To be fair, the scratching was usually caused by fucking morons moving the console while the disc was spinning.
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Microsoft: Xbox One reversals haven't hurt us; "we're in an enviable position"
- Thread starter shinobi602
- Start date
To be fair, the scratching was usually caused by fucking morons moving the console while the disc was spinning.
Red Mage
Member
Not trying to argue, but I'm not entirely sure that's true. For my own part, I plan on getting a 360 soon, but will obviously be making sure to get a newer model if I buy used, and I never use my CC for PSN or the Eshop.
Kalamari
Member
A behemoth such as Microsoft is anything but agile and reactive, if they were they would be going head to head with Apple right now.
And it's interesting when they say they value consumer feedback, they should have payed more attention to consumers before they introduced anti-consumer DRM measures.
And it's interesting when they say they value consumer feedback, they should have payed more attention to consumers before they introduced anti-consumer DRM measures.
first no need to apologize .
MS XB1 Marketing will work if the XB1 is a product people want. it will bring mass awareness . it's still about the product and can It win the consumer and win there hearts and pockets. and honestly, no one ever knows . If any did they be the richest person on planet and I will be buying there stock . Same goes for PS4.
Other OS was a piracy related thing, It was certainly a shame to see it go away and I can understand calling that a mistake, though I think including it in the first place was the mistake, due to the Piracy ramifications and the need to later remove it.
The PSN Breach wasn't a mistake, it was a malicious act and they reacted incredibly well, AFAIK there have not been any credit card fraud related to this, Unlike the whole FIFA charges thing, which is still denied to this day.
Nintendo have certainly made mistakes such as the original Wii Strap was certainly not up to the standard it should have been, hence the replacements, this was of course handled quite well.
I appreciate the fact that they listened to consumers and reversed their decision. The only thing that bothers me is that it seems they are just waiting for consumers to change so they can go back to the original vision for Xbox One. If they want to regain trust they have to promise that they will never again try to implement mandatory online and restriction of used games like they did with Xbox One.
Micromegas
Member
Lol @ Microsoft - they just keep giving. I wonder when they'll drop the price $100, drop Kinect, throw in a free game. They just can't stop digging that hole deeper and deeper. I look forward to their next PR interview.
For every RRoD, I salute you, Microsoft. You've earned it.
For every RRoD, I salute you, Microsoft. You've earned it.
After the whole Orth debacle you would think they got the message.
Brilliant post.
Zatoichi's Cane
Member
The reversals don't hurt them, what hurt them was making such terrible decisions in the first place. From a PR standpoint they have been on the back foot since day 1, and even tough they've fixed al their bad policies the negativity around the system still seems to linger. The problem for them is that by the time they actually started pulling the 180s the majority of the hardcore console buyers had already decided on a ps4. I guess will see how enviable their position really is with the NPD numbers later this year.
Liberty4all
Banned
In the past? It was less than 30 days ago!!
Sony didn't just get a free pass after their launch fuck ups PS3 gen. It took YEARS for them to win many of the formerly faithful back. And eventually they did, not through empty words but through kickass game after kickass game. Action not hollow words.
In the first months following launch GAF ridiculed the PS3 just as bad as the Xbone, and Sony executives had to get the arrogance beat out of them. Their PR was JUST AS bad right after launch. Remember this:
http://youtu.be/_mdd7H1wQDM
Again it took years for many to trust Sony again.
Just in the past lol. You are way to forgiving. Microsoft is going to have to prove to me they aren't full of words. PR bullshit ain't going to win the day.
TechnicPuppet
Nothing! I said nothing!
Good post, I agree.
Consumers can react in many ways. They have a right not to buy a product and they also have a right to complain about it and tell other people not to buy it. This is exactly what happened. An apology isn't necessary but a guarantee that nothing like this will happen again in the future is.
No credit card information was lost. IIRC a Canadian government agency investigated and found no such evidence. If you have evidence to the contrary I'm not aware of it and would like a source as I like to be informed.
TechnicPuppet
Nothing! I said nothing!
MS haven't even launched the XB1 yet.
NullPointer
Member
I agree with this in that my real anti-consumer worry was collusion with publishers and Sony to make always-online, limited resale/used into a defacto standard for next gen.
Luckily Sony chose to stick to current gen policies which put both models up for choice among consumers. I guess we know how well MS thought that choice was going to work out for them.
LittleJohnny
Banned
If you read it carefully, he's talking about being reactive aka 180's and also delivering both digital and physical across all titles, that's just my interpretation but I'm sure everyone's going to run with the "Enviable" part and take it to whatever context keeps us on the Xbox One bash-fest.
"As a business, the minute we don’t listen to our customers attentively, and adapt and react in an appropriate way, then we would be in a dangerous place. I love the fact that we are reactive and agile in that way. We remain true to our vision – digitally and physically – and we are genuinely in an enviable position versus anyone else in being able to deliver that. I wouldn’t trade places with anybody.
Good post. If you don't like something, don't buy it. Simple as that.
TechnicPuppet
Nothing! I said nothing!
I'm not surprised since near enough every post you make is praising Sony or abusing MS and never constructively.
Liberty4all
Banned
er I should have said after E3 (was it 2005 or 2006 E3? I can't remember now) ... basically it was non stop bad press from when they announced the pricing on the thing straight through to a year or so after launch. Warhawk and the drop to $399 is when they really started to turn things around.
Salvor.Hardin
Banned
Took way too many posts for someone to finally get it right.
The MS hate on this board these days is comical.
Kazuma Kiryu
Member
You also forgot the ps3 chalkboard. Good times.
Pretty much. It's like a lot of people cant think and/or comprehend things for themselves anymore around here. The minute MS is in the thread title, the mind just goes numb.
Iacobellis
Junior Member
No other console I have owned scratched discs on its own when it was moved. The DVD drive in the 360 didn't have the four rubber pads to prevent the lens touching the disc.
Gee uh, maybe it's because Sony has done pretty much everything right for gamers since PS4 was announced and MS have been pissing off gamers and lying.
It's not just me buddy, look around. Don't blindside yourself.
TechnicPuppet
Nothing! I said nothing!
The point is MS never actually did the things that some people now hate them for. They said they were going to, suffered a backlash and reversed it.
dragonelite
Member
And drm can be included in by both platform holders because of piracy related issues.
The psn breach was an mistake because it happened same if it happens to live, companies this big should have their security up to standards.
CreateNowSleepLater
Member
Why don't they get it.
People do NOT want Kinect. Why is this so hard?
People do NOT want Kinect. Why is this so hard?
Well, since the XBone reveal, there are enough reasons why people are pissed off (including myself)
So you can defend them all you want (see everyone of your posts). But don't act like like there is no reason to dislike them.
I think a good distinction to make would actually be:
Announced it
Suffered a backlash
Told people they didn't understand or didn't want to go to the future
opened pre orders
reversed it.
There is a clear distinction, It was clear the vast Majority were against the policies and Microsoft simply said people did not understand, they only changed there mind after pre orders were not going well.
It's a very important distinction.
KoopaTheCasual
Junior Member
I don't think you understand what that word means. Bias means that we would be absolving Sony of any recent negative news, policies, or statements. The last "negative" thing Sony did was declare multiplayer would be pay-walled, with the reasoning to match the robust online gaming experience offered on competing platforms (dedicated servers). Even that piece of news was met with a fair share of hostility. That was months ago. Since then, Sony has been almost completely free of missteps. So much so that people are actually beginning to get suspicious, and waiting for the day Sony drops bad news. But there simply is no bad news to drop.
There is no Sony "bias". MS just gives a lot more opportunities to heckle and jeer at. If you can't understand the difference, I honestly don't know what to tell you.
EDIT: I hope people aren't honestly arguing for some perverse "False Equivalence" to be enforced here on GAF. This ain't CNN.
I honestly don't see what you're getting at. They said those things because that's what they were planning. I'm not sure you should be praising them for switching gears after getting rejected.
Enordash
Member
Why is the guarantee even necessary? If you are so worried that Microsoft is an evil corporation, don't buy the X1. This isn't hard.
TechnicPuppet
Nothing! I said nothing!
Gee uh that doesn't mean your contributions to threads need to be limited to MS disgusting, Sony GREAT.
The world isn't black & white.
There is a clear distinction between invasive and non-invasive DRM, also removing Other-OS is not DRM, it is an anti-piracy measure. DRM is a type of anti-Piracy measure but not all anti-Piracy measures are DRM.
if it happens to live? missing funds from FIFA players says it is currently happening right now on the XBL platform. Any system can be hacked.
EDIT:
Just used some of my Google-fu it seems there are results for the fifa unauthorized charges from 2011-2013, so it is certainly not being dealt with uickly
Are you kidding me my man.Did you forget how many flip flop different messages we got? Did you forgot no one knew what the hell was going on from each of there executives giving different detail messages every other day. to a point were they end up shutting everyone from media with no round table etc and Did you forget how press was upset about it?
they were anything but forthcoming
If you don't like criticism, ignore it. Simple as that.
Shitty arguments go both ways...
I'll state my opinion whenever I want thank you very much. It it makes you mad then #dealwithit
This is a gaming forum. If you don't like to hear people's feelings towards companies in the gaming industry then maybe this forum isn't for you...
Prince Vultan
Banned
"Attempted murder? Now honestly, what is that? Do they give a Nobel prize for attempted chemistry? Do they?"
We have a winner here!
And obviously preorders are showing that. But what does that has to do with discussions in a gaming forum like this one?
Nice post. The previous Xbox One policies were not forced upon anyone. You could just not buy it. It wasn't on sale, it wasn't in your hands, and they had just told you all about it, 6 months before it was going to launch. It was a option that you didn't have to chose if you didn't want it.
I'd argue otherwise, particularly on the transparency bit. This is admittedly totally speculative, but I seriously wonder whether any of the DRM issues would have come to light had they not found their way to the rumor mill from the get-go. If people had never gotten wind of the always-online, used games restrictions and what-not, how do we know MS would have ever let that information come to light if not compelled to reveal it? And even when pushed, they tried to give us things like "the power of the cloud" nonsense that folks saw for what it really was right away. So their message has hardly been transparent, and that's a big part of the problem of their public image, why people are so ready to call out MS' PR folks on everything they say.
Debatable on the grounds of whether it was truly listening to consumer feedback for the sake of truly listening to feedback, or if it was simply a reaction to pre-order numbers. But that's well-worn territory.
Just to make something clear, I don't realistically expect MS to actually apologize for anything, it was simply my idea of an example of what MS could do differently to break the circle of "rep says something, everyone calls him out."
And the point I was trying to make in my previous post was that, there's more to the whole issue than just consumer choice here and now - it's the establishment of precedent. The precedent that consumers will come to accept these kinds of policies - and to take that even further, the precedent that MS could implement these policies again in the future, or in some other form. If people come to accept that, it then establishes precedent that other companies can get away with the same thing. That is what folks are afraid of - surely you recall the popular narrative of "Well Sony's gonna have their own DRM too, just wait and see" leading up to E3 - that if one can get away with it, others will follow, all at the consumer's detriment. We've already got a shining example of just that with Sony now requiring PS+ for online play. (And here I bet you thought I was giving Sony a free pass, heh)
It's consumer vigilance. Sometimes it's about more than just "don't buy it if you don't like it," it's about stopping a bad thing before it can spiral out of control.
And for what it's worth, by this point I wont harp on anyone for buying an Xbone. Sure, you like the games or XBLG or the controller or whatever, go ahead and get one. At this point, the device is absolutely fine, even if I personally don't particularly care for it myself. But that doesn't mean I, and others, won't call out MS reps when they try to peddle their bullshit message again.
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