I don't think they 'banned as Commander" anymore. It's either just banned or it isn't. I don't see anything here indicating this is different, unless I missed it.
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Magic: the Gathering |OT11| Amonkhet - Have you ever had decks with a Pharaoh?
- Thread starter SigmasonicX
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I don't think they 'banned as Commander" anymore. It's either just banned or it isn't. I don't see anything here indicating this is different, unless I missed it.
Yeah, I mean they are oppressive commanders in 1v1, so they should be banned.
divisionbyzorro
Member
It's past time they took over the banlist responsibilities, to be honest. But that list is bad 60% correct at best.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
No, please stay far away from paper commander. This list is trash.
SigmasonicX
Member
Magic Story - Brazen
* Gideon joins a crop ready to start the black Trial of Ambition. Oketra has given him the white and blue cartouches without him having to go through those trials.
* Everyone gets along well. Djeru is in the crop and he wrestles Gideon.
* Samut was from this crop. Now that she has rebelled, they no longer talk about her.
* Bontu arrives. She doesn't walk around in public as much as the other gods. While Oketra brought calm, she brings a surge in pride and power.
* Gideon gets over excited and when she says no one is born strong, he shouts, "Not even the gods?" Everyone is shocked he would say that, but she commends him for his brazeness. She says even she is stronger than she once was, because she desired to be.
* They go into Bontu's Monument to start the trial. Each room has an obstacle that often forces the crop to leave someone behind to die.
* One room has a Bafeful Ammit. Like a crocodile, it's far faster than you would expect. In a flavor fail, it's too strong for Gideon to hurt and it overpowers him, though it doesn't break his barrier. An aven with wind magic has to save him, and the ammit leaps in the air to eat him. The others escape the room, thinking the hallway is too small for the ammit.
* The next room has spinning blade traps. Gideon brute forces through them, but the ammit does the same thing to the stone hallway, chasing them. The room after that has them leave their four weakest members behind to stand on pillars to open a door, which also releases monsters to eat them. The ammit joins in as the remaining crop goes ahead.
* They reach Bontu at the end, but too many people have reached the end, so she demands a heart from each person.
* To Gideon's shock, without words, everyone starts attacking each other, carving out the hearts of the dead. Those who offer the hearts to Bontu are allowed to cross her bridge and pass the trial. Gideon just stands there as the occasional arrow bounces off of him.
* Djeru tells his brother to kill him so he can pass, but as he prepares to do so, Djeru throws him into the water and holds him down, drowning him, as depicted on Cruel Reality. Gideon has to be held back to not interfere.
* Out of anger, Gideon crosses the moat to Bontu without a tribute, with the teeth of the poisonous sea serpents in the water breaking on his skin.
* He yells at Bontu, and she basically goes, "Well, what did you expect?"
* Gideon asks the other participants to question the gods and Bolas, but Bontu points out that of course they doubt their faith. But that's what drives them to shine brighter, reach higher. She asks when Gideon will be able to say the same for himself, and tells him to leave.
* Gideon leaves, and sees mummies carrying out the dead, as depicted on Annointed Procession. Gideon hopes he'll be found worthy... to kick Bolas's ass! He pats himself on the back for coming up with that.
* Gideon joins a crop ready to start the black Trial of Ambition. Oketra has given him the white and blue cartouches without him having to go through those trials.
* Everyone gets along well. Djeru is in the crop and he wrestles Gideon.
* Samut was from this crop. Now that she has rebelled, they no longer talk about her.
* Bontu arrives. She doesn't walk around in public as much as the other gods. While Oketra brought calm, she brings a surge in pride and power.
* Gideon gets over excited and when she says no one is born strong, he shouts, "Not even the gods?" Everyone is shocked he would say that, but she commends him for his brazeness. She says even she is stronger than she once was, because she desired to be.
* They go into Bontu's Monument to start the trial. Each room has an obstacle that often forces the crop to leave someone behind to die.
* One room has a Bafeful Ammit. Like a crocodile, it's far faster than you would expect. In a flavor fail, it's too strong for Gideon to hurt and it overpowers him, though it doesn't break his barrier. An aven with wind magic has to save him, and the ammit leaps in the air to eat him. The others escape the room, thinking the hallway is too small for the ammit.
* The next room has spinning blade traps. Gideon brute forces through them, but the ammit does the same thing to the stone hallway, chasing them. The room after that has them leave their four weakest members behind to stand on pillars to open a door, which also releases monsters to eat them. The ammit joins in as the remaining crop goes ahead.
* They reach Bontu at the end, but too many people have reached the end, so she demands a heart from each person.
* To Gideon's shock, without words, everyone starts attacking each other, carving out the hearts of the dead. Those who offer the hearts to Bontu are allowed to cross her bridge and pass the trial. Gideon just stands there as the occasional arrow bounces off of him.
* Djeru tells his brother to kill him so he can pass, but as he prepares to do so, Djeru throws him into the water and holds him down, drowning him, as depicted on Cruel Reality. Gideon has to be held back to not interfere.
* Out of anger, Gideon crosses the moat to Bontu without a tribute, with the teeth of the poisonous sea serpents in the water breaking on his skin.
* He yells at Bontu, and she basically goes, "Well, what did you expect?"
* Gideon asks the other participants to question the gods and Bolas, but Bontu points out that of course they doubt their faith. But that's what drives them to shine brighter, reach higher. She asks when Gideon will be able to say the same for himself, and tells him to leave.
* Gideon leaves, and sees mummies carrying out the dead, as depicted on Annointed Procession. Gideon hopes he'll be found worthy... to kick Bolas's ass! He pats himself on the back for coming up with that.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
Why is Edric banned and Leovold legal
They changed that a while ago in paper. It was too confusing so cards are just banned in general.
Bontu-kun?!
The next chapter is going to be the Gatewatch laughing at Gideon for joining a cult.
They changed that a while ago in paper. It was too confusing so cards are just banned in general.
Bontu-kun?!
The next chapter is going to be the Gatewatch laughing at Gideon for joining a cult.
divisionbyzorro
Member
They're using this list for multiplayer and Upheaval isn't banned?
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
They nuked all competitive combo decks for some reason.
neither is leovold, prime time, sylvan primordial, basically a BUG players wet dream.
neither is leovold, prime time, sylvan primordial, basically a BUG players wet dream.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
There's almost nobody who plays multiplayer on MTGO. They're just using the same banlist for simplicity.
Hence why Edric is banned; its a fun commander in multiplayer games and supremely unfun in 1v1. That doesn't mean you should be able to play Leovold.
divisionbyzorro
Member
I used to play a lot of it.
Before I got sick of losing games because [Sweet Card From An Old Set] was bugged and didn't work.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
I mean that relatively. There's games going, but its nowhere near the level of play of 1v1 games.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
that's what they say but there's a variety of streamers that consistently play 4p EDH on MODO.
There is already a supported banlist. Overwriting it is no simpler than creating a new format.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
Get a load of this guy who has never played MTGO
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
Your point? I played on MTGO since OGW. As long as they keep it to MODO I'm not going to be affected wrt EDH but I do fear them eventually overtaking the format in paper.
charlequin
Banned
I don't feel like people ever really provide a reason for WotC to take it over that doesn't boil down to "they would definitely fix {personal weird axe-grinding reason}" so I'm just not convinced it's a good idea.
We all know that after a year or two of random semi-arbitrary seeming bans nobody plays Modern anymore.
We all know that after a year or two of random semi-arbitrary seeming bans nobody plays Modern anymore.
I'm actually of the mindset that they've done Modern right.
This on the other hand, there's a lot of evidence that some cards are huge problems, and many of those were left off the list. Would have been smarter IMO to start off with a much, much more inclusive ban list, and generate excitement by slowly removing them over time, instead of slowly adding to it.
divisionbyzorro
Member
I agree. I would much rather have seen a union of the Duel Commander and EDH banned lists as a starting point, as opposed to whatever this is.
Infinite Stars
Member
That banlist is 100% right in the fast Mana category, because how Sol Ring/Mana Crypt are legal in Multiplayer is beyond me. Both of them effectively read "Whoever has this in their opening hand is 2-5 turns ahead in board state from turn 1" because they are that powerful.
Basically, Sheldon/EDH Committee has their heads up their asses regarding fast Mana.
Basically, Sheldon/EDH Committee has their heads up their asses regarding fast Mana.
Couldn't agree more.
Sol Ring/Mana Crypt being allowed in EDH despite being powerful enough to be auto-includes in every single deck is crazy to me. If a card shows up in 99% of decks, shouldn't you be taking a look at whether that card is too good?
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
In that case they have to ban Dark Ritual and GSZ/Dryad Arbor. Lotus Petal, Mox Opal, Chrome Mox, Mox Diamond, etc.
Should they ban Lightning Greaves then?
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
tempo doesn't matter when your commander is Narset or Leovold, neither of which is banned.
To me?
T1, land, Sol Ring, Signet/Mind Stone/Talisman
is too good an opening turn.
Add a Mana Crypt into that and baby, you got yourself a stew going.
Please ban that stew.
I don't personally have a problem with Dark Ritual in EDH because it's not easily repeatable. I feel similarly about Lotus Petal or Simian Spirit Guide in the format. That said, I'd gladly sacrifice their legality if it meant getting Sol Ring and Mana Crypt out as well.
Unless they plan on ever reprinting it, sure. Decks that deal in CMDR damage need whatever they can.
charlequin
Banned
I agree, I'm just remembering how goofy the initial banlist was and how long it took them to get it right. I certainly agree they've gotta make some major fixes to this one.
We talk about how WotC is mired in inertia/status-quo-bias on the ban list, but that's a much bigger and more real factor for the Commander team (and I don't think a WotC-owned multiplayer ban list would really avoid this.) Lots of these lists are essentially fixed due to the level of disruption changing them would cause. At this point the Sol Ring is so centrally associated with the identity of the Commander format, and in so many people's hands, that it'd be a big thing to reverse course on it -- and you can't go back on Crypt unless you also hit Sol Ring, and then it all unravels from there.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
My opponent played Turn 3 Gideon in both games in this MTGO match.
That shit is fucking infuriating. That is all.
I also had no land in either game and cycled into stuff I couldn't cast.
That shit is fucking infuriating. That is all.
I also had no land in either game and cycled into stuff I couldn't cast.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
Dark Ritual makes Yawg's Will a free cast and there's like 3 more cards in the format that do a similar effect. To a lesser extent that applies to Lotus Petal as well.
And I just realized they didn't hit LED.
I don't quite follow. Decks that deal in CMDR damaged need Greaves all the same.
Imperfected
Member
I think Sol Ring skates by largely on the basis that it's been reprinted such a crazy number of times at such low rarities that it's inexpensive and available for everyone.
I didn't word that properly at all. 100% my mistake. The only reason I feel LG shouldn't be banned is because of aggro decks needing the protection for their choice creatures and commanders. I'm just miffed at how much they cost and how WotC needs to reprint them instead of just making more versions of Swiftfoot Boots. I have much less of a problem with every aggro deck needing greaves verses every deck ever needing Sol Ring. There are at least some other kinds of decks that don't need to include greaves in them. Not so much Sol Ring.
Easy: Ban Yawg's Will
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
I think they reprinted Lightning Greaves 3 months ago
my box/bundle was pretty good for this set i think, i got all three planeswalkers including a foil gideon, a rhonas, an as foretold which i assume will be 5 dollars soon, a glorybringer, some cyclelands including a foil. some other stuff like angel of sanctions and foil hapatra. seems hard to get a lot of value unless you open an invocation but i guess i cant ask for everything
if i could ask greedily for three more things in order of greed, i would have liked to have opened an approach of the second sun, a hazoret, and a mind twist invo
if i could ask greedily for three more things in order of greed, i would have liked to have opened an approach of the second sun, a hazoret, and a mind twist invo
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
Past in Flames?
The only deck I don't run Lightning Greaves in is my Akiri Voltron deck for obvious reasons.
Yep. I was wrong. That's what I get for not doing my research. Could stand a couple more reprints, but yeah, it's not as expensive as I remember.
By your reasoning it can't be cast for free off a Dark Ritual. I would rather lose one card that's super-banned in Legacy and enables unfun play patterns than one that's fun and generates a few extra mana once a game if you're lucky enough to draw it early.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
They reprinted it in both Masterpieces and in the Commander 2016 decks.
divisionbyzorro
Member
Honestly though: part of the appeal of EDH is specifically that you get to play with some of these super busted cards that aren't quite as busted in EDH due to multiplayer politics.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
That too. Over time my decks have become much more competitive and I enjoy playing at competitive tables just as much as whipping out my Archangel Avacyn Angel Tribal deck for some janky fun.
Looking at their 1v1 banlist they banned almost every single combo deck in the format. They banned Zur and Necro at the same time, which is pretty much redundant.
You said Dark Ritual can't easily be recast, Yawg's will is the best method but other methods still give you an easy way to get doubly value from it.
What? There's tons of multiplayer EDH games that get played on MTGO. This is just plain wrong.
I really wish they'd keep this 1v1 cEDH crap away from multiplayer EDH, but appears that is too much of hassle.
Lazy vs Crazy
Member
That's neat idea.
Would they let you play Kor deck with Nahiri, the Lithomancer as your commander?
Would they let you play Kor deck with Nahiri, the Lithomancer as your commander?
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