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[malfcn]

CLEVELAND, Ohio -- A rookie Cleveland police officer shot a 12-year-old boy outside a city recreation center late Saturday afternoon after the boy pulled a BB gun from his waistband, police said.

Police were responding to reports of a male with a gun outside Cudell Recreation Center at Detroit Avenue and West Boulevard about 3:30 p.m., Deputy Chief of Field Operations Ed Tomba said.

A rookie officer and a 10-15 year veteran pulled into the parking lot and saw a few people sitting underneath a pavilion next to the center. The rookie officer saw a black gun sitting on the table, and he saw the boy pick up the gun and put it in his waistband, Cleveland Police Patrolmen's Association President Jeffrey Follmer said.

The officer got out of the car and told the boy to put his hands up. The boy reached into his waistband, pulled out the gun and the rookie officer fired two shots, Tomba said.

Tomba said the child did not threaten the officer verbally or physically.

At least one of the shots hit the child in the stomach. He was rushed to MetroHealth Medical Center in serious condition. His current condition was not immediately known.

Those are the only details I found so far.
Personally, I couldn't do the job. The decisions that have to be made very quickly can go wrong on both sides before consequences and options can be weighed.

Source.

 

[orochi91]

Can't blame that cops for that one.

Stupid kid, pulling a gun on them :/

 

[freenudemacusers]

terrible all around, wtf was that kid doing with a gun that looked like that? I didn't know you could even buy shit like that anymore.

and putting it in your waistband? reaching for it when a cop is pointing a gun at you?

while typing I found this:

http://*******/usa/208023-cleveland-police-shot-boy/

Upon further investigation, the boy’s “weapon” turned out to be an air gun “resembling a semi-automatic pistol, with the orange safety indicator removed,” the statement adds.

oh banned site. hm. does look like the orange tip was removed, though.

 

[Razgriz-Specter]

Recently caught my little brother playing with his friends BB guns outside.
I basically told them if a cop saw them with it they would be shot, so not to mess with them.

terrible all around, wtf was that kid doing with a gun that looked like that? I didn't know you could even buy shit like that anymore.

Many airsoft guns(the more friendly kind) have the orange tips, most airguns(the dangerous kind) don't have orange tips

 

[malfcn]

More here.

The man told police he was at the park near Cudell Recreation Center and could see "a guy with a pistol" on the swing set pulling the weapon from his pants and "scaring the s--t out of everyone."
"There's a guy with a pistol, and it's probably fake," he said quickly, "but he's pointing it everybody."

Probably fake or not, it looked real.

 

[PaulloDEC]

"Toys" resembling real firearms should be illegal, and stuff like this is going to keep happening until they are.

 

[Lamel]

Damn...that's just terrible. I can't really blame them here though.

 

[.GqueB.]

Holy crap at that gun. Hooooly crap.

 

[Sanjuro]

Kid, we'll shoot your eye out.

Oh god at that bb gun. I feel like my generation went through that whole phase of making them look silly enough, then I see one like that currently.

 

[diamount]

Hopefully he pulls through.

 

[tirminyl]

This is just sad. Did this kid even hear the officer yelling for him to put his hands up? Hope the kid pulls through.

 

[Massive Duck. C.M.]

Good luck, little boy

 

[Bitmap Frogs]

Can't blame this one on the cop.

 

[Jmanunknown]

Can't blame that cops for that one.

Stupid kid, pulling a gun on them :/

Uh yes you can one is a street judge I mean police officer carrying a loaded weapon the other is a kid playing with a bb gun. One person is in the hospital fighting for their life the other gets to go home unharmed. Only one person fired a gun and it was not the kid carrying a bb gun so yes you can blame the street judges sorry I mean police officers.

 

[Septy]

Police claim the kid pointed the gun at them, but that doesn't mean it actually occurred.

 

[BrokenEchelon]

Why is there such a thing as a toy version of a tool whose sole purpose is to fucking kill or maim living things? I never understood that shit.

 

[.GqueB.]

Uh yes you can one is a street judge I mean police officer carrying a loaded weapon the other is a kid playing with a bb gun. One person is in the hospital fighting for their life the other gets to go home unharmed. Only one person fired a gun and it was not the kid carrying a bb gun so yes you can blame the street judges sorry I mean police officers.

I wouldn't call putting a kid in the hospital and wondering if he's going to pull through going home "unharmed". He's not a robot cop.

 

[Apath]

Uh yes you can one is a street judge I mean police officer carrying a loaded weapon the other is a kid playing with a bb gun. One person is in the hospital fighting for their life the other gets to go home unharmed. Only one person fired a gun and it was not the kid carrying a bb gun so yes you can blame the street judges sorry I mean police officers.

So at what point is it acceptable for a police officer to defend themselves? If someone is already shooting at them, it's already too late.

Why is there such a thing as a toy version of a tool whose sole purpose is to fucking kill or maim living things? I never understood that shit.

Probably for the same reason we have toy swords.

 

[Massive Duck. C.M.]

So at what point is it acceptable for a police officer to defend themselves? If someone is already shooting at them, it's already too late.

In the article, the department's field ops guy says the kid didn't threaten the officers verbally or physically, so I'm guessing he didn't shoot

He also says it seems like the rookie didn't obey an order

ED: actually I think I misread that, he was probably talking about the kid not following the rookie's command

 

[Apath]

In the article, the department's field ops guy says the kid didn't threaten the officers verbally or physically, so I'm guessing he didn't shoot

He also says it seems like the rookie didn't obey an order

Pulling a gun out of your waistrap sounds like enough of a reason to me. It's tragic but you cannot draw on an officer.

 

[Whitechocolatekrispies]

Uh yes you can one is a street judge I mean police officer carrying a loaded weapon the other is a kid playing with a bb gun. One person is in the hospital fighting for their life the other gets to go home unharmed. Only one person fired a gun and it was not the kid carrying a bb gun so yes you can blame the street judges sorry I mean police officers.

Prejudice much?

 

[masud]

Police claim the kid pointed the gun at them, but that doesn't mean it actually occurred.

This.

Its amazing how many people pull fake guns (or other non gun objects) on cops forcing the cops to shoot them. Lots of suicidal people out there...

 

[Jmanunknown]

I wouldn't call putting a kid in the hospital and wondering if he's going to pull through going home "unharmed". He's not a robot cop.

How do you know if if he is wondering if he is gonna pull through? Mentally he may not be fine but, we do not know since we are not him. Physically he is fine though and It is not like he is gonna get punished for shooting a 12 year old boy. They'll put it down as an accident and if the kid dies they'll just put him down as another justified homicide.

Prejudice much?

Against what? I do not dislike cops. I just believe they have way to much power and no one is really doing anything about it.

So at what point is it acceptable for a police officer to defend themselves? If someone is already shooting at them, it's already too late.

Not every one is out to get the cops but, I guess it is ok for the police to assume everyone is out to kill them since the US has so many guns. It is basically their free pass to shoot anything they want as long as they follow procedure. It is not like they can actually take people in who have guns and not shoot them. That never happens oh wait it does. I mean their was video of a guy pointing a gun at people at a overpass and the police in that incident handled the situation perfectly. No one was shot and everyone came out of the situation without bullet wounds and life threatening injuries.

 

[Overdoziz]

maybe dont sell toy guns that look like real guns
maybe

 

[Massive Duck. C.M.]

This.

Its amazing how many people pull fake guns (or other non gun objects) on cops forcing the cops to shoot them. Lots of suicidal people out there...

There's a video of an adult dancing with a real gun out and the cop tries to reason with him for a while before the guy ends up shooting the cop

Gotta watch out for those 12 year olds tho

 

[diamount]

maybe dont sell toy guns that look like real guns
maybe

BB guns aren't 'toys'. They aren't made by Fisher Price.

 

[ramuh]

Shit that looks like a real weapon.

 

[.GqueB.]

How do you know if if he is wondering if he is gonna pull through? Mentally he may not be fine but, we do not know since we are not him. Physically he is fine though and It is not like he is gonna get punished for shooting a 12 year old boy. They'll put it down as an accident and if the kid dies they'll just put him down as another justified homicide.

Why assume he's not and pass judgment? Just seems like a strange stance to take.

But whatever man, do you.

 

[Jmanunknown]

Why assume he's not and pass judgment? Just seems like a strange stance to take.

But whatever man, do you.

Just being cynical I guess. Tired of hearing crappy stories of people getting shot by police officers where it was not necessary.

 

[lightus]

How do you know if if he is wondering if he is gonna pull through? Mentally he may not be fine but, we do not know since we are not him. Physically he is fine though and It is not like he is gonna get punished for shooting a 12 year old boy. They'll put it down as an accident and if the kid dies they'll just put him down as another justified homicide.

You're completely ignoring the fact that the boy pointed what looked like a lethal weapon at the officers. I know I would be afraid for my life if that was pointed at me, 12 year old boy or not.

Against what? I do not dislike cops. I just believe they have way to much power and no one is really doing anything about it.

I don't really see how cops having too much power plays into this specific scenario.




----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

This is a bad scenario overall though and it's unfortunate that it played out this way.

 

[speculawyer]

Oh, FFS.

What kind of parent lets a 12 year old kid go around an urban area with a pistol?

This kind of shit should not be happening.
1) Kids should not be carrying pistols.
2) There should not be so many guns out there that the cops have to shoot anyone who looks like they have a gun.

 

[Javaman]

This.

Its amazing how many people pull fake guns (or other non gun objects) on cops forcing the cops to shoot them. Lots of suicidal people out there...

I'd imagine some of those are people who panic and try to hand the gun to the cop to show it's not real without thinking about the consequences.

 

[.GqueB.]

Just being cynical I guess. Tired of hearing crappy stories of people getting shot by police officers where it was not necessary.

I hear ya.

This just seems like one of those situations where it's not necessary to pick a side. Just a rather unfortunate situation based on what we know.

 

[Sophia]

I really want to know why this kid had a BB gun in a recreational center of all places. There's a lot of unanswered questions too. Where were the parents on this? Did the kid hear the officer? What about the other people at the pavilion? You're telling me nobody else there knew this 12 year old boy carrying around a BB gun? Was the rookie officer not informed that the guy could possibly be fake?

 

[Jmanunknown]

You're completely ignoring the fact that the boy pointed what looked like a lethal weapon at the officers. I know I would be afraid for my life if that was pointed at me, 12 year old boy or not.

Are people actually reading the article where does it say he pointed the gun at them?
It says

"The officer got out of the car and told the boy to put his hands up. The boy reached into his waistband, pulled out the gun and the rookie officer fired two shots, Tomba said."

At no point does it say he pointed the gun at them it says he pulled it out of his waistband and was then shot. Who knows what he was gonna do with it but, lets just go ahead and say he pointed it at them because that is what the article said oh wait no.

This is a bad scenario overall though and it's unfortunate that it played out this way.

Yeah it is a real bad scenario for everyone involved but it is really bad for a police department already under investigation by the justice department for you guessed it possibly regularly using excessive force against its citizens.

 

[PaulloDEC]

Not every one is out to get the cops but, I guess it is ok for the police to assume everyone is out to kill them since the US has so many guns. It is basically their free pass to shoot anything they want as long as they follow procedure. It is not like they can actually take people in who have guns and not shoot them. That never happens oh wait it does. I mean their was video of a guy pointing a gun at people at a overpass and the police in that incident handled the situation perfectly. No one was shot and everyone came out of the situation without bullet wounds and life threatening injuries.

It'd be wonderful to live in a world where every cop was a steely-eyed superhero capable of facing down armed suspects without fearing that a split-second of inaction might cost them, or any of those around them, their life. That's not the world we live in though. Tough decisions are made, and sometimes they're the wrong ones.

Some of these tough decisions could be avoided entirely if children didn't have access to things that look like real weapons. There are other people out there who are more responsible for this happening than the police officer is, IMO.

 

[Volimar]

Crazy stupid thing to do kid. Hope you pull through okay.

 

[Richfield]

Are people actually reading the article where does it say he pointed the gun at them?
It says

At no point does it say he pointed the gun at them it says he pulled it out of his waistband and was then shot. Who knows what he was gonna do with it but, lets just go ahead and say he pointed it at them because that is what the article said oh wait no.

So cops should wait for the gun to be pointed at them first?

 

[Jmanunknown]

So cops should wait for the gun to be pointed at them first?

Well in this incident it was not a gun so are you telling me he was justified in shooting the kid? I never said they should wait for the gun to be pointed at them . I am saying they could have handled the situation better hindsight is 20/20 though so. Just makes them look worse especially with the justice department investigating their department for this type of situation.

 

[Tekniqs]

shit looks like a real gun. It's not like he could take a closer look to make sure first....

 

[Rembrandt]

So why do cops even have tasers or pepper spray? It's unfortunate that this happened and this gun looks extremely real, but aren't their precautions in place? Especially when the victim is obviously not even an adult.

 

[Sophia]

It'd be wonderful to live in a world where every cop was a steely-eyed superhero capable of facing down armed suspects without fearing that a split-second of inaction might cost them, or any of those around them, their life. That's not the world we live in though. Tough decisions are made, and sometimes they're the wrong ones.

Some of these tough decisions could be avoided entirely if children didn't have access to things that look like real weapons. There are other people out there who are more responsible for this happening than the police officer is, IMO.

I view it like this with the limited amount of details given: The officers made poor judgement.... but not necessarily the wrong judgement. On one hand, the fact that the gun was out in the open among people + with the age of the boy and lack of verbal thread suggested they probably overreacted a bit too quickly. On the other hand, the reality is that making such a judgement call is genuinely hard, and they have to act quickly in case the worst scenario plays out. Those details are not for us to determine tho, but rather that of the city and police department.

The real people to blame in all this are the parents/legal guardians of the boy. There is absolutely no reason for a boy to be carrying around a semi-realistic BB gun in a public place. None. At all. Especially one that's missing the red cap indicator that it's a fake gun.

 

[Zomba13]

Can't blame that cops for that one.

Stupid kid, pulling a gun on them :/

Yeah. It's a super shitty and horrible situation but the cop said to put his hands up and instead the kid reached for a gun. A fake gun but the cops couldn't tell at that distance.

Should have put his hands up and explained it wasn't real, let the cops go over and check it. Even if he was pulling it out to put it down or show them it was fake when a cop points a gun at you and tells you to do something most often you should probably just do it, it should be common knowledge how trigger happy cops are by now. Best not to make sudden movements or go for anything that could be seen as a weapon when they have theirs on you.

 

[Doctoglethorpe]

The shoot first attitude is insane enough in general, but to do it against a little kid is.. I don't even understand it. You'd think there would be tests to make sure people that trigger-snappy don't get the job. But no of course not.

 

[Richfield]

So why do cops even have tasers or pepper spray? It's unfortunate that this happened and this gun looks extremely real, but aren't their precautions in place? Especially when the victim is obviously not even an adult.

For when they're not facing a drawn gun.

 

[King Tubby]

Well in this incident it was not a gun so are you telling me he was justified in shooting the kid?

How the hell is the cop supposed to know that though? In the heat of the moment if you hesitate when presented with a threat you could die. Is he supposed to give anybody with a gun a free shot at him to make sure if it's real or not?

The shoot first attitude is insane enough in general, but to do it against a little kid is.. I don't even understand it. You'd think there would be tests to make sure people that trigger-snappy don't get the job. But no of course not.

What makes you think the cops were trigger-happy here? This case seems like a tragedy caused by a dumb 12 year old kid. If I were in the cop's shoes I probably do the same thing.

 

[WanderingWind]

Well in this incident it was not a gun so are you telling me he was justified in shooting the kid? I never said they should wait for the gun to be pointed at them . I am saying they could have handled the situation better hindsight is 20/20 though so. Just makes them look worse especially with the justice department investigating their department for this type of situation.

Yes. Absolutely. Is this even really in question? Did the kid deserve to get shot? Of course not. But is the officer justified in shooting somebody who is pulling what looks to be a real gun on him? Of course. This isn't even one of those really messed up situations where it turns out it was a wallet or phone or something - those you can definitely see a side to saying the cop wasn't justified. Not in this case though.

 

[reckless]

So why do cops even have tasers or pepper spray? It's unfortunate that this happened and this gun looks extremely real, but aren't their precautions in place? Especially when the victim is obviously not even an adult.

Cops don't use tasers and pepper spray on people who supposedly have guns.

 

[Volimar]

This is obviously a tragedy, but it really seems like the officer wasn't in the wrong here.

So why do cops even have tasers or pepper spray? It's unfortunate that this happened and this gun looks extremely real, but aren't their precautions in place? Especially when the victim is obviously not even an adult.

You expect him to use a taser or pepper spray vs. a gun?

 

[WanderingWind]

The shoot first attitude is insane enough in general, but to do it against a little kid is.. I don't even understand it. You'd think there would be tests to make sure people that trigger-snappy don't get the job. But no of course not.

Really? You don't understand it? If you're being honest, I can link you to roughly infinite stories about young killers, youth gang members, school shootings, etc.