Too late. That’s exactly what it already sounds like. Bungie has obviously left incredibly badly documented code and now 343 is in a position where they don’t know why certain old parts are there, what they do, if they’re needed and if something will break if they remove them.They should be careful how they word this...it could be interpreted like they don't know how to use their own engine.
The original showcase of the game would serve to fuel that narrative.
I don't think programming language is the issue here. Poor perspective is. Yes, not all C code should be rewritten in another language, but I assure you they would have still run into issues by choosing, say, C# or even Rust.Modern C++ is a bloated mess, if I found C99 code that still worked the last thing I would do is covert it to C++. But that's just my 2 cents.
Legacy code also is an unfortunate fact of life. You usually only completely avoid it in brand new projects. And even then, there's the typical dependency on libcurl, libpng, etc.This:
Is not good. As a software developer this sounds like a nightmare. Legacy code is rarely a good thing, most of the time it's a hindrance and has a funny way of interacting with new things you add when you least expect it. Then when you find what it is that's causing the problem you've got to figure out what the fuck that section of code does and how to work around it (or remove it without breaking anything else). House of cards.
The only way to get around that process is to have very good documentation.
Yeah, same exact feeling I got. Sounds like the engine is a mess. The last thing I ever want any code base referred to is a "mystical beast."They should be careful how they word this...it could be interpreted like they don't know how to use their own engine.
The original showcase of the game would serve to fuel that narrative.
C#?I don't think programming language is the issue here. Poor perspective is. Yes, not all C code should be rewritten in another language, but I assure you they would have still run into issues by choosing, say, C# or even Rust.
Bad code knows no language, but it does know certain mindsets.
Haha so true, can’t believe they thought this would sound good, looking at the code of your latest engine shouldn’t be like digging at an excavating siteThe last thing I ever want any code base referred to is a "mystical beast."
To 343:“Mystical”, “intimidating” and “legacy” are some one of the last adjectives I want associated with any piece of software I rely on to do my job. It sounds like they are screaming for help without trying to throw the original development team under the bus.
edit: The more I read it, the more it sounds like a cry for help.
I follow tons of graphics programmers and many prefer c like c++ so embracing modern c++ seems almost contradiction to these other preferencesModern C++ is a bloated mess, if I found C99 code that still worked the last thing I would do is covert it to C++. But that's just my 2 cents.
Legacy code also is an unfortunate fact of life. You usually only completely avoid it in brand new projects. And even then, there's the typical dependency on libcurl, libpng, etc.
Nah, I get it.Previously, 343 Industries stated that the SlipSpace Engine allowed the Halo Infinite team to realize aspects of gameplay that previously would have been simply impossible . Also, experimenting with new ideas and additional features turned out to be a much faster operation than in the past.
Halo Infinite: The SlipSpace Engine is a ‘mystical beast’, for 343 Industries
While it is true that Halo Infinite immediately set itself the goal of recovering the atmospheres and sensations offered bywww.wiredupreport.com
Not only game engines. Creating things from scratch basically means going back to the drawing board, it's a lot of effort and its time consuming. You have banking systems, management software with tons of old code below because it simply works, no reason to change it. Most companies just continue developing on top of what they already have with newer technologies.Agreed. I don't think GHG has a background in software development though, so he's forgiven. I honestly don't think there's a single game engine on the market, which doesn't have odd legacy parts here and there. Or any piece of modern software for that matter.
But the engine isnt pushing other things also.In this thread there's a lot of people that thinks that an engine is only used for graphics.
Reading his quote he never talks specifically about that and can be talking about gameplay for example.
I don't expect Halo to be a graphical powerhouse myself, the beta was good enough and it was really fun IMO. Having the single player at a similar level would be enough for me.
Yeah but don't forget to look at all the other things it's not doing like terrain deformation, destruction, and so living environnement.But the engine isnt pushing other things also.
MP for example still stucks at 12v12, meanwhile other f2p games push 60+ players with great graphics etc
Really nothing in the flight stood out while playing.
Or a good suite of regression tests. Basically there's no way for us to tell if the Slipspace legacy code is a good or bad thing because we don't have access to the codebase and documentation. The engineer quoted in the article does.This:
Is not good. As a software developer this sounds like a nightmare. Legacy code is rarely a good thing, most of the time it's a hindrance and has a funny way of interacting with new things you add when you least expect it. Then when you find what it is that's causing the problem you've got to figure out what the fuck that section of code does and how to work around it (or remove it without breaking anything else). House of cards.
The only way to get around that process is to have very good documentation.
But remember, forum posters always know betterOr a good suite of regression tests. Basically there's no way for us to tell if the Slipspace legacy code is a good or bad thing because we don't have access to the codebase and documentation. The engineer quoted in the article does.
Where was that?Weren't employees bitching about how hard the engine was to use and how outdated a lot of it was to Schreier a year ago?
Challenge accepted……Find me one game engine that doesn’t have legacy code.
Math?I mean I’m still excited for the game I don’t think 6 months will make that of a different should all games just be delayed forever for polish? You gotta release your damn game.
They certainly seem to have underperformed. Hopefully things are getting better.Yeah but don't forget to look at all the other things it's not doing like terrain deformation, destruction, and so living environnement.
So far it's been mostly talk and an in engine trailer in 2018 far ahead than what they've been able to show.Please note that I said show because there is still a ridiculously small part of me that still has hope.
I really hope that year delay has paid off.But 343 isn't bungie and I have less hope that they will deliver.They certainly seem to have underperformed. Hopefully things are getting better.
New engine is in most cases BS PR. The word engine in some studios is BS PR in itself as you have a collection of various libraries, exporters, loaders, and common glue code that ties it together (and call that an engine). You may create a new project and call it a brand new engine, but you are likely to carry over components that “worked”. “Completely new engine… oh look 20 years old code”… yeah, right .I thought Slipspace was an entirely new engine. Wasn’t developing that why Infinite was experiencing so much trouble?
The fuck? The tech preview was awesome and not even final representation? You expect the final game to possibly look worse?? I'm legit confused. You post sounds fucking stupid. No offense.Fluff talk. "Yay us!". Let's see the final release before cheering. Tech Preview was good, but let's hold off till we get the real deal.
There is a lot more to a game engine than graphics.Take all the game assets and logic and port it to the Unreal engine and see what looks better.
Well ain't that the concept of a mystical beast?DOUBT™
Lol savageSo in other words their new engine has a bunch of 20 year old bloat that they don't understand? Halo infinite looks distinctly average from a tech perspective, talking about the engine like its a mystical beast sounds like overcompensation for wasting 6 years and half a billion when they could have used unreal engine and got it out in half the time with half the budget and without craig
Wtf lmao.Based on the recent cinematic and the campaign flyover it's definitely right there. Consider what a Halo game must do and the scale they're going for in this title, for it to look anything like what it appears to now is nothing short of extraordinary.
still contains engine code from this game:
Math doesn't age, and that's about all it contains from Quake 2.
Quake 1
It's true math doesn't age ....2+2 is still 4 even after all this time.Math doesn't age, and that's about all it contains from Quake 2.