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Is the "Dpad" Nintendo's best contribution to gaming?

ec0ec0

Member
I know who made something first isn't necessarily the best argument, but I found this image that can serve as a starting point for discussing some of the innovations and where they originated:

h9fiHmX.png


"Who popularized/perfected it" is probably a better question, and we can use this as a springboard to discuss some of these.

Even thought some of this comparisons are bad, according to some posters (i don't know, i've never tried those machines), i really like the line of thinking behind this image.

It doesn't really matter (like, at all) that nintendo didn't truly "invent" any of this things. They created huge properties while making their games and consoles around this (hardware or software) concepts, often nailing it on their very first try.

So, for example, nintendo didn't create the analog stick, nor did they create 3d games, but they sure as hell linked both together and "popularized/perfected it" (on their very first try, i may add) and showed everyone who you were supposed to do it.

They built the nintendo 64 and its games around that concept, as the ds with tounch controls, or motion controls with the wii, now the switch...

They can't take credit for creating any of those things... so, who cares?

Knowing who invented something is cool and all, but without the proper implementation in games (or if the technology hasn't arrived yet, or if you don't have the proper resorces) you're not going to get much out of it.

edit: ouch... first post, how embarrassing, please don't look at me!! :p
 

big_erk

Member
I'd give it to 4 face buttons and shoulder buttons.

Yeah, while the d-pad is definitely important and changed gaming for the better, the face buttons and especially the shoulder buttons were epic advancements in controller design. I remember the first time I held the SNES controller I was like this makes so much sense.
 

Tripolygon

Banned
So Nintendo introduced console controller rumble as hardware and an integrated game feature, which was then swiped by Sony, then Sony's next console continued to include the swiped feature, but because Sony's next console came out first they now get the credit for it because they were the first to include it at a console launch. Rich stuff.
The Rumble Pak was launched on April 27 1997, with Star Fox 64 in Japan
The Dual Analog which has Rumble was launched with Tobal 2 on April 25, 1997, in Japan, Bushido Blade which had Rumble support was launched 1 month prior to its release.

The Dual Analog with rumble (SCPH-1150) was only released in Japan, as the rumble was removed when sold in the US and EU. The Dual Shock became the marketing name for the Dual Analog and was sold everywhere.
 

Yoshi

Headmaster of Console Warrior Jugendstrafanstalt
I feel like you can settle who "set the standard" by looking at the follow up from each company. Sony sold the exact same controller for the next two decades. Nintendo never made a follow-up to their N64 design, instead making a controller that looked like Sony's. And used Sony's design for the stick itself as well. Sony set the standard.

The analog stick was a huge risk at the time, Nintendo was very worried people wouldn't accept it. Thus, the three-pronged design was born, which would have allowed them, to go back to the d-pad without changing the controller set up, had the stick failed to gain traction. Such measures were not required on GameCube. Having a stick instead of buttons to control the camera would obviously have added to that risk. I agree that the form factor of the GameCube controller is much closer to the Dual Shock's than the N64's (obviously massively improved by the left analog stick position alone), but keeping a third handle for a d-pad wouldn't have made much sense after the N64 anyway.
 

jroc74

Phone reception is more important to me than human rights
How?

Oh wrapped in your hand. That's true, but it wasn't a thumb stick. It sort of a hand-held arcade cab joystick.

Yea I know. I made sure to call it a joystick, lol. I was just responding to this part of that post:
before the NES, controllers were things you put in the coffee table and played with your index and middle fingers, or index and thumb; or even the whole hand over it.

When I had both the 2600 and Colecovision and friends, family that had either one, I have never seen anyone in my circle use it on the table or as described above.

Just thought it was odd that poster said Nintendo introduced handheld controllers.

Even tho now that I re-read that I see what that post means....but we always had it in our hands.

Maybe it would have been more comfortable to put it on a table, lol.
 
You young cats don't understand how bad and confusing controllers were before the D-pad and how Nintendo changed EVERYTHING when they brought it out on the NES.

atari-2600-controller.jpg

atari_5200_controller.jpg

5200paddlecontroller.jpg

220px-Atari-2600-Paddle-Controller-FR.jpg
 

bionic77

Member
You young cats don't understand how bad and confusing controllers were before the D-pad and how Nintendo changed EVERYTHING when they brought it out on the NES.

atari-2600-controller.jpg

atari_5200_controller.jpg

5200paddlecontroller.jpg

220px-Atari-2600-Paddle-Controller-FR.jpg
They also don't understand how insanely awesome and ahead of its time Super Mario Bros felt on release.
 
Well, Nintendo's specific D-pad could technically be called an invention- that's what patents are for, after all. Obviously that patent was fairly trivial to engineer around, as seen with Sega and Sony, and I don't think many people will think Nintendo invented the idea of four directional inputs in general.
Only the visible shape of Nintendo's d-pad was an invention. There were square and circular d-pads before them. Covering most of the control disc and just exposing a plus was the only new thing Nintendo did.

As for the analog stick, which I've seen people arguing about in this thread, I think it's fairly absurd to think Nintendo's N64 controller didn't popularize and standardize the concept.
It definitely helped popularize it. But I think it's also fairly absurd to think that Sony didn't do more to make it a standard. Though the DualShock came late to the party, it also got into far more people's hands than N64. PS1 sold twice as much after the DualShock introduction than Nintendo's machine did in its entire lifetime.

The importance of the Dpad is that it popularized the way we hold controllers today; before the NES, controllers were things you put in the coffee table and played with your index and middle fingers, or index and thumb; or even the whole hand over it.
Having grown up with the preceding machines, this is completely wrong. Every single home console I can think of from the first and second generations had handheld controllers. It was possible to set some of them down, but very few people I saw playing--adults and kids alike--did that.

The thumbstick is an evolution of this same idea, they needed a way to control a character in 3D and the Dpad wasn't good enough, they came up with the thumbstick.
One, they didn't come up with the thumbstick. Two, a thumbstick does not control characters in 3D. It's a 2D control.

The key insight that happened at Nintendo was the link between analogue control and 3-diminsional gaming.
There's no such link. Battlezone and Zaxxon, just to name a couple early examples, gave a very strong sensation of control in 3D space, and used digital sticks. Right up until today, some 3D games allow use of the d-pad to control your avatar. Analog motion feels smoother for sure, which is why it's often preferred. But it isn't necessary.

And if your point was only about that, the better sensation of slick movement, then Nintendo didn't have any special insight. There were tons of games with analog controls decades before them, starting with mechanical arcade games, on through to Star Wars, After Burner, and so on.

Interestingly the tech behind Nintendo's d-pad is the breatkrough too - it used rubber membranes beneath a plastic button. Calculator button tech, adjusted into a combined single directional pad. Before that game and watch games used the rubber membranes directly, but Donkey Kong introduced the hard plastic top which made it roll and pop perfectly.
The Intellivision d-pad had previously used a hard plastic disc over calculator-style membrane switches.

Yeah, while the d-pad is definitely important and changed gaming for the better, the face buttons and especially the shoulder buttons were epic advancements in controller design. I remember the first time I held the SNES controller I was like this makes so much sense.
Nintendo did not invent face buttons or shoulder buttons.

So you are saying the video in the OP is wrong?
Yes, it most definitely is incorrect. Nintendo did not invent the d-pad, or even the plus shape. EDIT: My previous sentence was confusing. What I mean is, they didn't invent the plus shape for controls, or the d-pad. But they were first to put the two together. SECOND EDIT: Actually, further research calls even that into question, depending on how exactly you define "plus shape".
 

nkarafo

Member
Yes, it most definitely is incorrect. Nintendo did not invent the d-pad, or even the plus shape. EDIT: My previous sentence was confusing. What I mean is, they didn't invent the plus shape for controls, or the d-pad. But they were first to put the two together. SECOND EDIT: Actually, further research calls even that into question, depending on how exactly you define "plus shape".
Could you share these sources with us then? Gaming Historian provided some information, he even showed how Nintendo patented this. So i'm curious to see the evidence against that.
 
wasn't this symbol used to certify a game was a genuine product and not conterfeit?

when did the myth that it was a "good game" seal ever begin? every game ever released officially has this symbol, even the shittiest game ever made.

Yup, the Seal of Quality was used primarily as a certification system and also a way to circumvent piracy. Nintendo also trademarked the seal of quality so it could not be dupped, and put up a guideline for any authorized retail outlet to not stock NES cartridges if they do not have the Seal of Quality.

Back then, Nintendo wanted a tight quality control over third party software, so they could avoid another video game crash (at least in North America). They did this by limiting the amount of games a publisher could release within a year, as well as controlling the cartridge distribution directly.

Pretty sure that just about every officially licensed first and third party NES cartridges were manufactured by Nintendo's own factories. The NES used a lockout chip called the NES10 which was put in place to keep out unlicensed games and a flood of third party software. As a way to keep the lockout codes for the NES10 a secret, Nintendo had to manufacture every cartridge themselves using their own facilities.

This lead to their Seal of Quality program, which meant that in order for a third party publisher to meet the requirements of getting their game published on the NES, they needed to pass through a certain number of conditions before earning a seal of quality. Like being checked for inappropriate content, or to see if the game is functional at all. But at no point did Nintendo ever check and see if the game was fun or not.

Apparently some unlicensed publishers found a way to bypass the NES10 by just zapping it with a high voltage of electricity. But there was a also company called Tengen who found out a way to get a hold of NES10 lockout chip documentation by abusing the patent office. This lead to them releasing non-officially licensed NES games to retail that resulted in a huge uphill battle for them. Some retailers would not stock their games because they didn't feature the Seal of Quality. Authorized NES retailers could lose their license to sell NES games and accessories if they stocked unlicensed games along side the games with a "Seal of Quality" label.
 
Could you share these sources with us then? Gaming Historian provided some information, he even showed how Nintendo patented this. So i'm curious to see the evidence against that.
Sure. To start, just a quick reminder of how the Nintendo version works (shots taken from the video you linked in the OP): The user-manipulated control surface has a plus shape on top of a solid plate. On the underside of the plate is a hemisphere, set down into a cup to allow gimbaling. Under the plate is a sheet of conductive rubber, with bumps in each of four primary directions. When the plate is pushed down on that side, the corresponding bump is collapsed, closing a circuit on a contact membrane below it.
npad1twk74.png
npad2s4jx2.png
npad3ugjv6.png


This is contrasted with earlier devices that used four individual buttons hit by the user, like in these handheld games:
4key16vjut.jpg
4key2tnkob.jpg


But in fact, handheld games tried out so many control schemes that we can easily find multiple d-pad designs, both prior to and contemporaneous with Nintendo's Game & Watch "plus controller". Here's a solid disc from 1981.
2060_1209313168224_V_Tech_Dragon_Castle.jpg


Also from 1981, here's a cool Tron game with an incised disc to indicate directions.
tomy-tron-handheld-tabletop-arcade-game-411440161569f6dbf3771893fba1aaff.jpg


The earliest portable d-pad I've seen was from an electronic Mattel toy (not a videogame) from 1980. The pad is a circular dome, with rays to indicate the primary directions.
Mattel-IAN.jpg


Here's a stylish 1982 Casio handheld, again with a circular control surface, but explicitly broken into 8-way zones with individual divots.
960_2719-Cosmo-Fighter-CG-110-CASIO_000.jpg


Here's another Casio game, from 1983 with an octagonal d-pad. Apart from the planar shape, it also changes the Nintendo version by being convex rather than concave.
AstroChicken.jpg


Here's a 1982 game with a square d-pad split into quadrants.
cc3.jpg


And there were also explorations of cross shapes not exactly like a plus, such as this 1983 one.
CosmoThunder.jpg


There are even early control schemes that are essentially a "virtual d-pad". Tomy had a 1980 line of slim games with four long buttons arranged in a plus shape. But note the raised hard plastic nub in the center.
s-l1600.jpg

Obviously, the user is not meant to press the buttons individually by fingertip. Instead, it's clear that bump is to rest your thumb there, and just rock it toward the buttons to depress them. Thus the player's thumb is working like the d-pad plate, gimbaling to make contact on switches.

And of course, preceding all of these was the non-portable Intellivision. Like the OP video says, its d-pad felt loose and squirrelly...but mechanically it was essentially the same idea. The underside of the control disc had a central hemisphere, which allowed it to gimbal. Instead of pressing on conductive rubber to make contact with a membrane below, it presses on one membrane to make contact with another one folded below it. Compare these pictures to the Nintendo ones I started the post with.
ipad1c5sco.png
ipad20ij34.png
ipad3xakwv.png

(Some of these are from the later Intellivision III console because they show features more clearly, but this original Intellivision breakdown shows there's no material difference.)

Most of these versions came before G&W DK, although a couple released slightly later. But together they show that every company in this crowded field was actively revising their controls repeatedly, searching for novelty and functionality. As noted in the OP video, Nintendo themselves skipped the "plus controller" in some later handhelds, all the way up through 1986. (Not to mention in the new Nintendo Switch.)

So if all this experimentation and usage was going on, beginning years earlier, then how did Nintendo manage to patent the d-pad? The answer comes from what patents typically are: not general ideas, but very specific descriptions of exact engineering solutions to specified design challenges. Though some wider patents are granted (the wisdom of this being a topic for another time), most are narrow, taken to apply to a very small range of devices, not varying in any meaningful way from instantiations given in the patent. For this reason, they often cite earlier patents in order to clearly differentiate themselves from similar prior art. Let's look at the patents Nintendo references in their d-pad filing.

First is this Bell Labs patent from 1961, for a telephone control device that takes the form of the familiar dial, but instead actuates switches for much less complex innards. (The interior of a rotary phone is actually an amazing marvel of miniature electro-mechanical engineering. As an aside, I highly recommend this James May show about it.) The described mechanism is still quite complicated, but this picture clearly shows an operating idea that's an obvious precursor to a d-pad.
patent162jv7.png


The following reference is for a 1975 pen with a calculator in it. With limited space on the barrel for buttons, each one was a four-way switch. The attachment has become simpler than on the phone patent, now just a spring that allows the "button" d-pad to swing down and cause switch contact in four directions. Here's the whole assembly, to which I've added the cutaway at top left and some suggested alternate "button" configurations at lower right.
patent2ahkfn.png


Next is Atari's patent for the 2600 controller, from 1977. Again the mechanism has gotten simpler. Instead of being on top of a spring, it has a simple gimbal with the hemisphere on the baseplate and the socket on the control plate, opposite of Nintendo's later version. But just like the Nintendo design that'd follow, each button resists pressing (using a spring for Atari, rubber for Nintendo) until enough pressure forces it to complete a circuit.
patent3b2j1s.png


Next is a reference to the Intellivision patent. As mentioned above, this does use the Nintendo-style gimbal, but again a spring instead of rubber applies tension. Next up is a 1979 patent by an industrial firm for a plus-shaped d-pad. It explicitly states that not only can each arm be pressed, it's intended for the user to be able to keep their thumb or finger in a central divot and lean it to accurately actuate multiple inputs in rapid succession without looking (the tactile "levering" action which the OP video claims Nintendo invented). The design also includes the inscribed arrows Nintendo used on G&W DK. And this plus-shaped d-pad also uses rubber-dome membrane switches to both provide resistance and complete the circuit, just as with Nintendo's design from years later. The only difference seems to be that it's pictured mounted on a pivot pin, not a ball-and-socket gimbal.
patent4p2uvf.png


And that's where Nintendo's patent comes in. Here are the salient features of the d-pad hardware they describe;

- A plus-shaped control surface
- Operated by positioning a digit in the center and applying lateral pressure
- Causing the control surface to tilt via ball-and-socket gimbal
- But it's biased toward neutral position by rubber domes
- Which must be overcome to make contact with membrane switches

Every single one of these things had already been patented and was in use before Nintendo applied. I presume the only way they could make their patent unique enough to get it granted was by combining all of these features together into a single device. There's a very informative detail regarding this revealed on the official patent page.
ninappmrjzr.png

Nintendo originally applied for this patent in 1983, and it was not granted. The patent they hold is from when they re-applied in 1985. Though the earlier application doesn't seem to be available, I strongly suspect it was rejected because it wasn't specific enough to differentiate from all the prior art. Nintendo had to add further detail, making their version patentable but also eliminating their ability to stop very similar approaches to the same problem. Hence why d-pads continued to appear on competitors' machines.

In summary, Nintendo did not invent the d-pad, not even close. They were part and parcel of a burgeoning industry that was constantly experimenting with control schemes and manufacturing methods. Out of that chaos they developed one narrowly-defined combination of factors that happened to be included in an extremely successful consumer product, making their version most people's first exposure to the general idea of d-pads. Their method wasn't first, and wasn't necessarily best--some folks believe Sega or Sony have done better d-pads--but it was part of a breakout hit.



P.S. Note that all the above totally ignores the existence of joystick hat switches in aircraft. These have clear affinities and undoubted influence on both d-pad and thumbstick development. I don't know when they were invented, and didn't want to spend the time researching, but they predate everything in this post by decades at least. Here's a picture of the cockpit of an F-100 Super Sabre, developed in the early 1950s. The hat switch is the circular control on the right rear of the joystick.
cockpit.jpg
 

phanphare

Banned
I know who made something first isn't necessarily the best argument, but I found this image that can serve as a starting point for discussing some of the innovations and where they originated:

h9fiHmX.png


"Who popularized/perfected it" is probably a better question, and we can use this as a springboard to discuss some of these.

Nintendo didn't invent the chicken, just the chicken sandwich
 

FyreWulff

Member
Nintendo's best contribution is being weird. Every other company just does things so.. orderly, then Nintendo over there like

"what


what if


what if we glued a baskeball to a watch"
 

MattKeil

BIGTIME TV MOGUL #2
Nintendo's best contribution is being weird. Every other company just does things so.. orderly, then Nintendo over there like

"what


what if


what if we glued a baskeball to a watch"

"But a Spalding rubber ball, like I grew up with."

"Yeah, those vinyl balls are just too slick."
 
I still have this. Easily the best of the LCD electronic games of its era, in large part because that control disc worked so well. It was 1982, though. Definitely don't recall it being out a year before the movie.
I thought the date was weird too, but I'm just going by what I found. The collector site Handheld Museum lists it as 1981, despite often leaving dates blank when it doesn't know them. And the same confusion also exists for its big brother, the arcade Tron. Wikipedia says that version was "distributed by Disney Interactive Studios in 1981 and manufactured by Bally Midway in 1982". Not only does that sound like the wrong order, but Disney Interactive wasn't founded for years afterward. Similarly, Arcade Museum has the big game with a release date of 1982, but then says, "Bally Midway released 89 different machines in our database under this trade name, starting in 1981."

Maybe prototypes were all ready in 1981 (while the film was still being finalized) but didn't get mass produced until 1982 to coincide with release? In any case, it's clear that the d-pad controller wasn't derived from Nintendo, but was its own thing.
 

1morerobot

Member
Most of them weren't popularized by Nintendo.

Analog Stick - hard to say Nintendo popularized it when every controller for the last three generations, including Nintendo's with the Wii as the only exception, are basically clones of Sony's Dual Shock design.

4 button layout - something Nintendo hasn't consistently used themselves, developed at a time when SEGA was doing just as much in developing new controller tech (three button and six button pads).

Touch screen - Both SEGA and Tiger put out consumer products with touch control well before the NDS and the popularization of touch screen gaming was done by smartphones and tablets, not by the NDS which used a stylus for most well controlled games.

Gyroscopic aiming - Sony had this on the PS3, the Vita, and now the PS4. They put it in many popular titles while Nintendo was still heavily relying on the IR sensor to handle Wii targeting. At this point I can only think of two major Nintendo releases (Splatoon and BotW) that have gryo aiming as an option, meanwhile Sony made an entire first party franchise (Gravity Rush) built around the concept and put out Uncharted, Killzone, and Warhawk games with the feature as an option.

Accelerometer and IR pointer gaming aren't widely popularized mechanics and IR pointer interfaces predate Nintendo with SEGA having comparable success in the outset. One can debate who has serviced it better since, Nintendo with the Wii or SEGA, Namco, etc. with their far longer stint of lightgun shooter production.

Wireless controllers - Wireless controllers massively predate the Wavebird, the Gamecube wasn't successful enough to popularize shit, and besides, Logitech sold truckloads of their wireless PS2 (great) and Xbox (crap) controllers that gen. That was the real popularization of wireless, when Logitech's 3rd party controller began legitimately cannibalizing Sony's first party controller sales.

Analog triggers - The N64 didn't have an analog trigger. The Gamecube shoulder buttons aren't referred to by Nintendo as triggers and don't operate like triggers. The pressure sensitive L2/R2 on PS2 are comparably close to being a "trigger". Dreamcast was the first mainstream product to deliver real triggers standard and the first Xbox was what widely popularized triggers and made the rest of the industry adopt them.




All of this is fucking absurd and honestly pretty goddamn insulting to the hundreds of great game designers who predate Nintendo in the industry by about half a decade, and the thousands who have beaten Nintendo to many, many of these methods and design choices by months to years.


And nothing quite proves you have your head up Nintendo's ass like trying to argue the Virtual Boy as being first into VR.

This, ladies and gents, is a true hater.
 

Skyzard

Banned
^ he makes good points tbh.

Is the "Dpad" Nintendo's best contribution to gaming?

Mario is.

At least they can still get Mario mostly right. The switch's d-pad, even on the pro controller :/
 

FyreWulff

Member
let's be real, the game.com's touch screen was ass. to get a good touch screen any time in the 90s required shelling out hundreds of dollars for a palm pilot or similar tier devices, not a toy.
 
lol the Dpad, are you serious? Nintendo is one of the craziest companies ever and he picks the most boring thing imaginable.

i think the best contribution was the NES, particularly Mario's realistic scrolling world. most games before then we very ephemeral things. single-screen arcade games that refreshed, where nothing was permanent. the NES was a vision of an electronic world, a real virtual reality, somewhere fantastic existing in your glowing CRT.
 
I know who made something first isn't necessarily the best argument, but I found this image that can serve as a starting point for discussing some of the innovations and where they originated:

h9fiHmX.png

Jeeeeez, that image.

A) a lot of that stuff is reaaaaally reaching.

and

B) I just cannot believe that Nintendo brings out such strong emotions in people that someone would go to the trouble of making a chart like this. I mean, Nintendo themselves don't even claim to have 'invented' all of this stuff. It's just gamergatey, conspiracy theorist console war stuff.
 
i think the best contribution was the NES, particularly Mario's realistic scrolling world. most games before then we very ephemeral things. single-screen arcade games that refreshed, where nothing was permanent. the NES was a vision of an electronic world, a real virtual reality, somewhere fantastic existing in your glowing CRT.
There were tons of games prior to NES that had complete virtual worlds larger than a single screen. This is especially true of SHMUPs, which almost all had smooth scrolling (Time Pilot, Defender, Zaxxon). But there were others too, like Battlezone. Other games had different approaches because they worked on a size far beyond Super Mario Bros. Gravitar and Major Havoc skipped between space-scale and human-scale, but within each of those scales there was solid geometry that scrolled smoothly, and a sort of "flight platforming" around enemies and obstacles.

Home consoles, restricted by their hardware, took longer to do this. They usually approximated it with a series of static screens. But even on the Atari 2600, they started working toward more complex setups. Raiders of the Lost Ark mixed alternating static screens and scrolling areas. Pitfall II was still a series of screens, but new ones scrolled on instead of blinking into being. And dying would send you gliding back to the last checkpoint, giving you an overview of what could then be seen as an entire, permanent world.

Nintendo's survival past the Atari crash, and their eventual dominance of the home console arena, allowed them to play host to the continued evolution of this trend. But, like almost everything in artistic fields, creators were building on foundations that extended back into the past. People growing up only with the new stuff then sometimes think it arose de novo, without the long slog of gradual improvement it almost always had.
 
lol the Dpad, are you serious? Nintendo is one of the craziest companies ever and he picks the most boring thing imaginable.

i think the best contribution was the NES, particularly Mario's realistic scrolling world. most games before then we very ephemeral things. single-screen arcade games that refreshed, where nothing was permanent. the NES was a vision of an electronic world, a real virtual reality, somewhere fantastic existing in your glowing CRT.

Super Mario Bros. Really wasn't the first side scrolling platformer though. There were others before it. Namco did it a year earlier with an arcade game called Pac-Land, which was released in 1984: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2sRiFoJMNTU.

In 1983 Atari had a vector graphic arcade game called Major Havoc (developed by Owen Rubin and Mark Cerny), which features omnidirectional scrolling : https://youtu.be/9n6I1KPxOfE?t=187

Also from 1983 there was an obscure Atari 800 micro computer game called Snookie which featured basic platforming and scrolling graphics: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TpD7wTKWrG8 . This game wasn't influential or anything, but it does showcase a platformer that existed 2 years before Super Mario Bros. The Atari 800 and Commodore 64 were some of the few home PC's from the early '80s that could do hardware scrolling.

Then there is also Jump Bug from 1981, which is also classified as a platformer, but it does have forced scrolling and plays a bit more like a horizontal shooter.

I don't really think that Super Mario Bros. innovated the side scrolling platformer, I think refined is a better word to use. But it did popularize the 2d scrolling platformer and became a staple for the NES. Just seeing a game like this on a home console was a revolution in itself.
 

Currygan

at last, for christ's sake
The best blend of eastern and western appeal.

Very few developers achieve this ( current Blizzard ) and I would say Nintendo was at forefront.

this may be the truest post. Bravo, sir

also, they f'ing exist. I dread to think of what would my hobby be these days without Nintendo as the main driving force behind my purchases
 

D.Lo

Member
SMB, like Mario 64 years later, is notable not because it invented a genre or any individual feature but because it was a huge leap ahead in an existing fledgeling genre in dozens of ways at once and delivered a polished, confident, complete package vastly ahead of anything else available at the time in the space. And as a result it set a template that others built from. It is quintessential.

This is just like their hardware innovations, they didn't necessarily invent the tech or be first to any part of it, but put it together in a way that worked far better than what came before and became templates going forward.
 
SMB, like Mario 64 years later, is notable not because it invented a genre or any individual feature but because it was a huge leap ahead in an existing fledgeling genre in dozens of ways at once and delivered a polished, confident, complete package vastly ahead of anything else available at the time in the space. And as a result it set a template that others built from. It is quintessential.

This is just like their hardware innovations, they didn't necessarily invent the tech or be first to any part of it, but put it together in a way that worked far better than what came before and became templates going forward.
You can make this case for Super Mario Bros. Though it's not quite as unique and advanced as you claim, it does have a highly cohesive design in its mechanics. Nintendo's hardware, however, is not like that. With few exceptions, the controllers and consoles they built did not work far better than their predecessors, or serve as templates for the future.

(The outliers are the SNES pad, which for obvious reasons was the template for Sony's PlayStation controller, which after revision itself became an industry standard. And the Wii as a whole, for the brief and intense period of motion control popularity.)
 

Bleepey

Member
I know who made something first isn't necessarily the best argument, but I found this image that can serve as a starting point for discussing some of the innovations and where they originated:

h9fiHmX.png


"Who popularized/perfected it" is probably a better question, and we can use this as a springboard to discuss some of these.

i chuckled at this
 

Muffdraul

Member
I still have this. Easily the best of the LCD electronic games of its era, in large part because that control disc worked so well. It was 1982, though. Definitely don't recall it being out a year before the movie.

My memory is hazy but I think the arcade game landed a full year before the movie (i.e. summer '81) and the handheld was more like Christmas, approx. six months ahead of the movie. I still have mine too, spotted it when I cleaned my garage a couple years ago.
 

yurinka

Member
I think their best contribution was saving the gaming industry after atari shock.
Wrong. The Atari fail basically affected a few companies who only made games for Atari, who had a big market share in console but was a minority in the gaming industry. The gaming industry was ok in arcade and 8 bit computers.

I know who made something first isn't necessarily the best argument, but I found this image that can serve as a starting point for discussing some of the innovations and where they originated:

h9fiHmX.png
What is explained in the image is true, Nintendo didn't invent them. And in many cases they were iterated several times before Nintendo copied the idea. Nintendo fans keep saying Nintendo invented everything, when it isn't true.

As an example, according to Miyamoto Super Mario Bros (many say it invented the side-scrolling platformers) was inspired by Pac-Land. It's what today people call a clone in mobile market. Another example can be the Wii and its main games, basically a Xavix console concept rip-off.
 

Tab0203

Member
Miyamoto's GDC 2007 keynote speech touched on this subject a little bit.

Miyamoto: "Nintendo's definition of technical progress often focuses on new forms of interface for console games."

Iwata: "Are you still playing around with that face creation idea?"
Miyamoto: "Yes, but we haven't been able to turn it into something significant, yet."

Nintendo didn't invent the avatar, analog stick, rumble, accelerators/gyro or the bathroom scale (balance board).

They (try to) make it work. They turn it into something significant.
 

fireflame

Member
Super Mario Bros is extremely overrated, i understand it was good for its time, bu there were much better games in the following years.

The dpad sure is a great invention for controls, there is no denying, though i wish that kind of stuff was not lockable through copyrights and patents.
 

FinalAres

Member
Council Pop said:
B) I just cannot believe that Nintendo brings out such strong emotions in people that someone would go to the trouble of making a chart like this. I mean, Nintendo themselves don't even claim to have 'invented' all of this stuff. It's just gamergatey, conspiracy theorist console war stuff.
I think this is a really interesting and important point. Because when people get angry about Nintendo fans, that doesn't necessarily reflect on Nintendo. Nintendo isn't saying all these things, it's the fanbase. Me personally I love Nintendo, but I find a certain loud sect of Nintendo fans to be incredibly irritating because of their willingness to spread misinformation and hyperbole. Retroactive history re-writing really annoys me, and I do think Nintendo fans in general (though obviously no everyone) are particularly bad at this.
 
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