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[daycru]

The fat community are tired of being referred to as fatties.

Bans plz.

 

[i_am_ben]

Honestly, do you feel the same way about other hate/insensitive speech?

let's just say Patriot7 has never been the strongest gay supporter on gaf :lol

 

[fatigues_gasolini]

Honestly, do you feel the same way about other hate/insensitive speech?

Most other hate speech has an understandable negative connotation behind it. Some people dont understand why "tranny" would be considered negative. I always assumed "tranny" was short for Transexual, kinda how Jew is short for Jewish. I had no idea that it was negative in any way.

Banning people from saying Tranny, when they had no idea there was anything negative to being with is outrageous.

 

[scotcheggz]

It's probably the cultural difference between the US and Europe. I realize you were attempting to be politically correct, but a lot of what you were saying was coming off as borderline snide towards gay people, or minimalizing the real situation we tend to face every day.

I'd say it is definitely a cultural issue then as if I made light it is simply lack of understanding. Not an excuse really, but I can say with 100% honesty I didn't intend to come across that way. The fact is, that IS how it is in Brighton, it is both a blessing and a curse and I will admit to lacking understanding in other issues involving intolerance also, simply because here, it largely doesn't exist. It's not a paradise, but is very tolerant of all walks of life and struggles aren't really apparent. Even English issues, like the bnp etc are alien to an extent here.

I have to go out but I wanted to explain more eloquently, but trust me when I say i'm certainly not trying to be rude here about the lgbt community. Mutual respect is a big deal in my books.

Edit, missed the bus anyway. Fuck :lol

 

[RiskyChris]

He said it was insulting.

Yes, it is to some gays. He also said there was a preference, which for some is due to the insulting nature, for others it's just simply a preference for whatever reason.

Just like getting up in arms over TGs getting upset about tranny, it's kinda silly and a waste of energy. Live and let live.

 

[Future]

I'm not offended by it per se, I'm just saying that it's not a preferred usage in general conversation because it does carry some negative connotations when used casually. Like I said, most people wouldn't say they were heterosexual, they'd say they're straight. So use the casual term for gay guys when speaking casually.

Holy shit. Not exactly the same, but it is this type of response that is causing the uproar here. The thought that people are being oversensitive and creating mountains out of nothing. That dude used homosexual in the most innocent casual context possible. To even mention the fact that they might want to use another term is approaching ridiculous territory, and is really how this debate started (albeit a different term)

 

[Gaborn]

That's your choice? Why don't you hold his hand? What will happen if you do?

Why didn't Strom Thurmond embrace his secret black lover publicly or acknowledge his interracial love child?

I mean, seriously, are you being deliberately obtuse here?

Future - Honestly his innocent use of the term homosexual is why I mentioned it. I think it's worth making people think about an innocent use of a clinical term like that and explaining the way some people perceive a term like that. It's just something to keep in mind.

 

[Father_Brain]

That's your choice? Why don't you hold his hand? What will happen if you do?

*Jaw drops* You cannot be this naive. Even in New York City, it's not safe to engage in gay PDA in my neighborhood (East Harlem), nor would I have done so in my old DC neighborhood (Bloomingdale). Most gay people do not live in neighborhoods that are fully accepting.

 

[RiskyChris]

Most other hate speech has an understandable negative connotation behind it. Some people dont understand why "tranny" would be considered negative. I always assumed "tranny" was short for Transexual, kinda how Jew is short for Jewish. I had no idea that it was negative in any way.

Banning people from saying Tranny, when they had no idea there was anything negative to being with is outrageous.

That's the point of this thread, to showcase that it is in fact negative. Banning people for their ignorance is dumb, I agree. That's why we have TGs coming into here to tell people it is in fact offensive.

 

[Bitmap Frogs]

You need a link to know that transgendered people have seen persecution for decades? They received some of the most brutal effects of LGBT discrimination.

In fact, I think a lot of older LGBT issues involved people making derogatory comparisons between TG and gay people. Maybe faggot was the preferred term for hate speech, it doesn't really matter.

Wait a second there.

Not gonna deny they've suffered the most (I know several who lost their jobs and got ditched by all people they knew) but this doesn't make the word tranny offensive.

Because if all it is required for a word to be labeled non-pc is someone to be offended by it, boy we'd have a lot of banned words. Patriots7 example is a good one. He also makes a good point.

The word itself as it is now is slang. If it is being useful offensively, then ban. But banning the word is setting a bad example. Look Chris, I'm fat. The days I'm very depressed it might hurt to hear it. Because I have a bad day every two or three months when I hate I lack the will to get rid of the extra weight should I attempt to ban a word which is not used offensively? Nonsense! For reference, I'm also balding (thanks, dad) - another thread about slang or regular words about baldness? Heck I also have a chronic illness which requires medication - should the word "sick" be pushed for removal?

The N word was consisently and abusively used over and over for decades if not more to hurt and humiliate people. It's still in use today for that same purpose. That's the golden standard. Everything else is lobbying for the sake of exerting power over society.

In my language there's a saying that roughly and uglily translates as "being a bigger supporter of the supremacy of the Pope than the Pope himself". I firmly believe that you are falling into that category right now.

 

[RiskyChris]

Holy shit. Not exactly the same, but it is this type of response that is causing the uproar here. The thought that people are being oversensitive and creating mountains out of nothing. That dude used homosexual in the most innocent casual context possible. To even mention the fact that they might want to use another term is approaching ridiculous territory, and is really how this debate started (albeit a different term)

The uproar is caused by people who are hypersensitive to the fact that people might be sensitive.

 

[notworksafe]

No one gets shitted on in their own threads like RiskyChris. Kinda sad, really.

Also, had no idea tranny was offensive. I can't even remember the last time I used the word, so I guess it's not a big deal for me personally to stop using it.

EDIT: TG is a funny replacement, at least to me. I'll never stop thinking of it as TurboGraphx I suppose.

 

[Father_Brain]

The uproar is caused by people who are hypersensitive to the fact that people might be sensitive.

That's a large part of it, yes.

 

[Deleted member 17706]

Why do we stand to let it slide for transgendered individuals but not blacks or gays or... you see?

I mentioned my opinion earlier in the thread, but I don't agree that being a transvestite should be considered on the same level as someone's ethnicity or sexual orientation.

You have to go out of your way to become a transvestite. It is entirely the individual's decision. Obviously you can't change how you feel. If a person is born a male, but finds that he identifies more with females than males, then that is fine. It doesn't change that he was born a biological male. Nothing can change that.

 

[SoulPlaya]

Why do we stand to let it slide for transgendered individuals but not blacks or gays or... you see?

It's a bit of a difference. The negative connotations of the N-word for instance are pretty universally recognized. You don't really have to explain it. Until this thread, I had no idea that tranny or shemale were offensive. It may not seem fair, but that's life, I guess (dumb excuse, I know).

I mean, I'm Christian, and some of the Jesus stuff offends me (Raptor Jesus, etc.), but I don't think it should be banned. I know what I'm getting into when I start posting on a video game message board. People want to make jokes, and enjoy the anonymity that comes with a forum. People are under a lot of pressure to be mature throughout their "real" life, so I just say that more leeway should be given. In all honesty, I'm someone who hates censorship, so that just may be it for me.

 

[RiskyChris]

I mentioned my opinion earlier in the thread, but I don't agree that being a transvestite should be considered on the same level as someone's ethnicity or sexual orientation.

You have to go out of your way to become a transvestite. It is entirely the individual's decision. Obviously you can't change how you feel. If a person is born a male, but finds that he identifies more with females than males, then that is fine. It doesn't change that he was born a biological male. Nothing can change that.

Tranvestites are different from the classical definition of transgendered.

He is not trying to change his biological fucking sex, he is changing his gender presentation. This is very easy to do. People are born with the wrong gendered brain, in many cases you have to go out of your way NOT to transition because the alternative would lead to suicide.

It's a bit of a difference. The negative connotations of the N-word for instance are pretty universally recognized. You don't really have to explain it. Until this thread, I had no idea that tranny or shemale were offensive. It may not seem fair, but that's life, I guess (dumb excuse, I know).

I mean, I'm Christian, and some of the Jesus stuff offends me (Raptor Jesus, etc.), but I don't think it should be banned. I know what I'm getting into when I start posting on a video game message board. People want to make jokes, and enjoy the anonymity that comes with a forum. People are under a lot of pressure to be mature throughout their "real" life, so I just say that more leeway should be given. In all honesty, I'm someone who hates censorship, so that just may be it for me.

Blacks have a rich cultural history and widespread persecution, to a much greater extent than TG people. That's why we have awareness programs to help teach people about how to relate to the community.

 

[Future]

Why didn't Strom Thurmond embrace his secret black lover publicly or acknowledge his interracial love child?

I mean, seriously, are you being deliberately obtuse here?

Future - Honestly his innocent use of the term homosexual is why I mentioned it. I think it's worth making people think about an innocent use of a clinical term like that and explaining the way some people perceive a term like that. It's just something to keep in mind.

You mentioning it at all is insanity. Why even bother? What good has it done. Now he has to try and watch his tongue when ever the topic comes up. Is that what we want? Its like the whole African-American/black thing that tried to start up from activists. Who gives a fuck about this shit, it means nothing

I think people need to learn how not to react. Its often better not top create issues where there were none to begin with. All it does is flare tempers and provoke response.

 

[Drkirby]

No one gets shitted on in their own threads like RiskyChris. Kinda sad, really.

Also, had no idea tranny was offensive. I can't even remember the last time I used the word, so I guess it's not a big deal for me personally to stop using it.

EDIT: TG is a funny replacement, at least to me. I'll never stop thinking of it as TurboGraphx I suppose.

Sounds like an abbreviation on a highly religious message board for 'Thank God!'

"I am glad to see you are safe, TG."

 

[Gaborn]

I mentioned my opinion earlier in the thread, but I don't agree that being a transvestite should be considered on the same level as someone's ethnicity or sexual orientation.

You have to go out of your way to become a transvestite. It is entirely the individual's decision. Obviously you can't change how you feel. If a person is born a male, but finds that he identifies more with females than males, then that is fine. It doesn't change that he was born a biological male. Nothing can change that.

the thing is, most non-TG people don't identify themselves by their chromosomes. You'd never hear "I'm a man because I have an X and a Y chromosome" or "I'm a woman because I have two X chromosomes." You're a man because you FEEL like you're a man, or a woman because you FEEL like a woman. Your genetics aren't the issue for people generally, it's all about your own perception.

 

[Deleted member 17706]

That's the point of this thread, to showcase that it is in fact negative. Banning people for their ignorance is dumb, I agree. That's why we have TGs coming into here to tell people it is in fact offensive.

So would you be okay with someone calling a person "a fucking TG!" or having websites called "TGsurprise"?

Either way, why are you being so specific about asking for a moratorium on words that you consider slurs against TGs? Why aren't you pushing for a universal ban on any personal insult that targets a person's physical characteristics, ideology or sexual orientation? I imagine you would be equally outraged at a fat person being called a "fucking fatass" or a bald person being called a "stupid baldy", etc...

 

[SoulPlaya]

I'm not offended by it per se, I'm just saying that it's not a preferred usage in general conversation because it does carry some negative connotations when used casually. Like I said, most people wouldn't say they were heterosexual, they'd say they're straight. So use the casual term for gay guys when speaking casually.

It's funny you say that, because I always refer to myself as a "heterosexual". I always thought that calling myself "straight" was insulting to Gays, because it insinuated that there was something "crooked" about them.

 

[Gaborn]

It's funny you say that, because I always refer to myself as a "heterosexual". I always thought that calling myself "straight" was insulting to Gays, because it insinuated that there was something "crooked" about them.

Then you're a fairly unusual person. I can't say I've ever met someone who identified themselves that way.

 

[Deleted member 17706]

the thing is, most non-TG people don't identify themselves by their chromosomes. You'd never hear "I'm a man because I have an X and a Y chromosome" or "I'm a woman because I have two X chromosomes." You're a man because you FEEL like you're a man, or a woman because you FEEL like a woman. Your genetics aren't the issue for people generally, it's all about your own perception.

Okay. So shouldn't TGs be trying to change social perceptions of what "man" and "woman" mean instead of using surgery to and cosmetic solutions to adapt themselves society's commonly accepted perception of "man" and "woman"?

 

[SoulPlaya]

Then you're a fairly unusual person. I can't say I've ever met someone who identified themselves that way.

Can't argue against that, lol.

 

[RiskyChris]

So would you be okay with someone calling a person "a fucking TG!" or having websites called "TGsurprise"?

Either way, why are you being so specific about asking for a moratorium on words that you consider slurs against TGs? Why aren't you pushing for a universal ban on any personal insult that targets a person's physical characteristic? I imagine you would be equally outraged at a fat person being called a "fucking fatass" or a bald person being called a "stupid baldy", etc...

I'm being specific because I've seen specific instances of this happening. This doesn't preclude me from believing in other causes? I don't need to fight every cause simultaneously otherwise face being wrong or something.

My posting ideology is generally this: "I don't like seeing people torn down." I've posted nearly literally those words before when people cried and bitched about hipsters, etc.

Okay. So shouldn't TGs be trying to change social perceptions of what "man" and "woman" mean instead of using surgery to and cosmetic solutions to adapt themselves society's commonly accepted perception of "man" and "woman"?

Uh they do? But we live in an imperfect world. To live their dream they need these procedures.

 

[Zaraki_Kenpachi]

*Jaw drops* You cannot be this naive. Even in New York City, it's not safe to engage in gay PDA in my neighborhood (East Harlem), nor would I have done so in my old DC neighborhood (Bloomingdale). Most gay people do not live in neighborhoods that are fully accepting.

Ok, I have no idea where he lives. Where I live there is no problems with gays holding hands. Harlem isn't exactly a great neighborhood so I can understand problems there.

 

[Bitmap Frogs]

The uproar is caused by people who are hypersensitive.

Goes both ways.

That's a very biased way of describing the situation.

 

[i_am_ben]

I think this is on a per-homosexual basis... I and many other gay friends of mine don't find the term offensive at all. Hell, I don't even think most of GayGAF is offended by it!

I'm inclined to agree. I mean i've dropped every gay slur imaginable in the gay thread.

<3 sodomite-gaf

 

[HolyCheck]

As you said in the thread title.. I put forward the notion that calling Australians Racist should be banned too

 

[Patriots7]

Honestly, do you feel the same way about other hate/insensitive speech?

Of course I do.

There are numerous words that can be extremely vicious if you know the intent behind the speaker. Banning them all would be near impossible because a lot of them are simply descriptive words that are commonly use and accepted as someones identity.

 

[Gaborn]

Okay. So shouldn't TGs be trying to change social perceptions of what "man" and "woman" mean instead of using surgery to and cosmetic solutions to adapt themselves society's commonly accepted perception of "man" and "woman"?

No. Why should they do that? Their problem is the way they perceive themselves, they don't object to society's definitions, they EMBRACE them, and want to be like the opposite sex in every way they can. You can't "fix" your genes, but no one I know would "check" that themselves. I mean, aside from your genitalia do you KNOW you're an XY male?

 

[Hex]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stonewall_riots
Quote:
In 1966, drag queens, hustlers, and transvestites were sitting in Compton's Cafeteria in San Francisco when the police arrived to arrest men dressed as women.

"supposed brutal" Yeah, there is a history of persecution of the most visibly gender-fucking members of the LGBTQ community.

Would that be considered a drag-net?

 

[Deleted member 17706]

Perhaps. But just because people have "forgotten" disgusting slang terms like "kike" or "spic" or "chink" or "wetback" on and on and on or never heard them before doesn't mean they're not offensive, so either way his post doesn't make much sense.

Then you're a fairly unusual person. I can't say I've ever met someone who identified themselves that way.

Hrmm... so you are the one who decides which words are offensive to whom and which aren't. I see...

 

[Tntnnbltn]

Ok, I have no idea where he lives. Where I live there is no problems with gays holding hands. Harlem isn't exactly a great neighborhood so I can understand problems there.

He lives in Canada, but said earlier that:

i can't even feel comfortable pecking my bf on the lips in public because of people have pointed or called us faggots.

I'd imagine hand-holding would ellicit a similar response.

 

[RiskyChris]

Of course I do.

There are numerous words that can be extremely vicious if you know the intent behind the speaker. Banning them all would be near impossible because a lot of them are simply descriptive words that are commonly use and accepted as someones identity.

Ok, so you think we should unban the use of nigger, fag, jap, etc?

Goes both ways.

That's a very biased way of describing the situation.

No it doesn't go both ways. One group is saying they are sensitive to something and the other group is being reactionary and insensitive in response.

 

[Furret]

I'm being specific because I've seen specific instances of this happening. This doesn't preclude me from believing in other causes? I don't need to fight every cause simultaneously otherwise face being wrong or something.

My posting ideology is generally this: "I don't like seeing people torn down." I've posted nearly literally those words before when people cried and bitched about hipsters, etc.



Uh they do? But we live in an imperfect world. To live their dream they need these procedures.

That's nice, but there doesn't mean there should be a law against it.

Or does free speech only apply to things you have specifically authorised?

 

[ghst]

As you said in the thread title.. I put forward the notion that calling Australians Racist should be banned too

yeah, the word racist carries quite enough weight on its own.

 

[Zaraki_Kenpachi]

Why didn't Strom Thurmond embrace his secret black lover publicly or acknowledge his interracial love child?

I mean, seriously, are you being deliberately obtuse here?

Future - Honestly his innocent use of the term homosexual is why I mentioned it. I think it's worth making people think about an innocent use of a clinical term like that and explaining the way some people perceive a term like that. It's just something to keep in mind.

Yeesh, dude. Stop trying to attack everyone over every little thing. I have no idea why he didn't, like I said by me one of my friends who is gay holds his bf's hand as much as any other couple and never had a problem.

He lives in Canada, but said earlier that:


I'd imagine hand-holding would ellicit a similar response.

Ok, that makes sense. I dunno, people act say stupid things with my friend too but that doesn't stop him from being affectionate towards his boyfriend. Was just curious why he couldn't.

 

[RiskyChris]

That's nice, but there doesn't mean there should be a law against it.

Or does free speech only apply to things you have specifically authorised?

Do you realize you have limited free speech on NeoGAF? I'm not asking for a law, this is a fucking forum.

 

[afternoon delight]

yeah, the word racist carries quite enough weight on its own.

 

[Gaborn]

Seriously now. Have ANYONE posting in this thread had their chromosomes checked? Do you KNOW you're a biological XY male? Or XX female?

 

[Hex]

Ok, so you think we should unban the use of nigger, fag, jap, etc?



No it doesn't go both ways. One group is saying they are sensitive to something and the other group is being reactionary and insensitive in response.

So one group has the right to put out a case for sensitivity but the other side does not have the right to make a case for perhaps over sensitivity?
Not saying either side is right or wrong, but both have an opinion

 

[btkadams]

Ok, I have no idea where he lives. Where I live there is no problems with gays holding hands. Harlem isn't exactly a great neighborhood so I can understand problems there.

i live in canada. i live in a city that has the lowest crime rate out of any other major city actually.

 

[Deleted member 17706]

Seriously now. Have ANYONE posting in this thread had their chromosomes checked? Do you KNOW you're a biological XY male? Or XX female?

Does it matter? My stance is anyone who willingly gets cosmetic surgery to modify their appearance should be willing to be called out about it.

 

[BattleMonkey]

Seriously now. Have ANYONE posting in this thread had their chromosomes checked? Do you KNOW you're a biological XY male? Or XX female?

This has what now to do with anything?

 

[Gaborn]

Does it matter? My stance is anyone who willingly gets cosmetic surgery to modify their appearance should be willing to be called out about it.

It does for anyone making an argument involving the biology of a transsexual, yes.

 

[JoeBoy101]

I'm really wondering if in this 'discussion' there will come a point when the other Gaffers realize that language can be used as a weapon regardless of the exact term or combination of letters to form said word. Then would come the realization of the complete fallacy of trying to 'police' language effectively and/or fairly, and that one can only 'police' those who use language as a weapon.

 

[NinjaFridge]

i live in canada. i live in a city that has the lowest crime rate out of any other major city actually.

I always imagined you lived in L.A.

World crumbling around me...

 

[scotcheggz]

Does it matter? My stance is anyone who willingly gets cosmetic surgery to modify their appearance should be willing to be called out about it.

Why do you need to call someone out about it though? At the end of the day, why does it matter to you?

 

[Furret]

Do you realize you have limited free speech on NeoGAF? I'm not asking for a law, this is a fucking forum.

Okay, I find the word "potato" offensive.

I demand that anyone that uses it be banned or I will start self-obsessed threads in which I post every other minute with detailed discussion on how I am morally superior to everyone else and why my lifestyle is the most fascinating subject matter on the Internet.