Support NeoGAF

[Draugoth]

Eiyuden Chronicles has released today and much like Persona 3 Reload, players quickly noticed how different the translation is from the actual japanese:

​

One of the most strange localization choices is the inclusion of the term 'CHUD', which is completely out of context from the original japanese release:

​

This led to very negative critiscism on social media and on The Steam Community page, which is full of people with negative sentiment, some of the most upvoted threads being for refunds:

Refunded the Game because of the localization:

I love the Suikoden franchise and this game has been a dream come true for reviving the interest in the games, but with this translation i rather have nothing at all. It is an insult towards the developer, the game itself and the fanbase to have this game defiled in this matter. I can handle some errors because of culture differences and grammar mistakes, but this is more than i can take.​

Such a shame:

Was looking forward to the spiritual successor of Suikoden, but think I'd rather stay with the timeless classics.
Funding activist "localizers" who butcher the script is not on my radar. Worse yet; banning people from calling it out.
Hard pass.

Examples of the poor localization quality

This is not a thread for people who blindly accept any complaints about localization and things like that as "minor" What I am asking for is actual examples of the poor quality of the localization to judge if the game is even worth playing or not, in English anyway. Not just a general feel thing, but specific sentences and examples please.

Despite the negative reception, there isnt seem to be much of an impact.

 

[BaneIsPain]

Chud is mainstream now? I wonder when AI will takeover their job.

 

[Deerock71]

Cannibalistic
Humanoid
Underground
Dweller

 

[Kilau]

I’m not playing this until or unless there is a way around this shit.

 

[saintjules]

I don't care. I am thankful for the Suikoden spiritual successor.

 

[Arsic]

Goofy changes but nothing major to upset me. It’s just unnecessary and makes the whole script seem up for dumb changes.

Wasn’t someone saying in another thread you can buy the Asian version and play with English subs to get a direct translation instead?

Or can the western version somehow do this?

 

[Evolved1]

Chud is mainstream now? I wonder when AI will takeover their job.

hopefully very soon

 

[STARSBarry]

Did you just assume that golems gender?

 

[Mr Moose]

Oh it's listed on that site: https://deidetected.com/dei-detected/eiyuden-chronicle-hundred-heroes

 

[Punished Miku]

I’m not playing this until or unless there is a way around this shit.

AKA: Count me outta this one bucko, low key not touching this Taco Bell diarrhea until there's a way around it ya'll.

Spoiler

P.S. I honestly don't really care that much based on the pics above. I'll play it an see how it goes

 

[jshackles]

Goofy changes but nothing major to upset me. It’s just unnecessary and makes the whole script seem up for dumb changes.

Wasn’t someone saying in another thread you can buy the Asian version and play with English subs to get a direct translation instead?

Or can the western version somehow do this?

Unfortunately this isn't true. There is only one English script in the game, regardless of which audio track you use.

I might have to see if my Japanese is up to snuff to play this without all the silly shit.

 

[Kilau]

AKA: Count me outta this one bucko, low key not touching this Taco Bell diarrhea until there's a way around it ya'll.

Spoiler

P.S. I honestly don't really care that much based on the pics above. I'll play it an see how it goes

Something like that but mostly I vote with my wallet. No reason to waste time and money supporting people that openly despise me.

 

[graywolf323]

Oh it's listed on that site: https://deidetected.com/dei-detected/eiyuden-chronicle-hundred-heroes

solely because of a mediocre translation?

that seems like the site is painting too wide of a brush and they’re going to dilute the point about the actual trash out there

 

[Killer8]

What a waste of 4 years.

 

[German Hops]

What a waste of 4 years.

I'm waiting on a fan re-translation.

 

[Skifi28]

This is an issue with most games these days. I hated the localization of DQ 11 as well as FF7 remake. They just completely change what is being said or add their own shit for no apparent reason. But what can you do.

 

[sigmaZ]

As a translator myself and someone fluent in both languages, let's take a look.
I just started playing the game but haven't taken notice of any oddities, since I don't read text for voiced games anymore, as I find it breaks immersion.
Let's look at the pictures though.

For the Lian dialogue...
1. The first one depends on the delivery. There are times where Japanese uses "mo" when it is
not necessary to translate as too as that can be conveyed by intonation in English.

2. Yeah, this is adding a bit. I guess they are trying to spruce things up since it's voice lines.

3. Translating that literally is bad, but the English writing is cringe for sure. I'm not sure the context of the scene exactly though.

4. Both translations are unnatural and the left is cringe. Maybe something like, "Hey. Did you see that?" would be more appropriate.

Verdict:
The English writing is bad and a bit too furry/zoomer for my tastes.


Nowa and Mio dialog

1. That's perfectly fine if it matches the context. You don't want to keep translating yatta as we did it because the frequency of yatta is way higher in Japanese than I/We did it! Though there might be a better phrase for the situation still not sure.

2. Ok. That's blatant. The Japanese isn't implying that what so every. "What the hell is this thing?" or "What the hell is this monstrosity?" if you want to include the "huge" element, but in English we often omit certain things like that when they are visibly obvious.

Verdict:
The "You sure it's a he?" is a very odd choice. Maybe a bad try at humor? I don't know, but they weren't going for any sory of accuracy that's for sure.


Milana dialog
Are they debugging it here somehow?
This one I have no idea the context as it's just a single word, but what the hell is a chud is this context? Certainly feels unnecessary.

So, yeah. From what I've seen so far. The writing looks pretty fanficy/amateur, but I know there's a lot of younger people who watch shows that have this kind of quirky dialogue, some players might actually like it. The non-voiced NPC dialogue seemed pretty straightforward from what I played, but I think for main voiced characters they probably took more liberty to make it more suited for dialogue perhaps. Glad I'm not playing in English though. Japanese has been pretty standard anime fair but the dialogue is concise with lots of little quips here and there which helps solidify the relationships (like something akin to the better Marvel movie intereactions).

 

[Werewolf Jones]

Been two times a character has assumed an enemy/characters gender and someone else asked if they were sure that's the right pronoun. I'm like brooooooo.

 

[Vyse]

Cannibalistic
Humanoid
Underground
Dweller

I understood that reference! Ha!

 

[thicc_girls_are_teh_best]

At first I thought it was a reach b/c changes in localization for JRPGs is literally nothing new; Working Designs were a bit infamous for it back in the '90s when putting Western pop culture jokes/references in translations for Lunar and other games.

However, some of the later examples for this game do show a bit of a...."modern identity politics"...pattern. Then there's a paper one of the lead translators wrote that is just soaked in modern 3rd-wave feminists messaging and, well...yeah. It's likely an influence on a lot of the changes done for this game's localization.

A shame, but also wouldn't be surprised if fan translators find a way to provide a more accurate English translation for the PC version in the future. Could also use one of those AI-based translation apps on phone (I wished text hookers were easier to set up on PC TBH) if you'd like, though accuracy might not be 100% there.

As a translator myself and someone fluent in both languages, let's take a look.
I just started playing the game but haven't taken notice of any oddities, since I don't read text for voiced games anymore, as I find it breaks immersion.
Let's look at the pictures though.

For the Lian dialogue...
1. The first one depends on the delivery. There are times where Japanese uses "mo" when it is
not necessary to translate as too as that can be conveyed by intonation in English.

2. Yeah, this is adding a bit. I guess they are trying to spruce things up since it's voice lines.

3. Translating that literally is bad, but the English writing is cringe for sure. I'm not sure the context of the scene exactly though.

4. Both translations are unnatural and the left is cringe. Maybe something like, "Hey. Did you see that?" would be more appropriate.

Verdict:
The English writing is bad and a bit too furry/zoomer for my tastes.


Nowa and Mio dialog

1. That's perfectly fine if it matches the context. You don't want to keep translating yatta as we did it because the frequency of yatta is way higher in Japanese than I/We did it! Though there might be a better phrase for the situation still not sure.

2. Ok. That's blatant. The Japanese isn't implying that what so every. "What the hell is this thing?" or "What the hell is this monstrosity?" if you want to include the "huge" element, but in English we often omit certain things like that when they are visibly obvious.

Verdict:
The "You sure it's a he?" is a very odd choice. Maybe a bad try at humor? I don't know, but they weren't going for any sory of accuracy that's for sure.


Milana dialog
Are they debugging it here somehow?
This one I have no idea the context as it's just a single word, but what the hell is a chud is this context? Certainly feels unnecessary.

So, yeah. From what I've seen so far. The writing looks pretty fanficy/amateur, but I know there's a lot of younger people who watch shows that have this kind of quirky dialogue, some players might actually like it. The non-voiced NPC dialogue seemed pretty straightforward from what I played, but I think for main voiced characters they probably took more liberty to make it more suited for dialogue perhaps. Glad I'm not playing in English though. Japanese has been pretty standard anime fair but the dialogue is concise with lots of little quips here and there which helps solidify the relationships (like something akin to the better Marvel movie intereactions).

So basically, it's Working Designs 2.0 but less funny and way more vulnerable to modern-day identity politics stuff?

Eh. I mean it is what it is. If it's only present for, say, 5% of all dialog I think that's rather tolerable. Also it's not "bad" to write a character that way as long as the writers/translators are self-aware enough to not have every other character reaffirming something that conveniently matches their real-world ideology. People sometimes forget that part of good writing or even translations involves sometimes writing annoying characters.

However, I don't trust modern Western game writers or translators to think about it from that perspective, meaning a higher chance "that" type of writing permeates through most of the translation and there's a weird reaffirming/validation of it throughout the script by multiple characters because that's what the translators want because it's reflective of their real-life ideologies.

Just speaking in general here; I have zero proof Eiyuden Chronicle's English translation is doing that whatsoever and the (extremely few) examples in OP could've been cherry-picked and lacking a lot of context. You'd have to play through a substantial amount of the game and keep track of incidences and contexts for them to claim the script's actually been made "woke" by translators.

 

[Complistic]

Will wait for a fan translation. How annoying.

 

[Davevil]

At this point I'm afraid to ask, can you explain to me what the problem is with the translation? what serious damage has it done to the game and which side should we take?

 

[Boss Mog]

I won't be getting this now. These piece of shit activists even have to ruin Japanese games by altering translations to push their agenda. Despicable people.

 

[March Climber]

The only part I don’t like is ‘chud’ because:

1. That’s not a widely known slang term, especially not amongst JRPG fans
2. It is a political-based slang term being used incorrectly
3. I have only ever seen a couple of famous youtube political commentators(you know who) and maybe one or two politically charged subreddits use this term.

Anyway, I’m still on the side of A.I. translations replacing both translators and english voice actors due to my disdain for Crunchyroll’s sloppy business. I will temporarily side with the people constantly searching for the DEI boogeyman in every video game, because that’s how much I don’t like Crunchyroll’s operations.

 

[thicc_girls_are_teh_best]

At this point I'm afraid to ask, can you explain to me what the problem is with the translation? what serious damage has it done to the game and which side should we take?

Well, that's the thing. There is potential that the translation injects a lot of modern identity politics in it (of the far-left persuasion in this case). However, given it's a JRPG that has likely tens of thousands of lines of dialog, a literal small handful of quotes like in the OP don't prove if the translation as a whole is affected or not. At best it just shows a few potentially cringe lines.

But, we also don't know the context for the quotes in the OP; a script with annoying characters who say annoying things isn't a bad thing, in fact it could be great if the irony in what they're saying is pointed out by other characters and lampooned. Unfortunately with the tendency of a lot of Western game writers & translators, when we see a few lines reflecting modern-day identity politics in any way there are decent chances many other lines are similar and that it's written in a way where the characters never question it because the writers don't want the audience to question any of it, either.

That's a possibility with this game's English translation, not a statement it's actually happened. So I do think some of the people jumping to that conclusion likely without having played a significant portion of the game are jumping to conclusions. Again, you have to prove both that it appears frequently AND that the context is out of sheer admiration & forcing validation of whatever ideology the dialog refers to. Otherwise, it's nitpicking.

I won't be getting this now. These piece of shit activists even have to ruin Japanese games by altering translations to push their agenda. Despicable people.

I genuinely think you and others should try seeing if there are actually substantial instances of this dialog in the game, and it is in a context where this far-left ideological slop is being validated, before writing the game off.

Otherwise it just seems wrong to potentially punish a group of talented programmers, artists, musicians etc. over what a few English translators may have done to the localization. Stressing "may" because, again, we need more proof, and more definitive proof.

 

[Metnut]

Would be a bummer to see this game get review bombed based during this critical period over this issue given the precarious state entire studio who made the game. The issue appears to be quite minor and most seem to think the localization is adequate at worst.

 

[semiconscious]

'rub-a-dub-dub, don't be a flub!'...

isn't that a line from pulp fiction?...

 

[Punished Miku]

'rub-a-dub-dub, don't be a flub!'...

isn't that a line from pulp fiction?...

 

[LazyParrot]

Those are the worst examples they could come up with?

 

[GHG]

So who is responsible for this abomination of a translation job?

Did they outsource it?

 

[semiconscious]

'rub-a-dub-dub, don't be a flub!...

 

[DonkeyPunchJr]

So who is responsible for this abomination of a translation job?

Did they outsource it?

 

[YeulEmeralda]

This is why I support AI taking people's jobs.

 

[killatopak]

Are ALL localizers in on this?!

I might have to bust out the old japanese dictionary.

 

[Comandr]

Imagine kickstarting this four years ago and not even having the option to refund

 

[StereoVsn]

As a translator myself and someone fluent in both languages, let's take a look.
I just started playing the game but haven't taken notice of any oddities, since I don't read text for voiced games anymore, as I find it breaks immersion.
Let's look at the pictures though.

For the Lian dialogue...
1. The first one depends on the delivery. There are times where Japanese uses "mo" when it is
not necessary to translate as too as that can be conveyed by intonation in English.

2. Yeah, this is adding a bit. I guess they are trying to spruce things up since it's voice lines.

3. Translating that literally is bad, but the English writing is cringe for sure. I'm not sure the context of the scene exactly though.

4. Both translations are unnatural and the left is cringe. Maybe something like, "Hey. Did you see that?" would be more appropriate.

Verdict:
The English writing is bad and a bit too furry/zoomer for my tastes.


Nowa and Mio dialog

1. That's perfectly fine if it matches the context. You don't want to keep translating yatta as we did it because the frequency of yatta is way higher in Japanese than I/We did it! Though there might be a better phrase for the situation still not sure.

2. Ok. That's blatant. The Japanese isn't implying that what so every. "What the hell is this thing?" or "What the hell is this monstrosity?" if you want to include the "huge" element, but in English we often omit certain things like that when they are visibly obvious.

Verdict:
The "You sure it's a he?" is a very odd choice. Maybe a bad try at humor? I don't know, but they weren't going for any sory of accuracy that's for sure.


Milana dialog
Are they debugging it here somehow?
This one I have no idea the context as it's just a single word, but what the hell is a chud is this context? Certainly feels unnecessary.

So, yeah. From what I've seen so far. The writing looks pretty fanficy/amateur, but I know there's a lot of younger people who watch shows that have this kind of quirky dialogue, some players might actually like it. The non-voiced NPC dialogue seemed pretty straightforward from what I played, but I think for main voiced characters they probably took more liberty to make it more suited for dialogue perhaps. Glad I'm not playing in English though. Japanese has been pretty standard anime fair but the dialogue is concise with lots of little quips here and there which helps solidify the relationships (like something akin to the better Marvel movie intereactions).

Weird thing here is the zoomers aren’t going to buy this game anyway. The audience is Gen-X and Milkenials who are nostalgic for Suikoden. Why the f is the localization targeting a completely different audience I have no idea.

Going to try it on Steam in Japanese and see how it goes.

 

[GHG]

Fucks sake.

What a load of shit this is.

 

[graywolf323]

I remember back when 8-4 started up and they had a cool podcast (8-4 Play was great back in the day) only for them to end up like this

 

[Belthazar]

I’m not playing this until or unless there is a way around this shit.

There is: learn japanese.

 

[SaiyanRaoh]

Eiyuden Chronicles has released today and much like Persona 3 Reload, players quickly noticed how different the translation is from the actual japanese:

​

One of the most strange localization choices is the inclusion of the term 'CHUD', which is completely out of context from the original japanese release:

​

This led to very negative critiscism on social media and on The Steam Community page, which is full of people with negative sentiment, some of the most upvoted threads being for refunds:

Refunded the Game because of the localization:

Such a shame:

Examples of the poor localization quality


Despite the negative reception, there isnt seem to be much of an impact.

That thing tried to kill me. Don't care if it's a he. I care even less that it's dead. Fuck it's pronouns.

 

[NecrosaroIII]

Most of these aren't that bad tbh.

 

[thicc_girls_are_teh_best]

Yeah, this is the main reason why maybe to not give the translation the benefit of a doubt. The chances this person didn't let their political ideology seep into their efforts with the translated script are low.

 

[N30RYU]

I don't care... I wasn't gonna purchase it... buy anyway playing it in spanish I would play it in a localization of a localization... so if the story isn't lost in translation I don't really care if they get some license to get some jokes/things to work for every language.

 

[Alexios]

Lol @ the first image comparing the localization with whatever google translate blurts out and complaining about the differences. Especially without seeing the rest of the lines/dialogue around each of those. That's not how shit works, no book or game has even been translated word to word bozo.

Why the fuck do you care it doesn't say "too" in that lens line, maybe it's implied they're not the only one with it in the next or previous line so there's no need to repeat, same for the glint shit, why does it matter how they convey the same thing, that something was briefly glimpsed by one character?

2012 interview segment, possibly referring to even older practices/games, to prove a 2024 game is newly woke without even showing an example of it in the previous images so for all you know even with that line of thought they had nothing to really alter for this particular game's characters, lol gg.

Even if it's later proven that there are such big changes, the bozos are still bozos for frothing without any proof whatsoever rather than vindicated in retrospect for their asinine assumptions and knee jerk reactions, they're not proven prophets that should be worshipped for knowing all before all, lol.

Some of the greatest localizations are super different to the originals, or did people think Vagrant Story's people spoke ye olde English in the Japanese game? And how do people think a western game with flowery language like that would be localized for Japan, it'd be totally different as well, duh.

 

[Boss Mog]

I genuinely think you and others should try seeing if there are actually substantial instances of this dialog in the game, and it is in a context where this far-left ideological slop is being validated, before writing the game off.

Otherwise it just seems wrong to potentially punish a group of talented programmers, artists, musicians etc. over what a few English translators may have done to the localization. Stressing "may" because, again, we need more proof, and more definitive proof.

The use of the word "chud" is all the proof I need. I won't support it despite probably liking the game itself, it's the only way these devs will learn not to let activists translate their games.

 

[Lambogenie]

Wait for fantranslation.

These localisers are shit. Same thing with FFVII.

Why are so many localisers these DEI types. Just 1:1, I don't want your new take on a character you fools.

 

[StereoVsn]

Lol @ the first image comparing the localization with whatever google translate blurts out and complaining about the differences. Especially without seeing the rest of the lines/dialogue around each of those. That's not how shit works, no book or game has even been translated word to word bozo.

Why the fuck do you care it doesn't say "too" in that lens line, maybe it's implied they're not the only one with it in the next or previous line so there's no need to repeat, same for the glint shit, why does it matter how they convey the same thing, that something was briefly glimpsed by one character?

2012 interview segment, possibly referring to even older practices/games, to prove a 2024 game is newly woke without even showing an example of it in the previous images so for all you know even with that line of thought they had nothing to really alter for this particular game's characters, lol gg.

Even if it's later proven that there are such big changes, the bozos are still bozos for frothing without any proof whatsoever rather than vindicated in retrospect for their asinine assumptions and knee jerk reactions, they're not proven prophets that should be worshipped for knowing all before all, lol.

Considering the state of what translators output for “modern audience” I would err on a side of caution personally.

The examples comparing to Japanese seem amateurish and plain bad in places.

It’s unfortunate that this is putting off fans off the game which is clearly a labor of love.

I will get it on Steam and see if I can put both Audio and Subs on Japanese.

 

[CamHostage]

The use of the word "chud" is all the proof I need. I won't support it despite probably liking the game itself, it's the only way these devs will learn not to let activists translate their games.

Wait, "chud" is a political term now? What side are the cannibalistic humanoid underground dwellers on?

 

[BaldingAshCrimson]

All of this is actually making me really depressed lately.

Even though this "Localizers taking a shit on the writers work" routine, is only touching games I'm not interested in playing to begin with.
Is still a major issue for me, and should be to everyone.

Because it's a disrespect on the work of artists, and straight up cutting off shit from their work to fit "western sensibilities" (Localizers view od it). It's as anti-art as it gets. Not to mention borderline racist.

I worry when a game comes that I actually want to play, and I localizers do their thing on it...

I only care about what the original writer put on paper, and in the game...
I don't care if it sounds sexist to westerners, if it doesn't sound as "lol so hip memes lmao chud". Give me what they wrote, in a language I understand, which is English or Portuguese.

 

[rkofan87]

thank god for gp i can still play the game but i do not have to feel like shit giving cucks like them my cash.