like you can put out a restraining order on "white people". I'm not sure if I'd call it a mental illness, but if you have a fear of leaving your house due to an unsavory comment made on FaceBook, then it's really up to the individual to seek help or counseling. If there was a threat on her life, or gangs roaming around her home then I would understand, but there are some issues that society can't fix for you, whether they're justified to you or not. We have to operate within some form of reasonable cohabitation.

I'm not really sure what the endgame is for your argument.

 

[Littlefang]

I'm not going to comment on the merits of the litigation but I think it's important to give people a bit of context for the facility itself.

It's important to point out that this computer lab is just one (very small) part of QUT's broader program for helping Indigenous students called the 'Oodgeroo Unit': https://www.qut.edu.au/about/oodgeroo.

The broader program involves scholarships and other academic and cultural support services for Indigenous students.

The lab is really just one type of facility the university has set up to facilitate cultural interaction between those students. You have to remember that many Indigenous students come from remote communities or disadvantaged backgrounds or both and there are few of them compared with the whole university population. University retention rates for Indigenous students have also historically been low. Programs like this are trying to help those students adapt to university life, not by giving them a 'safe space' but just by giving them a space to meet other Indigenous students and that's staffed with Indigenous staff members who they can speak to about issues specific to them.

Another thing that's important to point out is that there is nothing stopping, for example, Indigenous students bringing non-Indigenous friends into the lab. So, again, it's not about 'segregation' but giving a group of (usually) very disadvantaged students readier access to other people from the same cultural background and readier access to services to help them fit into university life.

Successive Australian governments on both sides of the political fence have recognised the need for these sorts of facilities. Universities get specific funding based on the Indigenous support services they offer. Every Australian university has facilities like this. It's just very unfortunate that this one has become the target of a particularly nasty piece of litigation.

Alright yeah this program seems totally reasonable to me. It's a shame that the actions of this one lady are bringing such bad press to the program. If she hadn't decided to sue those students, this whole thing wouldn't have even made the freaking news. It would just stay one or two mildly disgruntled students complaining on the internet.

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

Ok, but it's not like you can put out a restraining order on "white people". I'm not sure if I'd call it a mental illness, but if you have a fear of leaving your house due to an unsavory comment made on FaceBook, then it's really up to the individual to seek help or counseling. If there was a threat on her life, or gangs roaming around her home then I would understand, but there are some issues that society can't fix for you, whether they're justified to you or not. We have to operate within some form of reasonable cohabitation.

I'm not really sure what the endgame is for your argument.

To give a shit about the things people say and why they're saying it, rather than dismissing it outright.

 

[TM94]

She also says she was unable to return to work in a role that required her to have face-to-face contact with white people

What a pathetic human being.

 

[Peagles]

I'm not going to comment on the merits of the litigation but I think it's important to give people a bit of context for the facility itself.

It's important to point out that this computer lab is just one (very small) part of QUT's broader program for helping Indigenous students called the 'Oodgeroo Unit': https://www.qut.edu.au/about/oodgeroo.

The broader program involves scholarships and other academic and cultural support services for Indigenous students.

The lab is really just one type of facility the university has set up to facilitate cultural interaction between those students. You have to remember that many Indigenous students come from remote communities or disadvantaged backgrounds or both and there are few of them compared with the whole university population. University retention rates for Indigenous students have also historically been low. Programs like this are trying to help those students adapt to university life, not by giving them a 'safe space' but just by giving them a space to meet other Indigenous students and that's staffed with Indigenous staff members who they can speak to about issues specific to them.

Another thing that's important to point out is that there is nothing stopping, for example, Indigenous students bringing non-Indigenous friends into the lab. So, again, it's not about 'segregation' but giving a group of (usually) very disadvantaged students readier access to other people from the same cultural background and readier access to services to help them fit into university life.

Successive Australian governments on both sides of the political fence have recognised the need for these sorts of facilities. Universities get specific funding based on the Indigenous support services they offer. Every Australian university has facilities like this. It's just very unfortunate that this one has become the target of a particularly nasty piece of litigation.

Thanks for this. We have the same types of indigenous spaces in my University in NZ so it was interesting and surprising reading this thread and seeing that it was such a foreign concept to most here.

 

[knkng]

To give a shit about the things people say and why they're saying it, rather than dismissing it outright.

That's an incredibly vague response to a very specific argument that was made (which you were originally responding to).

Do you believe that she should be offered protection from any form of interaction with white people? Is this a realistic expectation that should be provided to her by society, and how would it be accomplished? Or is this an issue that she has to sort out on a personal level?

That's not a dismissal of issues, it's a question of reasonable resolution.

When someone is attacked by a dog, you of course punish the owner for negligence, and laws are in place to ensure it doesn't happen again (hopefully). But you don't then reinforce the victim's fear of all dogs for the rest of their life. If they can not function due to fear, then they require counseling to get them functioning again, regardless of the legitimacy of their fears.

 

[Aselith]

One of my good friends is an Australian, and he has implied in the past that indigenous Australians are infamously lazy.

Must be true then. Good friends are always correct.

 

[User 73706]

Here's the thing: people are acting like this specifically removes white people from the equation, when in reality it doesn't. If you're an Aboriginal ally and a decent person who happens to know someone, and there are seats open? Chances are you'll probably be able to chill with your Aboriginal buds in there without a hitch. You might get a question or two - y'know, just like minorities are asked (in various forms) why they bother existing on a near-daily basis - but ultimately it's probably not going to cause a dispute.

Now, let's say you're a white dude who's unbridled by the shackles of emotion and subjectivity, wherein your morality is defined by diction and law. You go into a computer lab that just so happens to be comprised of near-entirely Aboriginal individuals. You don't know any of them, you don't know any of their friends or family, and you're not there trying to run a specific errand for an Aboriginal individual benefitting from the program. You're just looking for a computer, and as pointed out before, this computer lab is one of many computer lab facilities in near proximity. Someone steps up and says that it's primarily an Aboriginal safe space. Now, what do you do in this situation? Apologize, ask if they'd mind you finish writing up a dissertation? Maybe just go to another computer lab?

Nah. Let's go on Facebook and talk about how equality is ultimately contributing to the elimination of the white man, and that you deserve to use that computer lab regardless of context, because objectively speaking you aren't a threat to Aboriginal peoples - that's why you're crying about it on Facebook and illustrating how this is an act of reverse racism of the highest order, after all.

If something benefits a white dude exclusively, that's just "business" or "how it is". If something benefits all parties, even though one was already at a marked advantage, ultimately fixing nothing? Complaining about that is "not knowing what's best for you", it's "good for everyone so how can it be bad", it's #FeelingTheBern.

But if something benefits everyone but a white dude exclusively? Oh, fuck that. You might as well just start making up laws by the seat of your pants and feeding directly into the endgame of the SJWs if you're going to let yourself sit there and humor the feelings of someone inferior who doesn't know how good they really have it.

Don't get me wrong, though, it's totally about ethics in reverse segregation.

 

[SecretDan]

What a pathetic human being.

Yeah, this is the correct response.

 

[Sushi Nao]

Here's the thing: people are acting like this specifically removes white people from the equation, when in reality it doesn't. If you're an Aboriginal ally and a decent person who happens to know someone, and there are seats open? Chances are you'll probably be able to chill with your Aboriginal buds in there without a hitch. You might get a question or two - y'know, just like minorities are asked (in various forms) why they bother existing on a near-daily basis - but ultimately it's probably not going to cause a dispute.

Now, let's say you're a white dude who's unbridled by the shackles of emotion and subjectivity, wherein your morality is defined by diction and law. You go into a computer lab that just so happens to be comprised of near-entirely Aboriginal individuals. You don't know any of them, you don't know any of their friends or family, and you're not there trying to run a specific errand for an Aboriginal individual benefitting from the program. You're just looking for a computer, and as pointed out before, this computer lab is one of many computer lab facilities in near proximity. Someone steps up and says that it's primarily an Aboriginal safe space. Now, what do you do in this situation? Apologize, ask if they'd mind you finish writing up a dissertation? Maybe just go to another computer lab?

Nah. Let's go on Facebook and talk about how equality is ultimately contributing to the elimination of the white man, and that you deserve to use that computer lab regardless of context, because objectively speaking you aren't a threat to Aboriginal peoples - that's why you're crying about it on Facebook and illustrating how this is an act of reverse racism of the highest order, after all.

If something benefits a white dude exclusively, that's just "business" or "how it is". If something benefits all parties, even though one was already at a marked advantage, ultimately fixing nothing? Complaining about that is "not knowing what's best for you", it's "good for everyone so how can it be bad", it's #FeelingTheBern.

But if something benefits everyone but a white dude exclusively? Oh, fuck that. You might as well just start making up laws by the seat of your pants and feeding directly into the endgame of the SJWs if you're going to let yourself sit there and humor the feelings of someone inferior who doesn't know how good they really have it.

Don't get me wrong, though, it's totally about ethics in reverse segregation.

I really appreciate this post.

 

[Cindi Mayweather]

Always love how people, often white, chalk up dedicating a place to a specific malaigned race who may need a special kind of care, as racism or segregation. Like, things are so black and white (lol) with them and they don't bother consider context. That's how you get people bemoaning "Why isn't there a White Entertainment Television?" and actually believe those words. People who make these arguments, they just don't get it. They don't want to get it, and what's worse is they don't have to get it.

I have no idea of the situation in Austraila because I'm not Austrailian or Native but reading reports, Austrailian Aboriginals need a support and structure system to help them get on their feet. Comparing to other colonized countries with natives, whether it's USA or Canada, the majority do not take the needs of natives seriously. For that reason, in an University setting, I can understand the need for a computer room for Aboriginal students, to perhaps continue to help motivate and help them.

Funnily, the reaction to not being allowed in the lab is a big reason why they made their own lab in the first place, more than likely.

But of course, that context is never considered. Much easier to be a coward, cry wolf, make a false equivalence of "reverse segregation", and play the victim when you represent a majority.

When situations like this happen they can only account for only one instance, when historically, segregation and apartheid existed on an institutional and cultural level. That's the cowardice and vanity showing. One incident and now they're coming for you. It's anarchy. It's Jim Crow!

Laughable replies in this thread. They have the nuance of a freshmen sociology paper.

 

[Chuck Norris]

While indigenous need these sort of programs and everything should be done to bring them up into universities after years of mistreatment. I don't agree with how this one particular lady is making it all about her. She is suing everyone around her because of a post about a University policy that wasn't even targeted at her? That is downright ridiculous

 

[Cindi Mayweather]

While indigenous need these sort of programs and everything should be done to bring them up into universities after years of mistreatment. I don't agree with how this one particular lady is making it all about her. She is suing everyone around her because of a post about a University policy that wasn't even targeted at her? That is downright ridiculous

I completely agree.

 

[Poimandres]

Safe spaces in general are totally fine, but separating safe spaces by ethnicity or by sexual orientation, etc. is just downright bizarre.

It makes sense when there is active discrimination against a particular group of people. There are a lot of outspoken racists, homophobes etc out there that can make people's lives hell.

And oh hey, I work at this particular university! I'm supervising an exam right now...

 

[trixx]

If I had to guess, I'd bet none of you are aboriginal, or have had any exposure to aboriginal peoples or their concerns. Of course, that doesn't mean you can't empathize or rationalize the situation, but once again, these opinions are flat out wrong.

A lot of these people have nothing. And not just nothing, but they grew up with nothing. Many of them will be the first members of their family to even graduate from high school, let alone go to university. Many of these people have been traumatized by the casual racism that is hurled towards them on a daily basis. In Canada, aboriginal people are commonly called "chugs" due to the prevalence of alcoholism in aboriginal communities. Growing up in Canada, it is pretty much verboten to call someone by their racial slur name, unless they are aboriginal.

Part of the difficulty in these kinds of situations is that very intelligent people attempt to put themselves into the shoes of marginalized groups and say "what would I do in their shoes?". Obviously, there are a lot of indigenous peoples who fit into the greater populace with no concern whatsoever (they even use the same computer rooms as other people do!). I have many friends even in the legal community who you wouldn't know were native unless you were told otherwise. We rationalize backwards from that and say, these people should be fine if those people are fine. But this is simply not the case.

Out of any group that might need a safe space or dedicated computer room, aboriginals are the one. The fact that there even is an aboriginal only computer room should indicate to you that something is afoot. Aboriginals in Canada and Australia have suffered some of the greatest injustices known to human history, both topics covered in extreme depth in hundreds of books. This is not about "equality" or "Segregation", this is about "equity", bringing people up so that they can be on par with the rest of society. There is no difference in an aboriginal computer room and a blacks-only scholarship, our societies and our cultures are morally obligated to appreciate that not everyone is equal and not everyone has the same needs as anyone else. It may be something as simple as a few computers so that a person can be with their fellow community members and foster a comaraderie. This doesn't mean aboriginal peoples hate white people or don't want to integrate, but as is evidenced by the fact that this woman feels she is going to be persecuted, there still is a long way to go before indigenous peoples feel safe and accepted in society at large.

I'll leave it at that for now. For those who disagree, congratulations on not being aboriginal, or for growing up as non-ethnically identifiable.

I actually agree with this. I go to UofT and if there's any group that needs a space it would be of indigenous populations, i know of a few that attend and they have to go through a lot. They are barely represented in university and the atrocities that continue to persist is appalling. The suicide rates among the indigenous populous should be of top priority in Canadian politics, for years it was recognized as catastrophic levels by the WHO . Yes I think they should have their own room and feel free to invite others if they want. An ability for them to come together and connect at university could go a long way for mental health and wellness.

I do think Ms. Prior may be overreacting though. Also 200k bill???

 

[Prototype Viktor]

Re: bolded- Did I never say that minorities might feel oppressed? Sorry but if the presence of someone of another race is making you uncomfortable then the problem's with you because there's no generalization that extends to every person of the same race to the point you can make arbitrary assumptions and exclusions about them

Regarding italics: Lol. If you truly use those words then you have no right to crtiticize people for racism.

I personally think that ethnicity-based scholarships are morally reprehensible anyway. Socioeconomic status is something else.

You realize most people never leave the area they are in so generalizations are hyper focus to localized areas not the entire planet who go about saying they are a race in current history (they were separate in the past)

 

[autoduelist]

One of my good friends is an Australian, and he has implied in the past that indigenous Australians are infamously lazy.

That's a common racist rumor about indigenous people in many cultures. Heck, in America we have racist phrases like 'working on Indian time' [translation: "always late"]. It probably arose at some point because native americans didn't instantly adjust to 'western' clocks, but at this point it's just racist. I'm sure the same is true for Australia.

 

[Sutton Dagger]

I think this thread highlights exactly why these programs are needed, because Australia still has issues with racism, especially towards Aboriginal people. The program described above sounds fantastic, it's a shame that the litigation aspect is going to cast a shadow on what it's trying to do.

 

[dity]

Aussie here, in my experience the Aboriginals in my area entering into the public school system have usually been far and few between - usually making up a small percentage of the school. Programs are set up to let those students meet and make friends with each other to bridge age gaps and let them indulge in their culture criticism-free (it was common for kids to make snark and poke fun at the local Aboriginals' yearly performance).

I honestly think the program is really cool. Through a highschool friend Josh I was able to see how positive and fun the environment was, which really helped the younger kids get past the snark of their peers.

It sounds like the university program here is very similar, and whether or not non-Aboriginies are allowed in or not it still sounds like the goal of the program is the same as the one I experienced in high school.

When it comes to the suing, to me it sounds like a desperation move made by a woman who feels like she wouldn't be able to get proper support through the normal methods. The monetary amount doesn't happen, she's taking action. The students making the posts also don't sound like they came invited if they were kicked out and began making posts like that.

 

[Necroscope]

Many of you need to watch this to have a better grasp from the perspective of people being marginalized for hundreds of years. For the record, I don't think there is anything wrong with an aboriginal only lab as a temproray step to help shorten the absurdly huge disadvantage aboriginals have borne into the society.

http://youtu.be/vX_Vzl-r8NY

 

[Deleted member 30609]

.

 

[bodyboarder]

Under the Racial Discrimination Act, complainants must go through a conciliation process before a Federal Court action can be launched and the Human Rights Commission says more than half of all section 18C cases have been resolved at that level.

But the students were not made aware of the complaint until days before a final conference with the commission, despite the matter having been underway for 12 months, and Mr Wood claims a QUT lawyer told him he did not need to attend.

A year to find out you are getting sued.

 

[The_Kid]

I feel like there are two separate issues, the "indigenous only lab" and the suing/ sick leave.

The lab as a safe space for aboriginals, if needed (Ill admit I don't know too much of the issue in Austalia) is fine, whatever. I feel like purchases or free rentals of laptops would honestly be more beneficial than a singular room only for them, not because it is a communal space but it doesn't paint this giant target for them (and also they would actually be able to use laptops wherever they went). The other issue is the room wasn't signed, so like, it's weird if it is a computer lab where people don't actually know they can't go in unless they are aboriginal? So was it actual policy or did the worker in there just decide to kick the student out?

The other issue is the suing. Okay that's a blatant overreaction. Suspend the student, explain to him why the room is like that, etc. but suing them and then claiming you can't go to work because you might encounter white people? It's hard to have sympathy for that. I mean, the student doesn't understand the context of anything from that or learn anything, the school and worker just gets a ton of money and the students end up and debt.

 

[Snowman Prophet of Doom]

Here's the thing: people are acting like this specifically removes white people from the equation, when in reality it doesn't. If you're an Aboriginal ally and a decent person who happens to know someone, and there are seats open? Chances are you'll probably be able to chill with your Aboriginal buds in there without a hitch. You might get a question or two - y'know, just like minorities are asked (in various forms) why they bother existing on a near-daily basis - but ultimately it's probably not going to cause a dispute.

Now, let's say you're a white dude who's unbridled by the shackles of emotion and subjectivity, wherein your morality is defined by diction and law. You go into a computer lab that just so happens to be comprised of near-entirely Aboriginal individuals. You don't know any of them, you don't know any of their friends or family, and you're not there trying to run a specific errand for an Aboriginal individual benefitting from the program. You're just looking for a computer, and as pointed out before, this computer lab is one of many computer lab facilities in near proximity. Someone steps up and says that it's primarily an Aboriginal safe space. Now, what do you do in this situation? Apologize, ask if they'd mind you finish writing up a dissertation? Maybe just go to another computer lab?

Nah. Let's go on Facebook and talk about how equality is ultimately contributing to the elimination of the white man, and that you deserve to use that computer lab regardless of context, because objectively speaking you aren't a threat to Aboriginal peoples - that's why you're crying about it on Facebook and illustrating how this is an act of reverse racism of the highest order, after all.

If something benefits a white dude exclusively, that's just "business" or "how it is". If something benefits all parties, even though one was already at a marked advantage, ultimately fixing nothing? Complaining about that is "not knowing what's best for you", it's "good for everyone so how can it be bad", it's #FeelingTheBern.

But if something benefits everyone but a white dude exclusively? Oh, fuck that. You might as well just start making up laws by the seat of your pants and feeding directly into the endgame of the SJWs if you're going to let yourself sit there and humor the feelings of someone inferior who doesn't know how good they really have it.

Don't get me wrong, though, it's totally about ethics in reverse segregation.

I don't have a problem with their being a computer lab for aboriginal students, just with the idea that people are defending the mental state of the person filing extremely pricey litigation against a few students who faux pased in one of the most minor ways possible and claiming they cannot even go to work anymore because of the stress of the very possibility they might have to interact with white people in any capacity. If a reaction is radically distant from normal human responses to a specific and common human situation, it's pretty safe the say the problem is primarily with that person, even if there is an objective societal problem giving that person's problem its particular shape.

 

[Gentlemen Demon]

Here's the thing: people are acting like this specifically removes white people from the equation, when in reality it doesn't. If you're an Aboriginal ally and a decent person who happens to know someone, and there are seats open? Chances are you'll probably be able to chill with your Aboriginal buds in there without a hitch. You might get a question or two - y'know, just like minorities are asked (in various forms) why they bother existing on a near-daily basis - but ultimately it's probably not going to cause a dispute.

Now, let's say you're a white dude who's unbridled by the shackles of emotion and subjectivity, wherein your morality is defined by diction and law. You go into a computer lab that just so happens to be comprised of near-entirely Aboriginal individuals. You don't know any of them, you don't know any of their friends or family, and you're not there trying to run a specific errand for an Aboriginal individual benefitting from the program. You're just looking for a computer, and as pointed out before, this computer lab is one of many computer lab facilities in near proximity. Someone steps up and says that it's primarily an Aboriginal safe space. Now, what do you do in this situation? Apologize, ask if they'd mind you finish writing up a dissertation? Maybe just go to another computer lab?

Nah. Let's go on Facebook and talk about how equality is ultimately contributing to the elimination of the white man, and that you deserve to use that computer lab regardless of context, because objectively speaking you aren't a threat to Aboriginal peoples - that's why you're crying about it on Facebook and illustrating how this is an act of reverse racism of the highest order, after all.

If something benefits a white dude exclusively, that's just "business" or "how it is". If something benefits all parties, even though one was already at a marked advantage, ultimately fixing nothing? Complaining about that is "not knowing what's best for you", it's "good for everyone so how can it be bad", it's #FeelingTheBern.

But if something benefits everyone but a white dude exclusively? Oh, fuck that. You might as well just start making up laws by the seat of your pants and feeding directly into the endgame of the SJWs if you're going to let yourself sit there and humor the feelings of someone inferior who doesn't know how good they really have it.

Don't get me wrong, though, it's totally about ethics in reverse segregation.

THANK YOU. I read the first page of this thread in complete disbelief. so much white fragility up in here.

 

[dity]

I feel like there are two separate issues, the "indigenous only lab" and the suing/ sick leave.

The lab as a safe space for aboriginals, if needed (Ill admit I don't know too much of the issue in Austalia) is fine, whatever. I feel like purchases or free rentals of laptops would honestly be more beneficial than a singular room only for them, not because it is a communal space but it doesn't paint this giant target for them (and also they would actually be able to use laptops wherever they went). The other issue is the room wasn't signed, so like, it's weird if it is a computer lab where people don't actually know they can't go in unless they are aboriginal? So was it actual policy or did the worker in there just decide to kick the student out?

The other issue is the suing. Okay that's a blatant overreaction. Suspend the student, explain to him why the room is like that, etc. but suing them and then claiming you can't go to work because you might encounter white people? It's hard to have sympathy for that. I mean, the student doesn't understand the context of anything from that or learn anything, the school and worker just gets a ton of money and the students end up and debt.

1. This space existing is no different than any other club existing at an Australian university. They want to hang out together in one area.

2. The student is an adult, not a child. I'm sure they certainly understand the context of what they posted. They're currently learning the lesson. And don't worry about the debt part.

 

[The_Kid]

1. This space existing is no different than any other club existing at an Australian university.

2. The student is an adult, not a child. I'm sure they certainly understand the context of what they posted. They're currently learning the lesson. And don't worry about the debt part.

Most clubs probably are listed or have a sign out front that say "--- club here". Never said the lab was a bad idea, but that maybe other ideas are better.

That's giving a university student entirely too much credit. And there is a difference between actually teaching them what they said was wrong and suing them into the stone age.

 

[dity]

Most clubs probably are listed or have a sign out front that say "--- club here". Never said the lab was a bad idea, but that maybe other ideas are better.

That's giving a university student entirely too much credit. And there is a difference between actually teaching them what they said was wrong and suing them into the stone age.

Nuh uh, when I ran a club for years all we had was a room we booked and if someone walked in we were like "get out we are doing something here".

They are not a child. They are fully grown adults. What would you suggest happen? There's no way they'd be hit with the full 200k.

 

[The_Kid]

Nuh uh, when I ran a club for years all we had was a room we booked and if someone walked in we were like "get out we are doing something here".

They are not a child. They are fully grown adults. What would you suggest happen? There's no way they'd be hit with the full 200k.

Uh "fully grown adults" is very subjective for people in college. Legally yes, mentally, very debatable.

I think that a 200 k lawsuit that faculty members are apart of sends the wrong message. It's not "here is what you wrote is wrong" it is "here you said this and now pay us", which doesn't teach anything and honestly would probably make them angrier at any specific group. It isn't that they won't get hit with the 200 but rather that it is viewed as legitamate in the first place.

If you are going to punish them suspend them or something.

 

[Gotdatmoney]

Uh "fully grown adults" is very subjective for people in college. Legally yes, mentally, very debatable.

I think that a 200 k lawsuit that faculty members are apart of sends the wrong message. It's not "here is what you wrote is wrong" it is "here you said this and now pay us", which doesn't teach anything and honestly would probably make them angrier at any specific group. It isn't that they won't get hit with the 200 but rather that it is viewed as legitamate in the first place.

If you are going to punish them suspend them or something.

If I thought I could get 200k outta this I'd sue too. These guys aren't gonna wanna get educated if there response to this was to go on fb amd spew some racist insensitive garbage. Whether they learn or they dont learn is not really anyone elses problem. But if the litigation is successful (it wont be because it's absurd) then so be it.

People have so much desire in trying to educate people whose first thought is to jump to entitlement and racism. Fuck that. They can teach themselves if they ever grow to care. Spend resources on people you actually may reach.

 

[dity]

Uh "fully grown adults" is very subjective for people in college. Legally yes, mentally, very debatable.

I think that a 200 k lawsuit that faculty members are apart of sends the wrong message. It's not "here is what you wrote is wrong" it is "here you said this and now pay us", which doesn't teach anything and honestly would probably make them angrier at any specific group. It isn't that they won't get hit with the 200 but rather that it is viewed as legitamate in the first place.

If you are going to punish them suspend them or something.

I dunno dude, I get the feeling that a fully grown adult is a fully grown adult no matter how you swing it.

I don't see how suspending the students does any better job at supposedly teaching them a lesson. In Australia that's basically just like saying "here you made someone feel unsafe, have time off". Because that's the culture here.

 

[User 73706]

I dunno dude, I get the feeling that a fully grown adult is a fully grown adult no matter how you swing it.

I don't see how suspending the students does any better job at supposedly teaching them a lesson. In Australia that's basically just like saying "here you made someone feel unsafe, have time off". Because that's the culture here.

Nah, fully-grown adult is totally dependent on "context" (even though I'm better than resorting to using weapons like empathy or context).

21-year old white dude who wears badges in deliberate advocacy of Apartheid rule, burns the American flag and shoots up a church? Gentle loner, harmless kid.

Person of color who isn't a fetus? Grown man/woman who know exactly what they were doing, and believe me, they were no angel.

 

[The_Kid]

I dunno dude, I get the feeling that a fully grown adult is a fully grown adult no matter how you swing it.

I don't see how suspending the students does any better job at supposedly teaching them a lesson. In Australia that's basically just like saying "here you made someone feel unsafe, have time off". Because that's the culture here.

Agree to disagree then. I just don't see how such a lawsuit is any better. It doesn't seem like it corrects behavior, more punishes them ten times over and ruins their life.

 

[dity]

Nah, fully-grown adult is totally dependent on "context" (even though I'm better than resorting to using weapons like empathy or context).

21-year old white dude who wears badges in deliberate advocacy of Apartheid rule, burns the American flag and shoots up a church? Gentle loner, harmless kid.

Person of color who isn't a fetus? Grown man/woman who know exactly what they were doing, and believe me, they were no angel.

Ah yes, this explains why he is the mentally undeveloped child adult (who somehow got into university) and she is the crazy absurd ridiculous woman out to ruin his life.

 

[The_Kid]

Or, you know, I could just have an alternate opinion on the matter without painting it in the lense of "because he is white".

 

[User 73706]

Agree to disagree then. I just don't see how such a lawsuit is any better. It doesn't seem like it corrects behavior, more punishes them ten times over and ruins their life.

It's pretty apparent the lawsuit isn't going to go through. Also: what's an acceptable form of repercussion for racist behavior correction that isn't a punishment? Because I'm pretty sure it's not indifference (suspension) or praise (all the devil's advocates in this very thread).

 

[The_Kid]

Well, I think it is conditional on what actually happened (Assault would obviously be jail/ lawsuit) but for internet comments, I think 200 k lawsuit is a bit hefty. Also there were 3 separate comments of varying intensity by 3 separate people, that were grouped together.

-I got kicked out of a room, which is fighting segragation with segragation
- Equating the room to a white supremacist room
- a racial slur

First one (which has already been expressed several times by people in this thread in some form) seems like a misunderstanding of privilage. The second is just plain ignorant, and the third disgusting. But I don't think they all should be lumped into the same punishment?

The first could arguably be solved in reconciliation (which the defendant was told wrongly he did not have to go to), which apparently solves over half of these issues?

The second, maybe the same? Suspension, expulsion, etc.

The third, expulsion.

Also, regardless of the lawsuit being thrown out this has already cost them a bunch of money and could cost them tens of thousands more even if it is thrown out. So it isn't like if it is thrown out they aren't already paying out the ass.

 

[Dead Man]

It's pretty apparent the lawsuit isn't going to go through. Also: what's an acceptable form of repercussion for racist behavior correction that isn't a punishment? Because I'm pretty sure it's not indifference (suspension) or praise (all the devil's advocates in this very thread).

Suspension is now indifference, and calling a pathetic response to something what it is is now praising racism. Awesome. I have no problem with the room and resources being there. This woman is pathetic though.

 

[Mental Atrophy]

I don't see how posting racist comments on the internet should be grounds for any kind of punishment except some measure of scorn from your peers.

 

[Chuck Norris]

The ultimate question is did anyone involved do anything that would directly cause her to fear for her personal safety so much that she can't even leave her house? No I don't see that

She may very well feel that but it is likely more reflective of a lifetime of other issues, reflective perhaps of wider social issues - but not reflective of a disgruntled kid having a rant on the Internet. Why should she individually collect on some misguided belief that was directed at a group of people?

You see this sort of thing all the time in Australia unfortunately. Indirect racism about groups who collectively represent organisations to some degree. For example I wouldn't have to look far for some racist Facebook rant about Indian taxi drivers. But you don't see some individual come out and try to sue the Facebook ranter and his Taxi company because he is scared to go back to work

 

[Snowman Prophet of Doom]

It's pretty apparent the lawsuit isn't going to go through. Also: what's an acceptable form of repercussion for racist behavior correction that isn't a punishment? Because I'm pretty sure it's not indifference (suspension) or praise (all the devil's advocates in this very thread).

Why does a few dummies complaining ignorantly to each other on a Facebook post require any intervention from any level of society, other than, say, a FB friend correcting them and arguing with them, if one is so inclined? It's alleged that one of them used a racial slur, which, if true and provable, may deserve suspension if the university has a rule about that sort of thing (and assuming most countries are not like the U.S., where publicly-funded universities [rightly, imo] cannot take action against students for speech-related offenses), but otherwise, this is the kind of shit that plops into the great pool of meaningless human actions without a single ripple, and the idea that society has some kind of vested interest in actively (rather than interpersonally) policing people over this kind of shit is nonsense.