Phoenix Fang
Banned
The only stage that impressed me in NG3 was day 5 area minus the boss.
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Ninja Gaiden 3 |OT| Ninja Dog Revengeance
- Thread starter AAK
- Start date
The only stage that impressed me in NG3 was day 5 area minus the boss.
ViewtifulJC
Banned
I think your username really sums up the feel of the levels in NG3, just from a setting point of view. NG2 had a lot of visually interesting places as you were globe-trotting, from Neo-Tokyo to the beautiful Hayabusa castle, the air fortress, the water temple, South American rain forest...and then there's that big descent into Hell, the shit just seems to get crazier and crazier. Like that forest with the blue fog that enemies sneak out of, or the rivers of blood, or even that last section before the final boss where it's completely dark except the white-outlined paths. Even when it's linear as all get out, it made the stakes feel higher, and I was more interested in the whole thing. Once you got to the last three boss fights, it felt like this was some world-saving shit. It was like every video game's final Hell stage got thrown in here.
NG3, in comparison, had you galloping about a generic cityscape in its final level, fighting all the same enemies you've been mashing buttons against for the last 8 hours, until you do this lame final boss fight against...whatever the fuck that thing is that nobody in the game seemed to care about before or after it's killed.
NG2 finale felt like the end of a big film trilogy, with the production values to show for it. NG3 felt like a TV season finale, so small and lacking in scale or grandeur.
Is the install option PS3 broke or a known fault? I found it b4 bed last night when got the update and the dlc pack went to play it tonight and it ran like treacle! Uninstalled it now but having to redownload the patch as its tagged to it. Love the game but if the install fecks it up it's bloody stupid!
Kai Dracon
Writing a dinosaur space opera symphony
My gaming instincts want to tell me NG3's problems are fifty percent: it's a lower budget, smaller scale game than NG1 or 2 and fifty percent: their attempt at a "realistic" art style didn't work out as well as it seems to be working in DOA5.
The art in NG3 is definitely trying to be less plastic, and dare I say it, based more around western games' portrayal of cities, deserts, jungles, and a touch of Mass Effect high tech labs. Unfortunately, combined with what looks like a low art and asset budget (DOA5 looks A LOT BETTER even with the little we've seen) it comes off as under-developed and generic.
The environments in NG1 and 2 are a bit sterile and shiny but they're actually well designed in terms of having interesting layouts and memorable locations, with some impressive vistas to frame the up close action with a sense of scale. NG3 feels like there's no scale at all and the world around you never extends further than the buildings or structure immediately bordering your available area of movement.
For all the shitting on Team Ninja going on (gamers love to dogpile), I've seen this shit before. It says "they were given no budget and possibly half the development cycle required".
I think had they just stuck directly to the template of NGII and not try to really redesign anything, they could have made a serviceable sequel that didn't feel as if it had the guts ripped out. But the disaster for this game feels like a confluence of the worst things ever: no budget, short dev cycle, mandate to westernize the art direction, mandate to throw out most of the game systems and simplify it.
Does that count when the majority of the Aesthetic is not only from NG2, but it was even in NG1?
You know, when I finished playing, I tried to wrack my brain for anything that NG3 did better than NG2, and I honestly couldn't think of anything, which is astounding to me. Itagaki was't a strong dev outside of action gameplay. He should have atleast been able to weave a better story than him, or better visuals or something. But no, I don't think there is a single thing in NG3 that surpasses NGB or 2
ViewtifulJC
Banned
I had my own theories about how NG2 ended up the way it was, but I think Itagaki just kinda accepted everything the team came up with.
"Oh hey, my 7-year old son came up with a monster, he's got like this cannon for an arm, and uh...a chainsaw on the other one!"
"Yeah, whatever, put it in the game"
Like they asked all the artists to come up with a cool Hell area, and they decided they just didn't want to get rid of any of them.
http://i.imgur.com/fMFr0.jpg
So they are all in the game. There's no real sense of balance or thoughtfulness put into many of the game's encounters, so the game doesn't run like the clockwork precision of NGB. There's half a dozen off-screen projectile enemies, a 100 ninja staircase battle with 8 fps gameplay or some shit, there's a giant armadillo that comes out of fucking nowhere and straight up kills you if you don't, like, block the entire explosion with your sword?
Just a lot of oddball gameplay decisions, like they had a lot of ideas but they didn't have the means to do 'em correctly. Maybe they spent too much money on the art, maybe maybe the Q&A time was cut short, maybe Itagaki saw the writing on the wall and was just on his way out, maybe maybe maybe. The bottom line is that NG2 didn't get nearly the amount of polish and care it should have gotten, so it remains a great game hidden under a huge nasty pile of poorly-implemented/thought out gameplay decisions and performance issues.
NG3 was like..."Ok, let's just take out everything and build up. What can we add to NG3 to make it appeal more to Western audiences?"
*awkward silence*
"....QTES!"
"More cutscenes!"
"Yes, good, good, anything else?"
*awkward silence*
"...online multiplayer?"
I like...
...
...fuck, I can't even think of anything. There's nothing about NG3 I don't prefer over NG1/2. And I don't even like 2 that much.
Phoenix Fang
Banned
I think that was the reason I found it impressive.
Robot Pants
Member
NG2 story is terrible, but the final scene in the katana graveyard, with Ryu paying his respect to Genshin and walking away is amazing. The only cutscene that I never skipped.
NG3
Ryu: Hey Imma take ur sword and kill off all ur clan trying to protect u from being graverobbed lolkthxbye
*near end of game*
Lol, ur sword got broke, cheap piece of shit. oh wellz, atleast I have mah Dragon Sword back nao lolololol.
Rhazer Fusion
Member
Beat the entire game and I liked it despite the dismal reviews and negativity. Overall, I think it is a good game. A "3"?? Seriously? That's a joke. Some of the action scenes and settings are the most memorable in the series. Online is actually quite a bit of fun also which really surprised me since I really don't play games online. Yes, there are alot of things missing from the previous NG's which is disappointing, but the fighting engine imho is still very solid, fun and better than most action games that I can think of. The cutting feels so...satisfying to me lol. I do not consider this a "terrible" Ninja Gaiden, but a very different or altered Ninja Gaiden. I did notice that it seems like Ryu cannot dash while he is slashing which is really throwing me off on Mentor difficulty. I think he was able to do that in NG2. Not sure about NG1 though. Also, the Falcon Talons are awesome. So much fun.
Mentor in NG3 is harder than Mentor in both NG1 and NG2 imo since you do not have potions and power ups to rely on. Also, I do notice some slow down at some parts which do seem to cause interference with inputs once in a while for me. Anyone who said this game was too easy obviously was trying Ninja Dog. Pressing the square button will get you through the entire game with little to no effort? What a load of crap.
Mentor in NG3 is harder than Mentor in both NG1 and NG2 imo since you do not have potions and power ups to rely on. Also, I do notice some slow down at some parts which do seem to cause interference with inputs once in a while for me. Anyone who said this game was too easy obviously was trying Ninja Dog. Pressing the square button will get you through the entire game with little to no effort? What a load of crap.
Fantastic post dude
PepperJack
Banned
Playing on hard mode after normal. Quite the difference.
Not just more waves/slightly different enemies, but also more aggressive attack patterns.
Steel on bone actually comes in handy. Also fighting the red Alchemist is one of my favorite boss fights in any NG game so far.
Playing with claws is really fun, much better than falcon talons from NG2 (which I hardly used). The SOB with claws is extremely satisfying. The game does get a bit repetitive when they start throwing too many waves at you, but the fighting engine is so solid that I don't mind.
I'm hoping they have some mega DLC pack for ~$10 that includes more weapons and all the new trials (in a month or two). I still think DLC pack 1 should have been totally free.
Not just more waves/slightly different enemies, but also more aggressive attack patterns.
Steel on bone actually comes in handy. Also fighting the red Alchemist is one of my favorite boss fights in any NG game so far.
Playing with claws is really fun, much better than falcon talons from NG2 (which I hardly used). The SOB with claws is extremely satisfying. The game does get a bit repetitive when they start throwing too many waves at you, but the fighting engine is so solid that I don't mind.
I'm hoping they have some mega DLC pack for ~$10 that includes more weapons and all the new trials (in a month or two). I still think DLC pack 1 should have been totally free.
Wait till later in the game where EVERYBODY starts trying to grab you as soon as you press a button.
The Antitype
Banned
This is totally off topic, but did using a Lives of a Thousand Gods in Ninja Gaiden Black extend your life as well as fill it? Or just extend it?
a Master Ninja
Member
Extend and fill.
The Antitype
Banned
That's what I though, thanks. I just couldn't remember if it was in Black, or if it was one of the little tweaks they made to make NG2 a little easier.
The Antitype
Banned
actually it only extends, no fill. i'm playing black right now.
God damnit, now I'm confused.
ViewtifulJC
Banned
I would have swore it fills up in NGB, but I guess that's just vanilla NG1. It was like a bootleg Great Spirit Elixer, you just hold on to them until you was in need of health, then use the Thousand Gods. Not a big fan of the only extend change. If that's all it does, what's the point of keeping it in the inventory? Just have it increase my health instantly if you gonna take that strategy away.
"Ah, so just take away all the inventory/depth/strategy. Good idea, ViewtifulJC"
And thus, NG3 was born
"Ah, so just take away all the inventory/depth/strategy. Good idea, ViewtifulJC"
And thus, NG3 was born
The Antitype
Banned
I definitely used that tactic in NG1 as well.
I'm thinking of DLing NGB on Xbox Live. Do you get the mission mode (hurricane packs) and costumes unlocked up front, or do you have to beat the game first like in the retail copy?>
a Master Ninja
Member
Ah fuck, you're right. I last played NG2.actually it only extends, no fill. i'm playing black right now.
akilshohen
Member
I believe its beat the game first, and hurricane pack had things that weren't in NGB.
ViewtifulJC
Banned
Sigma is definitely only extends, I played that before NG3. I thought that was another one of Hayashit's unnecessary changes, but apparently it's the same in NGB as well.
The Antitype
Banned
Speaking of changes to NGB, I seem to remember a pretty heavy nerf of the flying swallow. Like a really pronounced pause after the attack, that prevented me from zipping back and forth with it like I did in NG.
Might be skewed memory though.
Might be skewed memory though.
ViewtifulJC
Banned
I remember some of the enemies would straight up counter it(the army guys would catch you on their bayonets) or enemies/bosses straight up dodged it more often then vanilla. Although that might just be the harder difficulties.
The Antitype
Banned
I remember hating those changes. Flying swallow is basically the only way to cross the gap quickly and give the player some kiting/crowd control ability.
At least, the only consistently effective way that I found.
ViewtifulJC
Banned
It's still pretty damn effective and it's a decent approach for a single enemy, just maybe not the godslayer it used to be. It's really good in certain situations, like you're in the middle of a nasty group, you can FS towards the enemies on the outskirt to improve your situation.
It still owns Alma for free, too.
It still owns Alma for free, too.
The Antitype
Banned
Yeah, I just remember NGB turning some of my favorite multiple-foe battles into needless frustrating BS.
The Spider Ninjas were so fun to fight in NG, and then in NGB, it seems like they used incendiary grenades even more, could (and WOULD) tag you mid-dodge, interrupt combos, etc.
I just started saying 'fuck it' and rolling around like an idiot, hitting a dude once or twice, move on to the next guy, repeat, just cause there was NO WAY they were actually going to let you finish a full combo.
Oh, and god forbid you stepped 10 feet away from the group, cause they just take their ball and go home, disappearing into a cloud of smoke.
ARGH... such highs and lows in that game (my memories are flooding back now).
The Spider Ninjas were so fun to fight in NG, and then in NGB, it seems like they used incendiary grenades even more, could (and WOULD) tag you mid-dodge, interrupt combos, etc.
I just started saying 'fuck it' and rolling around like an idiot, hitting a dude once or twice, move on to the next guy, repeat, just cause there was NO WAY they were actually going to let you finish a full combo.
Oh, and god forbid you stepped 10 feet away from the group, cause they just take their ball and go home, disappearing into a cloud of smoke.
ARGH... such highs and lows in that game (my memories are flooding back now).
ViewtifulJC
Banned
The Spider Ninjas are still fun, you just have to tackle them in a different way. Also, it's so easy to abuse the invincibility frames on the roll. The timer for when the shurikens explode after they hit you is always the same, so you can time your roll to avoid damage. It also doesn't effect you during a quick UT or Izuna Drop.
The Antitype
Banned
Yeah, but having 2.5 seconds to suck in some essence and unleash a UT without being interrupted is another matter entirely.
It also didn't help that the timing window for counter-attacks in Black was MUCH tighter than it was in Ninja Gaiden 2.
I played the hell out of Ninja Gaiden Black, really enjoyed it for the most part, I just felt some elements of the game were made more 'challenging' (I call it cheap) when they didn't need to be. There were plenty of incredibly easy enemy types that could have been beefed up.
Heh, I dunno about any of that. After busting my fingers on NG2 mentor for the last week even black spiders now seem hilariously easy. If the counter timing was looser and enemies were any less aggressive I don't think any challenge would remain.
My go-to solution for IS in both games is actually a simple guillotine throw. You get plenty of i-frames to clear it and gives you more breathing room.
My go-to solution for IS in both games is actually a simple guillotine throw. You get plenty of i-frames to clear it and gives you more breathing room.
riceandbeans
Member
I'm thinking about renting this, but I'm not even sure it's worth a rental at this point. How bad is the whole steel-on-bones zoom in thing and can I avoid it? It's my biggest problem with the game and drives me fucking nuts how it has to zoom in for a QTE after you kill a random enemy. I can put up with the bullshit AI, stupid story, and ridiculous bosses but if the game is gonna fuck up the combat by zooming in every 5 seconds, I'm not even gonna bother.
You can't avoid it and the game throws mountains of generic fodder infantry at you, so you'll be chaining sob attacks through masses of idiots the entire game
Have fun
The Antitype
Banned
So I bit the bullet and bought Ninja Gaiden Black on the marketplace.
I forgot that I have to play through on normal before unlocking the real difficulties. So I ran through the first 4 stages in like an hour (I still found all the items though).
And then I ran into the Spider ninjas. And fine, I got through them, I made it into the temple, but it wasn't fun at all. I mean, I would literally be attacking one of them, and MID-COMBO ANIMATION, one of their buddies could come up behind me and pull of their throw/stabby move.
That, and the fact that there are always 3 incendiary grenades within a foot of me at any given time in the fight... when they aren't actually attached me, usually the result of being thrown off screen and nailing me mid dodge-roll or jump.
Ok, that rant is over.
I think I actually prefer the combat in Ninja Gaiden 2. The actual staging of the encounters and the combinations of enemies (and the design of the enemies in general) is definitely better in Black. But the actual pace of the combat, the greater number of moves at your disposal, feels better in NG2 to me.
I actually found myself missing some of the DS combos from Black, thinking "ARGH, this is the exact moment for that move, if only I had it". (Pretty much any of the combos that start with -->XX)
Anyway, those minor complaints aside, this is still probably the best $15 I've spent on Xbox Live in awhile. I'm gonna hop back in after dinner.
I forgot that I have to play through on normal before unlocking the real difficulties. So I ran through the first 4 stages in like an hour (I still found all the items though).
And then I ran into the Spider ninjas. And fine, I got through them, I made it into the temple, but it wasn't fun at all. I mean, I would literally be attacking one of them, and MID-COMBO ANIMATION, one of their buddies could come up behind me and pull of their throw/stabby move.
That, and the fact that there are always 3 incendiary grenades within a foot of me at any given time in the fight... when they aren't actually attached me, usually the result of being thrown off screen and nailing me mid dodge-roll or jump.
Ok, that rant is over.
I think I actually prefer the combat in Ninja Gaiden 2. The actual staging of the encounters and the combinations of enemies (and the design of the enemies in general) is definitely better in Black. But the actual pace of the combat, the greater number of moves at your disposal, feels better in NG2 to me.
I actually found myself missing some of the DS combos from Black, thinking "ARGH, this is the exact moment for that move, if only I had it". (Pretty much any of the combos that start with -->XX)
Anyway, those minor complaints aside, this is still probably the best $15 I've spent on Xbox Live in awhile. I'm gonna hop back in after dinner.
The Antitype
Banned
Kai Dracon
Writing a dinosaur space opera symphony
How bad it is may depend on how mortally offended you are by a "NG in name only" game, lol.
If it didn't have NG on the cover, it might be viewed as a fairly decent brawler.
Underneath the simplified systems it's still got a good combat engine and can be a lot of fun.
They're still adding content back to it like more weapons.
I thought there was also supposed to be an extra, rebalanced difficulty at some point.
It's not a true NGIII in any way.
Its multiplayer is actually kind of cool. Its Ninja Trials are surprisingly fun thanks to an experience and persistent character upgrade system.
For a bomba price it is probably OK as a fun brawl to play through.
But again, be warned, it is an insult to Ninja Gaiden in terms of carrying the series flag.
Kai Dracon
Writing a dinosaur space opera symphony
It's the dragon sword. The claws and scythe are being added in as free updates for story mode. Basically it looks as if they were supposed to be in at release but the game was rushed.
No word yet if they'll add more weapons in over time.
The real problem the game has isn't even lack of Itagaki, but the focus on trying to westernize it to appeal to their perception of western players. AKA make it simple and give it more cut scenes.
The Antitype
Banned
Ugh, I forgot about the platforming sections in the hidden temple, with the swinging balls and the zombies shooting arrows.
Why? Why is something this annoying and not-fun allowed to exist in a AAA videogame?!
Why? Why is something this annoying and not-fun allowed to exist in a AAA videogame?!
The Antitype
Banned
I just said 'Fuck it'. Jumping in the general direction and threw some incendiary grenades at the zombies instead of bothering to aim the bow (or rely on the bow's crappy auto-aim from that distance).
The one with the blue patch was fine, the one with the spikes and the swinging balls, I said 'fuck it again' and just jumped into the spikes, took the damage, waited for the ball to pass, jumped in the spikes on the other side, took the damage, and finished the damn section.
Now I remember I have that damn factory with the laser hover-bots coming up soon, and a boss battle that requires first-person bow-shooting.
It's a testament to how good the combat in the game is that I'm willing to consider it a true classic despite all the stupid, pointless and/or frustrating shit mixed in with it.
Don't forget an entire level involving swimming... that ends with fighting Doku. Weird way to pace things.
But yeh, the puzzles/platforming seem to screw with the pacing in Black on Normal. This wasn't really fixed in Sigma, if I remember correctly.
I almost want to just pick up NG3 for something new to play. I've played OG Ninja Gaiden/Ninja Gaiden 2/Sigma 2 enough times that I just want to play something different.
But yeh, the puzzles/platforming seem to screw with the pacing in Black on Normal. This wasn't really fixed in Sigma, if I remember correctly.
I almost want to just pick up NG3 for something new to play. I've played OG Ninja Gaiden/Ninja Gaiden 2/Sigma 2 enough times that I just want to play something different.
The Antitype
Banned
I'm just annoyed that I'm going to have to play it over and over to unlock all the costumes I had already unlocked, just cause I'm not allowed to transfer my Black save from the original Xbox.
I wonder if there are any *ahem* unofficial ways of getting around that....?
I wonder if there are any *ahem* unofficial ways of getting around that....?