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Iwata: I misread the market, the company needs to keep track of foreign trends better

The idea on becoming a third party and teaming with Sony would be amazing and allow for somebody like me who's never played Nintendo IP's to finally play them. Let's make it happen Nintendo and Sony.
 
The idea on becoming a third party and teaming with Sony would be amazing and allow for somebody like me who's never played Nintendo IP's to finally play them. Let's make it happen Nintendo and Sony.

That nearly happened in the early 90's, except Sony was to be Nintendo's partner. In fact, the failure of that partnership a large reason the Playastation exists as a brand at all.
 

jblank83

Member
I wonder if Nintendo could pull off the luxury item branding. PS4 level hardware but sold for $500 but with $40 software. Basically pull a Apple, Bose, Nespresso, or Beats style branding with super polished casings and point of sale. Get casuals in with reverse pricing.

NES, SNES, N64, GC were all high end electronics. They have a history of doing so. This current low end strategy only happened from the Wii onwards. That's disregarding handhelds.

They don't need to be highest end. No one should come into the market at $599. They do need to start coming in higher than they are.
 

Nilaul

Member
Pretty sure NST proper is only like 30 people now.
That 1000 number may be including a lot of divisions that don't produce games like Treehouse.

Might be a mistake on my part.

The idea on becoming a third party and teaming with Sony would be amazing and allow for somebody like me who's never played Nintendo IP's to finally play them. Let's make it happen Nintendo and Sony.

Dream on.
Go buy a WiiU; you'll have access to Wii games too. I'm sure you'll be able to find a good deal somewhere. Also judging by your post you never played the Wii either so you will have plenty of great and cheap games to play.
 
They'll become the next RIM/Blackberry in irrelevancy soon if they don't.
I already consider Nintendo to be the Blackberry of the videogame industry. Their handheld segment is not advancing past the previous hardware generations and their console ventures are failing beyond imagination. And their lack of movement to enter the 21st century makes them a near perfect synonym to Blackberry.
 

BocoDragon

or, How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Realize This Assgrab is Delicious
I already consider Nintendo to be the Blackberry of the videogame industry. Their handheld segment is not advancing past the previous hardware generations and their console ventures are failing beyond imagination. And their lack of movement to enter the 21st century makes them a near perfect synonym to Blackberry.
The more I think about it, the more this analogy is apt (and I hate to admit so). They both entered the market and took over in a total absence of competition (the post-crash console industry of the 80s and the smartphone industry if the early 2000s). Then they were out-maneuvered by competitors willing to adapt and change far more quickly.

The only difference is that Nintendo sat in its throne and was relevant for quite a bit longer than Blackberry's brief moment in the sun.
 
The hallmark of running a successful business is to meet and exceed your customers' expectations.

Customers have been very vocal about what they want to see from Nintendo, but Nintendo's response has been one of either complacency, pretentiousness, or irreverence. Charting your own path isn't a singular decision. It should take into account and incorporate the needs of your fans within a strategically viable business model.

For YEARS, fans have been clamoring for FZero, a console Pokemon MMO, Star Fox, an open world Zelda, new and mature-themed IPs, a robust online experience with accompanying social feature set, more capable hardware with a deemphasis on motion controls, higher software output to avoid the all too common software droughts....what has Nintendo's response been to all these requests? NO, no, no, ,no, no, no, no, no, no, no.

How could Nintendo expect anything other than the currently bleak reality with the myopic vision and stubborn mindset it's put on display?

Please change for the better Nintendo. This hobby wouldn't be the same if you continue to descend on the path to irrelevance.
 
The hallmark of running a successful business is to meet and exceed your customers' expectations.

Customers have been very vocal about what they want to see from Nintendo, but Nintendo's response has been one of either complacency, pretentiousness, or irreverence. Charting your own path isn't a singular decision. It should take into account and incorporate the needs of your fans within a strategically viable business model.

For YEARS, fans have been clamoring for FZero, a console Pokemon MMO, Star Fox, an open world Zelda, new and mature-themed IPs, a robust online experience with accompanying social feature set, more capable hardware with a deemphasis on motion controls, higher software output to avoid the all too common software droughts....what has Nintendo's response been to all these requests? NO, no, no, ,no, no, no, no, no, no, no.

How could Nintendo expect anything other than the currently bleak reality with the myopic vision and stubborn mindset it's put on display?

Please change for the better Nintendo. This hobby wouldn't be the same if you continue to descend on the path to irrelevance.

this. simply put. they wouldn't be at this problem today if they listened to their fans. release desirable products. people will buy.
 

Log4Girlz

Member
Normally I would be ecstatic for Nintendo to be working on Metroid, but I checked your old posts, and wth is this?



Surely you were jesting right?

Considering his past post history, and the fact he's saying he has insider info which is normally bannable...I must only assume he is a hilarious troll.
 
T

thepotatoman

Unconfirmed Member
"In Japan, I can be my own antenna, but abroad, that doesn't work," he said.

Except his own antenna still didn't seem to pickup up the fact that even Japan doesn't want the Wii U at all.
 

SegaShack

Member
Sorry. Stopped reading right there. Instead of buying out Rare, they should have bought Sega or Capcom, long ago when they were in trouble. IP's actually worth a damn, right up their alley, but with a broader appeal to older/core gamers. Not moving in on any of the dozens of talented studio's that went belly-up the past decade, that could have floundered under the guiding hand of Nintendo. What they did with Bayonetta2, they could have done years ago with Timesplitters. Darksiders could have been picked up for cheap. Even IF all that talent would have left after a takeover, they would still have had a buttload of interesting IP to complement their own.

Rare was an already established Nintendo developer and knew how to successfully develop for the Gamecube platform. They had an appeal to western audiences that Iwata couldn't see. I think Iwata's recent take over as the CEO of NoA was a bad idea as well. They need to give NoA power in corporate decisions. The company that bought Sega was a gambling company, I doubt Nintendo had the same kind of money.

When was Capcom in trouble?
 

10k

Banned
Misread the market my ass. This is still bugging me. How can you misread a market when you have one of the largest R&D firms in the world? They fully knew what they were doing and thought they could catch lightning in a bottle twice with the Wii U.
 

Terrell

Member
Rare was an already established Nintendo developer and knew how to successfully develop for the Gamecube platform. They had an appeal to western audiences that Iwata couldn't see. I think Iwata's recent take over as the CEO of NoA was a bad idea as well. They need to give NoA power in corporate decisions. The company that bought Sega was a gambling company, I doubt Nintendo had the same kind of money.

When was Capcom in trouble?
Nintendo had enough money that they were going to purchase BANDAI. I don't think Sega would have been a problem.
 

royalan

Member
Rare was an already established Nintendo developer and knew how to successfully develop for the Gamecube platform. They had an appeal to western audiences that Iwata couldn't see. I think Iwata's recent take over as the CEO of NoA was a bad idea as well. They need to give NoA power in corporate decisions. The company that bought Sega was a gambling company, I doubt Nintendo had the same kind of money.

When was Capcom in trouble?

Yep. Iwata consolidating power by taking more direct control of NOA is only going to guarantee that we get no real substancial changes outside of the lip-service they're paying. I mean, you've admitted that you don't understand the martket, Iwata...so MORE control is the answer here?

Positions opening up at NOA would have been the perfect opportunity for Nintendo to poach some western talent. In my opinion, that's the first thing they need to do to turn this ship around.
 
Then answer me this: why do you insist that everyone should thrive towards making games like Nintendo does. Why can't TLoU and games that Nintendo create co-exist?

Why can't a game tell a story instead of being all about gameplay?
I don't mind if a game tells a story, but this is a GAME and not a movie. Why can't a game that lacks any gameplay focus and only cares about secondary things to the medium be considered an excellent game? Because it excels in things that are completely secondary here.

This is like asking "why can't the crappiest movie in terms of plot, acting quality and scene montages be considered a masterpiece when it has the greatest OST of all time?". Well, the answer is fairly simple, and that would be: "because you're not buying an audio CD-ROM".

But the problem in the videogame industry is that unlike on the cinema industry, where the foundations where established (it was pretty popular since the beginning) before other external factors could destroy them (the abuse of CGI effects), the video game industry was held mainly on frikis that liked to play a lot, but it didn't had any big appeal to the casual crowd for what it was.

It wasn't until the CGI effects entered at full force that videogaming become popular, but it became popular at the cost of becoming what it wasn't meant to be.
And now we have tons of "players" that are the main customers of the current big developers (since now a game is just a way to experience and not what it used to be, "gamers" don't spend a lot of time in a single game because you're as much as a soldier on level one than on level 10 and the traditional gamer, the one that enjoyed to play and that will stick with a single game for months until he feels he has totally dominated that game, not only is on the minority but also spends less money than the casual "tech-focused" hardcore "experiencer" that will buy tons of games per month).

I know that I'm on the minority and that traditional gaming is dead, but don't act as if you were victims when nowadays every game that doesn't focus on graphics and plot will be considered "average" at best unless it's from a big established franchise and it literally revolutionizes the gaming industry. It's not that games can't tell a good story, it's just that a good story should only be a good plus above an excellent gameplay, and nowadays it's the gameplay that's just a small plus over the graphics/plot that's what matters.
 

monome

Member
I know that I'm on the minority and that traditional gaming is dead, but don't act as if you were victims when nowadays every game that doesn't focus on graphics and plot will be considered "average" at best unless it's from a big established franchise and it literally revolutionizes the gaming industry. It's not that games can't tell a good story, it's just that a good story should only be a good plus above an excellent gameplay, and nowadays it's the gameplay that's just a small plus over the graphics/plot that's what matters.

I agree.

but Nintendo could/should have built a TPS/FPS/Action games studio.

if only to give teenagers an option to kill robots/aliens rather than japanese/soviets/arabs/whores.

and have an inside view of what technologies drive such types of games.
 
I agree.

but Nintendo could/should have built a TPS/FPS/Action games studio.

if only to give teenagers an option to kill robots/aliens rather than japanese/soviets/arabs/whores.

and have an inside view of what technologies drive such types of games.
Well, this is my main criticism at Nintendo, that despite they know they're all by themselves on this industry, they still focus their efforts in too few genres, abandoning others that are really popular.

A TPS/FPS/Action game can be excellent if made with the right priorities, and I would pay nearly all my monthly pay to see how a game like this could turn.
Metroid Prime was a great FPAdventure, and I'm sure that they could make a truly great TPS if they wanted.
Let's see if Platinum brings that (they had Vanquish which was an incredible evolution of the TPS genre, but lack of AAA level of investment turned it into an average title in our beloved "western-casual-dudebro" media).

Tron#1 said:
It is obvious he doesnt get the market and is out of touch with the gamers.
Instead of "gamers" better say "experiencers". Gamers are the people that were there when playing was only a "friki" thing and were enjoying even with a bunch of pixels moving from place to place.
Nintendo still acts as if we were an important part of the industry, and so it doesn't get that now this is not about videogames but about interactive experiences defended by the "hardcore experiencers" and the same ones that mocked the real players back then.
 
Either way he doesnt understand what is going on right now. OBVIOUS! its actually sad to watch him as a CEO of this company. I cringe everytime he gets up to speak at press conference because he has no clue.
Well, I'm not a shareholder but a gamer, so if I like this company it's because its the only one of the big companies that still defends this kind of vision of the industry.
The moment Nintendo turns into a bad copy of what Sony is nowadays, that moment it's the one I will left the industry.
 
The hallmark of running a successful business is to meet and exceed your customers' expectations.

Customers have been very vocal about what they want to see from Nintendo, but Nintendo's response has been one of either complacency, pretentiousness, or irreverence. Charting your own path isn't a singular decision. It should take into account and incorporate the needs of your fans within a strategically viable business model.

For YEARS, fans have been clamoring for FZero, a console Pokemon MMO, Star Fox, an open world Zelda, new and mature-themed IPs, a robust online experience with accompanying social feature set, more capable hardware with a deemphasis on motion controls, higher software output to avoid the all too common software droughts....what has Nintendo's response been to all these requests? NO, no, no, ,no, no, no, no, no, no, no.

How could Nintendo expect anything other than the currently bleak reality with the myopic vision and stubborn mindset it's put on display?

Please change for the better Nintendo. This hobby wouldn't be the same if you continue to descend on the path to irrelevance.
Yes, I never understood this about Nintendo. They have a really hard time listening to their fans outside of Japan. Everyone was asking for Earthbound on the VC. They kept saying no until recently. When it was released it sold pretty well despite being more expensive and being on a console that was in low demand.

They need to realize that the large numbers of people they won over with the Wii and Pokrmon games have all aged since then. You can't keep those fans without broadening your offerings. My younger brother played all sorts of Nintendo games. Now he messes around with Mario on the SNES, but then jumps over to his 360 to play new games.
 

sega4ever

Member
Sorry. Stopped reading right there. Instead of buying out Rare, they should have bought Sega or Capcom, long ago when they were in trouble. IP's actually worth a damn, right up their alley, but with a broader appeal to older/core gamers. Not moving in on any of the dozens of talented studio's that went belly-up the past decade, that could have floundered under the guiding hand of Nintendo. What they did with Bayonetta2, they could have done years ago with Timesplitters. Darksiders could have been picked up for cheap. Even IF all that talent would have left after a takeover, they would still have had a buttload of interesting IP to complement their own.

if nintendo bought rare the gamecube would have gotten donkey kong racing, perfect dark and kameo plus i'm sure the jumps they had to do from the gamecube to xbox to 360 slowed down their output.
 
Yes, I never understood this about Nintendo. They have a really hard time listening to their fans outside of Japan. Everyone was asking for Earthbound on the VC. They kept saying no until recently. When it was released it sold pretty well despite being more expensive and being on a console that was in low demand.

They need to realize that the large numbers of people they won over with the Wii and Pokrmon games have all aged since then. You can't keep those fans without broadening your offerings. My younger brother played all sorts of Nintendo games. Now he messes around with Mario on the SNES, but then jumps over to his 360 to play new games.

The most frustrating part is that at one point it looked like they were almost there. Eternal Darkness and Metroid Prime western orientated, adult games. They even got MGS Twin Snakes. Just.. what the fuck happened. They probably sold "poorly" (in Nintendo's view) because it was on GC, which nobody wanted because of what people thought Nintendo were. Instead of giving up they should of continued to push and push. Look at Microsoft. Did they give up after Xbox? No, they pushed even harder and came with 360 and took away what Sony had dominated for two straight generations.

You get out of life what you put in, and Nintendo have put bare minimal into Wii U so far and speak empty word after empty word. "10 years until we do Mario online". Ridiculous.
 

teeny

Member
Maybe Iwata shouldn't have chopped NoA's testicles off.

Once upon a time, I had a dream that Nintendo would have divisions all over the world under the umbrella of NCL, NoA and NoE, sort of how EA or Ubisoft work / name their studios. The divisions would be semi autonomous (rather than on a short leash held by NCL) and could fill the gaps in their portfolio (the way Rare did on the N64).
 
Actually I can't blame him. To me, the WiiU is exactly as outdated as the Wii was back then while providing a similar range of software (i.e. the total lack of any relevant third party game available on all other platforms).
I still have no idea why the Wii was such a hit and the WiiU a total failure. The only difference is that back then I could only shake my head at the popularity and now nod silently in agreement.

Probably comes down to the success of the respective marketing approach, especially important for catching the more casual users early on.
 

monome

Member
Iwata is an IDIOT! i know that is a harsh word but he is an arrogant Japanese CEO that thought the Nintendo name would get them to the promise land again. He should IMO be immediately replaced as CEO. This has nothing to do with me hating him or anything like that. It is obvious he doesnt get the market and is out of touch with the gamers. the apologies and please understands are getting VERY old. I say this as someone who have bought nintendo consoles before i could purchase my own. I played them as a kid and my kids play them now. Nintendo gamers deserve better and not just someone who is going to talk a good game then apologize later. it very old at this point.

He is a CEO. and far better than the Riccitello, Kotick etc...

He simply wanted to keep the company focused on family entertainment. which, IMO, he deemed to be a niche market in light of how MS/Sony approached the market.

He brought in PG* in for WiiU, thus acknowledging the lack of technical and traditionnal "boys be boys" games.
 

teeny

Member
Actually I can't blame him. To me, the WiiU is exactly as outdated as the Wii was back then while providing a similar range of software (i.e. the total lack of any relevant third party game available on all other platforms).
I still have no idea why the Wii was such a hit and the WiiU a total failure. The only difference is that back then I could only shake my head at the popularity and now nod silently in agreement.

Probably comes down to the success of the respective marketing approach, especially important for catching the more casual users early on.

The Wii had Wii Sports and Twilight Princess at launch. There's your difference.

Also, I wish the Wii U had support similar to the Wii. It might not have received a lot of multiplatform games, but at least there were a number of quality B games that could take your fancy. The Wii U doesn't even have those as supplements to Nintendo's software.
 
The hallmark of running a successful business is to meet and exceed your customers' expectations.

Customers have been very vocal about what they want to see from Nintendo, but Nintendo's response has been one of either complacency, pretentiousness, or irreverence. Charting your own path isn't a singular decision. It should take into account and incorporate the needs of your fans within a strategically viable business model.

For YEARS, fans have been clamoring for FZero, a console Pokemon MMO, Star Fox, an open world Zelda, new and mature-themed IPs, a robust online experience with accompanying social feature set, more capable hardware with a deemphasis on motion controls, higher software output to avoid the all too common software droughts....what has Nintendo's response been to all these requests? NO, no, no, ,no, no, no, no, no, no, no.

How could Nintendo expect anything other than the currently bleak reality with the myopic vision and stubborn mindset it's put on display?

Please change for the better Nintendo. This hobby wouldn't be the same if you continue to descend on the path to irrelevance.
Yeah... not really. Hardware power, software diversity, robust online and more new IP that jives with the west are things everyone has been asking for, but the major requests to move away from motion controls have always been from the "core" Sony and MS camps. I may be getting ahead of myself but I think most Nintendo fans (lapsed and current) would have been just fine with a next generation Wii-mote and Pro controller bundled with all Wii U consoles. The Gamepad was too expensive an experiment and a really dumb controller to use on a machine under the "Wii" brand.
 

teeny

Member
Yeah... not really. Hardware power, software diversity, robust online and more new IP that jives with the west are things everyone has been asking for, but the major requests to move away from motion controls have always been from the "core" Sony and MS camps. I may be getting ahead of myself but I think most Nintendo fans (lapsed and current) would have been just fine with a next generation Wii-mote and Pro controller bundled with all Wii U consoles. The Gamepad was too expensive an experiment and a really dumb controller to use on a machine under the "Wii" brand.

I agree. a hypothetical "Super Wii" with a refined Wii Remote + and Pro controller packed in would have been ideal. Nintendo could have packaged the Gamepad as a peripheral with Nintendo Land and (another hypothetical) Pokemon NFC Skylanders-like and it would have sold a lot better, in my opinion (as long as the software was there).
 

monome

Member
OK. I dont think all his/their decision have been bad but they need to take more action and do more to balance their approach and taking western gamers seriously.

obviously true.

I regularly go to Kyoto, and it's a city known for people being obsequious. So considering Iwata masquerades under the guise of your everyday salaryman is not unfunded.

that said. when I see what 343i did with Halo 4 or ND with Uncharted 3, I think Nintendo being hesitant towards chasing after the 20/30 years old shooting fantasy is understandable.
these two games made a lot of money. they also showed the limits of putting even more money into the AAA space and the tension it puts on creativity.
 
I agree what they need is balance and a little bit ot fan service. It's not hard for Nintendo to turn around whats going on it just takes them accepting they have been wrong and stepping out their little box
I don't think "fanservice" is the word, but they need to "attack" some untaped (for them) genres that are actually rather popular, and attack them with the perspective that defines them as a company: gameplay first, gameplay second and gameplay third accompanied with a serviceable technical fidelity.

I hope their partnership with Platinum allows them to have this kind of approach (Platinum it's also a company that's focused on gameplay, even when their games often need a bit more polish and are not as perfect as Nintendo's own games) and that they expand their western studios but always impregnating them with their gameplay focused philosophy.
 

Harlock

Member
Things Nintendo can do in months, if really wants:

- Online account system to re-download games if the hardware broken.
- Sharing VC games between Wii U and 3DS
- Netflix of old games
- Steam sales of digital games


Will not, of course.
 

RAIDEN1

Member
So is it fair to say these financial results are the "game-changer" for Nintendo? BIG question is where will it be this time next year...on the upward curve...or stagnant?
 
Maybe Iwata shouldn't have chopped NoA's testicles off.

Once upon a time, I had a dream that Nintendo would have divisions all over the world under the umbrella of NCL, NoA and NoE, sort of how EA or Ubisoft work / name their studios. The divisions would be semi autonomous (rather than on a short leash held by NCL) and could fill the gaps in their portfolio (the way Rare did on the N64).
I always saw Rare as Nintendo West. They filled a hole of games for the older crowd while maintaining the Nintendo Seal of Quality and attention to detail. Nintendo needs to do things like that again. Maybe Retro is working on some sort of secret "adult" game that we'll hear about soon. Rare was able to make Donkey Kong and Perfect Dark, Retro should be able to make Donkey Kong Returns and Metroid HD Online Supreme.
 
They need to realize that the large numbers of people they won over with the Wii and Pokrmon games have all aged since then. You can't keep those fans without broadening your offerings. My younger brother played all sorts of Nintendo games. Now he messes around with Mario on the SNES, but then jumps over to his 360 to play new games.
I like this point. So many of us few up with Nintendo, yet Nintendo seems to go out of ya way to ignore these people. They seem to think we'll be happy with Mario/Zelda/Kart/Smash sequels each generation and a few bones thrown out here and there. Then they implement a shitty online system and a the Wii U launch, restricted adult title purchases between 11pm and 3am on the eShop. No wonder the core Jintendo fanbase has decreased significantly over the years. It seems Nintendo goes out of its way to alienate these people.
 

Kimawolf

Member
Well we will find out next week what will happen. I still believe we will get the announcement of several new western focused studios, a major 3rd party buyout, lower tiered game prices, and the announcement of a joint venture with a major tech company who will work with them on their next systems which will be tiered like pc hardware. All can play the same games but at different quality levels.
 

Riki

Member
Well we will find out next week what will happen. I still believe we will get the announcement of several new western focused studios, a major 3rd party buyout, lower tiered game prices, and the announcement of a joint venture with a major tech company who will work with them on their next systems which will be tiered like pc hardware. All can play the same games but at different quality levels.
Haha.
 

Bluenova

Neo Member
for my 1c, I think other CEOs have resigned for smaller failures. But I still respect their vision, yet with terrible messaging, and a tech like the gamepad that is underutilized and regulated to being a gimmick [IMHO like Kinect], except for off tv play.. poorly executed

Also not really listening to customers or their competition, they really need to be responsive
 
Well we will find out next week what will happen. I still believe we will get the announcement of several new western focused studios, a major 3rd party buyout, lower tiered game prices, and the announcement of a joint venture with a major tech company who will work with them on their next systems which will be tiered like pc hardware. All can play the same games but at different quality levels.

What...
 

RAIDEN1

Member
Someone posted on the original thread about Nintendo's next console with detailed "specs" there was a screenshot that had a logo of "Nintendo Go" with what looked like Japanese writing, anyone here able to translate that? might give a clue if the pic was legit, or a fake...
 
Well we will find out next week what will happen. I still believe we will get the announcement of several new western focused studios, a major 3rd party buyout, lower tiered game prices, and the announcement of a joint venture with a major tech company who will work with them on their next systems which will be tiered like pc hardware. All can play the same games but at different quality levels.

Is there some sort of Nintendo event happening next week that I don't know about? I keep seeing people mention a Nintendo event happening soon. Is this just an assumed month-end Nintendo Direct?
 
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