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Famitsu #901 news (FFXII gets 40/40 and "shakes the pleasant")
- Thread starter Jonnyram
- Start date
Jonnyram said:What exactly needs downgradiing if it's been on PS2 from the start? I think your belief that it was always going to be a next-gen game is pretty far-fetched. But hey, wait and see
3 FF titles per generation.
1-3 NES
4-6 SNES
7-9 PS1
10-12 PS2
Why would they have planned 13 for PS2? Like others have said they started on FFX several years before the PS2 was released so they could have it out pretty soon (1 year+) after the release of the system instead of 3+ years after the release of the system.
If they were planning FF13 for PS2 in the year 2007, you're telling me they aren't planning the PS3 FF14 until 2010!!? Because you know that FF12 was originally supposed to come out summer 2004 which is 3 years after FF10, and hmm FF13 coming in 2007 would sure be another 3 years after the planned release of FFX12.
FF games don't take a year to make. They take 3-4 years to make. There are only two choices here:
1. Put 13 on PS2 and not have a PS3 FF until the 3rd year of the system.
2. Keep 13 held back and worked on until the PS3 is released and have ready in the first year of the system.
No one wants to see another FF held back by current-gen visuals, no one wants to see FF13 on PS2. Square Enix does NOT need the money anymore after having so many hits this gen. Even if the game was intended for PS2 originally (which I don't believe), they would be smarter to delay it and upgrade all the textures to HD in the meantime and have it out around the start of the PS3.
FF13 = Kitase team
FF14 = ?????????? (Matsuno team gone, Nomura sure as hell isn't making an FF)
SatelliteOfLove
Member
Troidal said:
:lol :lol :lol
And this 40/40 means what now?
I'm sorry, but really; at least I know I will love it.
My Arms Your Hearse
Banned
Matsuno is... gone?
I know he got "sick" and had to take leave of most of his duties on XII (which was already mostly done), but I've heard nothing about him being "gone" permamently?
I know he got "sick" and had to take leave of most of his duties on XII (which was already mostly done), but I've heard nothing about him being "gone" permamently?
Spiritreaver
Member
No I love it too, just rarely visit it.Jonnyram said:What do you mean - it's an awesome site!
I visit the gamefaqs forum more frequently (for the humor, I only lurk) and noticed the news there but lacking a source. Knowing you usually post the stuff on FFXIOnline, when it comes from Famitsu, I checked out there so yay. I was just poking at you. My Arms Your Hearse said:
Word was that he left Square after his issues. Doesn't really effect XII much since like you said it was mostly done and he set all the groundplans and wrote the script. But I don't think he'll be making any more Square Enix games. Square is probably pretty upset with him about this whole FFXII fiasco even if it wasn't really his fault (medical issues), so in order to avoid worry about evil eyes at work everyday I think he just distanced himself.
He'll still make games...just probably not at Square Enix.
OK, you're blatantly ignoring the fact that, since FFVIII and up to the release of FFXI, the games had been coming out at a rate of one per year. FFVIII - 1999, FFIX - 2000, FFX - 2001, FFXI - 2002. The games are not supposed to have a three year interval. This situation has happened purely because Matsuno was put in charge of FFXII and the delay that resulted. While Matsuno was working on FFXII, is it just assumed that every other FF-capable department was sitting twiddling their thumbs? You say Nomura isn't working on FF now - isn't it possible he finished designs for FFXIII before he even started on KH2?
Whatever, think what you will. There's little point in arguing about something like this. Just wait and see, that's all
Whatever, think what you will. There's little point in arguing about something like this. Just wait and see, that's all
My Arms Your Hearse
Banned
I'll simply refuse to believe this until I see some sort of confirmation...
The series could definitely be in jeopardy with all the recent defections...
Oh well, here is to hoping...
The series could definitely be in jeopardy with all the recent defections...
Oh well, here is to hoping...
Jonnyram said:OK, you're blatantly ignoring the fact that, since FFVIII and up to the release of FFXI, the games had been coming out at a rate of one per year. FFVIII - 1999, FFIX - 2000, FFX - 2001, FFXI - 2002. The games are not supposed to have a three year interval. This situation has happened purely because Matsuno was put in charge of FFXII and the delay that resulted. While Matsuno was working on FFXII, is it just assumed that every other FF-capable department was sitting twiddling their thumbs? You say Nomura isn't working on FF now - isn't it possible he finished designs for FFXIII before he even started on KH2?
Whatever, think what you will. There's little point in arguing about something like this. Just wait and see, that's all
Yet you fail to see or ignore that FFXII even before all the delays was meant as a June 2004 title. That's 3 years after the summer 2001 FFX. How does that fit in your yearly FF schedule?
Jonnyram said:OK, you're blatantly ignoring the fact that, since FFVIII and up to the release of FFXI, the games had been coming out at a rate of one per year. FFVIII - 1999, FFIX - 2000, FFX - 2001, FFXI - 2002. The games are not supposed to have a three year interval. This situation has happened purely because Matsuno was put in charge of FFXII and the delay that resulted. While Matsuno was working on FFXII, is it just assumed that every other FF-capable department was sitting twiddling their thumbs? You say Nomura isn't working on FF now - isn't it possible he finished designs for FFXIII before he even started on KH2?
Whatever, think what you will. There's little point in arguing about something like this. Just wait and see, that's all
So should we expect a FF13 announcement at E3?
DCharlie
And even i am moderately surprised
because they expected the PS3 to not be a 5 year machine, rather a 7 year machine?
define several years please.
no. the teams work in phases so they aren't releasing 1 game every 3 years.
FF12 was due to hit before summer 2004, because Digicube went down the spout around spring 2004 blaming the delayed FF12 for the problem.
and if FFX started several years prior, do you think that FFXII perhaps maybe had a big lead up too perhaps?
FFXIII could well be pretty much completed - but you can't start touting the next FF until you get the preceeding FF out of the way! I expect FFXIII at the start of 2007 - on the PS2.
multiple teams, different time lines don't happen at SE?
IF it's built from the ground up for next gen systems - which i don't think it is.
except square enix perhaps? If the game is pretty much done, and the PS3 isn't hitting until spring, i'm pretty sure they'd rather release the game when there is a big fat X million user base rather than rushing the game out to a smaller PS3 fan base. And as far as i recall, those new PS3 owners will be able to play the game too
EVERYONE needs more money!
isn't that advocating sunstandard product? if it's for the PS2 release it for the PS2 - i want PS3 games to be PS3 games, not upconversions from the PS2 - that would just smoke coqs.
Again, PS2 to get FFXIII , and i'm sure either FF7-2 or FFXIV is under dev for the PS3 in terms of art and asset creation from a year or so ago. *shrug*
DCharlie I guess my main argument about your POV there is what I said above about SE staff. You say multiple teams is how they'll have a PS3 FF, but I say who? No Matsuno, Nomura is busy with projects, Kitase is DOING FF13, are you going to tell me they have an entirely new group of nobodies doing the PS3 FF?
The only possible situation is if Nomura is doing it alongside Crisis Core. (Isn't he working on Kingdom Hearts 3 after that? )
Or Kitase finishing FF13 at the end of this year and then starting from scratch on a whole new one and having it out in a year or two...which seems impossible.
The only possible situation is if Nomura is doing it alongside Crisis Core. (Isn't he working on Kingdom Hearts 3 after that?
)Or Kitase finishing FF13 at the end of this year and then starting from scratch on a whole new one and having it out in a year or two...which seems impossible.
Red Scarlet
Member
Bebpo said:
Were they working on earlier titles at the same time then? That is news to me if true. IIRC, I remember hearing that 8 was in development before 7 was released, and I remember that '9, 10, 11 on the same day' thing, but have never heard about simultaneous work on earlier releases in the series.
Because
FF1 = 1987.
FF2 = 1988.
FF3 = 1990.
FF4 = 1991.
FF5 = 1992.
FF6 = 1994.
FF7 = 1997.
FF8 = 1999.
FF9 = 2000.
FF10 = 2001.
Rorshach already beat me to the 'no DQVIII on PS2'.
DCharlie
And even i am moderately surprised
DCharlie I guess my main argument about your POV there is what I said above about SE staff. You say multiple teams is how they'll have a PS3 FF, but I say who? No Matsuno, Nomura is busy with projects, Kitase is DOING FF13, are you going to tell me they have an entirely new group of nobodies doing the PS3 FF?
The only possible situation is if Nomura is doing it alongside Crisis Core. (Isn't he working on Kingdom Hearts 3 after that?
Or Kitase finishing FF13 at the end of this year and then starting from scratch on a whole new one and having it out in a year or two...which seems impossible.
.... some people can multitask!
also, someone must be doing this - with everyone busy, SE still managed to knock up a FF7 ps3 demo that apparently took 3 months - so there's some spare capacity that isn't full of "nobodies" somewhere!
WhippinSean
Banned
Anybody have any in game screen shots of FF12? I still have not seen ANYTHING on this game...
Prince of Space
Banned
Or not. SE hardly ever announces games at E3, especially big name titles. the only recent game they unveiled at E3 was Musashi: Samurai Legend.Jonnyram said:
Red Scarlet
Member
cvxfreak said:
You're weird (for the most part)!
True... but the times have changed I think. Now you have games such as Kingdom Hearts and online FF's that will interrupt the smooth development and release flow from one single player FF to the next. Especially if people that are involved in FF13 and/or 14 are also involved in the next-gen KH. Look at how long it has taken for FF12 to come out. FF10 was a long time ago. Then again, it was supposed to come out in 2003, maybe if he didn't get sick it would have? I don't know. For all the delays it seems like the game still would have been pushed back to 2004 or something.Red Scarlet said:
Plus, PS3 is new hardware, they probably don't know how to do everything yet, when they complete FF13 they will probably want to take a long break or do something else.
Also consider how much more complicated development has become. FF7-9 were mostly prerendered environments, save battles. By the time they started developing FF9, they probably had PSX development wrapped around their fingers, they could do whatever they wanted to, as fast as they wanted to. Compare it to a PS2 RPG where everything is realtime 3D. And then take it up a few steps more with PS3, which is new hardware that is without a doubt much more complicated than PS2 is/was. That takes more time. Combine that with the other popular Square-Enix titles that will be expected, and well, I think we can expect more than a 1-2 year wait in between FF's. I hope it doesn't happen, but I think there is a good chance that it could.
Only thing I've seen Kitase mention is that he's recently started working on a "Final Fantasy title for PlayStation 3." Far as I've seen, there's been no mention of "XIII" from Square Enix in relation to that project, and it's instead just been a lot of conjecture on part of the media.Bebpo said:
In fact, the only Final Fantasy XIII tidbits I've ever really seen were from October 30, 2002:
Source: http://www.rpgamer.com/news/Q4-2002/103002a.html
Source: http://64.233.179.104/search?q=cach...tasy+xiii"&hl=en&lr=&client=firefox-a&strip=1 (I take it GameForms died?)
Now, don't get me wrong, I'm not saying Jonnyram & DCharlie are right on this... It's just that, you shouldn't rule out the possibility. After all, who's to say that Kitase & Nomura haven't already finished the bulk of XIII (given the dev cycle), and that the PS3 project isn't XIV instead?
Red Scarlet
Member
Diablos said:
FFX2 and 12 the same year?
X-2 was a spinoff though, not really a complete FF game, rather an extension of X. So to answer your question, yes, I think they would have. If not they only would have pushed 12 back by a few months (into early 2004) to give X-2 some room to breathe, but Square knows what they make the most money from.Red Scarlet said:
But like I said I still think it would have got delayed till much much later in 2004, even if he didn't get sick. They clearly wanted to revamp the whole thing.
Indeed... they probably were not anticipating so many delays for 12 at that point and were going to release it for PS2 (like right around now, haha). But Square was one of the first to get devkits, so knowing what to aim for hardware-wise could have enabled them to go back and revamp all the textures and models for PS3 development.DCharlie said:
It is a lot of reworking, but you aren't completely in the dark, furthermore this is not like, say, having to redo FFIX knowing you would have to release it on PS2 instead of PSX. That would be a nightmare, making every place go from prerendered to realtime.DCharlie said:hmmm... if it was 3 years into development, that's a lot of reworking of code/assets etc. I personally don't see it.
What do people who were convinced that the PS3 game would be FF7-remake? what say those people?
The console's architecture is different, no doubt. But knowing Square, they probably have much higher res textures for 13 stored somewhere that they can add to because the PS3 is powerful enough to use them. And if they already have models they can beef them up as well. There are probably some things they'll have to redo completely, but what I'm saying is, if they've been doing it since 2002 and soon became well aware of FF12 and all of its delays, you can bet as soon as they got PS3 devkits they started beefing up 13.
Also, another possibility could be that, Square, knowing that FF12 would be delayed so much that they wouldn't be able to release 13 for the same console, could have made FF13 with next-gen in mind and not the PS2, based on talks with Sony as to what kind of hardware they would be using.
As for the remake, I don't know. I think it will come out much later than expected if it actually does. But you'd think they'd want to hit the 10 year mark.
As of right now, I'd rather have a new single-player FF for the PS3. FF7 remake can wait. But sometimes I want it to be the other way around. So I dunno.
DCharlie
And even i am moderately surprised
well, for me personally, i'd want a new FF built from the ground up with the PS3 in mind, not something that was salvaged out of a PS2 project, but thats just me
I mean, PS2 game would be built with DVD in mind for a start, PS3 game (you'd expect) would be less space limited and be a richer experience.
I don't think SE would sell themselves short, especially if they go up against good quality games from other devs - they need to keep FF special.
Also, after showing the FF demo, they'd be disappointing people if they didn't come at least close to that sort of level surely?
I mean, PS2 game would be built with DVD in mind for a start, PS3 game (you'd expect) would be less space limited and be a richer experience.
I don't think SE would sell themselves short, especially if they go up against good quality games from other devs - they need to keep FF special.
Also, after showing the FF demo, they'd be disappointing people if they didn't come at least close to that sort of level surely?
See, that's an interesting example, considering the timing of the releasesDiablos said:
FFIX was made by a number of pretty much unknown Square guys. Ito had worked on FFVIII and other staff had worked on other FFs too, but it wasn't the big name production FFX was. FFX had char. design from Nomura and was directed by Kitase. The two games were made in tandem yet one was made for PS1 and one was made for PS2. Who's to say the same hasn't happened with XIII and XIV? XIV could well be another Nomura/Kitase combo. What's even more impressive is that all the while, Tanaka and co. were making FFXI, which is a HUGE game, and online too.
I don't think they're in the business of shifting platforms nowadays. Not after FFVII. It costs a lot and it has a huge impact on the timeframe of the project.
Mefisutoferesu
Member
Where's is all this stuff about FFXIII on PS2 coming from?
The tradition has always been 3 numbered FFs per system. I doubt we'll see that change ever, side stuff is a different story - FFT2 or whatever. Besides, who's been working on this game for all these years? Matsuno? Obviously,no. Nomura? As far as I'm aware, he just finished KH2 and is now overseeing the PSP FF. Kitase? He just finished DoC and has started work on his next project, which seems to be FF based and thus most likely the candidate. Someone else you say? Has there been a sudden influx of new blood? Think about SEs releases almost every division just finished or will soon be finishing a game. Mana stuff , the DS games, Front Mission, etc. So where exactly is the team that's been working on the next FF for years at? Remember, before production is the planning phase that would mean a chosen producer and director to asign the creative team to create the new FF world, but if all the divisions and their leaders are busy and there's no new blood, how's that gonna happen? Even if you make the argument that they been working on it since 2003 you could always add to the "it'd take five years to make an FF look like that" line about the tech demo at E3 a "Nudge nudge, wink wink, know what I mean, know what I mean, say no more, say no more!" as if Kitase was loading that comment. I see no evidence other than SE needs money, as though all they're other projects brought them no money. Unless you all have inside information it seems silly.
P.S. Forgive the bad grammar, I'm really sleepy.
The tradition has always been 3 numbered FFs per system. I doubt we'll see that change ever, side stuff is a different story - FFT2 or whatever. Besides, who's been working on this game for all these years? Matsuno? Obviously,no. Nomura? As far as I'm aware, he just finished KH2 and is now overseeing the PSP FF. Kitase? He just finished DoC and has started work on his next project, which seems to be FF based and thus most likely the candidate. Someone else you say? Has there been a sudden influx of new blood? Think about SEs releases almost every division just finished or will soon be finishing a game. Mana stuff , the DS games, Front Mission, etc. So where exactly is the team that's been working on the next FF for years at? Remember, before production is the planning phase that would mean a chosen producer and director to asign the creative team to create the new FF world, but if all the divisions and their leaders are busy and there's no new blood, how's that gonna happen? Even if you make the argument that they been working on it since 2003 you could always add to the "it'd take five years to make an FF look like that" line about the tech demo at E3 a "Nudge nudge, wink wink, know what I mean, know what I mean, say no more, say no more!" as if Kitase was loading that comment. I see no evidence other than SE needs money, as though all they're other projects brought them no money. Unless you all have inside information it seems silly.
P.S. Forgive the bad grammar, I'm really sleepy.
DCharlie said:well, for me personally, i'd want a new FF built from the ground up with the PS3 in mind, not something that was salvaged out of a PS2 project, but thats just me
I mean, PS2 game would be built with DVD in mind for a start, PS3 game (you'd expect) would be less space limited and be a richer experience.
I don't think SE would sell themselves short, especially if they go up against good quality games from other devs - they need to keep FF special.
Also, after showing the FF demo, they'd be disappointing people if they didn't come at least close to that sort of level surely?
Well, what you must remember is 2002 = early development. Baby steps. The ideas were there, the story was there, etc. But the game engine was just being tinkered with at that point, I would assume. Probably not even really started.
I'd guess that 2003 is probably when they were really getting into full swing development for the game, but just the START of this. But FF12 just kept on getting delayed. Correct me if I'm wrong, but the sequence of events for FF12 is development, delays, more delays, he gets sick and apologizes for it taking so long to come out (this was summer last year when 1up posted it, correct)? 12 was SUPPOSED to come out in 2003, so that means Square would've had to wait until 2004-2005 (or maybe this year) for 13, assuming they really were planning on releasing it for the console. BUT, knowing that 12 wasn't coming out in 2003 and was going through delays in 2004 (they found out about them before anyone else, I'm sure they all talked to each other as it was happening, and understood that FF12 wouldn't be coming out for a while), they could have, as I said before, started making 13 with a next-gen console in mind. Especially if they were talking to Sony about PS3 development and what they could do for their game.
By building a game with next-gen in mind, I mean higher res textures, better models, etc. Nothing final, so that it can be expanded upon and tweaked for better hardware of course, but still, a blueprint.
And quite frankly, I'm wondering if that speculation is what sparked the false rumor about FF going to 360 as well. If you're going to build something with next-gen in mind and Sony just has stuff on paper, or as hardware you can't really work with at that point, they have to use PC's obviously. Which means the engine could be more portable in the sense that it goes multiplatform.
But something tells me Square and Sony were in constant communication so they knew what they could do with their game engine, and, as stated here before, Square was like the first developer to get PS3 devkits.
Jonnyram said:See, that's an interesting example, considering the timing of the releases
FFIX was made by a number of pretty much unknown Square guys. Ito had worked on FFVIII and other staff had worked on other FFs too, but it wasn't the big name production FFX was.
Understood, but by that point, the company probably had PSX development schemes for a new FF. It's not hard... you model some generic looking characters (PSX was beyond obsolete in 1999-2000, and not to mention, easy to develop for to begin with unlike PS2), make some really small textures, and a bunch of prerendered backgrounds pumped out by a bunch of artists. Then you code the battle system, items, weapons, etc. It is a lot of work, but like I said, PSX development for them by that point should have been EASY. Then all you need is your soundtrack and your FMV, and you basically have another FF.
Who knows at this point. It is a possibility, though.
True, but considering the circumstances right now, they're probably doing anything they can to avoid such a gap in between FF's (that are not sequels and not online.
) Then again, maybe not. PS2's Squeenix RPG release schedule could have set the new tone.Single player FF, spinoff game, other project (Kingdom Hearts, maybe something else, perhaps in place of the FF spinoff... a remake maybe
), online game, Enix RPG (Dragon Quest), new single player FF.soundwave05
Member
If FF13 is a PS2 game for 2007 or even 2008 ... it may still be able to sell its customary 2.5-3 million in Japan, but sales would take a big time hit in North America and Europe, because the series while popular over here, isn't nearly as big of a deal.
I think their release schedule is gonna be like this
2006 - Final Fantasy XII
2007 - Final Fantasy VII Remake (10th Anniversary)
2008 - Final Fantasy XIII
I think their release schedule is gonna be like this
2006 - Final Fantasy XII
2007 - Final Fantasy VII Remake (10th Anniversary)
2008 - Final Fantasy XIII
It's just Scarlet, you gotta love her.TheTrin said:
You so crazy.
Whoa, I didn't know Matsuno got owned by his own people like that, how terrible. :\
He should stick around; just because he might not be able to handle a single-player FF doesn't mean the company can't use him for other projects (*cough*NEXT-GEN FFT YOU ASSHOLES*cough*)
Mefisutoferesu said:
If the game was in early development in 2002 you can bet Square was initially making it with PS2 in mind! FF12's delays are what triggered them to change up their plans, I would think.
So you're counting FFXI. The tradition was three SINGLE PLAYER FF's per system, not online titles. FFXI shoud have been called Final Fantasy ONLINE, dammit. It would have still had Final Fantasy in the name, so it's not like people wouldn't have bought it! Grouping an online title with the numbered series is unorganized, in my opinion.
Plus if Squeenix as a whole counted FFXI as one of the three "per system" then there would've been no hard feelings towards Matsuno.
Well, this is a good point. But, knowing of FF12's delays in 2003-2004 could have still enabled them to get some seperate teams working on SOMETHING related to 13, just to get the ball rolling, so they could go to it as soon as the time is right and then really get the development moving forward.
Now that I know Matsuno really got pushed aside by the company, something tells me Square-Enix is not looking for such a large gap in between single-player FF's again. Otherwise they would have completely respected his work despite the fact that he was ill.
Red Scarlet
Member
TheTrin said:
You so crazy.
I know. But I have a "Get out of being bitched at" card from you for making that Gamecube Menu song. Do you want to use it now?
Borys, there was a scan earlier in the topic.
