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Original PS1 Tomb Raiders worth checking out?
- Thread starter SatoAilDarko
- Start date
SolidSnakex
Member
play anniversary instead
I like Anniversary, but after playing through the original recently, it's way too forgiving in comparison to that. Not too surprising since it's in part based off of Legend, which is even more forgiving compared to the original series. I'd say that if you want to know why people fell in love with TR in the first place, then going with the original game is the best route.
Blast Processing
Member
The first TR is one of my favorite games ever. It was the only game I had on PSX for a while. The atmosphere, the level design, the challenge, the controls that now seem cumbersome to those used to analog sticks but in fact are ingenious and allow Lara a wide range of maneuvers perfectly fitted to the environments she traverses. So good.
Definitely play the first. The others are optional.
Definitely play the first. The others are optional.
Messofanego
Banned
Here's a look at the thought that went into the level design, thanks to Gavin Rummery.
Shadow Hog
Member
You can patch the soundtrack back into the PC version. I know I did. Definitely recommend one does so, too, because it's not a half-bad soundtrack - sure beats having nothing but ambient noise.
And I highly, highly doubt the sound quality is better in the PS1 version than the PC one. Heck, I noticed the sound quality in Tomb Raider [1] PC was far better than Tomb Raider 2's, somehow...
TR1 had to make a lot of concessions on the audio side for old computers. The reason it lacked the PS1 soundtrack was because old PC CD-ROM drives were slow to spin up after any period of inactivity and would constantly pause the game, while the PSX drive is always spinning while the game is active. As for the sound effects, they're 8-bit/22kHz samples meant to support older sound cards, while the PS1 version has 16-bit samples. They are absolutely, undeniably lower fidelity than the console version's audio.
People did manage to patch in the original music, which is great. Personally I have a hard time getting over how 'fuzzy' the samples are though.
Deputy Dangle
Member
Tomb Raider 1 has aged like a fine wine.
Jazzkokehead
Member
I'm probably biased since I've only ever played the first Tomb Raider on PC, but I actually prefer it without music - running around the levels with the ambient sound as the only soundtrack increases the sense of atmosphere and tension. It really reinforces the feeling that you're alone, exploring these incredibly desolate locales.
RadarScope1
Member
Awesome post, great GIFs. Perfect embodiment of why the 2013 TR sucked. Real gaming vs an amusement park ride.As people have already pointed out, the controls are perfect for the games. They are extremely precise and always work exactly as they should. If you fail it will always be your fault. It's nice to get through a level because of your skills and not because the game made sure your character couldn't miss the jump. The real standout is the level design which is well above today's standards.
Old standards:
Today's standards:
Yeah, I've always been of two minds about this. On one hand, what you said is absolutely correct. It's also the fact that you have the ambient audio playing all the time, while the majority of the time in the console versions you're running around in complete silence.
On the other hand, the PSX music is really really good, and makes those sudden encounters and narrow escapes so much more exciting and dramatic.
SolidSnakex
Member
I don't think it sucked, but it really has very little in common with the classic games. It's a good example of what people talk about when they mention casualizing a franchise. Everything about it seems to be designed to not frustrate the player. Remove traps that could leave to instant death, make sure platforming sections look cool rather than have actual challenge, simplify puzzles and focus heavily on gunplay.
The original Tomb Raider games have amazing soundtracks, though.
Main Theme
St Francis Folly
Gruesome Encounter
The Colosseum
Escape Tomb of Qualopec
Surprise
It's not like the music plays constantly. They are all fairly short tracks that enhance the feeling of specific moments.
I can't. Brilliant.
Running up the Colosseum steps and it slowly revealing itself in the dark background with that tune playing was glorious.
Then comes Pierre to ruin it
This is what I remember the most from TR1, walking into St. Francis Folly and being 6-stories off the ground.
The other games are great at this too.
Something Spooky in that Jungle - TR3
The Puzzle Element - TR3
Stone the Crows - TR3
Jeep Thrills Max - TR4
Boss Battle 1 - TR4
Egyptian Mood - TR4
Boss Battle 2 - TR4
Angel of Darkness soundtrack is amazing, as well.
To be fair 99% of the PS1 library aged terribly, especially the 3D stuff.
And not just the graphics either. Also things like loadtimes, basic interface stuff etc.
Shadow Hog
Member
Sorry, but doing some looking into this, I'm really not seeing your claim here. Admittedly not owning the PS1 version makes it difficult to do a perfect comparison, but resorting to what's on YouTube, this PS1 video compared to this PC video, the PC version (which I can attest sounds roughly like what it did when I played through it recently) sounds crisper than the PS1 version - the exact opposite of your claim.
(Also the Saturn version for comparison's sake. Wow, I hadn't noticed the sound was that much worse than the PS1 version's.)
MichaelFassbender
Member
It's something everyone should experience, both for the sense of movement and the ambiance.
First I'd recommend playing a copy of the actual PS1 game rather than using a poorly sampled youtube video with clearly audible distortion and background interference. I will try to find a cleaner video of the PS1 version when I have the time but playing them both with headphones would be the best option if it really matters to you.
You can definitely hear the effect of the 22KHz samples in that PC video though. The easiest thing to notice is probably to focus on the audible hiss that trails every footfall. That hiss is the effect of converting a 16-bit sample to an 8-bit one. It also sounds 'sharper' overall than the PS1 version because the PS1 filters the audio.
The DOS port of TR1 was a bit of a rush job and a few things, like the sound effects, were downscaled to fit the lowest common denominator for PC hardware at the time.
Well, while I didn't like the direction they were taking the series in with Angel of Darkness even if it had turned out to be good, it's hard to blame Core for getting stretched thin. Eidos wanted Tomb Raider to be an annual franchise and wasn't willing to give Core the time to work out their ideas. Tomb Raider (1996), Tomb Raider 2 (1997), Tomb Raider 3 (1998), Tomb Raider: The Last Revelation (1999), Tomb Raider Chronicles (2000)... You know it's pretty impressive what they pulled off, especially considering that they improved the engine every time. Eidos didn't want to wait for a PS2 game after Last Revelation, so they had Core make another PS1 game. The main staff pumped out Chronicles while the rest of Core worked on Angel of Darkness. When the main staff finished Chronicles and started working on AoD the game was a mess. They obviously had too many ideas and not a clear vision. Development floundered and Eidos rushed the game to market. It failed compared to Last Revelation, but did better than Chronicles, but Eidos kicked them to the curb. The game came out in 2003, so that was a 3 year gap without a Tomb Raider game, but still... Crystal Dynamic' Tomb Raider games have come out even more sporadically and only sold slightly better than Angel of Darkness at best and they kept getting more chances... AoD must have wasted a lot of money or something. They even canned the Tomb Raider Anniversary that Core was working on, which was looking really good. I think CD was pretty talented at making Lara's movement evolve to fit more powerful hardware, but they always focused too heavily on action and story. Everything that was wrong with CD's Tomb Raider games was dialed up to 13 in Tomb Raider 13 and all redeeming qualities removed.
RadarScope1
Member
Oh man. This was great, thanks.
Shadow Hog
Member
I can notice the hiss now that you mention it, actually, yeah. Although, honestly, it still sounds better than the PS1 version - at least, from what I can scrounge up, a little bit of hissing is a more than acceptable compromise for less-muffled audio for me (seriously, I cannot find a video of the PS1 version that does not have that muffling).
Sub_Level
wants to fuck an Asian grill.
I was less inclined to play Last Revelation when I perused a walkthrough and noticed you seemed to "revisit" a lot of areas. Is it still worth playing in spite of what I presume is backtracking?
Trying to get Tomb Raider 2 to run on EPSXE but it's not cooperating and not a fan of Xpadder or keyboard controls with regards to the Steam version.
Trying to get Tomb Raider 2 to run on EPSXE but it's not cooperating and not a fan of Xpadder or keyboard controls with regards to the Steam version.
Last Revelation starts out with the standard linear level structure. You have a couple of tutorial levels set in the past in Cambodia, then 4 levels set around the Tomb of Seth introducing the plot. Then it starts to introduce... I guess mega levels? It's not so much that you return to areas through linear paths. Even Tomb Raider 1, 2, and 3 did that. Rather you have pretty much a massive level that is divided into smaller levels. You can freely move back and forth between these levels. Usually you enter a level to obtain some kind of item to use as a key in another level that is part of the mega level. There are 4 of these in the game and believe me they get insanely big. The first is The Temple of Karnak, which is made up of the levels: Temple of Karnak, Great Hypostyle Hall, and Sacred Lake. The Alexandria levels are really amazingly complex. The whole Alexandria section is made up of 8 levels and they all form 1 nonlinear level, though the various sections of it are linear in nature.
If you do things right there's not really a lot of backtracking. You'll enter an area one way and upon doing whatever it was you needed to do there you'll move forward and find a quick path out of that area. The levels can get quite massive and so you might get lost, especially in Alexandria and Cairo, trying to figure out where to go and what to do. It's a great game. Definitely doesn't baby you.
To be honest there is one section of TR4 that is annoying. In the Alexandria levels there is a block pushing puzzle that is set between 2 levels. You have to climb to the top of a ruin in one level and enter a door that takes you to another level. In this level all you can do is press a button that raises a block to fill a hole in the floor in the room below you. To access that room you have to go back to the level you just came from, go to the bottom of the ruin you climbed, crawl through a crawlspace, and enter a door there. Back in the 2nd level, now in the lower room, you can pull a column out onto the block you raised. Then you exit back out to the first level the way you came, climb back up to the top door, and enter the 2nd level again to push/pull a block across the floor that is now supported by the column you moved in the room below to open a door. It's the only example of the game of something made needlessly complicated like that and it's only really annoying because you have to go through 5 loading screens just to do a block puzzle, lol.
Here's a video of it: http://youtu.be/1fx7pIiFk5o?t=17m17s
I just checked the walkthrough videos of badassgamez, a guy who does great walkthroughs of the classic Tomb Raider games, and he did the whole Alexandria section of the game in just under 3 hours. It's a great section apart from that silly block puzzle.
As for TR2, it has one of the best first levels in the series. Great Wall is an amazing introduction that doesn't pull any punches. That guantlet at the end is crazy. TR2 does have more enemies, a lot more humans, but it still focuses heavily on level design and platforming. Definitely wouldn't characterize it as an expansion pack. That's an extremely negative thing to call it. It's very much a sequel. It slogs a bit with the Venice and Oil Rig levels. There are 3 Venice levels and 2 Oil Rig levels, but it's clear sailing past those. Some amazing amazing levels.
Alex_Mexico
Member
In my opinion Metal Gear Solid 1 on PS1 has aged like fine wine thanks in large part to its static camera and simple shooting mechanics. That Gamecube remake can go #$%& itself, though.
But yeah I'll agree that many 3D games from PS1 aged terribly and are unplayable now. But I'd never say all of them.
Le_Samourai
Banned
I love the original tomb raider, I recently play it again, definitely would buy a hd version, because I can't stand the definition though.
Auto-Reply
Member
Having to actively press a button to grab a ledge somehow makes climbing around so much more meaningful. Climbing in videogames degraded since then into mindless and magnetic/automatic traversal you just want to get over with.
If you play anniversary, turn that on!
If you play anniversary, turn that on!
PeakPointMatrix
Member
play anniversary instead
This is like your most used gif, but I laugh every time.
Novum_Veritas
Member
I just watched some videos of badassgamez, and one thing I noticed in the old TR games is that you had to do a lot of puzzling, hand holding what to do next was non existent, it was like Core threw you in cold water, and see what happens next, I think this is also one of the things which made the old TR games special, not to know which lurks next around the corner. It is also amazing how well badassgamez handles these old controls, these are definitely antiquated, but it is possible to master them fine, if you have the dedication for it.
I really miss Core design, and it is a shame they're now a thing of the past. Every progress in these games felt like huge success, and the game brought up great rewards to do so.
I really miss Core design, and it is a shame they're now a thing of the past. Every progress in these games felt like huge success, and the game brought up great rewards to do so.
BAW
Banned
I think it was amazing how Core managed to produce such expansive games every single year with such hectic development schedules. Obviously some entries ended up very good (TR1, TR2, TR4) while some others suffered a bit (TR3, Chronicles) but still an amazing achievement.
I am currently replaying TR2 and TR4 on my PSP because I got stuck 1 or 2 levels before finishing them when I was a kid and they are as addicting as I remember them. Every little progress you make leaves a huge feeling of satisfaction. No handholding. Also there is absolutely no issue of "dated" controls, TR requires very specific, very measured jumps and the controls are perfect for that kind of play. The game has 2 different buttons for jumping and holding out your hands to grab ledges, and there is a reason for that! Which games give you such ultimate sense of control today? None.
Also the most fluid movement on PSX by far, no other 3D platformer got it right, it just feels good.
The moment someone decided that the TR formula had grown "stale" and should "evolve" by introducing "modern features", it was the moment TR died.
I am currently replaying TR2 and TR4 on my PSP because I got stuck 1 or 2 levels before finishing them when I was a kid and they are as addicting as I remember them. Every little progress you make leaves a huge feeling of satisfaction. No handholding. Also there is absolutely no issue of "dated" controls, TR requires very specific, very measured jumps and the controls are perfect for that kind of play. The game has 2 different buttons for jumping and holding out your hands to grab ledges, and there is a reason for that! Which games give you such ultimate sense of control today? None.
Also the most fluid movement on PSX by far, no other 3D platformer got it right, it just feels good.
The moment someone decided that the TR formula had grown "stale" and should "evolve" by introducing "modern features", it was the moment TR died.
Congratulations, this is the single worst post I've ever seen on Neogaf.
stump sock
Member
I've never thought they were very good games, and I feel like they've only gotten worse with time.
Having said that, however, it's an important series in the grand scheme of games, and it's probably worth at least trying the first one just to see what they're like. And if you end up liking it, then even better.
I think even fans of the series tend to think the games post 3 were average to bad until Legend and Anniversary.
Having said that, however, it's an important series in the grand scheme of games, and it's probably worth at least trying the first one just to see what they're like. And if you end up liking it, then even better.
I think even fans of the series tend to think the games post 3 were average to bad until Legend and Anniversary.
dapperbandit
Banned
It will take you time to get accustomed to how Lara moves in the first games but I would encourage you to persevere. Once you get a feel for it the door is open for some of the most challenging (and rewarding) 3D platforming there has been.
The biggest obstacles to someone who never played them back in the day are, again, controlling Lara, the graphics and the way the combat works. The graphics could be an issue in darker sections but otherwise you should be fine. In regards to combat, Lara locks on automatically to enemies but there is no cover mechanic. I had a friend watching me play ask what exactly you're supposed to do in a gun fight since you can't duck behind a chest high wall. The answer is, oddly enough, a lot of side and backflipping.
My favourite by a mile is Tomb Raider 2, to me a near perfect blend of action, platforming and puzzling.
Tomb Raider 3...it's merciless is all I'll say. Similar to 2 except you have finite saves this time around, there's a sprint mechanic and there are poisonous enemies. There's also the option, once you beat TR3's intro section, to play the other sections in any order which is nice I suppose, but subtracts a little from the sense of direction.
The Last Revelation wasinteresting. I never finished it but it seemed more puzzle oriented than 2 and 3 which were quite actiony.
Go and play them I say.
The biggest obstacles to someone who never played them back in the day are, again, controlling Lara, the graphics and the way the combat works. The graphics could be an issue in darker sections but otherwise you should be fine. In regards to combat, Lara locks on automatically to enemies but there is no cover mechanic. I had a friend watching me play ask what exactly you're supposed to do in a gun fight since you can't duck behind a chest high wall. The answer is, oddly enough, a lot of side and backflipping.
My favourite by a mile is Tomb Raider 2, to me a near perfect blend of action, platforming and puzzling.
Tomb Raider 3...it's merciless is all I'll say. Similar to 2 except you have finite saves this time around, there's a sprint mechanic and there are poisonous enemies. There's also the option, once you beat TR3's intro section, to play the other sections in any order which is nice I suppose, but subtracts a little from the sense of direction.
The Last Revelation wasinteresting. I never finished it but it seemed more puzzle oriented than 2 and 3 which were quite actiony.
Go and play them I say.
AntiFacebook
Member
A big mistake. Chronicles is by far the best game in the series.
Tizoc
Member
They're on sale on US PSN. They go on sale regularly for peanuts during Steam sales.
All that needs to be said about the controls. Imprecise controls my ass. Rather perfect controls.
What I really loved about the PS1 versions, was those save crystals. It made the game feel even more like a survival platformer. Sort of like Resident Evil. And TR3 even introduced collectible save crystals. Really liked that approach.
SphericalCrusher
Member
Absolutely! One of the best! You should also check out Tomb Raider Anniversary, which is a remake of the first game. Love this series.
Anything available about it? TBH I was never really interested in Tomb Raider that much back in the day, and it's the first time I hear about Core-developed Anniversary.
what about gex enter the gecko
MrCunningham
Member
This is absolutely true. Tomb Raider was designed before the event of analogue controls, and because of that it is designed to work within the confines of the d-pad. Everything was designed on a grid base as this video clearly shows and because of that Lara's controls are much more precise than people give it credit for. It is actually kind of a miracle how well this game is designed around control scheme and every single move Lara has at her disposal is taken into account in the level design.
It's really interesting that her jumps are based on her foot movement too. If you hit the jump button, she won't actually jump until her foot is firmly planted into the ground. This makes it look like button lag, but in reality it is not. Once you figure that out in the game, jumping actually becomes a breeze. This where the game is a bit like the original Prince of Persia.
Though they did kind of change this a bit for the later games to make Lara feel more responsive.
When I played through this for the first time on PC, there were a lot of moments that felt reminiscent of the Legend of Zelda games (this was long before OoT). The game definitely doesn't have any hand holding, but it doe drop clues once in a while by having Lara's head moves to look at something that should be brought to the players attention.This was a nice little touch that felt non intrusive. Plus it does have that chime when finding secrets, just like Zelda.
The combat was a little clunky, though Lara's auto aim certainly was interesting, and the enemy AI was clumsy. But still, it was a really well designed game for something that was one of the first of its kind.
Sub_Level
wants to fuck an Asian grill.
FINALLY got xpadder workin' good, so Steam versions of TR2 and 4 for me 
The first Venice level wasn't so bad. Fun actually. Have to manage your medkits though, can't just go around healing everytime you take a little damage.
Trailer: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EtvNYM1wY7s
The first Venice level wasn't so bad. Fun actually. Have to manage your medkits though, can't just go around healing everytime you take a little damage.
Trailer: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EtvNYM1wY7s
What would I give for this version
Such a shame that none of it even leaked at some point.
Novum_Veritas
Member
I really liked those nods, that Lara only moved her head towards where something could be interesting to the player, but even better was it was not told what it was exactly, you had to find out yourself, I really liked this mechanic, and it is a shame something like this is not used anymore. Those secret chimes were pretty cool, because it sounded so magical and well hidden, the secrets were also really well hidden, so they deserved the name secret.Well the A.I was clumsy alright, because the thing with A.I wasn't looked in at the time of the new 3D era. I still find the TR 1-5 better than most of today's games, it is really weird.
Wow, that Trailer of Cores TR AE looks so good...what a shame that Eidos took the rights of Core because they failed with Angel of Darkness....
This looks so much better than the Anniversary edition from CD.