Support NeoGAF

[Jimnymebob]

I loved the game, but I'll be damned if I didn't have some issues where I knew what to do, I'd issue the command once, and Trico'd not do the thing, then after a few attempts he'd finally decide to.
I know you can argue that "oh, he behaves like a real creature, so he won't always listen to your command", but it's frustrating when you know you've figured​ a puzzle out, and he won't cooperate.

 

[Soul of the Beast]

I am a huge Souls fan but to be fair Bloodborne's launch does seem to be rushed.
The fact that the death loading time is 45-55 seconds average (This never happend in Souls history, ever.)
The loading screen also didn't have any item description at launch, only a big ''Bloodborne'' logo as placeholder.
Remember people defending it saying ''It's not a Dark Souls game so of course there won't be item description in the loading screen, get over it!'' only to see item descriptions patched into the loading screen a month later.
It's absolutely hilarious.

Me and my Soulsborne friends often joked that Bloodborne's true release date is actually April 23rd, 2015. (where Patch 1.03 dropped)

Still, the game is absolutely incredible.

 

[King_Moc]

Great story, shit game. Was an absolute chore to play it.

 

[unknownstranger]

SOTC is probably in my top 5 games of all time, but with TLG I put it down after about 2 hours and have no desire to go back. Such a disappointment.

This comment makes no sense to me. SotC is in your top 5 of all time, you wait 11 years for another game by the same developers and give up 2 hours in? It's not like the beginning of the game is anywhere close to unplayable. The beginning of the game is the weakest part but Shadow of the Colossus had a weak point too.

 

[LowlySmokeGuy]

Never did come to love it, instead it felt like I just tolerated it long enough until I got the platinum. Can't see myself returning to it ever again like I do ICO & Shadow of the Colossus for a playthrough every other year.

Wow getting a pain in the ass platinum for a game you don't like that much. Why torture yourself like that?

 

[Mexen]

I knew it. Should of been a PS 5 release.

 

[s-bojan]

Controls are awful, camera is terrible in some situations and input lag is cherry on top.
Interesting and frustrating game.

 

[Vexii]

Genuinely, I would love to know how many people who complain about Trico's behaviour don't (or do) own pets of their own.

We have 4 cats here, and I found his behaviour typical. It's workable, but you need to understand how vague an instruction can seem to an animal unless you change the context in such a way that it clicks for them.

Like "He's been patting his leg for 10 minutes now. Oh! If I go over there, I'll get attention."

I found it endearing and adorable, especially when he got things wrong then first time.

 

[silva1991]

I am a huge Souls fan but to be fair Bloodborne's launch does seem to be rushed.
The fact that the death loading time is 45-55 seconds average (This never happend in Souls history, ever.)
The loading screen also didn't have any item description at launch, only a big ''Bloodborne'' logo as placeholder.
Remember people defending it saying ''It's not a Dark Souls game so of course there won't be item description in the loading screen, get over it!'' only to see item descriptions patched into the loading screen a month later.
It's absolutely hilarious.

Me and my Soulsborne friends often joked that Bloodborne's true release date is actually April 23rd, 2015. (where Patch 1.03 dropped)

Still, the game is absolutely incredible.

That loading screen got nothing on "still in development areas" like Demon ruins and Lost Izalith tho.

And that persona didn't play the game at launch iirc, so it's not about loading screens and loading times, and just hates Bloodborne with passion.

 

[kinoki]

The lack of narrative and urgency really hurts the presentation. There's no goal, no conflict, no story... there's a series of events... or rather: series of rooms. You progress from one room to the next room. There's no telling how far you've completed the story since there is no development.

I haven't finished it but I'm not stuck. I've just completed the room where you use that thing to help Trico out so he can jump out of the room so I got to the next one.

 

[Shari]

If your game is janky please do make sure that at least is not slow and same-y all the way through.

Don't know what was harder to fight, Trico's "will" or my boredom.

 

[wetflame]

What's that quote? A delayed game is eventually good, but a rushed game is forever bad.

Should have pushed it back to work on it a little more.

 

[Imp the Dimp]

I had similar complaints and stuck with it.

Honestly, it wasn't worth the time or effort.

Same here lol. Felt insanely annoyed by the controls, worse than Witcher 3, but stuck with it and wish I hadn't. Game is just not that good or unique or anything. I guess I could justify finishing it in December or January or whenever I did but I'd drop it instantly if I were to buy it now amongst all the other truly amazing games.

Nobody gonna talk about this game in a couple of years, honestly.

 

[c0Zm1c]

What's that quote? A delayed game is eventually good, but a rushed game is forever bad.

Should have pushed it back to work on it a little more.

It was delayed and, I believe, put on hold for a number of years? But for many of us, the game we got is good, so I guess that quote does still work.

Some of the things people struggle with in TLG are intentional anyway, so it's unlikely that further development would have 'fixed' much, if anything. I guess it's just not that easy for everyone to accept that when something peculiar happens that it may be intentional, and not a bug. A little more work on the framerate would not have hurt though, because I'm sure that's not intentional!

 

[Persona7]

That loading screen got nothing on "still in development areas" like Demon ruins and Lost Izalith tho.

And that persona didn't play the game at launch iirc, so it's not about loading screens and loading times, and just hates Bloodborne with passion.

Feel free to dig up my launch week posts. I preordered the game and played maybe 15 hours on launch week and then completed the game a few months later.

 

[Vincent Grayson]

It's weird. Ico and Shadow of the Colossus are two of my favorite gaming experiences. Playing through SotC was one of the coolest fucking experiences ever.

But TLG just did not click with me. I played maybe an hour and just wasn't into it. I can't put my finger on why.

 

[lvl99 Pixel]

It was delayed and, I believe, put on hold for a number of years? But for many of us, the game we got is good, so I guess that quote does still work.

Some of the things people struggle with in TLG are intentional anyway, so it's unlikely that further development would have 'fixed' much, if anything. I guess it's just not that easy for everyone to accept that when something peculiar happens that it may be intentional, and not a bug. A little more work on the framerate would not have hurt though, because I'm sure that's not intentional!

After having issues myself, ive checked out playthroughs by beard bros and game grumps and everyone seems to have issues with trico just derping the hell out for a long time. If thats intentional then it might be the one of the worst design decisions ive witnessed in an otherwise good game. Its also kind of hard to take some parts seriously when the kid has the grip strength of 10 Nathan Drakes D:

 

[bigol]

It's weird. Ico and Shadow of the Colossus are two of my favorite gaming experiences. Playing through SotC was one of the coolest fucking experiences ever.

But TLG just did not click with me. I played maybe an hour and just wasn't into it. I can't put my finger on why.

An hour is too early. The game is developed around the bond between Trico and the boy and at the beginning that bond is not developed enough. In my experience more i played, more i liked the game because of that. The last two hours are truly great both from a visual and emotional point of view.

While playing it eventually i got used to the controls i felt more in control when giving Trico orders and i enjoyed it, a lot. That framerate and motion blur gave me headaches sometimes, though but i still think it was worth it.

Comparing it to Shadow of the Colossus i think TLG ending was more emotional to me. It was definitely a memorable experience.

 

[c0Zm1c]

It's weird. Ico and Shadow of the Colossus are two of my favorite gaming experiences. Playing through SotC was one of the coolest fucking experiences ever.

But TLG just did not click with me. I played maybe an hour and just wasn't into it. I can't put my finger on why.

I think much of it hinges on caring about Trico and being invested in the relationship between the two central characters that builds throughout the game. If that's not there then I don't see the game having much at all to offer.

Really, even ignoring the technical problems people have, it's not hard to see why the game is so divisive. For me it was a far stronger experience than Shadow of the Colossus, but in a traditional sense, that game is the better game I think.

After having issues myself, ive checked out playthroughs by beard bros and game grumps and everyone seems to have issues with trico just derping the hell out for a long time. If thats intentional then it might be the one of the worst design decisions ive witnessed in an otherwise good game. Its also kind of hard to take some parts seriously when the kid has the grip strength of 10 Nathan Drakes D:

I never had any major issues with Trico. There were points where it would stall but the trick I think is working out why he's derping the hell out, and having patience. Lots of patience. It could very well be one of the best design decisions, just not one that can be appreciated by everyone.

 

[myco666]

I think the game keeps getting the further you go. The beginning is bit boring in comparison but it is building up mechanics slowly and establishing the connection between the boy and trico so I don't mind it. It isn't that long game either so I would suggest to just go through it.

That loading screen got nothing on "still in development areas" like Demon ruins and Lost Izalith tho.

And that persona didn't play the game at launch iirc, so it's not about loading screens and loading times, and just hates Bloodborne with passion.

I would argue that Byrgenwerth and Lecture building are "still in development areas". Good thing they are very small so it doesn't shine through that much compared to Demon Ruins and Lost Izalith.

 

[gfxtwin]

Sorry you're not enjoying it OP. The key to not getting frustrated is learning how to work with Trico. By respecting the fact that he isn't a game mechanic and is more designed to be a realistic AI animal that you hang out with, it is possible to play the vast majority of the game without experiencing issues of getting him to do things.

Aside from that, the remaining jank didn't bother me. The controls are definitely not the most smooth or responsive but they have an appropriate feel to them and I could rarely blame a missed jump or something on poor controls. Would be nice for there to be a walking animation though, I admit. The only other thing is how the camera is so awkward and bugs out every once in a while sometimes, but you can manage it most of the time.

 

[Skulldead]

Controls are awful, camera is terrible in some situations and input lag is cherry on top.
Interesting and frustrating game.

This


There are like 2-3 really cleaver puzzle moment i was like, if the solution is this, this is pretty cool.

 

[SunBroDave]

I can usually tolerate clumsy controls if the game underneath is good (see: Breath of the Wild), but TLG controlled just so unbelievably bad that I couldn't make it more than 2 hours in (and I love both Ico and Shadow btw). Was going to wait for them to patch it, but then I just watched a 2 hour cut of the game's story on YouTube. Zero regrets

 

[Theslammer]

My GOTY for 2016. Loved the set pieces, loved the tense battles, loved the relationship-building, and the ending blew me away.

 

[Clive]

Game of the Generation for me. There were a couple of sequences where the controls get in the way but overall it was a fantastic ride. The boy actually has very similar controls to ICO/SotC if you replay them.

 

[lvl99 Pixel]

I never had any major issues with Trico. There were points where it would stall but the trick I think is working out why he's derping the hell out, and having patience. Lots of patience. It could very well be one of the best design decisions, just not one that can be appreciated by everyone.

wasting peoples time because "its just as unresponsive as a real beast!" seems like a very niche appeal, and as such, a bad one if they wanted it to be universally loved

 

[CHC]

I sympathize. Usually I can get used to controls and eventually overlook them, but not in this case. Aggressively horrible throughout, to the detriment of the game, sadly. I wish I could have liked it more but it was just such a fucking nightmare trying to do anything that it really sullied my impressions. I mean, most emulators provide a better experience than this did.

I was a huge fan of Ico and Shadow of the Colossus, but times change and TLG needed a tighter package to blow me away.

 

[massucci]

I remember getting completely pissed off by ICO's control and puzzle design. (To be fair I played it right after finishing The Last of Us so it's REALLY hard for me to adjust.)
But still in the end I really loved the game and would consider it to be one of the best game of 2001.
It's a magical experience for me, the only down side is that it's way too short.
I hope I feel the same about The Last Guardian, because I really love the art style and atmosphere of Fumito Ueda universe.

p.s. I am still waiting for the performance patch, don't wanna let shitty framedrop ruin the set pieces for me.

Good luck with that. I doubt this tiny studio will put any major effort to fix fps in the future. I think the only way to play it at decent fps, it's just to have a Pro and play it at 1080p, unfortunately.

 

[matrix-cat]

Game of the Generation for me. There were a couple of sequences where the controls get in the way but overall it was a fantastic ride. The boy actually has very similar controls to ICO/SotC if you replay them.

He absolutely doesn't. I replayed both right after TLG, because I was positive Team Ico's games had never controlled so poorly, and they didn't. Ico is perfectly responsive, and Wander had some floaty jumping physics at worst. TLG's has terrible input lag, the boy feels like he's struggling through molasses at all times, and the camera control at launch was almost farcical; 90% of the game you're going upwards to progress, but the camera fought you if you tried to point it upwards. Thankfully they at least patched that.

 

[Gravy Boat]

This comment makes no sense to me. SotC is in your top 5 of all time, you wait 11 years for another game by the same developers and give up 2 hours in? It's not like the beginning of the game is anywhere close to unplayable. The beginning of the game is the weakest part but Shadow of the Colossus had a weak point too.

Everything I've heard about the game tells me it stays pretty much the same through out. SOTC had me gripped from the very first encounter, which is like 15 minutes in. With TLG I've been bored since I booted it up. I think 2 hours is plenty of time to know whether or not I'll enjoy the game.

 

[Jawbreaker]

It was my favorite game last year. If you're not enjoying it, just drop the game. It's not going to be for everyone, and it's totally OK if it bores you.

 

[Vince DiCola]

You play the game for the story & experience, not for your enjoyment.

What the hell does this even mean?

 

[c0Zm1c]

wasting peoples time because "its just as unresponsive as a real beast!" seems like a very niche appeal, and as such, a bad one if they wanted it to be universally loved

You could apply that thinking - that it's a waste of time - to pretty much any game with obstacles or challenges that need to be overcome in order to progress. That Trico behaves realistically is often highlighted as one of the best things about the game (and it is), so that is an odd criticism.

If they had made Trico perfectly and spontaneously snap to the boys directions then the illusion of a living creature would have been lost totally. And for the sake of players that don't have patience, and think anything that doesn't work perfectly is a waste of time? Yeah, I'm glad they didn't do that!

The game reviewed well and even came fifth in GAF's top ten games of 2016, so whatever the case a good amount of people do find it appealing.

 

[gfxtwin]

I still think it's safe to say SOTC > TLG > Ico. The story, production values and concept alone make it a more enjoyable game than Ico, but it never reaches or maintains heights remotely close to SOTC's. And it did feel like a step backwards in game design. Like how Breath of the Wild's team learned art direction from Team Ico to improve its immersion, I hope Ueda's team learns from BOTW's gameplay going into their next game. And hopefully it will be a progression of the open world design of SOTC and not a return ton the more dated Ico style.

 

[Laurel_McFang]

Here's hoping that Madden game Euda is working on turns out well. TLG I thought was ok, but geez flawed in execution. Its kind of like when the math team behind Shadow of the Colussos got it so right on the ps2 they fot over ambitious and TLG was the result. Simplifiy the math next time.

 

[Reedirect]

Fantastic game, though I can't really deny anything you're stating here. Probably the best thing would be to just quit. None of the problems disappear later on.

 

[Griss]

The last third of the game contains almost all of the best moments but whether it's worth it all is a tough call.

It's not a great game, it just has some amazing features and moments.

 

[gfxtwin]

What the hell does this even mean?

I think what he's trying to say is the game aims to evoke many emotional responses and "fun" anddictive gameplay isn't necessarily a focus, and that some of the awkwardness (the way the boy is supposed to be clumsy and not agile and also controls that way) is intentional.

 

[Soul of the Beast]

Good luck with that. I doubt this tiny studio will put any major effort to fix fps in the future. I think the only way to play it at decent fps, it's just to have a Pro and play it at 1080p, unfortunately.

It's a shame that I don't have a PS4 pro *sigh*
Well, at least I can stop waiting now.

 

[Gravy Boat]

You could apply that thinking - that it's a waste of time - to pretty much any game with obstacles or challenges that need to be overcome in order to progress. That Trico behaves realistically is often highlighted as one of the best things about the game (and it is), so that is an odd criticism.

It's not a 'challenge' though. I know what I need to do, and what needs to be done to progress, but having to repeat commands over and over again until Trico finally listens isn't challenging, it's just tedious and frustrating. There's nothing difficult about the game, at least from what I played. I just found it frustrating.

 

[hollomat]

Terrible controls, AI and technical issues persist throughout the entire game. Totally half baked and extremely frustrating. It feels like a bloodborne situation where the game is pushed out a few months early but knowing the history of this game it just shows that it is deeply flawed to the core.

My feelings exactly. I spent two hours just trying to get trico to stand on its hind legs in one spot. It eithe refused to do it or stood on its hind legs in a different spot.

I looked up a let's play to make sure I was doing the right thing and I was. After that I gave up on it.

Absolutely hated the game. And I love ico and shadow.

 

[Savantcore]

I really liked it. Not quite my GOTY but definitely in my top five. Just a really nice, evocative experience.

People will probably think I'm lying but I only wrestled with Trico maybe a handful of times in the game.

 

[Omnistalgic]

Ico
SotC


TLG


Dunno what he was thinking with this one, I'm gonna finish it, but doubt I'll get the platinum. The controls just never click, speed runs in Ico were actually fun, I don't see how this would be relying on Trico for so much. That said, I do enjoy the game, but I play it in burst where Ico and SotC I was pretty hooked and finished in the first week of play.

 

[edgefusion]

I stopped playing it after about an hour because I just could not get to grips with the controls. The only game in my 30 years I've ever abandoned because of poor controls. Really should not have been released in such a terrible state.

 

[c0Zm1c]

It's not a 'challenge' though. I know what I need to do, and what needs to be done to progress, but having to repeat commands over and over again until Trico finally listens isn't challenging, it's just tedious and frustrating. There's nothing difficult about the game, at least from what I played. I just found it frustrating.

Perhaps the challenge is in understanding which commands to use and how to use them appropriately? Because I don't remember having to spam commands like you're describing in any of my three playthroughs. You may be actively making the game harder and more frustrating for yourself by doing that.

 

[gfxtwin]

My feelings exactly. I spent two hours just trying to get trico to stand on its hind legs in one spot. It eithe refused to do it or stood on its hind legs in a different spot.

I looked up a let's play to make sure I was doing the right thing and I was. After that I gave up on it.

Absolutely hated the game. And I love ico and shadow.

That's on you, bud. You can definitely avoid issues like that 90% of the time.

 

[bigol]

It's not a 'challenge' though. I know what I need to do, and what needs to be done to progress, but having to repeat commands over and over again until Trico finally listens isn't challenging, it's just tedious and frustrating. There's nothing difficult about the game, at least from what I played. I just found it frustrating.

You call Trico (don't call him many times consecutively or he will be confused making weird noises), he moves his ears as soon as you call him then he moves his face towards you, it means he listened and ready to hear your order. Give orders mostly using analog stick in the direction you want Trico to look.

No need to repeat orders if you are patient enough and don't spam order button.

 

[hemo memo]

Same here. I forced my way through most of it and I rarly do that for a game just because I love Ico and SotC so much.

 

[Whompa02]

Please...If you can handle Ico's controls, you can handle these.

How anyone had a problem baffles me. After you understand Trico's behaviors, it's not difficult.

It's a beautiful game and I love the ending. Definitely worth it.

 

[lvl99 Pixel]

You could apply that thinking - that it's a waste of time - to pretty much any game with obstacles or challenges that need to be overcome in order to progress. That Trico behaves realistically is often highlighted as one of the best things about the game (and it is), so that is an odd criticism.

If they had made Trico perfectly and spontaneously snap to the boys directions then the illusion of a living creature would have been lost totally. And for the sake of players that don't have patience, and think anything that doesn't work perfectly is a waste of time? Yeah, I'm glad they didn't do that!

The game reviewed well and even came fifth in GAF's top ten games of 2016, so whatever the case a good amount of people do find it appealing.

why is realism (its not even realistic that he sometimes actually just doesn't function) being championed here?

Its not something applied to other games because its often completely arbitrary when Trico decides to do something. We dont need a minute of jumping on his head waiting for him to stop swaying around and do something useful for the sake of this so called realism.
you're being really dishonest comparing a slow moving AI that you hope will function to games where you have control. Its not a "challenge" like you're calling it, its waiting for the game to let you progress.