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Gran Turismo 6 |OT| Moon Rover The Castle

P

Psycho_Mantis

Banned
malyce said:
Some of you are hilarious. When GT offers the same level of competition/physics as iRacing let me know.
Click to expand...

When iRacing offers the same level of content as GT for $60 let me know. $50 a year for 7 cars and 10 tracks and you have to pay on top of that for more cars and tracks hahaha GTFO with that shit. Thats so much worse than F2P.
 
D

Ding-Ding

Member
You just know its a GT thread when Forza and iRacing etc starts getting discussed.

Cant for the life of me think why mods created the comparison thread.
 
R

Red Blaster

Member
i haven't played iracing so i can't comment on physics or anything but its payment model reminds me of the notoriously pernicious gthd idea from 2006
 
-Amon-

-Amon-

Member
-Amon- said:
I'd like to ask a question about the driving mechanics.

In GT5 when driving without any kind of assist and using manual clutch with a wheel ( G27 with gate shifter for example ) you had to blip the trotthle when downshifting from second to first gear on RW cars.

Failing to do so caused the rear wheels to lock.

Only turnaround ( apart from using hell / toe tecnique, quite impossible to achieve with g27 pedals ) was to activate ABS.

Is the same thing happening in gt6 ?
Click to expand...

Last time i ask this. Serious !
 
B

Betta Lines

Member
Value, how does it work?

Forza and GT offer lots of content for an initial fee, and then have an option to pay more to earn things faster. The value is in the production quality and the amount of content out of the box, with the potential to deliver the right experience to a wide spectrum of gamers. It's a traditional package, easy to understand what you're paying for.

iRacing offers almost no content in comparison - you are expected to pay for tracks and cars individually. The subscription itself is paying for the service, not the content - a continuous, global online racing career, with a centralised database to organise races which try to place you against others of appropriate ability. The value is in the racing itself - the systems they have in place mean that the probability of signing in at any time and having a close, fair race is significantly higher than any other game. For some, this is worth the subscription fee.

Evidently, many people fail to understand the difference, or even accept that there is value to be found in a business model like iRacing.
 
M

malyce

Member
nasanu said:
Lol you want to talk physics? What is the NTM up to now? Version 5 is it? How many times will they need to patch it?

The MX5 (and frankly most cars) till a few months ago was an undrivable mess. You had to keep the car as straight as possible or else it would just spin for seemingly no reason at all. There were masses of complaints on the form, with of course fanboys saying it was perfect and cars are very hard to dive that is why billions of people do not do it every single day...

Then of course they patched it taking away grip at lower speeds, adding it at high speeds and doing 'other improvements' which they would not discuss. But its still broken. Its still far too hard to catch spins for example. PC != automagically awesome sim, or does harder = better. PC sim racers need a wakeup call. They dont judge what they play, they read that race driver X said 'iRacing is da bomb' and they jizz, but they dont realise that iRacing is paying racers to market the game by playing it and talking about it.

Anyway.. off topic rant over :p
Click to expand...

While the bolded is true, there a lot more things wrong with GTs physics than with the top PC sims. You practically get penalized for driving correctly in GT. It's faster to drift around corners, the draft is insane, lift off oversteer is pretty much non-existent, low speed physics are completely out of whack, you can downshift mid corner without rev-matching with little to no penalty etc. That's just the physics. No time deltas, no time trials, no ranking system(safety/skill), no PD sanctioned events. It's like they don't even try with online.

Is iRacing over priced? Sure, but there is no competition, and until there is, the pricing model wont change.

Preemo said:
iRacing is a joke compared to GT. just letting you know since you wanted to be informed.
Click to expand...

Snkfanatic said:
I really don't get the point of a post like this except for just trolling.
Click to expand...

Pyscho_Mantis said:
When iRacing offers the same level of content as GT for $60 let me know. $50 a year for 7 cars and 10 tracks and you have to pay on top of that for more cars and tracks hahaha GTFO with that shit. Thats so much worse than F2P.
Click to expand...

Yes, because the A.I. in GT provides unrivaled competition.

It's all about the level and quality of racing, but I doubt some of you will ever get it.
 
P

Psycho_Mantis

Banned
malyce said:
While the bolded is true, there a lot more things wrong with GTs physics than with the top PC sims. You practically get penalized for driving correctly in GT. It's faster to drift around corners, the draft is insane, lift off oversteer is pretty much non-existent, low speed physics are completely out of whack, you can downshift mid corner without rev-matching with little to no penalty etc. That's just the physics. No time deltas, no time trials, no ranking system(safety/skill), no PD sanctioned events. It's like they don't even try with online.

Is iRacing over priced? Sure, but there is no competition, and until there is, the pricing model wont change.
Click to expand...

There's no competition because no one wants to try such a ridiculous model. I just went to their website and it says over 45 000 members. I mean that just says it all. Meanwhile GT sells 10 million+. Theres hardly a market there.

Yes, because the A.I. in GT provides unrivaled competition.

It's all about the level and quality of racing, but I doubt some of you will ever get it.
Click to expand...

$12 per car......dat quality:

c6r_ss_4_screen_full.jpg
Click to expand...
 
W

Wax Free Vanilla

Member
B

Betta Lines

Member
Pyscho_Mantis said:
There's no competition because no one wants to try such a ridiculous model. I just went to their website and it says over 45 000 members. I mean that just says it all. Meanwhile GT sells 10 million+. Theres hardly a market there
Click to expand...
GT is a mainstream game. iRacing is not. I am grateful that both are making money.
 
G

gutterboy44

Member
nasanu said:
Lol.. But you are ok with paying $99 each year for about 4 tracks and ONE car, then $11 PER CAR and $15 PER TRACK after that?

How can you possibly be against MT when you are ok with iRacing bleeding you dry for content that really should be free (and a physics model not quite up to par)?
Click to expand...

LOL you are talking out your ass and don't understand two completely different models of content. iRacing doesn't bleed you dry. There is no illusion as to what the cost is to play. It is all up front, there has never been and will likely never be a new paywall. If anything, the rumors post Steam greenlight are they might be less paywalls to come.

Sign up with the half off deal (year sub for less than the cost of any GT game), race in a few series, and you earn discounts where you are paying nothing or barely anything at all to renew each year. Moreover, I bought the cars and content I need to play what I want and I now have that for every year, every revision and every update of iRacing. I don't have to rebuy anything when they update the game for the next season. Moreover, iRacing pays you to play. The more I play, the more money I get toward playing more, not the opposite with microtransactions where you pay them more to not play! Lastly, you get discounts for buying three or more tracks/cars at a time and another discount bump at 6 and up. The best thing is you are never paying for what you don't need. I don't own even half the content in the game because I am mostly obsessed with the Skippy since getting my D and then C license. I didn't have to buy a DLC pack of cars or an arbitraty sum of credits to then go and buy things, I knew what I wanted to pay for what I wanted to play. And the physics comment? Really? No racing sim in existence is not without its flaws but you are huffing dog shit if you really want to throw that out there against any console sim, especially a GT game.

But this isn't the thread for this, but your misinformation and asininity was worth addressing.
 
S

spats

Member
Photo mode is still as fun as ever, but they removed the camera orientation swap from the motion sensor and remapped it to the shoulder trigger. : (

Special+Stage+Route+5+Clubman
 
OmegaDL50

OmegaDL50

Member
I never understood this mindset that some PC Sim Racers believe that because it's harder makes it more realistic.

Darin Gangi of InsideSimRacing brought up this point that it's generally false and considering he has driven sports cars in real life and even stated at times some developers make the games harder to drive then the real life equivalent.

One of the SimBin Racing games for example was tested by a professional race driver and at his request to dial back the handling model because it was more difficult then what it was like in an actual race. Then after they implemented the patch there was a outcry from the fanbase in that the steering was "too easy" and thus they reverted the change despite it change being for realism.

It basically just showed a lot of people that have never driven a real car in their life and don't know what the hell they are saying. So this notion that realism = harder, needs to be thrown the fucking trash where it belongs.
 
D

dubc35

Member
-Amon- said:
Last time i ask this. Serious !
Click to expand...

Is anyone that has the game using a G27? I should have the game tomorrow but use a DFGT. I'm not sure if people are avoiding your question, seems like a major deal for G27 owners, but I'm not sure if anyone is currently using one.

[edit]
OmegaDL50 said:
I never understood this mindset that some PC Sim Racers believe that because it's harder makes it more realistic.

Darin Gangi of InsideSimRacing brought up this point that it's generally false and considering he has driven sports cars in real life and even stated at times some developers make the games harder to drive then the real life equivalent.

One of the SimBin Racing games for example was tested by a professional race driver and at his request to dial back the handling model because it was more difficult then what it was like in an actual race. Then after they implemented the patch there was a outcry from the fanbase in that the steering was "too easy" and thus they reverted the change despite it change being for realism.

It basically just showed a lot of people that have never driven a real car in their life and don't know what the hell they are saying. So this notion that realism = harder, needs to be thrown the fucking trash where it belongs.
Click to expand...
I believe that was addressed in Assetto Corsa (obviously not SimBin). I'd love to be playing that game right now along with GT6 (soon) if I had a gaming PC.
 
J

jet1911

Member
G

gutterboy44

Member
Pyscho_Mantis said:
There's no competition because no one wants to try such a ridiculous model. I just went to their website and it says over 45 000 members. I mean that just says it all. Meanwhile GT sells 10 million+. Theres hardly a market there.



$12 per car......dat quality:
Click to expand...

I don't think you understand the quality over quantity argument. There are 45,000 members, but they take online racing more serious than probably 99% of GT owners. Look at the trophy stats for GT5. There are a huge percentage of players who don't even win an A-Spec race, against GT AI! My first ever online race, hell my first online practice session in iRacing was a far better and more rewarding experience than anything I found with GT5 online and even rivaled our beloved NGRL which was a complete shit show in turn one every race until about the last 1/5th of the season. Is 12$ a lot? Yes, but the reason they didn't tank in the first year of operation is because the value of what you are paying for is quickly evident.
 
S

StanTowers

Member
OmegaDL50 said:
I never understood this mindset that some PC Sim Racers believe that because it's harder makes it more realistic.

Darin Gangi of InsideSimRacing brought up this point that it's generally false and considering he has driven sports cars in real life and even stated at times some developers make the games harder to drive then the real life equivalent.

One of the SimBin Racing games for example was tested by a professional race driver and at his request to dial back the handling model because it was more difficult then what it was like in an actual race. Then after they implemented the patch there was a outcry from the fanbase in that the steering was "too easy" and thus they reverted the change despite it change being for realism.

It basically just showed a lot of people that have never driven a real car in their life and don't know what the hell they are saying. So this notion that realism = harder, needs to be thrown the fucking trash where it belongs.
Click to expand...

Imagine being used to overexagerated physics and go race in real life. Must be like taking off your weighted clothes.

Please don't take this post seriously
 
G

gutterboy44

Member
dubc35 said:
Is anyone that has the game using a G27? I should have the game tomorrow but use a DFGT. I'm not sure if people are avoiding your question, seems like a major deal for G27 owners, but I'm not sure if anyone is currently using one.

[edit]

I believe that was addressed in Assetto Corsa (obviously not SimBin). I'd love to be playing that game right now along with GT6 (soon) if I had a gaming PC.
Click to expand...

Assetto Corsa is not great right now either. I would wait. The X-Bow imo is the only decently modeled car. The Zonda or any other race trim car feels horrible and the downforce and tire model goes out the window. It is very like GT in that regard. Amazing with the lower spec cars and tire models, not so great with slicks and aero.
 
G

gutterboy44

Member
-Amon- said:
And one nice thing i found on the Gtplanet forums i was not aware of, helpful for g25 / g27 owners i guess. It looks you can change degrees of rotation via buttons combinations.

900 degreees is the standard for g25 / 27, you can change to 670, 450, 270.

I was not aware of this, looks great !

Reference thread:

http://www.gtplanet.net/forum/threads/g27-g25-dfgt-undocumented-wheel-lock-settings-guide.286646/
Click to expand...

Any word on if you can adjust brake pedal settings/sensitivity? I would prefer to not have to de-mod my G27 brake pedal.
 
G

gutterboy44

Member
-Amon- said:
It looks like not.

What's the problem with the g27 brake pedal, i've always felt at home with it ...
Click to expand...

It has very little resistance and is almost entirely uniform from initial pressure to full pressure. For any decent shot at threshold braking (with no ABS) trail braking, or heel-toe you need some resistance. It will allow you to make minute adjustments more easily. Load Cells are the high end mod but by jaming a piece of sock inside the spring cylinder of my brake pedal I have striking similar feel to a load cell. It should feel like you are compressing something that gets harder the more you push at a certain point, not something you have to "float" your ankle and foot on to hold a braking level. It has always been a huge turn off for me on GT games, you can just stand on the brakes with perfect braking with ABS at 1, and then it is a shit show with ABS off because you can't tweak your brake pedal settings to match your hardware.

Edit: Stock G27 pedals are fine for consoles. The level of brake modeling, even without assists tends to be pretty forgiving.
 
S

Sleeplessnights

Banned
Just downloaded the patch. There's no need to restart the career, they'll retroactivity award the cars if you had gold in all the license tests. You just have to go through the menus again.

Was there only 3 licenses tests before the patch though? I can't remember. Now the fourth "You have to finish this to advance races" is a Super GT race.

phosphor112 said:
Are seasonal races up yet?
Click to expand...

yes
 
C

commedieu

Banned
Sleeplessnights said:
Just downloaded the patch. There's no need to restart the career, they'll retroactivity award the cars if you had gold in all the license tests. You just have to go through the menus again.

Was there only 3 licenses tests before the patch though? I can't remember. Now the fourth "You have to finish this to advance races" is a Super GT race.



yes
Click to expand...

can u screenshot/phoneshot the tommy kiara zz2 :eek:? pls...
 
O

oxidax

Member
im in between the g27 and the Fanatec CSR non elite. What do you guys think? i dont have any experience with wheels so this would be my first one.
 
-Amon-

-Amon-

Member
gutterboy44 said:
It has very little resistance and is almost entirely uniform from initial pressure to full pressure. For any decent shot at threshold braking (with no ABS) trail braking, or heel-toe you need some resistance. It will allow you to make minute adjustments more easily. Load Cells are the high end mod but by jaming a piece of sock inside the spring cylinder of my brake pedal I have striking similar feel to a load cell. It should feel like you are compressing something that gets harder the more you push at a certain point, not something you have to "float" your ankle and foot on to hold a braking level. It has always been a huge turn off for me on GT games, you can just stand on the brakes with perfect braking with ABS at 1, and then it is a shit show with ABS off because you can't tweak your brake pedal settings to match your hardware.
Click to expand...

Understood. Never had a problem with it, probably because most of my sim racing activities were made in the past where pressure sensitive brake pedals did simply not exist :)
 
G

gutterboy44

Member
-Amon- said:
Understood. Never had a problem with it, probably because most of my sim racing activities were made in the past where pressure sensitive brake pedals did simply not exist :)
Click to expand...

Since the days of GPL when I stuck a squash ball under my original GT Force wheel that came with GT3, I have found the additional resistance very helpful for consistent braking. You can rely on both your leg and ankle/foot muscles instead of just the more sensitive ankle/foot muscles which can fatigue when finessing them for extended periods. I remember that squash ball increasing my GPL rank like ten fold I improved my lap times so much. If I end up getting GT6 I will let you know if I find a way to make it work if ABS off is improved.
 
H

hort22

Member
dont have the game yet but what is the early consensus...GT5.5 or do the physics and other new stuff make it feel new and or different from 5?
 
J

jongkookie

Member
OmegaDL50 said:
It basically just showed a lot of people that have never driven a real car in their life and don't know what the hell they are saying. So this notion that realism = harder, needs to be thrown the fucking trash where it belongs.
Click to expand...

Yep.

Those people who complained that the Miata was too damn easy to drive obviously have never driven one. I have one for my daily driver, got the best/worst version too, 06 model with no TCS/DSC, but it does have a 6 speed MT, sport Bilstein shocks and a proper LSD, and she's seriously a breeze to drive. The Miata is supposed to be easy to drive... it's why it's highly regarded among gearheads.

Of course, if you push it hard enough things will go wrong, but that's true for all cars.

The 07 Miata in GT5 drives quite similar to my car in real life. Sure it's one car, but I'm more inclined to believe that Polyphony knows what the hell they're doing with the cars when they can nail the characteristics of one car compared to the outcries of a select few who think they know how to drive.
 
-Amon-

-Amon-

Member
gutterboy44 said:
Since the days of GPL when I stuck a squash ball under my original GT Force wheel that came with GT3, I have found the additional resistance very helpful for consistent braking. You can rely on both your leg and ankle/foot muscles instead of just the more sensitive ankle/foot muscles which can fatigue when finessing them for extended periods. I remember that squash ball increasing my GPL rank like ten fold I improved my lap times so much. If I end up getting GT6 I will let you know if I find a way to make it work if ABS off is improved.
Click to expand...

I tried that on my logitech momo days in Gran Prix Legends too.

Did not help me at all, so i never looked back.

OT: what is your Gpl rank id ? mine is flanker :)
 
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