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Dark Souls II - First review
- Thread starter Sn4ke_911
- Start date
Garcia
Member
The apologists showing up already? Either if they ran out of time or got lazy does not change the fact that the later parts of the game are shit.
You people...Seriously, just quit it already. That mantra applies to every game in existence. The Game Over screen isn't something revolutionary that Dark Souls introduced. Stop being so fucking hyperbolic, it's ridiculous.
What is his point? Is someone's carreer about to go to space this time too?
EDIT: I mean, I completely agree that the difficulty is blown way out of proportions. It's really not that hard (I don't agree with people who say it's easy tough), but I still don't get his point.
Eh, I agree with Lees. It's incredibly annoying how the media has blown the difficulty of the Souls series out of proportion. At times, it's pretty much the only thing they're reporting about, instead of focusing on mechanics, rewarding gameplay, world building, etc.
Lost Izalith is definitely shit, specially Bed of Chaos, what a garbage ass boss fight.
But I wouldn't call New Londo Ruins post lordvessel bad, personally. Duke's Archives is also cool.
Considering the quality of the DLC expansion, it's pretty obvious they ran out of time.
Pointing that out isn't apolagetic, it's just correcting you.
You're the one claiming that not putting a checkpoint right before a box is exclusive to Dark Souls. Why are you accusing other people of being hyperbolic?
Not being being able to have a checkpoint at any time does not make a game worse.
But is the actual review all about the difficulty or is it just the headline?
And players also blow the difficulty of the Souls seris out of proportion. Maybe people just find it really hard and are not as good at it as we are, but they enjoy that aspect of it.
I guess I agree with him, just don't see the big deal of this specific point. If reviews didn't make a big deal out of this, they would still suck.
EDIT: You know what, there's no reason for me to argue against him, I'll admit I was being defensive because it was him saying. Since I know he visits GAF, sorry, Matt.
There are many great gameplay aspects about the Souls series that have nothing to do with the difficulty. These great aspects include:
- Somehow making a very still and quiet game very entertaining
- Making the "process" of killing simple and easy enemies immensely satisfying, even when you've killed the same dregling like 150 times
There are way more but I need to go to bed. His point is that reviewers don't know shit about what makes a good game.
Facism
Member
Do we have the text of the review or are we jumping to conclusions over one line? Certainly not something to babbymode on twitter over.
It's just that the punishment isn't really that much at all.
I can see how dying at Bed of Chaos could be a pain in the ass if you didn't unlock The Fair Lady's shortcut, but other than that most of the times it's fairly easy and painless to go back to the boss because of the shortcuts. Good level design that rewards exploration is pretty much the main reason why Dark Souls pre-warp is much better, and the main reason why warping from the start make people worried about Dark Souls II.
Absolutely, I was wrong in standind against him on that.
Yeah, I guess he is acting like a shitheel, but I think it's a good thing to read the text of any review if you're going to take its score into consideration, and I agree that there are many things about the Souls games to love besides their difficulty.
- Beautiful and ghastly art design
- Huge enemy variety
- Complex level design
- Unique weapon movesets
- Secrets that don't have big arrows pointing towards them
- Creative boss gimmicks
- Multiplayer and single player merged to provide benefits for both
- Indirect story-telling that serves the gameplay instead of the other way around
- More than three colors
Garcia
Member
You know there's no real way know that they either ran out of time or got lazy, do you? For me it doesn't matter and it sounds apologetic trying to correct me about such an irrelevant point. That game breaks apart and makes the second half a terrible bore; something definitely went wrong and they decided to copy paste the most annoying enemies in confined areas just to try to shake things up.
I'm sorry? Where did I imply that? I wrote that Dark Souls has terrible chekpoint managment/placement which forces you to repeat the same tasks (some taking minutes long) ad nauseam. Where is the hyperbole in that? Apparently you're just interpreting my words incorrectly.
I agree. People like to draw a definitely line in the sand with regards to quality as 'post lordvessel', when in fact it's just Lost Izalith, Demon Ruins and Kiln of the First Flame that are poor compared to the rest of the game. Which means that half of the stuff after the Lordvessel is actually pretty amazing (Duke's, Tomb of Giants, New Londo)
inb4 New Londo is pre-Lordvessel
PetriP-TNT
Member
Messofanego
Banned
Garcia
Member
I had a terrible time with Dark Souls because it lacked fast travel from the beginning. I'm not exaggerating when I tell you I spent almost 6 hours stuck in the Catacombs because I decided to prematurely venture inside that place.
Do you imagine the frustration of having to backtrack all the way from the entrance to Nito's lair to Firelink shrine at a low SL?
Six Hours. Completely wasted. How is that fair?
For me Dark Souls was a convoluted mess that was too obscure for its own good. It brings good ideas to the table but the execution of those is flawed and unpolished. I do believe those guys are completely aware of all the big mistakes they did in the 1st. Dark Souls and the fact that you will have fast travel enabled form the get to shows that they found one of the worst offenders quite early in the development.
As mentioned before, the Duke's Archives and New Londo are fine levels, and the DLC has what is probably the best designed area in the game. I'd also add the Catacombs to the good level design list. The only really poor areas are the Demon Ruins and Lost Izalith, and they're nowhere near the entire second half of the game.
You were acting like putting a checkpoint that far before a boss was some sort of unique sin. Plenty of great games do it. The stretch before a boss is part of the motivation for not fucking up, and Dark Souls has so many ways to circumvent that time (Shortcuts like the staircase jump, parries to tough enemies, just running) that it becomes a non-factor for a veteran.
You got lost? That's how non-linear games work. There's a big red flag over the area with tough regenerating skeletons that says "DO NOT COME HERE", just like there is a big red flag over the area with invincible ghosts.
Thing is we don't have the text yet and the headline he's referring to is straight from the cover. Of course that's going to be a bit simplistic.
They themselves said they ran out of time towards the end. Being lazy has nothing to do with it, people should just stop using that stupid word so easily when it comes to videogames.
The storytelling really should get more praise than it does. I played around 40 hours before caring about it at all, but once I did, I was really into it, the way it tells a great story (imo) through gameplay, with the environments, items descriptions and sublte NPC dialogue and actions is really quite genious. It never gets in the way of the gameplay with slow walking shit and has very few cutscenes, but still manage to tell a story that I personally consider to be much better than most narrative driven games.
It's really immersive how things like
I went into the game like "lol who cares X X X" skipping every dialogue, and came out of my first playthrough just as amazed about the storytelling as I was about the amazing gameplay and level design.
It's really immersive how things like
Gwyndolin's secret is not just a plot point that will eventually be delivered to you through a cutscene, it's a secret kept from everyone, so that includes you. You may beat the game without ever knowing Gwynevere's an illusion or Anor Londo is embraced by darkness, it's up to you to find out that secret, and that directly affects your interpretation of other events in the game, such as the Primordial Serpents' role in that world and the different endings.
I went into the game like "lol who cares X X X" skipping every dialogue, and came out of my first playthrough just as amazed about the storytelling as I was about the amazing gameplay and level design.
Psycho_Mantis
Banned
I agree with him.
Humanity requires much more farming and from specific enemies meanwhile life gems are dropped by numerous enemies and require very little farming (basically like grass in DeS).
Totally agree with him.
Facism
Member
Yup yup I am in agreement.
Tomb of Giants is pretty damn cool too, you're right.
But I'll admit that I'm biased because I played the Prepare to Die Edition, so the DLC was post-lordvessel to me, and it was absolutely amazing. So, so, SO GOOD. Best DLC I've ever played, fantastic boss fights, amazing level design, superb atmosphere. It's just all around fantastic. Can't wait to get into it again in my current NG+ playthrough.
Can't believe it took me so long to play Dark Souls
Well, but that means you didn't like what Dark Souls was, which is completely fine, you don't have to agree with all the people who claim it is game of the generation, but when they "fix" it in a way that appeals to you, you also have to understand that they may be hurting those who loved it for what it was.
I went into the Catacombs early too, but in no way I felt like my efforts were not rewarded. After the lordvessel, all I needed to do was get inside the catacombs and jump off a bridge to quickly get back to Tomb of Giants. The shortcuts were rewarding enough imo.
Also, I had a blast with the time I spent there. In no way I felt like I was wasting it.
So the game is a convoluted mess because you didn't bother talking to the first NPC you see in firelink?
Crestfallen Warrior dialogue:
''Well, listen carefully, then
One of the bells is up above in the Undead Church, but the lift is broken.
You'll have to climb the stairs up the ruins, and access the Undead Burg through the waterway.
The other bell is back down below the Undead Burg,
within the plague-infested Blighttown.''
Why should they give you a fast-travel option just because you went the wrong way at the start? It is pretty clear from the dialogue and the difficulty of the enemies where to go. They also give you the warp option before you actually need to go to the catacombs/tomb of the giants.
I'm still trying to figure out why someone with an underleveled character would walk all the way to the end of Tomb of the Giants, a pitch-black area filled with giant terrifying skeletons that destroy underleveled characters right after a long dungeon filled with undying skeletons.
It reminds me of when I accidentally did the entire Thermal Visor bit in the sunken ship in Metroid Prime without the Gravity Suit and then realized I'd have to do tons of underwater platforming back up without the Gravity Suit. I was pretty pissed off at how dumb I was to forget that bit, but I also found it hilarious.
It reminds me of when I accidentally did the entire Thermal Visor bit in the sunken ship in Metroid Prime without the Gravity Suit and then realized I'd have to do tons of underwater platforming back up without the Gravity Suit. I was pretty pissed off at how dumb I was to forget that bit, but I also found it hilarious.
Exactly! The wheel skeleton thing made me wanna call the game unfair, but once I learned how to fight them, they're really not an issue at all. I don't think I ever got even close to dying to them when I went back there.
Oh, there's also the Rite of Kindling, it's a really damn good reward to go there early on.
Haha, yeah, I went as far as the famous NOPE gif and went back to Firelink Shrine.
I think I played more than 30 hours before going to Blighttown, if I'm not mistaken.
Psycho_Mantis
Banned
The game does decline after O&S which is a shame because it should only get better for the climax.
Lost Izalith is an abomination, and probably have damaged my eyes permanently, ToG has a nice gimmick to it in that you need a light source but its generally a barren environment with few branching paths, and New Londo is a very short level. Dukes Archives on the other hand along with CC were awesome.
Ash Lake is an optional thing and its not really a level. Just a pretty place where you can find the Everlasting Dragon.
CarbonByGravity
Member
According to the February 18th 2014 article below, the game director is hoping to release the PC version of Dark Souls 2 within weeks of the console release as apposed to months.
http://www.theepochtimes.com/n3/515...c-shortly-after-xbox-360-ps3-version-trailer/
http://www.theepochtimes.com/n3/515...c-shortly-after-xbox-360-ps3-version-trailer/
I think Matt means it's a challenging game. People say Ninja Gaiden for Xbox is hard but it's also pretty fair if you know what you're doing. Challenging.
I actually don't mind if it takes a couple of months, so I can finish my NG+ and my new DEX character without suffering from not playing Dark Souls II haha
Maybe I would even have time for a Demon's Souls playthrough, just bought it this week.
I think New Londo is great. The Ghost funhouse is a new kind of bullshit challenge, the second bit with the Darkwraiths is a nice change of pace, the area design is dripping with atmospheric details such as the body pit where the flood drained out to, and the area is pretty big when you include the optional parts. Also, it's fun being able to do it before you get the Lordvessel.
The only real black spot on its record for me is
The only real black spot on its record for me is
no bonfire. Throwing one of the hardest bosses in the game at people after a long area with no Bonfire is just horrible, especially if the Firelink Bonfire is extinguished. I never personally had trouble with it, but I felt sorry watching my younger brother die and have to run again all the way there from Valley of the Drakes.
JerryEveryday
Neo Member
Can't wait. I'm calling in sick on release day and picking my copy up from GS.
I really like how the difficulty of bosses is something that varies so much from person to person. I had the most trouble with
Capra Demon and O&S, but it was only by reading other people's posts about it that I found out that Manus was supposed to be really hard.
I really had no trouble with that boss, and even without the bonfire, you can still warp to it, can't you? That would make it so it's easier to warp there from the bonfire you respawn and go through the shortcut in the first area with ghosts.
You can ignore the Taurus Demons and go in the direction of the Capra Demon.
somebody wants hits to their youtube page
shouldn't listen to the first review because it's the first review
Are you trying to aggro them from the right? If so, it didn't work out for me either, you have to go through the left, it's fairly easy when you do.
Messofanego
Banned
lol sure
He did make a great preview of the game back on the Videogamer channel, but he's now on his own.
Haha wow is that the most ignorant assumption of him. He's also on GAF
They are easy to aggro with a bow and arrows. With a bit of trial and error you can hit the closest from the longest range your bow will allow. That should have them coming only one at a time.
He's completely right.
Watching it right now, and it is quite good. Makes me even more like a fool for going against him.
Haha wow is that the most ignorant assumption of him. He's also on GAF
Just the impression those tweets leave. I can't even fathom being so upset over a word used in a video game review from a translation of a foreign magazine.
The game is hard. I know you guys are sooooo good and it's easy to you, and you have to proclaim that on GAF and twitter, but to the rest of the world it's hard. And of course reviews are going to point that out. Reviews are intended to give readers an idea of whether they would like the game or not.
snesfanboy
Banned
i had done the same, thought 'hey great underwater level, but goes quite slow' until i got at a point to go back, jumping up all the way back was a pain