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[Blearth]

You forgot MS said. Even though Sony is not going to spit in your face we are going to spit in your face anyway. Then they saw pre-order numbers... Then they said we'll spit on your face later when your invested in a "policy change".

Isn't it fun to make shit up?

 

[slider]

Well, there are services beyond Xbox Live that need to be expanded. Xbox Live is just apart of the mix of services that are supported by "the Cloud".

Ahh, thanks for pointing that out. I wish I took more time to consider my posts!

In researching exactly what sort of services (spanning the entirety of MS's operations) this can offer... I'm hoping "MS Azure" a good search term to start that research.

 

[Sethos]

Isn't it fun to make shit up?

Make up what? Microsoft clearly said after they announced the removal of DRM they reserved the right to change it down the road etc. etc. which anyone with a modicum of sense knows they will slowly steer it all back into the digital DRM direction just slower and more methodical.

 

[Kyon]

Just because they wiped the spit away doesn't mean they didn't spit in my face.

Best analogy ever and you didn't lie.

 

[2San]

Of course I do, but I simply need to see it actually happening the way it's advertised before I can get excited. Everything Microsoft has done with XBO sadly has had red small print or an asterisk, so I have to be careful to measure my expectations for anything Microsoft says for the XBO. Not my fault :/

It is, what it is, however all things do point out that at least the first party stuff are getting dedicated servers. Then there's third party console exclusive stuff, which I'm guessing will be running on dedi's as well, if titanfall is any indication. Considering MS's 1st party is pretty shooter centric that's pretty nice to know.

Though admittedly things really start to get interesting if they can say that Ghosts/Battlefield 4 run on their servers. The EA BF3 servers are pretty bad imo.

Same with Sony's Gaikai. it'd be nice to stream old games, but I won't know how expansive or stable the system is for me until I use it, and I won't know how much they actually deliver on the promises, until I can see it for myself. The only difference is Sony has been more trustworthy so far this go around, so they have slightly less of a cynicism hill to climb with me right now lol

I always thought Gaikai was pretty shit, at least when Gaikai used to be independent. Honestly I'd rather play handhelds/mobile games at that point. I hope they use the infrastructure for online gaming. >_>

It's not a traditional dedicated server. The resources are shared between multiple devices and can be removed nearly instantly depending on demand.

I know what it is, but there's a lot of uncertainty about what teh cloud actually is. However at it's core it's a dedicated server and dedicated servers are awesome.

 

[Unregistered007]

I guess that cuts it, guys. Unregistered007 thinks this is bullshit. Who are Microsoft trying to kid, anyway? Christian Belady, the general manager of Microsoft's data centre services, obviously has no idea what he's talking about. There's no way they can get one around Unregistered007.

Thanks, lets keep our clouds clean.

 

[lynux3]

Ahh, thanks for pointing that out. I wish I took more time to consider my posts!

In researching exactly what sort of services (spanning the entirety of MS's operations) this can offer... I'm hoping "MS Azure" a good search term to start that research.

It's perfect. Windows Azure is a great IaaS. There are many reasons to have your services be deployed in the cloud. There are also more popular options such as Rackspace Cloud (as well as hybrid services, dedicated + cloud) and of course Amazon EC2.

I know what it is, but there's a lot of uncertainty about what teh cloud actually is. However at it's core it's a dedicated server and dedicated servers are awesome.

There's no uncertainty about what the cloud is. It's all over the internet about how it works and what is does. The only uncertainty here is if it is compliant with PCI standards, lol; however, there is such thing as a private cloud vs. public cloud. A lot of companies have their own private cloud on site or at the data center to be PCI compliant.

At it's core it is a hypervisor with a bunch of virtual machines that span across multiple devices, AKA, not dedicated in any sense.

 

[ZombiePlatypus]

Jesus Christ, give it a rest.

Microsoft gave you all exactly what you wanted. You still wanna be bitter? Fine. But don't take good news and act like it means nothing.

Xbone showed how deeply ingrained the "fuck the consumer" philosophy is ingrained in their corporate-culture. There's no way they suddenly dropped all of that within the span of a week. All without a management-shake up to boot.

They're putting on a hastily contrived "nice" facade now, but soon as they bait whatever they consider to be enough of a userbase, they'll revert back to the same bullshittery.

 

[Mihael Mello Keehl]

Make up what? Microsoft clearly said after they announced the removal of DRM they reserved the right to change it down the road etc. etc. which anyone with a modicum of sense knows they will slowly steer it all back into the digital DRM direction just slower and more methodical.

So in what year can I expect my used games to no longer work?

 

[RukusProvider]

So in what year can I expect my used games to no longer work?

Same year tin foil gets a global ban.

 

[Mihael Mello Keehl]

Same year tin foil gets a global ban.

lol thanks for that laugh

 

[twobear]

It's weird that they claim to be spending all this money on something I'm confidently informed by GAFfers doesn't even exist.

 

[MaxwellGT2000]

You must hate them forever and ever and ever for something they never actually did.

Think you quoted the wrong guy, but even if you did quote the right guy, MS has done a lot, and still have a lot wrong with their console, like all the ports, many desirable games on other consoles, other consoles with more power and 100 dollars cheaper, the few first party titles that were put out there were not good in the least, the outsourced exclusives looked terrible or were games gamers wanted but then revealed the team making it ruined your other favorite series (it's like giving you a puppy and then kicking it off a bridge right before handing it to you). They still use deceptive ways to say exclusive when you can get the same games on PC. XBL still costs money. Cloud gaming is still not important. They still aren't clear on what their policies will be and will not be cause they can't settle or one exec doesn't know the information the other does and it showed. And most of all I'm not happy cause I'm actually fine with the old MS model, but the way they handled this whole announcement and business practices literally made me want a PS4, after I was hoping they would cream Sony just so their execs would finally get a real wake up call and become better, now they're able to basically become the 360 and everyone is happy, they don't even have to step up their game which is when Sony actually tries... and when Sony doesn't try I tend to not like their consoles or games (looks at PS2)

 

[Blearth]

Xbone showed how deeply ingrained the "fuck the consumer" philosophy is ingrained in their corporate-culture. There's no way they suddenly dropped all of that within the span of a week. All without a management-shake up to boot.

They're putting on a hastily contrived "nice" facade now, but soon as they bait whatever they consider to be enough of a userbase, they'll revert back to the same bullshittery.

Nothing but speculation and assumptions.

 

[Black Republican]

Wonder if they do their own game streaming service similar to Gaikai? im sure they got the money for it

 

[GoofsterStud]

So in what year can I expect my used games to no longer work?

Give it a couple years. It'll be something like the next Halo will enforce the new policy. You have to agree to play it. You agree to not being able to sell used. Then more and more games abide by the new terms. Then your locked in from that point on.

I don't think one year will be a big enough user-base. Especially if the yield "truth-fact" doesn't get fixed.

 

[Ardenyal]

They spent that much on us gamers, they heard us

Shame they don't hear eu or jp.

 

[Mihael Mello Keehl]

Give it a couple years. It'll be something like the next Halo will enforce the new policy. You have to agree to play it. You agree to not being able to sell used. Then more and more games abide by the new terms. Then your locked in from that point on.

I don't think one year will be a big enough user-base. Especially if the yield "truth-fact" doesn't get fixed.

Not one year? Surely the year after that one year then, no?

 

[Blearth]

Think you quoted the wrong guy, but even if you did quote the right guy, MS has done a lot, and still have a lot wrong with their console, like all the ports

Which ports? Which console doesn't have ports?

many desirable games on other consoles

Opinion

other consoles with more power and 100 dollars cheaper

PS2 was weaker than its competition despite being the same price as Xbox and $100 more than Gamecube. PS2 did just fine.

the few first party titles that were put out there were not good in the least

Opinion

the outsourced exclusives looked terrible

So we're calling them outsourced exclusives now? I thought they were called third party exclusives.

Oh, and opinion

or were games gamers wanted but then revealed the team making it ruined your other favorite series

Example?

They still use deceptive ways to say exclusive when you can get the same games on PC.

Every company spins

XBL still costs money.

So does PSN

Cloud gaming is still not important.

Wrong

They still aren't clear on what their policies will be and will not be cause they can't settle or one exec doesn't know the information the other does and it showed.

They're been quite clear since the 180

And most of all I'm not happy cause I'm actually fine with the old MS model

They're using the old MS model

 

[Liamario]

5000 servers to 300000 servers. I'm a bit sceptical that they'll be used exclusively for Xbox live.
That said, it does go to explain the tificulous DRM policy they had in place. Got to pay that bill somehow.

 

[richman555]

So, what we know already of their investments

$400million NFL deal
$700 million in data center/cloud support
$1 billion in investments for development of first party/exclusives
A marketing campaign larger than the one for Kinect, so half a billion+
$??? in R&D costs for the Xbox One itself
__________________________________

$2.6 billion dollars + so far

Microsoft is paying out the ass this gen, I thought they wanted to be profitable this go around

This goes to show as ridiculous as Nintendo can be at times... somehow they manage to turn profits.

 

[RukusProvider]

Goddamn.

So if you add that 3 billion to the mix, the investment to date that we know of is at least 5.6 billion, and we're still missing the largest chunk of R&D budget. That's insane. Do we have comparable numbers on what the average investment in a console upfront is?

The deal is worth upto 3bil in revenue based on production volume over the course of the generation. It's no different than what Sony will pay.

http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=35070457&postcount=10

If MS cloud strategy works well, Sony will be left so far behind, not enough Ddr5 in the world will make up for the difference. I expect the differences in the online service to be vastly different 1yr into the console life.

As devs traditionally get better with developing on the console hardware over time, they will do the same with distributed computing.

 

[2San]

There's no uncertainty about what the cloud is. It's all over the internet about how it works and what is does. The only uncertainty here is if it is compliant with PCI standards, lol; however, there is such thing as a private cloud vs. public cloud. A lot of companies have their own private cloud on site or at the data center to be PCI compliant.

At it's core it is a hypervisor with a bunch of virtual machines that span across multiple devices, AKA, not dedicated in any sense.

So do you know if the cloud will able to provide real computing power and such, besides what the standard servers could already do? Virtual and physical servers fall under the dedicated server moniker afaik. Other companies use the tech as well.

 

[GoofsterStud]

Not one year? Surely the year after that one year then, no?

They'll slowly reintroduce it.

The infrastructure they invested in will get used. Microsoft isn't going to just toss it aside. My predictions have been right on the money so far.

I even sarcastically said good for them when they said Sony isn't a threat because I previously said they'd change when they saw pre-orders. I still feel they will use the bait and switch method. It just won't be an instant flood.. More like trickles until you realize your there.

The always connected Kinetic is part of this plan. That part hasn't changed. Microsoft is making zero announcements to reassure us that this change isn't anything more than temporary. That is worrisome to me. It might not be to you, but it is to many of us. All signs point to tread lightly.

 

[HocusPocus]

Sounds great. Online is the reason I'm getting an Xbox One over a PS4. People that champion PSPlus can enjoy the older games they get to rent for a bit if they want. I prefer smooth online play with the games I felt were worth a purchase.

 

[Ocelott]

So, what we know already of their investments

$400million NFL deal
$700 million in data center/cloud support
$1 billion in investments for development of first party/exclusives
A marketing campaign larger than the one for Kinect, so half a billion+
$??? in R&D costs for the Xbox One itself
__________________________________

$2.6 billion dollars + so far

Microsoft is paying out the ass this gen, I thought they wanted to be profitable this go around

A lot of Money for them to be having all of this negativity to be associated with them. Even though they are coming out this year I think that they need to take a step back and access because they are flying by the seat of their pants.

 

[Blearth]

They'll slowly reintroduce it.

The infrastructure they invested in will get used. Microsoft isn't going to just toss it aside. My predictions have been right on the money so far.

I even sarcastically said good for them when they said Sony isn't a threat because I previously said they'd change when they saw pre-orders. I still feel they will use the bait and switch method. It just won't be an instant flood.. More like trickles until you realize your there.

The always connected Kinetic is part of this plan. That part hasn't changed. Microsoft is making zero announcements to reassure us that this change isn't anything more than temporary. That is worrisome to me. It might not be to you, but it is to many of us. All signs point to tread lightly.

I'll believe it when I see it.

 

[GoofsterStud]

I'll believe it when I see it.

You can do whatever you want.

I'm not arguing with someone who gets mad that PSN+ online component is behind a pay wall so they can beef up the network infrastructure only to support Microsoft doing the same thing.

I can go on with pro Kinetic, Sony will be anti-consumer like Microsoft, Xbox One will have faster load times because of mandatory installs (which can be done on PS4) and on....

 

[Xdrive05]

Have Sony announced their plans for dedicated servers or cloud stuff?

 

[Phoenician_Viking]

The deal is worth upto 3bil in revenue based on production volume over the course of the generation. It's no different than what Sony will pay.

http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=35070457&postcount=10

If MS cloud strategy works well, Sony will be left so far behind, not enough Ddr5 in the world will make up for the difference. I expect the differences in the online service to be vastly different 1yr into the console life.

As devs traditionally get better with developing on the console hardware over time, they will do the same with distributed computing.

Gaikai? Sony have their own cloud services.

 

[2San]

The infrastructure they invested in will get used. Microsoft isn't going to just toss it aside. My predictions have been right on the money so far.

Like what? Feel free to provide multiple examples.

 

[Blearth]

You can do whatever you want.

I'm not arguing with someone who gets mad that PSN+ online component is behind a pay wall so they can beef up the network infrastructure only to support Microsoft doing the same thing.

I can go on with pro Kinetic, Sony will be anti-consumer like Microsoft, and on....

MS actually brings numbers to the table when they talk about online infrastructure improvement.

I'm pissed about PSN's online paywall because I have been a PlayStation owner since the PS1. I voted with my wallet and never purchased a paid-online console, yet Sony still screwed me.

 

[Mihael Mello Keehl]

They'll slowly reintroduce it.

The infrastructure they invested in will get used. Microsoft isn't going to just toss it aside. My predictions have been right on the money so far.

I even sarcastically said good for them when they said Sony isn't a threat because I previously said they'd change when they saw pre-orders. I still feel they will use the bait and switch method. It just won't be an instant flood.. More like trickles until you realize your there.

The always connected Kinetic is part of this plan. That part hasn't changed. Microsoft is making zero announcements to reassure us that this change isn't anything more than temporary. That is worrisome to me. It might not be to you, but it is to many of us. All signs point to tread lightly.

Yes but if they slowly reintroduce it by what year would it be on full steam ahead? It all sounds a bit too tinfoilish if I should describe it.

 

[lynux3]

So do you know if the cloud will able to provide real computing power and such, besides the standard uses for what used to be? Virtual and physical servers fall under the dedicated server moniker. Other companies use the tech as well.

I don't see the cloud being as significant as Microsoft makes it out, but its interesting none the less; however, I do think it is significant in the fact that you can meet demand a lot faster instead of provisioning new hardware (dedicated servers). Provisioning new hardware takes hours/days depending on how much you need.

The cloud is nothing new by any means and the idea has been around for years. People expecting their to be some kind of visual enhancement with offloading data to the cloud and then it being sent back to your screen are going to be disappointed, in my humble opinion.

Also, as far as I know, every company that has a cloud service explicitly separates dedicated vs. cloud servers. If there is one that doesn't then I am not aware of it.

 

[ElTorro]

It would be hilarious if a PS4 dev hires MS cloud space.

I can see that happen for multi-platform games. Would make much sense.

 

[pompidu]

So, what we know already of their investments

$400million NFL deal
$700 million in data center/cloud support
$1 billion in investments for development of first party/exclusives
A marketing campaign larger than the one for Kinect, so half a billion+
$??? in R&D costs for the Xbox One itself
__________________________________

$2.6 billion dollars + so far

Microsoft is paying out the ass this gen, I thought they wanted to be profitable this go around

they payed 400million dollars for nfl? so basically you can buy the nfl package similar to what direct tv has?

 

[GoofsterStud]

Yes but if they slowly reintroduce it by what year would it be on full steam ahead? It all sounds a bit too tinfoilish if I should describe it.

That all depends on what they think they could get away with legally and at what point the user-base is sufficient. I personally doubt it'd be full force tell close to the end of the Xbox One's life so when the Xbox Two is announced, people are use to it. Still it'll be felt along the way.

Have Sony announced their plans for dedicated servers or cloud stuff?

Gaikai was purchased for a reason. Gaikai provides a lot of well distributed dedicated servers accross the globe.


Still this is good news for Microsoft. Hopefully there cloud service improve. This is more about Microsoft's cloud service overall though. In the meantime I'll continue using Amazon.

 

[Sendou]

So, what we know already of their investments

$400million NFL deal
$700 million in data center/cloud support
$1 billion in investments for development of first party/exclusives
A marketing campaign larger than the one for Kinect, so half a billion+
$??? in R&D costs for the Xbox One itself
__________________________________

$2.6 billion dollars + so far

Microsoft is paying out the ass this gen, I thought they wanted to be profitable this go around

Well I can see NFL deal paying off. Exclusive games tend to be important too. If Xbox Live will continue being the best online gaming service behind paywall this generation then I can see that mattering too.

Good investments all around!

 

[Minions]

So, what we know already of their investments

$400million NFL deal
$700 million in data center/cloud support
$1 billion in investments for development of first party/exclusives
A marketing campaign larger than the one for Kinect, so half a billion+
$??? in R&D costs for the Xbox One itself
__________________________________

$2.6 billion dollars + so far

Microsoft is paying out the ass this gen, I thought they wanted to be profitable this go around

Let's not forget that they are probably tacking a bath on their cost to manufacture because of their yield problems due to ESRAM, so it is entirely possible they could be taking a loss on each console sold.

 

[ElTorro]

5000 servers to 300000 servers. I'm a bit sceptical that they'll be used exclusively for Xbox live.

Well, they won't reserve a fixed number, since the very purpose of a cloud infrastructure is to get rid of static allocations of physical infrastrucutre. But Azure is growing in general, and XBL seems to be a big "customer" in the near and far future.

I am pretty sure that all of this is not just about dedicated servers for online games, but also about media services and streaming. Microsoft obviously wants to go in that direction.

 

[Sephiroth_VII]

Sounds great. Online is the reason I'm getting an Xbox One over a PS4. People that champion PSPlus can enjoy the older games they get to rent for a bit if they want. I prefer smooth online play with the games I felt were worth a purchase.

Quick, medic! We've got a serious case of PSplus-envy-denial here!

 

[DragonSworne]

Anyone concern that much of this is going to be used to store and capture our personal data?

That's a lot of money for a gaming specific data center.

 

[Sethos]

Blearth standing up to the proud and noble Microsoft.

 

[ElTorro]

That's a lot of money for a gaming specific data center.

It won't be a gaming-specific data center. That would not make any sense at all, as you don't need a single big data center, but many data centers around the world to place your services as geographically close to your customers as possible.

They are expanding Azure in general, and XBL will run on many Azure data centers around the world along with all the other customers of Azure.

 

[Blearth]

Blearth standing up to the proud and noble Microsoft.

Uh-huh

I just find it odd that any news about MS is automatically met with extreme anger. Even if it's positive news.

 

[Kenka]

If I was a data center contractor I would be saying in my head "Time to fap !".

 

[sflufan]

Why are people allocating the entire $700 million data center investment solely to the Entertainment Division?

 

[Rebel Leader]

Uh-huh

I just find it odd that any news about MS is automatically met with extreme anger. Even if it's positive news.

A leopard can't change its spots

Why are people allocating the entire $700 million data center investment solely to the Entertainment Division?

How else will the wired story be true?

 

[Blearth]

A leopard can't change its spots

Good thing companies aren't leopards, then.

 

[Dead Prince]

Data mining