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Halo: Reach |OT5| A Monument to All Our Sins
- Thread starter GhaleonEB
- Start date
For those who enjoy a good grin-inducing nostalgia trip, Edge has uploaded 150 reviews of "classic" games from over the years.
Here's Halo: Combat Evolved.
Halo 2
Halo 3 Review:
I think the 10 for Halo 1 and 3 are well justified. Spending 14,000 words writing a review of Reach's Campaign made me realize how incredible Halo 3's really was.
Here's Halo: Combat Evolved.
This is not hyperbole: this is the most important launch game for any console, ever. It doesnt mean the XBox will succeed, but it does mean that, if it fails, it will leave videogaming with one perfect, eloquently coded moment.
Halo 2
Halo 3 Review:
And Halo 3's vision and deep, daring ambition are to be found elsewhere, too. They're in the Forge map editor, the replay theatre and the co-operative campaign. Over and above that, they're in the philosophy, the engineering, the game's infrastructure, the community support and the sheer commitment that lays behind these modes, and the way they're unified with the game at the most fundamental of levels.
I think the 10 for Halo 1 and 3 are well justified. Spending 14,000 words writing a review of Reach's Campaign made me realize how incredible Halo 3's really was.
Steelyuhas
Member
Tunavi said:
I'd be in. Although we really played that Countdown idea lol.
GhaleonEB said:
The script, "Cortana", "Halo", projectile-shooting flood forms, and brutes all say hai!
billy beane
Banned
Respect knuckles for picking ODST second. I feel like that game gets too much flak sometimes. Really dug that campaign; it was familiar, yet different at the same time.Ramirez said:
EDIT: Just saw you said all the campaigns after CE sucked. Still think ODST was a great great campaign though.
Played New Alexandria again. Flying through the open city, exploring different buildings, watching the post apocalyptic views from different parts of New Alexandria, collapsing skyscrapers, the covenant carrier glassing the planet...If only the rest of the campaign was as incredible as this level.
Instead we got Long Night of Solace and 7 shitty linear firefight levels.
If Halo 4 isn't open world like ODST, I'll be very disappointed.
Halo 1 - best story, biggest adventure.
Halo 2 - best themes (Elites branching off from the Covenant, Brutes taking over. I thought that was really interesting. Shame, because the plot wasn't done well)
Halo 3 had those awesome scarab explosions and thats about it
ODST - best atmosphere, open world was amazing. My favorite campaign in the series.
Reach - I dunno, best game with visible reticle Bloom? Worst campaign
Instead we got Long Night of Solace and 7 shitty linear firefight levels.
If Halo 4 isn't open world like ODST, I'll be very disappointed.
Halo 1 - best story, biggest adventure.
Halo 2 - best themes (Elites branching off from the Covenant, Brutes taking over. I thought that was really interesting. Shame, because the plot wasn't done well)
Halo 3 had those awesome scarab explosions and thats about it
ODST - best atmosphere, open world was amazing. My favorite campaign in the series.
Reach - I dunno, best game with visible reticle Bloom? Worst campaign
Trasher said:
I'm not really taking story into consideration at all, I was regularly going back to CE and replaying campaign up to a year or so ago. I've not had the urge to replay the others at all really, and probably never will. Reach is the biggest offender to me with all of the scripted Falcon rides and such. New Alexandria is one of the worst levels to replay through, great setting though.
I guess a lot of my enjoyment comes out of the weapons in campaign, the pistol was just an extremely fun weapon to use against the AI in both CE and ODST. Heck, I even enjoyed the scoped SMG in ODST. Another funny thing is I really enjoyed ODST's FF, but I loathe FF in Reach, I'm not sure why...
Agreed. The sandbox in Reach is boring. DMR/Plasma pistol - Anything else will get you killed. In ODST, every weapon served a purpose, not to mention fun to use. You had to have different weapons every round. Limited ammo, different enemies, different skulls, needed an SMG for Drone rounds. They were all powerful weapons in their own ways but you couldn't spend the whole game using the same two weapons.Ramirez said:
ODST was survival, Reach is target practice.
Steelyuhas
Member
Playing Reach for the first time in a while right now. The two things that always come to might within two seconds of picking this up again: the grenades are absolute abominations and double melee, especially with sprint is really really stupid.
Given simple fixes that could be applied to those, I'm pretty disappointed that "core" Reach will not be touched in the TU. I hope "classic++" is absolute money because otherwise there really isn't anything that is going to get me to play this game when better shooters like BF3 arrive in the fall.
Also, a frag grenade just stuck me, it felt like the ultimate Reach nade trollface haha.
Given simple fixes that could be applied to those, I'm pretty disappointed that "core" Reach will not be touched in the TU. I hope "classic++" is absolute money because otherwise there really isn't anything that is going to get me to play this game when better shooters like BF3 arrive in the fall.
Also, a frag grenade just stuck me, it felt like the ultimate Reach nade trollface haha.
Tunavi said:
Hmm, yea this is a good way of putting it. I remember being absolutely terrified seeing a pair of Hunters lumbering up the stairs on Crater. Only time you even fear for your life in Reach is when the fastball throwing Elites show up, and then it just feels cheap, meh.
I really think Frags stick you in this game just as much as plasmas, it's the reason you can't get away from that whirring sound.
I just want the TU to perhaps make people actually want to play and finish out games. I'm so sick of 90% of the games I play every night having multiple quitters, it's quite ridiculous.
I'm nearing 1K wins in TO, and I have a 93% winning percentage, how in the world is that even possible? What happened to the general Halo population? Losing was a pretty regular thing in Halo 2/3, but I'm lucky if I end up on the losing end more than once a night anymore, mostly due to people quitting more than anything. I know this sounds like a brag post or something, but I honestly cannot explain why people are so bad at Reach. I'm REALLY curious to see if things even out more once bloom is removed (hopefully!).
Ah ok.Ramirez said:
If I was ranking the games purely on story alone I would most likely go with CE>Reach>ODST>3>2.
CE I don't really have to explain much. It was amazing discovering a Halo for the first time. The music fit the game beyond perfectly. Good intro with popping the "hushed casket" and an even better ending. I'll stress the point again: god damn the music. Of course all the games in the series have great music, but CE's soundtrack is easily my favorite and is used wonderfully to help the mood and whatnot of the story.
It seems like most people here hate Reach and its campaign. I'm not sure if it's the gameplay or the story, but I actually quite enjoyed the story. Maybe I'm just a sucker for heroes who sacrifice themselves. It was fun getting to know a Spartan squad, and I thought it was a great tie-in to CE.
ODST's story is really great as well. I actually struggle a bit with putting this under Reach. The whole detective sort of angle was a cool change of pace. And the audio log story really hooked me. I really enjoyed listening/watching to those. It was a great way to beef up the story in that campaign. My biggest gripe with it was the ending though. It just kinda fell flat for me.
Once it gets down to 3 and 2 it's hard to choose for me. They both have some great parts, and they both also have some really weak parts. I actually really enjoy the story of the Arbiter, but I disliked missing out on MC stuff. He kind of just falls to the wayside, and the whole thing with the gravemind seemed like quite a stretch to me in that game. And because of how well 3 ends I think is the reason I give the edge to it over 2.
Now if I were to rank these according to gameplay alone, I'm actually not quite sure as to what I would do. CE would obviously be my number one by a long shot just because it was the only one that had me come back for multiple replays. All the other ones kinda mesh together in my mind when I try to think of which encounters I enjoyed the most, and which encounters I enjoyed the least.
i nerini del buio
Member
agreeTunavi said:
plasma pistol and needler to take out engineers, smg and carbine for drones, pistol for grunts and jackals, stickies for brutes.
and I loved, loved how tough were the chieftains! You really felt like you earned that hammer lol.
Steelyuhas
Member
Trasher said:
I really enjoy Reach's campaign as well, but yeah, most people here seem to hate it.
I won't argue that the gameplay was mediocre, but I thought the story was actually pretty well done.Steelyuhas said:
I don't play these games for their campaigns and the encounters within them. That doesn't mean I'm saying they are complete crap in that aspect, but there are better options if you want to be dazzled in that category in my opinion. The Halo campaigns have some little gems in them though like certain missions.
I play these games mainly for multiplayer, but a not too far-off second reason would be for their story. I love the Halo universe, and I love the Spartans.
I think he is going to the Raleigh one.Ramirez said:
lazybones18
Banned
Well, I just had an interesting firefight night
- Encountered two Inheritors in two separate matches (only one of them was wearing the skull armor). Actually, I didn't get to play with one of the Inheritors cause the other players didn't like the levels that were selected (end up with Waterfront as the last one)
- Finally maxed out the In Command commendation
- Oh, and this happened to me: http://www.bungie.net/Stats/Reach/FileDetails.aspx?fid=21655954&player=Lazykarl20
Can't get anymore fucked up than thatDon't have a BNet account so I can't render it. Maybe someone else will....>_>
xxjuicesxx
Member
Who's the baddest 10% gold in town?
The more I play Reach's campaign the less I like it. The environments are all pretty boring and dull, 90% of mission objective involve pushing buttons, and the sandbox is sooo boring. It seems like the only thing you ever need is the DMR/occasional needle rifle and a plasma pistol. ODST's scoped SMG was much more versatile and interesting than any automatic weapon in reach, and you actually felt a need to pick up different weapons, especially in firefight. Reach managed to include two automatic plasma weapons, and the spiker, and make them all fairly worthless, make the Covenant "sniper" completely undesirable to use, and and remove the most different and fun vehicle in the series (the Chopper, of course).
Sometimes I get a feeling like I should play campaign, and end up looking through the list of levels going. "nah, that one's boring, no, no, no... fuck it, I'll just play Halo 2/3 instead."
Sometimes I get a feeling like I should play campaign, and end up looking through the list of levels going. "nah, that one's boring, no, no, no... fuck it, I'll just play Halo 2/3 instead."
Really in terms of story Halo 2's is unmatched. The best in the series in my view. The thing it misses is the fantastic atmosphere and freedom we had gotten in Halo 1. Nothing comes close to that campaign just based off that regard. ODST attempted, but it felt more boring than anything else. Halo 3's story was vomit. And I liked Reach's, it just wasn't as special as hoped to be, or close to memorable as all of Halo 1's experience.Trasher said:
If Bungie did it the same way ODST style, you could argue the same for weapons and battle scenarios. For instance, using a quick sidearm like plasma pistol or Magnum against the Skirmishers, almost anything against grunts, though you rather get those quick headshots on the ones hoarding fuel rods. Use Needle Rifle and Needler against Brutes, which kills them faster than anything non-explosive. Jackals are stronger than they have ever been, but DMR (medium or far range) and Plasma Repeater or plasma pistol work absolutely fine for close quarters battle. Elites you pretty much are able to kill with any weapon, it just pends what weapon he's carry, what type of officer he is, and your region of the map. A melee or two plus a headshot can take him down swiftly.i nerini del buio said:
But Bungie made it different with weapon caches, so it's a different experience that those who often played ODST's Firefight. As for the maps, people talked alot about them, but I only liked a select few: Lost Platoon and Last Exit, the rest I don't care about. Same for Reach's set: I like Beachhead and Courtyard the most. I would like Unearthed a lot more if they allowed chaingun, but we've been down that road.
HiredN00bs
Member
I really like what I'm hearing from the podcast. It sounds like they're trying to re-create the CE experience in Reach.Ramirez said:
Bungie said they didn't want objective games in the Arena because they couldn't figure out a player rating system, but now that the Arena rankings are based purely on wins and losses, why can't objective games be included?
The mismatches always occurred in Social Skirmish in Halo 3 as well. In fact it was like that often in all of the unranked stuff. That's what Trueskill brings to the table.
Agree with ya about Objectives in Arena. I'm not sure why it didn't get implemented as they went to W/L, either. Another derp to the line of questionable decisions. They could've thrown in team based awards in game completion or whatnot to add more cR since it usually doesn't get rewarded enough.
Agree with ya about Objectives in Arena. I'm not sure why it didn't get implemented as they went to W/L, either. Another derp to the line of questionable decisions. They could've thrown in team based awards in game completion or whatnot to add more cR since it usually doesn't get rewarded enough.
The Reach campaign was okay it's just that it was kind of hard to like it knowing how it ended. It didn't feel the same way about RE:0 or MGS3 so that's weird.
I don't understand the complaints about the sandbox. Btw, I hate when the sandbox is brought up in any argument. It's like the go to thing to complain about. A buzz word that gets used way too often. I don't know what level of difficulty some of you played at but there were points in the game especially towards the end where I was scavanging for weapons. There was an area where you get ambushed by two Hunters and a bunch of skirmishers and I was jumping around like a ninja meleeing after running out of shotgun ammo and running away to pick up the AR that I dropped in the previous room just to clean up. It reminded me a lot of the CE campaign. Sure, you'll stick to the DMR/Pistol the same way you stuck to the Pistol/Shotgun in the first game but it doesn't mean that there weren't many spots where I had to use other weapons to kill stuff. On legendary Reach was as much a challenge as CE. I'm not going to say everyone did it but I recall many of you going on about just sprinting through areas so you wouldn't have to pull your hair out trying to complete it on legendary. That's not how you play a game.
CE > Halo 3 > Reach > Halo 2
That's for campaigns. I haven't played ODST. I know a lot of people knock Halo 3 for the story but I was okay with it and I really enjoyed going through the campaign. I just HATED the multiplayer.
I don't understand the complaints about the sandbox. Btw, I hate when the sandbox is brought up in any argument. It's like the go to thing to complain about. A buzz word that gets used way too often. I don't know what level of difficulty some of you played at but there were points in the game especially towards the end where I was scavanging for weapons. There was an area where you get ambushed by two Hunters and a bunch of skirmishers and I was jumping around like a ninja meleeing after running out of shotgun ammo and running away to pick up the AR that I dropped in the previous room just to clean up. It reminded me a lot of the CE campaign. Sure, you'll stick to the DMR/Pistol the same way you stuck to the Pistol/Shotgun in the first game but it doesn't mean that there weren't many spots where I had to use other weapons to kill stuff. On legendary Reach was as much a challenge as CE. I'm not going to say everyone did it but I recall many of you going on about just sprinting through areas so you wouldn't have to pull your hair out trying to complete it on legendary. That's not how you play a game.
CE > Halo 3 > Reach > Halo 2
That's for campaigns. I haven't played ODST. I know a lot of people knock Halo 3 for the story but I was okay with it and I really enjoyed going through the campaign. I just HATED the multiplayer.
I love it for a few reasons. Between 3 and Reach, I'd say the series bettered CE's campaign in just about every respect.Steelyuhas said:
For me, I'd hold Reach over Halo 3 for so many standout chapters and lack of a dud chapter (ie Cortana, Library), 3 over ODST, ODST and 1 about neck-and-neck, 2 bringing up the rear.
Reach: +encounter, objective, level variability; +micrograv, space combat; -slog of an ending, -missed story opportunities
Halo 3: +best vehicle encounters of series -huge missed story opportunities
ODST: +stellar aesthetic and atmosphere, +narratively ambitious, -extensive hub fairly repetitive
Halo 1: +objective, level variability; +most contiguous/seamless setting, -severe repetition
Halo 2: +meatiest campaign, a journey; +narratively ambitious, -dragged in places, -poor ending
Halo 3: +best vehicle encounters of series -huge missed story opportunities
ODST: +stellar aesthetic and atmosphere, +narratively ambitious, -extensive hub fairly repetitive
Halo 1: +objective, level variability; +most contiguous/seamless setting, -severe repetition
Halo 2: +meatiest campaign, a journey; +narratively ambitious, -dragged in places, -poor ending
LunaticPuma
dresses business casual
Ramirez said:
ODST FF created more of a sense of despair and struggle for survival. Maps were smaller creating more of a constant stream of enemies. Skull progression increased difficulty decently and lack of unlimited ammo forced you to improvise with enemy dropped weapons. ODST FF would be perfect with skirmishers instead of buggers and black eye skull simply reducing stamina recharge time.
squidhands
Member
a blown mind is no way to start a Friday.FyreWulff said:
I think a lot of what you're saying could be recitified in Reach if we didn't have so many unlimited ammo gametypes that always get chosen. Even Limited allows you to run amok with the DMR without having to worry about conservation, which imo is the main thing that made ODST's firefight so enjoyable. I'd love to see AA's integrated into the weapon drops (yeah, I know it's probably not possible) and start out the match with nothing but base speed and jump height. Make them something that's earned over the course of a limited life scenario and it would make for a much better experience for a lot of people.Tunavi said:
I love exploring campaign spaces. I discovered new things yesterday. We explored campaign countdown. Why the fuck aren't the doors open all the way in MP. Looks so much better. And the smoke coming from the engines... Open sky... Window to control room.... We got to the top of it too with clever jumps.Tunavi said:
THEN..... I figured out if you hold RB in space combat then it becomes like actual space combat. The ship doesn't self orient itself. You can coast upside down or to the side and roll without that banshee roll animation.
We then dog fighted with eachother. Fun as hell.
when we landed in the Corvette we started walking ON it. I though there would be soft kills, death barriers, and invisible walls everywhere. I thought the ship was cut off like it is in zealot. But its actually the entire ship. SOME barriers but there are some places that are safe. And exploring the ship with Savannah circling...
Loved it.
king picollo
Member
Had a small epiphany, Armour abilities it's the Arbiters fault.
squidhands
Member
It's interesting that Bungie chose to not have AA's drop along with guns and grenades, at the very least in Campaign and Firefight. Imagine a limited life gametype where you had no extra ammo or AA's (eh, maybe sprint) at your disposal, only what you could scavenge from the dead. Jetpack from Elites, Armor Lock from Brutes, Hologram from Jackals...me likey.Homeboyd said:
That sounds amazing.squidhands said:
As long as you were taking lives from your own pool and not a team's. Too many griefers to make it work... unless friendly fire was turned off.
But yea, essentially turning AA's into equipment, and not even guaranteed equipment at that. I wonder if AA's could be added to weapon drops alongside a complimentary weapon.
Kibbles
Member
Halo 2 set the mood well, it had some awesome environments and ambient sounds/music. The ending is the only thing that really puts the campaign down for me. I played it through on Legendary on H2V las year and still loved it. Of course MP is where it's at, and after the years I spent on it I'd give it a 10 retroactively That's how MP reviews should be done, IMO. Give it a good couple of months at least. Any reviews near launch just seem like promo to me.
That's how MP reviews should be done, IMO. Give it a good couple of months at least. Any reviews near launch just seem like promo to me.The Librarian
Banned
Then you haven't spent enough time with the rest of the sandbox. A large majority of Reach's sandbox is effective against fighting the Covenant to some degree, but you have to get within the right range. Medium-close range combat: AR, Plasma Rifle/Repeater, Plasma Pistol, Spiker, shotgun, sword, pro-pipe, pistol, Rockets, FRG, Plasma Launcher, Gravity Hammer, and Needler. Aside from the Plasma Repeater, all of those weapons, to me, are a lot of fun to use. Of course, each has a varying effectiveness depending on the enemy your fighting (the AR, for example, isn't great against Jackals), and in the Elite's case, the strength of their shields. Medium-long range: DMR, Nerfle, Sniper, and the Focus Rifle. All fun to use.Tunavi said:
Reach's sandbox isn't a pushover.
Let's scale back the hyperbole a bit (er, quite a bit). When it comes to consistency in level quality, Reach is unmatched in the Halo games. In almost every Halo game, the last two levels take a nose dive in quality. Pillar of Autumn is the best final level of any of the games and has some really good encounters (Brutes with the Wraith in the back, Boneyard map, the first fight before you get on the mongoose), and despite half of The Package being a Firefight match, it was fun because of the scale (the tank part is a hoot too). Winter Contingency is the best opening level out of all the Halo games; its presentation and gameplay are unmatched among the starting levels.Tunavi said:
And out of the three levels I mentioned, let's count how many "firefight moments" there are in each level:
1. Winter Contingency 2
2. The Package 1 (but it takes up half the level)
3. Pillar of Autumn 1
Hardly "shitty linear firefight levels." Also, I dunno where you get off with "linear": Reach's campaign is just as non-linear as Halo 1/2/3.
Firefight moments are far, far less in each level than you make it out to be. Taken together, they don't compromise more than a quarter of the campaign.
...
When it comes to the Halo campaigns, each sequel, individually, to Halo has improved, or made greater strides in, each aspect of the game.
1. Halo 2 had a better story.
2. Halo 3 took the encounter design a generation ahead.
3. ODST surpasses it in atmosphere and music (and linearity).
4. Reach has it beat in the consistency of level quality and gun feedback. Not to mention it has the best ending of the entire series.
I know I said Reach's campaign was the best when it first came out, but I think I'm slowly coming to see Halo 3's campaign as the best.
I think the last mission in the first game is better than PoA. Between the boring trench run (Mongoose down a light downhill series of s-curves on a dirt road), shooting gallery encounters (the two Boneyard fights), momentum-halting Drone encounter and endless siege battle, only two sequences are well crafted, IMO. Everything before you get on the Mongoose, and the battle right after, with the Brutes and the Wraith in the back. (That's actually one of my favorite fights in the game.)
Hitting up the Armory, pulling open and then blowing the four engine cores and the epic Warthog trench run in Halo 1 is a tighter, more successful sequence for me.
By my count:
Winter Contingency 2
Nightfall: 2
Long Night of Solace: 2 (I'm including the space station defense)
Exodus: 1
The Package: 1 (but it takes up half the level)
Pillar of Autumn: 1 (also takes forever)
Zeouterlimits
Member
+1.GhaleonEB said:
I'm very glad this campaign discussion is happening, as it occurred to me earlier this week, post-Comic-con Anniversary footage how much I felt unsure about the quality of Reach's campaign as a whole. Then I started thinking about my problems with H3's, ODSTs and H2's.
It has troubled me to find myself aware of deep levels of dis-satisfaction.