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Klepek: Don't Reward Nintendo For This SNES Classic Pre-Order Bullshit

zelas

Member
What consumer right is being violated here? The people who are upset are upset because they're not consumers.

Consumer rights are a thing that exist regardless of whether or not someone has purchased a product from Nintendo. There aren't a separate bunch of laws anytime Nintendo is involved.


Nintendo just needs to make more. That would solve every single problem associated with this problem.

*gives 10,000 unsubstantiated excuses as to why that's not the best move*
 
In general there's a really weird attitude amongst gamers when it comes to companies, like somehow they're invested in their practices and take on a pseudo PR role for them.

There's little reason in an age where you can arrange for preorders at the click of a button not to have a financial and industrial arrangement to meet the majority of demand.

Stop thinking like fans and collectors and start thinking like consumers. If there's a product on the market, it should be easy for you to purchase. Limited editions shouldn't refer to the quantity available but the period of time it's available. By all means make something for a few months then phase it out, leaving a standard edition - I get that you can't produce everything forever, there are choices to be made. But for the period something is available, why the fuck would you not try to fulfil demand? Especially when you don't allow for substitutions. Are there licenced NES Minis other than the official Nintendo one? No. Can you legally obtain NES and SNES games on the latest machine? No. Do Nintendo have a history for preserving your digital purchases? No.

Its not just Nintendo, companies big and small take the piss out of us all the time and we enable them because we buy regardless of the business practices. I've been vocal on here regarding similar attitudes with a smaller company and many were arguing that you should take into account the size of their operations. It doesn't matter because the attitude is the same. There are plenty of solutions to gauge and meet demand.
Allow for sign ups and preorders for a certain period of time, say 2-4 weeks plus more copies for general sale. All the fans get to release their pent up demand straight away, allowing companies to work on meeting those requests then they can produce for the general market based on their projections and targets. Right now all it does is piss people off and sours you on the brands.

Obviously Nintendo have me hard considering I own a Switch and a SNES mini preorder so I'm just as hypocritical but I draw the line at scalpers and I think we'd go a long way to solving part of the problem by refusing to deal with these parasites.

We need more journalists to hold companies accountable for their shit consumer practices, from tiny production runs to preorder culture, from misleading PR/marketing to microtransactions and pay to win mechanics, and we need to stop enabling and rewarding them.

I agree with you to a point. But you are all over the place. "Rise-up and stop enabling Nintendo's anti-consumer practices, but I will enjoy my Nintendo products as a self-identified hypocrite."

Look, I agree we owe gaming companies no loyalty. However they don't owe us as much as we think. They make games not epidepherine shots. If Nintendo wants to intentionally underproduce a hot item, that's NOT anti-consumer just because it's in high demand. You just don't like having fandom being taking advantage of. But guess what? Fandom is professionally curated by corporations to serve their interests. Not yours. This low priced impulse item was made not to make money on store shelves, but to make CNN as the Christmas 2017 must-have. Nintendo wants to see people rioting on Black Friday over this thing with red faced 350 lb mothers holding it over their heads at Walmart.

It's really about the Switch.
 
Nintendo wants shelf space.

There's a reason why pre orders were for in person at Gamestop.

You guys shouldn't carry on like this is an item they want people to buy.
 
So he is upset that he wasn't able to pre-order it? And his answer to all the problems is give a date (to him) so that it can be pre-ordered (by him)?

Feel there is a lot off about that. Not to mention I think that would crash websites. It isn't intended to be a widely available product.

I mean, many companies set pre-order times for high-demand items and tell the public. iPhones, concert tickets, whatever. The point is that it gives everyone who wants one a fair shot.
 
Nintendo announcing that this would be a limited product and discontinuing NES classic has made this a scalpers dream.

Yep, exactly what I've been saying. Nintendo bumping up stock a little bit from last year is irrelevant when they publicly guaranteed it would be a limited 2017-only product.
 

SMD

Member
I agree with you to a point. But you are all over the place. "Rise-up and stop enabling Nintendo's anti-consumer practices, but I will enjoy my Nintendo products as a self-identified hypocrite."

Look, I agree we owe gaming companies no loyalty. However they don't owe us as much as we think. They make games not epidepherine shots. If Nintendo wants to intentionally underproduce a hot item, that's NOT anti-consumer just because it's in high demand. You just don't like having fandom being taking advantage of. But guess what? Fandom is professionally curated by corporations to serve their interests. Not yours. This low priced impulse item was made not to make money on store shelves, but to make CNN as the Christmas 2017 must-have. Nintendo wants to see people rioting on Black Friday over this thing with red faced 350 lb mothers holding it over their heads at Walmart.

It's really about the Switch.

No, I'm just being honest. It's not like there's some sort of organised push against companies I can be a part of so my own position is pretty much "don't scalp". I don't preorders usually, made an exception for the SNES mini after the shit show of the NES classic. I actually work abroad so to begin with there was plenty of stock of the NES Mini for a while. Then people caught on to how much they could make selling them in Europe or the US, so the market got rinsed and shops took them off sale, then they came back mysteriously but at 3 times the price. You can still pick it up but for the low low price of $250.

The present system with video game manufacturers doesn't reward you for loyalty, it penalises you. If Nintendo want to underproduce, that's their prerogative. But when Nintendo underproduce and you're limited in how you can obtain it, that's anticonsumer. Can only buy from select retailers as part of a bundle? Pretty bullshit to me. Hiding game modes and/or DLC behind amiibo paywalls that you can't find? Absolute farce.

Lets be real, games companies exploit both gamers excitement and nostalgia, which is pretty much how business works, but with the added insult of making you jump through numerous hoops to get there.
Its like they're training people to be desperate and obedient. Remember how Sony sold the retro PS4?

Gaming is a fucked market because it's hard to get substitutes. You can't take your copy of Zelda and play it on a Samsung Switch. If you want to play a certain first party game, either you cave and buy the console or you don't and, well, that's it.

Anyway, you said it yourself, Nintendo want people to be beating the shit out of each other for it on Black Friday rather than, I dunno, make enough copies to sell to both? And since those punches keep flying, nothing will change. Media pressure is a good step though.
 
Thanks y'all!!

Pretty easy to do. I got a Pi3 case (not one of the SNES lookalikes) and everything snaps in really easily/cleanly. Need a USB mouse/kb to get things set up, then a usb drive to transfer things. Overall it's one of the easiest things I've done. Now I hit INPUT on my monitor two times and bam, got my SNES ready to go.

I'm only promoting this as a way for people who bought a ton of SNES games and have them stored away to "experience" the SNES classic wave - in other words, this booted my lazy ass into gear to make a way to play my old favorites that I've purchased easily.

It sure works. Most important part has been the controller - the 8bitdo SNES controller is immaculate and light as a feather. Already been using it on my PC as well.
 
I'm not buying one because I couldn't get the last one and I'd have an incomplete collection.

This new round of bullshit is just making me feel better about my decision.
 
For those interested, here's a FiveThirtyEight article on the resellers/scalpers in the sneaker industry that might be relevant. Why is Nike allowing this to happen, and could it shed light on Nintendo's behavior? https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/you-see-sneakers-these-guys-see-hundreds-of-millions-in-resale-profit/

Interesting read. Some select quotes:

When you ask Wall Street analysts why Nike allows resellers to pocket the profits from shoes, many say it’s great marketing: It fuels excitement about the brand, and it rewards the company’s most loyal customers. “They’re exceptionally good at keeping people hungry,” Poser, who has been following Nike for more than a decade, said. “They understand the cool factor, and they know how to stay cool. And if they don’t stay cool they know this business dries up, because this is fashion.”

“If you talk to the retailers, they always want more [pairs]. They’re never satisfied but they also understand that if they got too much, it could kill the golden goose.”

Another benefit to keeping supply tight is that Nike doesn’t have to discount sneakers to move inventory, said Paul Swinand, an analyst with Morningstar. Doing so could cheapen the brand’s perceived value.

When I asked whether there’s a point at which Nike gives up too much profit to resellers, Poser paused and said, “I don’t know the answer to that question.”

He saw only the benefits of a robust secondary market. Resellers are essentially doing PR for Nike; they’re curators. And Nike, he said, understands that to sell stuff it needs strong curators — whether that’s Foot Locker, Michael Jordan or some of the guys waiting in line in Harlem.

“They would rather err on the side of leaving money on the table than risk disrupting the secondary market and all the marketing, brand cachet, PR and hype that comes with having a really vibrant secondary market,” Luber said.
 

Scrawnton

Member
I have no issue with how rare the SNES classic is. I do have an issue that Nintendo is not using Switch's eshop as an alternative method to obtain this collection of games at this time.
 

Ghost

Chili Con Carnage!
He's not wrong at all but I find myself wondering, would this article exist if he'd gotten his pre-order in? I strongly suspect the answer is no, so I don't think his criticism is coming from the right place.
 
I'm convinced that a huge part of the demand for these Classic consoles is precisely because they're limited and very hard to get. If they were in abundant supply and on shelves year-round I bet over 70% of people who are desperately trying to preorder one wouldn't even buy it now if they knew they could do so any time in the foreseeable future.

If Nintendo "made enough" of them you would think twice before spending your money on some 16-bit games when you have a backlog/wishlist of current gen games.
 
I wonder how the gaming community would react to the item avaliability in the sneakers community.

I think Nintendo isn't making more because the margin isn't that high on these, better off dedicating their supply chain to the 3DS and the Switch.
 

Lord Phol

Member
I could care less about the product but I just think this whole thing is stupid. Why don't they just make enough products to please their fans theat actually want to give them their money?
 

Bad_Boy

time to take my meds
He's not wrong at all but I find myself wondering, would this article exist if he'd gotten his pre-order in? I strongly suspect the answer is no, so I don't think his criticism is coming from the right place.
Nobody would be upset if they got their pre order in. But thats the issue at hand.
 

Audioboxer

Member
He's not wrong at all but I find myself wondering, would this article exist if he'd gotten his pre-order in? I strongly suspect the answer is no, so I don't think his criticism is coming from the right place.

Nobody would be upset if they got their pre order in. But thats the issue at hand.

I've got my pre-order in yet I've spent a bit of time calling Nintendo out for this. Sure, you can be "I've got mine I don't care about anyone else" but others will happily chime in regardless of whether they hit F5 quick enough to beat the rest of the "salty" gamers around them.

It's a very passive aggressive dismissal to suggest the only people who could ever possibly call Nintendo out on this have to be salty people with no pre-order. Just reads like people with their pre-orders purposefully antagonizing those without to feel superior or defend Nintendo as they're catered for. More journalists regardless of whether they got an order in or have hookups in the industry to supply them with whatever they want should be pushing Nintendo on their stock/order/pre-order behaviour. Gamers shouldn't be so resistant to Nintendo catching some criticism either, but I've said enough about that throughout the topic.
 

fireflame

Member
Im' not interested in the Snes classic because it does not read cardridges, but if I was i would be baffled by those pre-order issues. If anything this s a purchase-killer of some sort, I would quickly loose patience.
 

Ikuu

Had his dog run over by Blizzard's CEO
They could easily make enough if they wanted, but they don't, they want it to remain a hard to get item, just fuels the hype for the next launch. You're all crying now but if they announced a N64 mini you would all try even harder to get it.
 
I have less of a problem with "We can't make enough right now" (although they swore that it wasn't going to be a problem this time), it's "We've already decided production will be for a finite time", after that was the issue with the NES Classic. Because even if modding wasn't a factor, if they were making them, they'd STILL be selling them today. It'd probably be tapering off by now, but they gave up months and months of sales to counterfitters and resellers because of poor production schedule planning.

So they turn right around and do the same thing with the SNES Classic. "We're only making these until the end of 2017!" WHY. This was entirely on your schedule, you hadn't even announced it yet, you could have adjusted production. But you're intentionally opting for limited sales because...?

The only thing I've been able to guess, besides Production is Hard, is that they wrote the contracts specifically so they'd only license the 3rd Party games through the end of 2016 for the NES Classic, and they did the exact same thing with the SNES Classic.
 
Im' not interested in the Snes classic because it does not read cardridges, but if I was i would be baffled by those pre-order issues. If anything this s a purchase-killer of some sort, I would quickly loose patience.

Unfortunately the situation feeds into our compulsive consumer tendencies, it gets Nintendo press and makes the scalpers rich. People unfortunately can't help themselves paying 2-3 times the value of an item because imma gotta have it! Not trying to judge, if its worth it to some people to pay drastically marked up prices go for it, but like fuck if I'm enabling these parasites.
 
If I buy something from Nintendo (or any other Company) I'm not rewarding them.

I pay for something I think has at least the value I pay for it. It's as simple as that.

So I managed to preorder one
(3 actually)
and I'm really happy to have it before Christmas.
Klepek is salty because he didn't manage to get one easily. Well wait a little and look at sites/shops to secure one.

Then if you still can't find one you can be sure that Nintendo missing a sale is already something they're not happy about. Just doing it on purpose changes nothing... it'll just make one available for someone else so I guess you made someone happy at least Klepek :p
 

jwhit28

Member
I have no issue with how rare the SNES classic is. I do have an issue that Nintendo is not using Switch's eshop as an alternative method to obtain this collection of games at this time.

This makes me more angry, but maybe it's Nintendo's way of throwing a bone to indies. People will always want LttP and DKC, so maybe leave that period of easy discovery at the launch of the system to the little guys.

Most of these games are available on Wii U or 3DS, a SNES Classic sale price would be a nice gesture.
 

benjammin

Member
I just bought a raspberry pi instead and loaded it up with digital copies of all the games I own on cart. Didn't even bother trying to preorder as I assumed it would be a giant cluster fuck after the NES Classic debacle.
 
After almost getting a preorder 3 times and patiently waiting for any opening, coming up with nothing still, I'm almost done with Nintendo. I say that after getting lucky enough to have a NES Classic and Switch on launch day which had all of their own hoops to jump through. This trend is tiring.

If Nintendo doesn't want to respect the fans, especially after the NES Classic last year, they surely don't deserve my business any more.
 

gaiages

Banned
Don't reward Nintendo? Shouldn't it be don't reward scalpers?

Scalpers only flock to the things that will make them guaranteed profits and that's precisely what Nintendo's constant stocking issues are doing. But Nintendo is making the same amount either way, so they see no issue with this.

If Nintendo actually made enough supply to meet demand, or get close to it, scalpers wouldn't be an issue because the profit wouldn't be there. They're a symptom of the problem, not the root.
 
Scalpers only flock to the things that will make them guaranteed profits and that's precisely what Nintendo's constant stocking issues are doing. But Nintendo is making the same amount either way, so they see no issue with this.

If Nintendo actually made enough supply to meet demand, or get close to it, scalpers wouldn't be an issue because the profit wouldn't be there. They're a symptom of the problem, not the root.

Exactly, it's a classic chicken or the egg scenario. The unfortunate reality is, people are people and will take advantage of a situation if they can. And while Nintendo can't be blamed for controlling people's parasitic behavior, they can certain control their own processes which by extension will limit people's ability to, again, 'be people'. But, ultimately I'm becoming more convinced that they don't really care about the scalpers. They're getting their cut off every initial sale, so the scalpers grabbing up units, stores lines going down the block, websites crashing and preorders selling out in milliseconds? Free marketing, and people get pissed off at it but ultimately get sucked right into the frenzy. How many 'I got a preorder in but fuck Nintendo anyway' posts have you seen on here the past 3 days? I recall one poster here say 'fuck it I'm done' when they couldn't get on Walmart's preorder list but 2-3hours later they were still trying to get through target's site, with each passing post here there was a 'Fuck Nintendo I'm done' sentiment. So yeah, we keep pissing on their supposed 'ineptness' but I think they know *exactly* what they're doing.
 

DR2K

Banned
I'm convinced that a huge part of the demand for these Classic consoles is precisely because they're limited and very hard to get. If they were in abundant supply and on shelves year-round I bet over 70% of people who are desperately trying to preorder one wouldn't even buy it now if they knew they could do so any time in the foreseeable future.

If Nintendo "made enough" of them you would think twice before spending your money on some 16-bit games when you have a backlog/wishlist of current gen games.

Well Nintendo will never be able to put that crack pot theory into play. Since that isn't going to happen.
 
I'm so glad I'm not interested in either of the Classic models. Otherwise, I would be so tilted at having to bend over backwards for the privilege of buying a pack of games from 20 years ago and still fail.
 

Kaibutsu

Member
"Please understand."

RIP
2326636-iwatagivecash.jpg
 

Teletraan1

Banned
I know at least 10 people who would have bought or would buy a NES or SNES classic if they were readily available but certainly aren't going to jump through hoops or pay a high price to get one. For me personally the MSRP was just about what I would pay for such a device. Add scalper prices to the mix and i'm out. IMO this is all on Nintendo. Everyone else selling products on this earth seem to be able to figure out the riddle of supply chains except Nintendo.
 
Nobody would be upset if they got their pre order in. But thats the issue at hand.

Bullshit. I have my pre-order in and happily call them out for being a shit company. If the SNES wasn't such a major part of my childhood, I wouldn't even buy the fucking thing, but it's my favorite console of all time, so I'm spending the money, but I absolutely refuse to give Nintendo another cent after this is released. They are scummy as all hell and can fuck off until they actually fix their shit.
 
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