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Doctor Who Series 9 |OT| Let Zygons Be Zygons

It'd be interesting, since the Christmas Special would have to fit into the normal progression of the series!

Nothing wrong with that, it'd be something different. Well, unless you count The Feast of Steven.

I think in principle it could be completely distinct from the main timeline. There's no rule that says you have to stick to a single timeline in broadcasting time travel adventures. But most likely they'd want to do something like Last Christmas, which was conceived as a continuation of Series 8 with a more seasonal look and feel. At one point it could even have been Jenna's swansong.
 

Finalow

Member
"24 years", such a nice ending.

that was a really good Christmas special. Kingston and Capaldi are both very capable actors and they were great together, give me a whole season with those 2. :[
 

Beefy

Member
I think everyone here is exactly the opposite. He was the only standout of a largely weak season for me.

I like him as a actor. I just don't think he works as the Dr. A friend of mine who is more into Dr Who and has every series feels the same. He has never missed a series until now.
 

RetroMG

Member
Anyone else given up watching this due to Capaldi? I think I will give this a pass until he goes.

I actually put off watching this last season because I wasn't feeling Capaldi. However, those last couple of episodes of this season really sold me on him.
 
Dude, I just saw the X-mas special.

I think I'm really, REALLY satisfied with it. Also stop playing with mah feelings, evil Moffat.

EDIT: Would like to point out that Murray Gold killed it with the music too. That guy's great.
 

Broken Joystick

At least you can talk. Who are you?
Six years ago today.
IT'S NOT FAIR.
CXqPW0QWQAAuBcY.jpg:large
 

Vibranium

Banned
Yeah, he's a great actor and ambassador for the show, I just don't really connect with him as the Doctor.

The nice thing is that Capaldi understands those feelings, as he's said in interviews he is ok if you don't connect with him as the Doctor.

For me, he's excellent.
 

thefil

Member
Time for more Big Finish Eight Doctor reviews! Went through Creed of the Kromon, Natural History of Fear, and The Twilight Kingdom over the holidays.

Creed of the Kromon

This left almost no impact on me, but I didn't really give it a fair chance. I think I listened to it in 10+ different sessions during holiday travel, while falling asleep, and in situations where I could be easily interrupted. C'rizz doesn't really have much impact as a new companion in this episode - he's defined more by his relationship to Lida than by any particular personal characteristics. The resolution to the mystery of the series (
using people to breed Cromon
) is pretty standard stuff for Doctor Who, and after the intense weirdness of Scherzo I found myself wondering how we had so suddently found a planet/situation that could have been from our good old Universe. Not a fan.

Natural History of Fear

Loved it! Only two complaints about this episode. First, it owes a little too much to Brave New World, but adapting a classic into another form and vessel is still commendable. Second, it was a little confusing to have the main cast playing different characters so soon after C'rizz was introduced. I hadn't learned his voice yet and so I never knew when it was him who was speaking, whether as the Conscience, rebels, or what have you.

Those quibbles behind, I loved feeling like we were constantly unwrapping more little truths about who was who; who knew what aout their situation; how the Doctor, Charlie and C'rizz got there; and so on. It was wonderfully paced over four parts. I also enjoyed the twist and found it unexpected.

The Twilight Kingdom

Another episode so unremarkable that I almost dislike it. Doctor Who Story #4234: some psychic creature tricks a bunch of people into serving it, with addendum #13C: turns out the creature didn't understand what it was doing and is thus forgiven. The supporting cast of Scientist and Army Lady were criminally boring. I've changed my mind: I do dislike this episode.


Almost done Faith Stealer now, and it's much better than Twilight Kingdom. What a roller coaster of quality this series is! Could be a season of NuWho for all the ups and downs

Was very excited to see the Eight Doctor Time War story announced for 2017. :)
 
If I had to rate the modern Doctors, I think I'd go:

Capaldi > Eccleston > Tennant > Smith

I guess I prefer my Doctors to be less 'whimsical' and more confrontational, and Capaldi and Eccleston sell that side of the Doctor best. It's a real shame we only got that one series with the 9th Doctor because I think he'd have really excelled in the role if he'd done two or three. I do still have a lot of love for Tennant, he's absolutely the easiest on the old eyes and he was a lot of fun to watch. Smith's Doctor I think took a while to grow on me, this was a very unusual incarnation of the Doctor, his movements gave him a sometimes Jack Sparrow type of air, that 'mad man with a box' Doctor.

One thing I will say is I think the casting for the Doctor has been fantastic since the reboot, there's not been an incarnation I actually disliked. Every actor brings something to the role to make it his own. Likewise I think the companions have been pretty good - although I thought Martha was too wishy-washy and Donna just annoyed me all the way through (She never really grew to be a character I liked, even at the end). Jenna Coleman was awesome as Clara, although I would agree that the show was too Clara-centric for the last few seasons. I don't even mind River in small doses.

If anything I feel it's generally the scripts or direction that often lets the episodes down. Eccleston's run is guilty of having a LOT of pop culture references from iPods to Scissor Sisters to Big Brother which even at the time I thought would date horribly. I won't go into detail on my opinion of the farting aliens (although they fixed that really well for Boomtown).

Oh, and the 'big' villains have had some superb casting. The modern Davros is fantastic, particularly on this last season's openers. I adore Missy, I think she's a much more convincing Master than John Simm ever was. Although maybe it's because I had him sort of typecast in my mind from Life on Mars. I hope Missy sticks around for a long time yet.

Anyway turns out I wrote more than I intended about my thoughts on the reboot, so I'll stop now.
 

M.Bluth

Member
Sooo...apparently the show is leaving netflix on feburary 1st? Popped up while I was watching today : (

Unless there's some exclusivity deal with Hulu, I wouldn't worry about it. As far as I know, DW is very popular on Netflix and they'll want to keep it.
This sort of thing happens pretty much every couple of years before they inevitably renew the streaming deal.
 
Sooo...apparently the show is leaving netflix on feburary 1st? Popped up while I was watching today : (

One thing that is happening is the BBC is expanding their iPlayer to be more than just the most recent 30 days of stuff. This already exists in the UK as a sort of streaming store and all of Who is on it, but this is eventually going to expand to be worldwide and they're trying to figure out how to make it a sub-based service within the confines of the license fee.

I doubt this'll impact Netflix in the short term, but if they sign another few years' deal, I wouldn't be surprised to see Who disappear from Netflix in the next round of negotiations after this one if all this planning on the BBC's part goes well.
 
This seems pretty quick for a re-negotiation though, isn't it? I coulda sworn we had the same mini-concern just last year. Or was it two years ago?
 

Symphonia

Banned
One thing that is happening is the BBC is expanding their iPlayer to be more than just the most recent 30 days of stuff. This already exists in the UK as a sort of streaming store and all of Who is on it, but this is eventually going to expand to be worldwide and they're trying to figure out how to make it a sub-based service within the confines of the license fee.

I doubt this'll impact Netflix in the short term, but if they sign another few years' deal, I wouldn't be surprised to see Who disappear from Netflix in the next round of negotiations after this one if all this planning on the BBC's part goes well.
Um, what? Unless you jumped in the TARDIS and travelled to a parallel universe, I can assure you that the entire backlog of New Who is NOT on iPlayer. They have clips here and there, the odd full episode, and the usual 30-day catch up, but you can not just pick and choose an episode to watch as you wish. It'd be awesome but, alas, no. You're wrong.
 
Um, what? Unless you jumped in the TARDIS and travelled to a parallel universe, I can assure you that the entire backlog of New Who is NOT on iPlayer. They have clips here and there, the odd full episode, and the usual 30-day catch up, but you can not just pick and choose an episode to watch as you wish. It'd be awesome but, alas, no. You're wrong.

That's referring to the BBC Store, which is planned to integrate more with the iPlayer in future.
 
Um, what? Unless you jumped in the TARDIS and travelled to a parallel universe, I can assure you that the entire backlog of New Who is NOT on iPlayer. They have clips here and there, the odd full episode, and the usual 30-day catch up, but you can not just pick and choose an episode to watch as you wish. It'd be awesome but, alas, no. You're wrong.

That's referring to the BBC Store, which is planned to integrate more with the iPlayer in future.

Yeah, thus me saying it already exists 'in a sort of streaming store', which is an offshoot of iPlayer. When I load up iPlayer atm one of the promo slots is a direct link to this store with, er, a picture of David Tennant as the Doctor, advertising you can stream/download his era over there instantly (at a cost!).

It's going to be integrated with iPlayer at least for a beta by the summer, they've said. They haven't given a timeline on offering a Netflix/Hulu style 'all you can eat' subscription model for all of the BBC's back catalogue, or on exporting it abroad - no doubt complex propositions with the way both the license fee and BBC Worldwide as a separate entity are set out, but they have made plain this is the endgame for this service, with the BBC Director General flat-out name checking Netflix when he talked about their up and coming digital offerings fighting their rivals. When that comes, it will obviously probably have significant repercussions for BBC stuff on Netflix and other similar services.
 

thefil

Member
Finished the Divergent Universe arc of the Eighth Doctor Big Finishes on my way to work. Thoughts on the rest of the episodes and the arc as a whole, with spoilers, to follow.

Faith Stealer

I really liked this story. The idea of a kind of stock market of faiths was amusing, particularly when the Doctor & Co's "Tourist" faith started being hawked in the streets. I find the best audio dramas are those in an interesting locale with well-written dialogue; I could listen to characters I like chat about anything and be happy for the 2 hours of a serial. Now that it's been a week or so since I listened, though, I find myself unable to really recall the details of the plot, which is a mark against. The actual monster behind it all was once again an unfortunate bore. Yet another strange, ethereal entity that has deceived a group of people to use them for food in some way. :(

The Last

Another great premise, and a rare story in the Divergent Universe that actually has a satisfying ending. The premise - a dictator locked away in her bunker with no idea how much her war has cost her people - is something I don't think I've experienced before in other media. I enjoyed her advisers skulking and conniving to save themselves, and the ultimate revelation that the world was yet another Divergent experiment in evolution, doomed to loop and repeat itself until it could avoid self-destruction. All in all engaging from beginning to end, and very mildly though-provoking, a quality I don't often associate with Doctor Who.

Caerdroia

A third good episode in a row! Having the Doctor split into three selves, each a limited aspect of his personality, seems like a recipe for disaster, but it really worked. It in some ways served as a long-belated introduction to Eight. Two parts of him were very familiar to me - the cheery, happy-go-lucky, awestruck and reckless endorfiend, and the intellectual timey-wimey problem-solver. But the third part of Eight, an impatient, superior and ultimately violent alien, was something I'd experienced but not quite internalized.

Up till now I had thought of the "negative" aspects of the Doctor, when they showed up in Zagreus and onward, as a temporary and somewhat shallow exploration of his sadness over leaving his universe behind. I didn't care for it. But in this episode, they reveal themselves more to be the dark side of the coin for Eight's poet's personality. In The Last The Doctor says he hasn't hated anyone before Excelsior, but I think this episode reveals that Eight is an incarnation that *does* hate, and feels the full spectrum of human/Time Lord emotion fiercely and constantly. He's not so much a dark doctor as a moody, unstable one. I like this, as it feeds into his willingness to change himself in Night of The Doctor.

The actual mystery of Caerdroia makes little to no sense. The Kro'ka tricks the Doctor - or doesn't. The Kro'ka is an incompetent rube of the Divergents - or isn't. It never really lands in a satisfying way and it's unclear why the Doctor is split into three, or why his selves and companions are sent marching around this world and getting into danger before ending up back in the maze. The character bits made up for it.

The Next Life

Oh boy. Zagreus part 2, with all of the bad and none of the good. Personally I couldn't follow it. What happened to Guidance? Is Keep the sound monster from Scherzo, or some other evolution created by the Divergents? If the latter, how did he learn French from Charley? The universe has culminated with a Rassilon vs Keep faceoff 84 times, but how was Rassilon planning on escaping in every iteration before the one in which the Doctor brought his TARDIS? Is this Rassilon connected in any way to the shade in the The Matrix from Zagreus? If not, why does he seem to know so much about the Doctor? If so, how the heck did he end up here? Etc.

Then there's a lore dump about C'rizz, which reveals him to actually be an interesting character from a sci-fi perspective - a chameleon in mind as well as body, who meshes so well with the Doctor and Charley because that's what his species does - but fails to rescue him from the shit personality he still carries around. Who could have guessed that C'rizz's arc would all come down to a love for Lida, which we're told is so strong but never got the opportunity to see? Blech.

Charley does nothing, as is increasingly the case. Big Finish seemed to struggle to handle two companions in this series, and so favoured giving all the activity to the new, less interesting C'rizz.

At least Zagreus had this interesting kind of journey to the center of the TARDIS (well before the TV episode), complete with warring Doctors, a manifestation of her personality and Alice in Wonderland. In this, we separate our interesting characters so they can't interact, pair them up with paper villains (and bad American accents), and churn for 3 hours.

Overall

The Divergent Universe was a mixed bag. Scherzo was a phenomenal and weird start that promised a universe with rules completely foreign to our own, achieved in a way only an audio drama could, not limited by SFX budget or physical realities. But after that, we were back to business as usual, except that people did not understand the literal word "time". What a wasted opportunity!

However, it would be unfair to say they did not try. Almost every episode in this arc (the exception being Twilight Kingdom) features a premise and world above average on the Doctor Who weirdness scale. If we were in the normal Universe, I would count a series including a formless evolution chamber, Brave New World, religion stock market, nuclear winter, and maze world ambitious. Pretty much every episode started off intriguing, which is more than I can say for a lot of Who.

Most of those intriguing starts turned out flat. In my limited experience with Big Finish, I'd say they have even more difficulty with their stories paying off than the current television series. Better premises, better supporting characters, and better pacing, but the stories just fall back on evil people-eating monsters or mustache-twirling about the overarching mystery of the Divergent Universe. I'd say only Scherzo, Natural History and The Last ended on a node similarly high to where they started.

I guess on an episode-to-episode basis I rate this arc pretty highly, but I know the missed potential is going to kill it in my memory. When I look back on this in five years and think "what do I want to listen to again" I suspect I will skip pretty much the entire Divergent Universe, and that makes me sad.

Episode Ratings

Great episodes:
Scherzo

Good episodes:
Natural History of Fear
Faith Stealer
The Last

Okay:
Caerdroia

Bad:
Creed of Kromon
The Twilight Kingdom
The Next Life
 
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