SapientWolf
Trucker Sexologist
They're the exception rather than the rule though. This ain't exactly a nation of bodybuilders.Crunched said:
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My rant on overweight justification in America
- Thread starter ScOULaris
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A couple of things that I wanna say...
1) Forget BMI. Everyone who's thought about it for even one second can figure out why BMI is outdated and ridiculous. It is simply height vs weight, not taking body composition into account whatsoever. Like plenty of people have said, someone who is well-muscled can easily be in the overweight category despite having very low body fat. They don't have to be a bodybuilder either. I was just slightly encroaching on the overweight category according to the BMI scale when I was 6'1'' and 195 pounds with 7-8% body fat.
2) The "girls are constantly pressured to look like an impossible ideal" argument is utter tripe. Impossible ideal? The models and celebrities that we see everywhere represent the "ideal" in varying degrees, and they're real people. There goes the "impossible" theory. Just go to a college town to see how many beautiful women there are around, and you'll quickly rethink the claim that looking fit with attractive features is anywhere near impossible. Even ignoring that part of the argument, so what if models are beautiful and in shape? Some people are better looking than others. Do little league baseball players have too much pressure to be on the level of Derek Jeter? Do young boys feel pressured to be jacked and lean like male models and action movie stars? Do you constantly feel inadequate because your boss makes more money than you? No. Some people become obsessive about looking their best while others don't. Don't blame the media or beautiful/successful/in-shape people for the insecurities of other people.
3) There are plus-sized female models but no plus-sized male models. I'm not sure what that means, but I'm pretty sure it's significant in some way.
1) Forget BMI. Everyone who's thought about it for even one second can figure out why BMI is outdated and ridiculous. It is simply height vs weight, not taking body composition into account whatsoever. Like plenty of people have said, someone who is well-muscled can easily be in the overweight category despite having very low body fat. They don't have to be a bodybuilder either. I was just slightly encroaching on the overweight category according to the BMI scale when I was 6'1'' and 195 pounds with 7-8% body fat.
2) The "girls are constantly pressured to look like an impossible ideal" argument is utter tripe. Impossible ideal? The models and celebrities that we see everywhere represent the "ideal" in varying degrees, and they're real people. There goes the "impossible" theory. Just go to a college town to see how many beautiful women there are around, and you'll quickly rethink the claim that looking fit with attractive features is anywhere near impossible. Even ignoring that part of the argument, so what if models are beautiful and in shape? Some people are better looking than others. Do little league baseball players have too much pressure to be on the level of Derek Jeter? Do young boys feel pressured to be jacked and lean like male models and action movie stars? Do you constantly feel inadequate because your boss makes more money than you? No. Some people become obsessive about looking their best while others don't. Don't blame the media or beautiful/successful/in-shape people for the insecurities of other people.
3) There are plus-sized female models but no plus-sized male models. I'm not sure what that means, but I'm pretty sure it's significant in some way.
HeadlessRoland
Banned
True that, there are actually a good number of men who will fuck an obese chick. I wonder how many attractive chicks are down to fuck an obese man (assuming that they are not obese themselves)?
AbsoluteZero
Banned
Yoritomo said:
Yeah, I'll be the first to admit I'm fat but when standing my stomach is pretty flat, it's only when I'm sitting that it looks like I have any kind of gut.
Most of the time I fit into XL shirts with the occasional need to go to XXL depending on brand and cut.
José Mourinho
cocknose
I thought BMI was actually a good indicator when done correctly by a doctor. Not just the online effort were you stick in in height, weight, gender and age.
neutralgamer02
Member
lol at people disputing the BMI.
How about something easier. If you have a big gut or rolls of fat, you are probably are overweight. If you can't walk up a flight of stairs without breathing heavily, you are probably out of shape. Hopefully you change your diet.
How about something easier. If you have a big gut or rolls of fat, you are probably are overweight. If you can't walk up a flight of stairs without breathing heavily, you are probably out of shape. Hopefully you change your diet.
HeadlessRoland
Banned
Kylehimself said:
The problem is the vast diversity in the shapes and metabolic rates of humans. A simple equation cannot account for this so you will get some skewed results.
José Mourinho
cocknose
And oh yeah, good thread OP. Sums up my thoughts exactly.ScOULaris said:
I'm no expert so I could be talking shit. But I thought when it was done properly by Drs and what have you, they done a lot more in depth tests.HeadlessRoland said:
milkyjay20
Member
first off, don't even act like you care about these people. you guys just don't want to see them. be honest.
the obesity epidemic is merely a symptom of just how decadent this country has become. everybody is a detriment to the social order in some capacity, not just fat people. most people just take and take without giving back. and if you contribute nothing beyond your day job, then you're worthless to society and should be taxed more.
except that's wrong. even though the government makes the grass grow, they can't fix everything. taxing people based on their lifestyle is wrong, so all these vice taxes are ridiculous. no one should get any special treatment just because they met some notion of "good." as for being a strain on healthcare, there's other ways to get sick beyond getting fat, and some of the time, it's based on personal choice. and i know it's hard getting over the idea of *gasp* having to pay for someone else, but that's just how it works.
wanting to look good isn't shallow, but being intolerant of others just because of the way they look is.
the real solution, like most things, is education and a dose of reality. if you're close to somebody who's reaching near the obese level, don't let them deny it. tell them that they're putting their life in jeopardy, and tell them how to fix it. don't wait for the government to come save the day, as that is only another symptom of decadence. you're on your own in this world. the government will not and cannot stop people getting fat or get people to stop smoking or make everyone love each other; that's not even the function of government. only society itself can fix these problems.
the obesity epidemic is merely a symptom of just how decadent this country has become. everybody is a detriment to the social order in some capacity, not just fat people. most people just take and take without giving back. and if you contribute nothing beyond your day job, then you're worthless to society and should be taxed more.
except that's wrong. even though the government makes the grass grow, they can't fix everything. taxing people based on their lifestyle is wrong, so all these vice taxes are ridiculous. no one should get any special treatment just because they met some notion of "good." as for being a strain on healthcare, there's other ways to get sick beyond getting fat, and some of the time, it's based on personal choice. and i know it's hard getting over the idea of *gasp* having to pay for someone else, but that's just how it works.
wanting to look good isn't shallow, but being intolerant of others just because of the way they look is.
the real solution, like most things, is education and a dose of reality. if you're close to somebody who's reaching near the obese level, don't let them deny it. tell them that they're putting their life in jeopardy, and tell them how to fix it. don't wait for the government to come save the day, as that is only another symptom of decadence. you're on your own in this world. the government will not and cannot stop people getting fat or get people to stop smoking or make everyone love each other; that's not even the function of government. only society itself can fix these problems.
MrToughPants
Brian Burke punched my mom
Crunched said:
30.0 to be exact!
You have to understand that my cousin's comment didn't mean that there were obese people everywhere. Where he's from (Italy) the average person is thin and healthy looking. We laugh about the Aguilera picture because she used to be hotter, but it's not like she's huge by our standards. To an Italian coming to America for the first time, however, someone Christina's size looks like a fat slob. Obese people look like something out of science fiction to them.Zwei said:oh
WanderingWind
Mecklemore Is My Favorite Wrapper
Bullshit. It's how diets work. If you're not on it, you're not on it. Telling people it's okay to cheat on a diet because, "Hey, you're only human" is the same mindset that causes people to get enormous in the first place.Bealost said:
Painting a diet that makes you cut out garbage foods in favor of fruits, veggies and meat as super strict is exactly why people claim "diets don't work." It's not super strict. It's just a diet. It's great that some believe that eating a salad once a week constitutes a diet, but it's not doing anything for them. You said "healthy choices" like they're outside of the fruits, veggies and meat of a paleo diet. Those are healthy choices and sticking to them will cause you to lose weight. Period.
And until somebody can show me science that the above choices are unhealthy, you're darn right I'll be suggesting it to people who want to lose weight. Saying that it's okay to eat a cookie every now and again is absolutely true. But not if you're serious about losing weight.
Pachterballs
Banned
Stet said:
I'd like you to find me an example of this. People know what healthy weight is. Duh. And they know what overweight is too.
WanderingWind said:
Knowing your BMR is key!
I could eat 2000 calories a day of fruits and veggies and lean meats and still gain fat. I could eat 1200 calories a day of snack cakes and lose fat ( i would never do this, just making a point). Its all about caloric intake. Eat over maintenance, not matter what it is, YOU WILL GAIN FAT. PERIOD!
Everyone should know their BMR/RMR. You want to lose fat? Eat under your BMR. Its that simple.
Protein =/= carbs =/= fatcameltoe said:
Not all calories are equal.
It's not as simple as calories in vs calories out. It's about eating nutritiously dense foods.
If I am lifting 5 reps at 80% of my max, and eating a bit over "maintenance" (which is ALWAYS imprecise), those calories will go toward muscle building and repair.
This is why body measurements and body fat tests are important. Plateaus for low carb diets are often mistaken for stalled fat loss, when in fact they're due to an increase in lean tissue.
All Hail C-Webb
Hailing from the Chill-Web
ScOULaris said:
Bullshit on the thin and healthy.
If you look at much of the fashion that comes out of Europe, it's for the scrawny and weak, not thin and healthy.
I can't speak for all of Europe, but have you been to Italy? I'm not lying or exaggerating when I say that most people look thin and healthy. Not malnourished or scrawny, although of course everyone's definition of "too thin" is different as it is with "too fat."All Hail C-Webb said:
HisshouBuraiKen
Member
I just read that fat because you're stupid site, holy shit that was funny
I am a big fatbody because I eat too much damn food. It's like fat chicks in party hats again! Made my day.
I am a big fatbody because I eat too much damn food. It's like fat chicks in party hats again! Made my day.
All Hail C-Webb
Hailing from the Chill-Web
ScOULaris said:
I haven't been to Italy, but the clothing sold/designed there speaks volumes.
If you have any semblance of an upper body, it doesn't fit, even if it's loose around the stomach/waist.
London is pretty bad too. I need to buy at least XL (often XXL) over there, when I can comfortably fit into Large in the US.
To go more on topic with the first post: Just seeing a fat/obese person doesn't bother me in the slightest. It's their choice, and if they're fine with it, so be it. If I'm interacting with someone though, I will be extremely annoyed if they can't keep up, or use their weight as an excuse not to do something. I hate being stuck behind someone huge going up the stairs, and they're going slow as fuck, and are too big to get around. I'll also get slightly queasy seeing an obese person stuff their face. Thick girls are fine though, anyone hating needs to try it first.
Crunched said:
There are differences in calorie sources in that some are more nutritious than others (they have more nutrients) and are therefore the preferred ones for us to eat. Aside from a minuscule difference in the thermogenic effect (the energy used to digest said food). Calories are calories. I'm not saying you can live off 2000 K cal of cookies for the rest of your life.
Edit:: To clarify you would not get nearly enough nutrients (things your body requires but can't produce itself) from eating things like cookies. But you wouldn't starve to death either. You would die from say... scurvy or insert another vitamin/mineral deficiency.
I didn't think responding in another post would be beneficial so I threw the edit up instead.
Crunched said:
The term "healthy eating" is relative. There are people that still think that loads of juice and low fat starches are excellent foods to base a diet on, and that saturated fats are bad. Science be damned, it's what people think.
You're not doing anyone a favor by using blame. Educating people on "healthy foods" and habits has been tried and it failed miserably. There's more to it than that. If one of the hypotheses on obesity, food reward, turns out to be true, you can easily make people fat with vegetables, meat, and some flavor enhancers (glutamate, sweet tastes, spices, texture, temperature) while bland tasteless starches, meat, or vegetables cannot.
Just because a "healthy diet" works for you doesn't mean it works for everyone. Keep in mind our gene pool is largely evolved against simple, limited foods. Modern food probably has unpredictable and inconsistent results on different genes. With the proper research this could be understood and things that express otherwise dormant behavior (like metabolic syndrome) could be avoided.
Edit: Actually you CAN go into chemical withdrawal. They have brain scans of obese people having abnormal dopamine surges when they eat fast food.
Italian-Canadian here.
I try to stuff my face with dual double big macs, two steaks every monday and wednesdays, pasta dishes tuesedays and thursdays, and 3 eggs with bread and such every morning with continuous snacking all day and I can't seem to break 180 pounds (I'm 6'2). I would like a more "meatier" frame, and I work out three times a week, but I can't seem to get the right size I want.
Genetics has ALOT to do with it. Everyone in my family is skinny, and we consume enough food to feed the average family for a week every day.
I try to stuff my face with dual double big macs, two steaks every monday and wednesdays, pasta dishes tuesedays and thursdays, and 3 eggs with bread and such every morning with continuous snacking all day and I can't seem to break 180 pounds (I'm 6'2). I would like a more "meatier" frame, and I work out three times a week, but I can't seem to get the right size I want.
Genetics has ALOT to do with it. Everyone in my family is skinny, and we consume enough food to feed the average family for a week every day.
Trent Strong
Banned
ezrarh said:
No, because I assume he's just talking about weight and not health.
HarryHengst
Member
Drink a gallon of milk a day for a few weeks besides eating everything you normally do. If you still cant get more bodyweight you should see a doctor.DrPirate said:
HeadlessRoland
Banned
Kylehimself said:
The only thing a doctor doing it is going to chance is the accuracy of the measurements. But accuracy of the measurements isn't why BMI is far from a good way to determine the ideals except in the broad strokes. Its that a vast array of metabolic rates and frames for humans differs so wildly. And BMI is not taking these fairly subjective factors into account.
Obviously it is going to give you some indication of the extremes of any norm, but thats about it. Figuring out your ideal weight is going to be relying heavily on your being aware of the state of your body. I know my ideal is 140 because my body resists gaining and holding any weight above that, and I have consumed a gallon of whole milk every day or two for a good period of time and only gained a few pounds that instantly evaporated.
Your body will let you know you just have to cultivate the awareness to listen.
milkyjay20 said:
Obviously you did not read the thread for you would know how silly it is to challenge us to "Be honest." Thread is jam packed with honesty and the reasons for disliking the obese and obesity.
Enosh
Member
I don't know if this falls under the rules of acceptable bumping or not (sorry if it doesn't), but
gz to the OP, you made it on cracked! (second link under point 2) ^^
http://www.cracked.com/article_1946...at-make-you-wrong-more-than-you-think_p2.html
gz to the OP, you made it on cracked! (second link under point 2) ^^
http://www.cracked.com/article_1946...at-make-you-wrong-more-than-you-think_p2.html
MilesWebber
Member
BURN!
SouthernDragon
Member
Internet famous!
Eh, I don't have any issues what-so-ever with overweight people. The only issues I have are when people claim to diet and exercise, but really they cheat on the diet all the time and working out equates to getting sweaty and out of breath. Or the infamous walking on the treadmill for 30 minutes.
vas_a_morir
Banned
The OP is such an ignorant jerk that other web sites are writing about it. That's classic.
freenudemacusers
Member
Numeric sizes are irrelevant if we are talking about the cut of a garment. Maybe stuff like Raf Simons or Dior Homme (not so much anymore in actual production vs a few years ago) is built for thin men, but is that the norm? No. Dolce runways look like this:All Hail C-Webb said:
what a waifish stickman.
and omg at this bump. hi internets!
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
I find it hilarious how if you post something stupid enough on GAF, professional writers and organizations will now mock you.Enosh said:
macuser1of5 said:Numeric sizes are irrelevant if we are talking about the cut of a garment. Maybe stuff like Raf Simons or Dior Homme (not so much anymore in actual production vs a few years ago) is built for thin men, but is that the norm? No. Dolce runways look like this:
what a waifish stickman.
and omg at this bump. hi internets!
I'll comment on my experience with Italy. There were a few over weight people there, mostly older women, but not that many of them. Italy, particularly Rome, was full of the most stylish, best dressed people I've seen assembled anywhere in my life. Tourists REALLY stood out.
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