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Embracer is shutting down Volition (Saints Row). Company issues official statement.
- Thread starter SirKicksalot
- Start date
- News
Dr.Morris79
Gold Member
Isnt it odd that this kind of 'be shitty to the fans' mentality wasnt just by this studio, it seems to be across most media
And look how thats doing, these vapid twats have zero clue what they're actually doing and only care about huffing their own farts
In a way I'm glad they shut that shite down. The talented will find jobs whilst these idiots will find it harder, hopefully for our sakes they'll move on to a different field, away from customers, we can only hope.
Thick Thighs Save Lives
Gold Member
Was looking through the other forum to see the discussion on Volition shutting down and I came to the conclusion that the mods there are deranged if this innocuous comment warrants a 1 week ban. Glad I buggered off from that hellhole.
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EDMIX
Member
lol nahhhh
I think a bunch really, really..REALLY want this to be based on some shit like they didn't listen to this or that or they didn't do this or that etc, Embracer literally just shut down a studio that didn't even put out a game yet, they could have made some bro-dude Saints Row and shut them down, they could have put out Punisher 2 and shut them down, I don't think Embracer was ever leaving this team open tbh.
I think folks just want to force that narrative while ignoring they are closing down many studios lol
It was a joke.
Drizzlehell
Banned
Damn. From Descent to Freespace to Red Faction to OG Saints Row... some good memories there. But Agents of Mayhem and Saints Row reboot? Oof, I'd rather not see any more of that.
I'm guessing that the studio creatives who were responsible for creating their good games must have left a long time ago, otherwise their last couple of games wouldn't be such turds. So if that's the case and the only people losing jobs are those arrogant soycucks who mouthed off to fans when they complained about SR, then rest in piss. I only wish the good folks from over there to land on their feet soon.
I'm guessing that the studio creatives who were responsible for creating their good games must have left a long time ago, otherwise their last couple of games wouldn't be such turds. So if that's the case and the only people losing jobs are those arrogant soycucks who mouthed off to fans when they complained about SR, then rest in piss. I only wish the good folks from over there to land on their feet soon.
You win the comments.
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crackajack
Member
Red Faction was okayish for its time, and SR too, the dialed up to eleven GTA clone, but the last versions of these missed the mark, basically on purpose. So not sure if we lose anything of value here.
Very much like with MS and Tencent, I have zero clue what the management does at Embracer.
MS at least acqired studios that are supposed to be good, while we still wait for a proper release cadence. But Tencent and Embracer more or less swallow all the AA studios that either have to step up their game or check their ambition and produce with a last gen effort, to be able to survive. I have no idea anyway why games this gen take longer while not one of them actually looks that much different to last gen. So AA should actually be easier than ever.
This situation kinda is also Embracer's fault. Who greenlit the failure SR now obviously was? What are they doing? Same as with Nacon and their struggle to escape mediocre AA and budgets that are probably not current top AAA but maybe closer to former AAA levels, it will not work well.
Weird that there could not even be found any sell out option, but at most they extract some capable guys to use in other studios and sending everyone else on their own way. Kinda implies that Embracer was already the last straw for some of their studios. And it seems that the allowance for failures is not huge there. Overall this just reinforces my doubts that several studios under this umbrella really can live longer and more succesful than Midway, Accaim, THQ, Jowood.
Very much like with MS and Tencent, I have zero clue what the management does at Embracer.
MS at least acqired studios that are supposed to be good, while we still wait for a proper release cadence. But Tencent and Embracer more or less swallow all the AA studios that either have to step up their game or check their ambition and produce with a last gen effort, to be able to survive. I have no idea anyway why games this gen take longer while not one of them actually looks that much different to last gen. So AA should actually be easier than ever.
This situation kinda is also Embracer's fault. Who greenlit the failure SR now obviously was? What are they doing? Same as with Nacon and their struggle to escape mediocre AA and budgets that are probably not current top AAA but maybe closer to former AAA levels, it will not work well.
Weird that there could not even be found any sell out option, but at most they extract some capable guys to use in other studios and sending everyone else on their own way. Kinda implies that Embracer was already the last straw for some of their studios. And it seems that the allowance for failures is not huge there. Overall this just reinforces my doubts that several studios under this umbrella really can live longer and more succesful than Midway, Accaim, THQ, Jowood.
CuteFaceJay
Member
Shame, I had hoped they would be working on a new version of Red Faction to take advantages of this gen of consoles and PC hardware.
Good luck my dudes.
Good luck my dudes.
Laptop1991
Member
Yeah, films and TV shows as well, as if that attitude is ever going to work!
Team Andromeda
Member
So sorry for the team
supernova8
Banned
Dr.Morris79
Gold Member
Yes, it was. A very basic rule of thumb if anyones been paying attention is that if it looks woke then it's no doubt dog shit regardless. TLOU 2 seems to be the outlier here but it seems in that case the woke rot is actually programmed by competent people and the 1st game was brilliant, that gave good old Neil a massive platform to splurge his shite over.
Look at woke films, adverts, basic writing in most shows nowdays.. it's not made very well, the old talented people had to make way for this new 'bunch' of ideologists, hence the failings across the board. Saints Row is no different. It's a poorly made game with some utterly terrible decisions made before it's release. There are a certain set of people in these industries who think thats it's a 'great idea' to slate the customer (Hell, they're the stupid people out of the huffing loop anyway, right), but it's not
We're now seeing the results.
If you're of a certain age then you've no doubt met some of these fart huffers in your own workplace. Self entitled, lazy, egotistical wonders that are utterly fucking useless but think they know everything. They wont be told what to do, certainly dont want to learn a trade as they know it all already and have no patience for more experienced workers, after all, they're better. Now imagine when these wonder people get in positions of control.. looks good doesnt it? Are we not having fun?
I know I am and I know I did in various workplaces when these types kept fucking up
Hudo
Member
For me, it was the gameplay and game design choices that made the game shit. The woke stuff was the "icing", so to speak. It's just not a good video game, even without the woke stuff. That was my point.Yes, it was. A very basic rule of thumb if anyones been paying attention is that if it looks woke then it's no doubt dog shit regardless. TLOU 2 seems to be the outlier here but it seems in that case the woke rot is actually programmed by competent people and the 1st game was brilliant, that gave good old Neil a massive platform to splurge his shite over.
Look at woke films, adverts, basic writing in most shows nowdays.. it's not made very well, the old talented people had to make way for this new 'bunch' of ideologists, hence the failings across the board. Saints Row is no different. It's a poorly made game with some utterly terrible decisions made before it's release. There are a certain set of people in these industries who think thats it's a 'great idea' to slate the customer (Hell, they're the stupid people out of the huffing loop anyway, right), but it's not
We're now seeing the results.
If you're of a certain age then you've no doubt met some of these fart huffers in your own workplace. Self entitled, lazy, egotistical wonders that are utterly fucking useless but think they know everything. They wont be told what to do, certainly dont want to learn a trade as they know it all already and have no patience for more experienced workers, after all, they're better. Now imagine when these wonder people get in positions of control.. looks good doesnt it? Are we not having fun?
I know I am and I know I did in various workplaces when these types kept fucking up
STARSBarry
Gold Member
I think the point being made is that people who push woke ideology are also terrible at the core parts of creating a game, because they see the player as a child to be lectured rather than a customer to be entertained.
Naturally this leads to design choices at odds with the players enjoyment and you end up with a shit game.
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ShadowNate
Member
So that Saints Row 2 update is never happening now, huh?
I mean it was already looking unlikely but this cut the final thread it was hanging from.
It was probably the only thing I was looking forward from Volition.
I mean it was already looking unlikely but this cut the final thread it was hanging from.
It was probably the only thing I was looking forward from Volition.
Dr.Morris79
Gold Member
beautifully put squire
Hudo
Member
Sure. But treating the player as a retard is not exclusive to the woke squad. That's more the hallmark of almost all modern "AAA" games, sadly. But I agree, the woke stuff certainly didn't help matters in Saints Row.
Dr.Morris79
Gold Member
Yeah thats been going on for years. It really irks me something chronic when you get an 18+ game but the tutorial stuff or game tips go on forever or never really ends, like you're some five year old that doesnt know basic gaming or forgets things in ten second intervals..
STARSBarry
Gold Member
Absolutely, although I think the difference with AAA is the priority is to see the player as a cashcow you need to milk the maximum amount of money from. This has a similair consequence in that decisions are now made directly counter to player enjoyment for the sake of profit.
but the end result is the same, games that are shit, that are not made with you the gamer as the top priority. I don't mind the more arty games when they do this, as often they are created as a... expression of the people developing them, the same way someone takes a brush to canvas. But when it comes out of the titles clearly created as a product it sucks for everyone on the receiving end.
MMaRsu
Banned
"Honesty? We shall have none of that here sir"Was looking through the other forum to see the discussion on Volition shutting down and I came to the conclusion that the mods there are deranged if this innocuous comment warrants a 1 week ban. Glad I buggered off from that hellhole.
crackajack
Member
In my perception writers overall did not really improve, especially in gaming where most writing is at best ambitioned, not even good but mediocre fan fiction drivel, and formerly those writers for games were at least passioned gamers. With the pressure of putting out more and more content quality did not keep up, in many movies, tv shows and games. Combined with more and more "enlightened" people it makes a weird product.
But I am not 100% sure the result is actually that bad, yet, for the reasons sometimes given as an important cause. People might just perceive it wrong, no matter how sound their arguments are, or, maybe they are right but just earlier than real results actually are showing:
Sounds like movies have yet to actually see the causation or correlation of a go woke go broke reality, they suffer not necessarily due to that, but other reasons are in play for a decline in objective success and probably subjective quality too.
Would have been interesting if they could do the same with games and also those HBO, Amazon, Netflix etc shows. I would assume at least big budget movies usually get the presumably best writers and not just all those now striking people capable of pumping out words without any real soul. Good writers are probably underpayed, but the horde of bad writers are probably payed almost too much, but when demand is high you gotta pamper even those.
GymWolf
Gold Member
Gameplay in past games never was pinnacle of something, shooting has always been meh to ok.
But the rest of the game had charme, this one make you want to invite the characters to dinner just to poison them (semi-cit)
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StueyDuck
Banned
the kid in that video is like 10 years old, i wouldn't take his google stats as gospel.
I agree however that Disney barely felt the woke/broke until fairly recently.
Hayabusabruh
Member
Didn't the community manager call people terrorist for liking the other saints rows?
Hudo
Member
That's a fair point.
Fart Knight
Al Pachinko, Konami President
Booted up SR2 for shits and giggles. Game is still fun. Hearing Young Jeezy, thaaaatss riiight.
crackajack
Member
I don't care about anyone's age. A rough voice from an old/wise long bearded man or whatever makes it not better or worse than if the numbers and graphs were done by an actual kid, as long that kid is doing it scientifically sound, which I can't check.
But of course, as with anything in the internet it does not have to be true, for some reason... willfully arguing against a truth they just don't want, or arguing for clickbait, whatever.
But I also don't take the woke is bringing doom over us gospel either. The arguments often sound reasonable, but also appear often very (anti) agenda driven and equally preachy.
The outcry over eg Snow White makes certainly some sense, but Snow White was not invented by Disney as some warriors seem to argue, usually especially freaking out over replacing the dwarfs. The dwarfs were dragons, robbers, giants or whatever in variations of that story that did exist for many decades prior the now famous animation. As a gemran speaker I also could feel affronted about the somewhat odd translation of her name. So Disney got it wrong already 1930, or whoever translated it before. But, whatever, depending on what the respective writer or storyteller wanted to tell the seven were changed. So changing bits and pieces is its actual past and how tales usually always worked. As some form of evolving bible like textbook to teach kids some stuff. Which is of course right in times with CRT i nschool and whatnot a hot topic, cause these tales were ultimately aimed at kids and had messages exactly aimed at them.
Calling it woke on little info and therefore destined to be doomed is certainly premature. Whatever agenda it is driving it may or may not be actually good, a men hating strong indepentant woman would be terrible like all those are, but I rather risk a woke remake than having a pointless remake like eg Psycho was.
No idea how this all applies to Volition though. If we have an indoctrinated new batch of writers that is stuck in some victim complex and agendas and not able to write interesting stuff around that. If that is really a core cause for failures. I guess other studios will fall on their nose too, even if millions and billions are thrown around currently and one would assume it is prime time right now. I know they removed the infantile more edgy stupid than really sharp humor a bit much or too much and practically no one seemed to like the rest of SR either. Cringy japanese writing isn't that much different or better imho though. Eastern Europe seems to have the most traditional attitude, catering still to men or boys and afaik igoring that topic and weirdly ex- by trying to be inclusive style.
But after all the market regulates itself in that regard quite nicely. If people actually don't like that agenda and see it in there, and it somehow correlates to some other qualites too, it will fail and the suits will think twice if they actually want to Bud Light their product and will need to not only close some studios but also need to replace parts of the workforce hired with that exact goal.
I don't think the 'wokeness' of a product is a guarantee of failure. I'd say problems arise when the political stance is directed towards the wrong target and/or there is nothing more to the product because everything is built around the message. You can make things like Barbie and get a big success, and you can add political inserts into otherwise fine products and get away with it. I think the last Saints Row failed in both fronts. It was a bad game made for the wrong audience.
In any case, it's always sad to see veteran companies disappear. If I'm not mistaken, the original founder was still in the company. I'm tempted to play some Descent for old times' sake.
In any case, it's always sad to see veteran companies disappear. If I'm not mistaken, the original founder was still in the company. I'm tempted to play some Descent for old times' sake.
JohnnyFootball
GerAlt-Right. Ciriously.
Embracer is so worthless that if I were MS, Sony, Take 2, or Ubisoft I'd sweep in and make an offer for the IPs they posses. Embracer is clearly worthless and terribly run. They got lucky acquiring the Eidos IPs for dirt cheap, but they have completely wasted it.
As much as I have criticized MS for their handing of inhouse development games, I'd trust them over Embracer and that REALLY says something when you consider that I have had very little nice things to say about MS and their handling of the Xbox brand.
As much as I have criticized MS for their handing of inhouse development games, I'd trust them over Embracer and that REALLY says something when you consider that I have had very little nice things to say about MS and their handling of the Xbox brand.
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Toots
Gold Member
I can understand her.
Saints Row helped me realize Jennifer Heaton is a particularly stupid individual.
Thanks Volition
STARSBarry
Gold Member
BBC Scotland - The Social - I saw my gaming avatar go through gender transition
Jennifer always felt different, but it took gaming for her to discover her true identity.
They even got into the BBC, I honestly skimmed and just laughed out loud, what utter trash. Apparently their job is to review films for rotton tomatoes... amazing.
To be fair the likeliness from the article is uncanny.
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Kerotan
Member
They went full woke and it backfired. This is a warning shot to the industry. Like Battlefield V this shit will backfire and even if the game is fun which it was you'll never recover all the lost day 1 full price sales.
If saints row went dark and gritty I think it would have done good considering the massive thirst for a GTA type game.
Toots
Gold Member
Is that you on your avatar pic ?
If so you might be responsible for Volition's demise.
Let me explain.
The soyboys working at the studio could not handle such amount of manhood and bulging muscles this close to them. They lived in a state of constant fear, could not concentrate on their work, and produced shitty games as a result.
Nicely done
Neon Xenon
Member
What an awful call. Doubly awful with the followup response, given that even Embracer admitted that the Saints Row reboot underperformed. And I like DX's videos.Speaking of things that aged poorly :
Judd Nelson
Neo Member
Some awful news to see.
JayK47
Member
Did my post get deleted or disappear? Interesting. Anyways, this was expected. If you make several bad games in a row, a Saints Row, your studio is likely to get cut. These huge investment firms give zero shit about the people or the property. It is not like the studio was going to make anything worth a shit, so nobody should really be disappointed. Anybody who worked at the studio who worked on previous good titles is long gone or not in a position to bring back the "good old days".
lughnasadh123
Member
Hopefully they can land on their feet soon somewhere else. Always hate to see anyone lose their job even if their offerings lately have been mid.
So Embracer owns the rights to all the IPs, right? I wonder what their plans are for them. Saint's Row might be put on ice for a bit but we might see something else from them if they can find the right people.
So Embracer owns the rights to all the IPs, right? I wonder what their plans are for them. Saint's Row might be put on ice for a bit but we might see something else from them if they can find the right people.
Red5
Member
Freespace and Descent are owned by Interplay.
lughnasadh123
Member
Would love to see something new done with Descent.