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PoliGAF 2017 |OT5| The Man In the High Chair

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G

Greigor The Fellhand

Member
Jimmy Kimmel was emotional last night. Basically calling for Trumps removal, either by impeachment or by giving him a false title and locking him in a tower in florida.

Also talked to the trump voters encouraging them to admit they messed up on trump. It shouldnt be looked down on that you voted for him, but this mad hatter is doing increasing amounts of damage by the day, and the longer it takes you to own it the worse it'll be.
 
F

Finale Fireworker

Member
dramatis said:
Shouldn't this question be posed to the "radical left" instead of us?

That is, if they are cool with the 'liberals' they despise so much, in the face of the real enemy?
Click to expand...

In general, the "radical left" wants the same things the "normal left" wants. They want strong social services, universal healthcare, well-funded education, are anti-war, hate conservatives, and want a Leninist paradise to empower the people over all else.

The only difference between the "normal left" and the largely made-up "radical left" is that normal left has more faith in the process and the system and the farther left finds conventional incrementalism unsatisfactory.

While there are indeed some disagreements in policy, the real most palpable disagreement is process. But there is positively no doubt that the everybody on the left hates fascists and Nazis and white supremacists. If anything, again, it's a disagreement of process - not politics.

You can disagree on process and argue back and forth about it, but ultimately, you want the same things and are working to achieve the same results.
 
S

Souldriver

Member
Greigor The Fellhand said:
Jimmy Kimmel was emotional last night. Basically calling for Trumps removal, either by impeachment or by giving him a false title and locking him in a tower in florida.

Also talked to the trump voters encouraging them to admit they messed up on trump. It shouldnt be looked down on that you voted for him, but this mad hatter is doing increasing amounts of damage by the day, and the longer it takes you to own it the worse it'll be.
Click to expand...

Yep,

I think that's a good strategy. There are Trump voters who have buyers remorse, but simply refuse to admit it, because there are so many people ready to yell "I told you so!". So the approach to tell them that there's no shame in admitting you made a mistake, and that by learning from that mistake they can help to set things right, and that everybody will be really happy they changed their mind, might be a good approach.

It's probably the quickest way to get the Obama-Trump voters back on the good side. It will also only work for those off course. There are a whole bunch of shitbags who think their Trump vote is awesome, or don't even have to capacities to critically consider their vote.
 
E

Ernest

Banned
He's not wrong that Amazon's hurting retailers, but he's also an idiot who doesn't understand innovation and that things change.
 
N

neurosisxeno

Member
I had someone ask me what we should do to the "fringe" people who were in Charlottesville.

What does that even mean??? They were at a White Supremacist Rally. I'm pretty sure they're not fringe at that point. When you're marching around with people chanting about racial purity and waving Nazi flags dressed in Iron Crosses and Nordic Purity symbols, it's safe to say you're pretty god damn committed.
 
K

kess

Member
Finale Fireworker said:
Most Americans pay zero attention to politics or even the news and only tune in once every four years to pick a president. They have been conditioned not to talk about politics, not to care about politics, and interpret everything everybody says as being hyperbolic and reactionary.

I don't even begin to know how to fix this problem. I actually remember a commercial when I was a little kid that played on Nickelodeon during election season that always made me want to vote when I got older. But when I turned 18, I didn't, because voting was confusing and inconvenient.

What actually made me vote for the first time was how much I hated our governor in the 2014 midterms. I didn't even know who the people on the ballot were and just voted for Democrats and Independents at random.
Click to expand...

You more or less answered yourself in the first paragraph. The system has conditioned people not to care about politics in years long chunks. Many people said after the election that they would try to become less invested in politics and try to live a normal life, but Trump is so awful, I suppose, that he's a lot like that governor you voted against. If statewide elections were staggered, and the terms of the office more flexible, people would be less likely to turn off their brains.

Involvement in local politics declined after the war, which correlated with the stagnation of cities and the growth of suburbs. Now compound that with the disapperance of the local newspaper, the vacuum has been filled by nationally syndicated radio, cable TV, or the internet, which are in nature, national, and far more curated.
 
S

Slacker

Member
Greigor The Fellhand said:
Also talked to the trump voters encouraging them to admit they messed up on trump. It shouldnt be looked down on that you voted for him...
Click to expand...
That's going to be a no for me dog. This isn't like voting for George W or McCain, or Mitt. If you voted for Dubya in 2000 then were disappointed how he handled things in his first term, I would be OK with the argument above, as any other candidate was at least a "normal" qualified conservative.

Trump was a racist, boorish, unqualified habitual sex offender reality TV star when they voted for him. I will look down on them quite comfortably.
 
F

Finale Fireworker

Member
Brawly Likes to Brawl said:
So this morning I've woken up in a world where the current US President has decided that his legacy will be defending Nazi Terrorism.
Click to expand...

Good morning

59944504140f0.png
Click to expand...
 
S

Slacker

Member
Sitting here reflecting on the Trump press conference yesterday, did he really say the counter-protesters didn't have a permit? In his pea brain is that what's important here?

"Ok Mr. President we need to make a more formal, what some might call a 'no bullshit' statement on the Charlottesville situation. We need to make it clear to the American people which side we're on. Any thoughts, sir?"

"Tell me about the two sides again?"

"Well sir, on one side we have the Nazis, a group founded on hate and fear whose main objective is the eradication of blacks and Jews from our society. Jews, for example, like your son-in-law and grandchildren. On the other side we have a group of protesters whose main concern is our free society becoming a fascist dictatorship."

"I see. Did either side not have a permit?"
 
P

Plinko

Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
balladofwindfishes said:
If that's the case, he should inform the IRS to look into it
Click to expand...

That is what is so bizarre. Does he even know he has this power? I wouldn't be surprised if he didn't.

ArkhamFantasy said:
Trump refused to call this terrorism, Sessions specifically said its not terrorism. Democrats should hit trump hard for being weak on terror.
Click to expand...

Things I want democrats to take back when it comes to the views of voters:

1) Idea that they are strong against terror when compared to republicans. Both want to fight it, but republicans have somehow convinced Americans they are better in this area.

2) Idea that they would do more for veterans than republicans (Funneling money into military industrials is less useful than helping them during and after their service).

3) That their policies are much more Christian than anything the republicans put up.
 
I

Ithil

Member
balladofwindfishes said:
He does realize he can actually do something about Amazon, right? He can propose legislation, look into if they're a monopoly, see if they break any laws, make sure they're paying proper taxes, stuff like that.
Click to expand...

Literally the only reason he's attacking Amazon is because the owner also owns the Washington Post, which shits on him daily and has exposed dozens of major stories about the administration.

You need to understand that absolutely everything and every action in Trump's life revolves around himself and his personal ego.
 
W

Wilsongt

Member
Slacker said:
Sitting here reflecting on the Trump press conference yesterday, did he really say the counter-protesters didn't have a permit? In his pea brain is that what's important here?

"Ok Mr. President we need to make a more formal, what some might call a 'no bullshit' statement on the Charlottesville situation. We need to make it clear to the American people which side we're on. Any thoughts, sir?"

"Tell me about the two sides again?"

"Well sir, on one side we have the Nazis, a group founded on hate and fear whose main objective is the eradication of blacks and Jews from our society. Jews, for example, like your son-in-law and grandchildren. On the other side we have a group of protesters whose main concern is our free society becoming a fascist dictatorship."

"I see. Did either side not have a permit?"
Click to expand...

That's the line of thinking Facebook political pundits are running with.

"The Patriots" had a permit to assemble, and things didn't start going bad until ANTIFA and BLM arrived without permits.
 
Phoenix RISING

Phoenix RISING

Banned
Ithil said:
Literally the only reason he's attacking Amazon is because the owner also owns the Washington Post, which shits on him daily and has exposed dozens of major stories about the administration.

You need to understand that absolutely everything and every action in Trump's life revolves around himself and his personal ego.
Click to expand...

balladofwindfishes said:
He does realize he can actually do something about Amazon, right? He can propose legislation, look into if they're a monopoly, see if they break any laws, make sure they're paying proper taxes, stuff like that.
Click to expand...

"Free enterprise" is a conservative value tho
 
A

Abinash117

Member
Wilsongt said:
That's the line of thinking Facebook political pundits are running with.

"The Patriots" had a permit to assemble, and things didn't start going bad until ANTIFA and BLM arrived without permits.
Click to expand...

Was it officially BLM or was it just supporters? The Facebook political pundits and others are going to use BLM and ANTIFA as justification for violence even if they aren't there. An invisible enemy like Jews, communists, etc. Going to hear about it more often going foward now.


http://thehill.com/homenews/administration/346754-poll-trump-hits-job-approval-low-at-35-percent

Just 35 percent of Americans give President Trump a positive score on his job performance, according to a new poll by Marist.

Over half, or 55 percent, disapprove of how Trump is leading the country. This rating marks highest negative rating the president has received by this polling hub.


Trump's last Marist rating in June hovered at 37 percent approval and 51 percent disapproval.
The poll notes that while he remains popular with his key base supporters, Americans who identify as strong Republicans have a less positive view of his job performance rating, with 91 percent approving of his performance in June compared to 79 percent who approved in the new poll.
Click to expand...

Trump is at his most unpopular standing since becoming president, according to the poll. More Americans have an unfavorable impression of Trump at 60 percent while just 34 percent view him favorably.
Click to expand...
 
D

dramatis

Member
Finale Fireworker said:
In general, the "radical left" wants the same things the "normal left" wants. They want strong social services, universal healthcare, well-funded education, are anti-war, hate conservatives, and want a Leninist paradise to empower the people over all else.

The only difference between the "normal left" and the largely made-up "radical left" is that normal left has more faith in the process and the system and the farther left finds conventional incrementalism unsatisfactory.

While there are indeed some disagreements in policy, the real most palpable disagreement is process. But there is positively no doubt that the everybody on the left hates fascists and Nazis and white supremacists. If anything, again, it's a disagreement of process - not politics.

You can disagree on process and argue back and forth about it, but ultimately, you want the same things and are working to achieve the same results.
Click to expand...
I'm well aware that the primary problem isn't in agreements about policy, but in trust. That's why I say the question should be posed to the so-called "radical left", not to the "centrist neoliberals" that they despise.

These were people who claimed themselves leftists and thought Trump was better than Hillary because he was anti-establishment, because their lack of trust in the process was more important and real than fighting white supremacy and racism. Ironically that sort of complicated process by which the country is governed is the mass of inertia preventing Trump from having much efficacy on healthcare and tax reform (economic issues), yet his prominence and media omnipresence is giving quite a voice, platform, and call to action to white supremacists.

If the "centrist neoliberals" are such anathema to not be trusted or listened to, then the question should be posed to those who have such disdain for the clear allies in this fight.
 
W

Wilsongt

Member
I am noticing more and more that the right is only good at creating boogiemen to mask their failures as a party.

Clinton, Obama, ((((((((((GEORGE SOROS)))))))), BLM, radical leftist, MSM, transgender individuals...

All boogiemen used to scare their base into thinking "x" group is coming to take away your "y thing".

They are using fear to control the base and to get them to vote, and I am sure there are other examples of this in history, but I can't pinpoint any at the moment.
 
T

Tall4Life

Member
Wilsongt said:
I am noticing more and more that the right is only good at creating boogiemen to mask their failures as a party.

Clinton, Obama, ((((((((((GEORGE SOROS)))))))), BLM, radical leftist, MSM, transgender individuals...

All boogiemen used to scare their base into thinking "x" group is coming to take away your "y thing".

They are using fear to control the base and to get them to vote, and I am sure there are other examples of this in history, but I can't pinpoint any at the moment.
Click to expand...

With the growth of labor unions in the late 19th/early 20th century, pro-business politicians would point to unrelated violence like the Haymarket riot, where a bomb was thrown by an anarchist at a police force, and shout "Look at all these anarchists, they're all anarchists!!". With stuff like the Red Scare of the 20's and 50's you also have people shouting communist or socialist at people who would dare even think of criticizing the government.

Then with the various forms of the Civil Rights Movement you have people (like President Johnson) saying that black people wanting civil rights is a disguise for wanting to discriminate against white people (sound familiar?)
 
D

Deleted member 231381

Unconfirmed Member
dramatis said:
I'm well aware that the primary problem isn't in agreements about policy, but in trust. That's why I say the question should be posed to the so-called "radical left", not to the "centrist neoliberals" that they despise.

These were people who claimed themselves leftists and thought Trump was better than Hillary because he was anti-establishment, because their lack of trust in the process was more important and real than fighting white supremacy and racism. Ironically that sort of complicated process by which the country is governed is the mass of inertia preventing Trump from having much efficacy on healthcare and tax reform (economic issues), yet his prominence and media omnipresence is giving quite a voice, platform, and call to action to white supremacists.

If the "centrist neoliberals" are such anathema to not be trusted or listened to, then the question should be posed to those who have such disdain for the clear allies in this fight.
Click to expand...

Who on earth are these people you're talking about? Like, who self-defines as a member of the radical left and prefers Trump to Clinton? You're fighting some non-existent bugbear.
 
V

Valhelm

contribute something
Brawly Likes to Brawl said:
So this morning I've woken up in a world where the current US President has decided that his legacy will be defending Nazi Terrorism.
Click to expand...

Past administrations have supported Nazis in dozens of other countries to preserve our interests. Like most things, Trump is just stupider and more vulgar in how he does this.

dramatis said:
I'm well aware that the primary problem isn't in agreements about policy, but in trust. That's why I say the question should be posed to the so-called "radical left", not to the "centrist neoliberals" that they despise.

These were people who claimed themselves leftists and thought Trump was better than Hillary because he was anti-establishment, because their lack of trust in the process was more important and real than fighting white supremacy and racism. Ironically that sort of complicated process by which the country is governed is the mass of inertia preventing Trump from having much efficacy on healthcare and tax reform (economic issues), yet his prominence and media omnipresence is giving quite a voice, platform, and call to action to white supremacists.

If the "centrist neoliberals" are such anathema to not be trusted or listened to, then the question should be posed to those who have such disdain for the clear allies in this fight.
Click to expand...

No radical leftists hated Clinton but liked Trump. The only folks who remotely resemble what you're talking about are TYT dipshits on Reddit whose problems with Clinton with emotional and half-formed and often invalid. You suggest that unity is necessary, but for the past ten months prominent Democrats like Neera Tanden and Peter Daou rejected any kind of that cooperation, preferring to coin the phrase the "alt left" and shame our policy concerns and perpetuate a narrative of a "violent Antifa". Not only have people of your political persuasion been an impediment to a united front against Trump and what he stands for, many of your arguments have been picked up verbatim by Republicans who wish to further their own monstrous agenda.

Please spend more time listening to leftists so you don't make posts like this in the future.
 
V

Valhelm

contribute something
Resident_UA said:
I still don't get how these two are connected... Does anyone really think that this show will portray white people in good light? If anything this is something that white nationalists should see to finally understand what their fucked up idea of utopia looks like.
Click to expand...

A world that is even more white supremacist is just kind of boring. While I doubt the show will be bad, or that the creators had poor intentions, it's not the most appropriate story to be told.

It will probably raise popular awareness of Confederate abuses rather than glorify the Old South, but a lot of people will definitely take it the wrong way.
 
K

kess

Member
This might be keeping an eye on -- a Orthodox community in Mahwah, NJ has been at odds with the zoning commission because they've been erecting PVC eruvs on utility poles. But..

In Jewish tradition, Orthodox Jews within an eruv can perform tasks outside of their home that are otherwise forbidden on the Sabbath. Those tasks include pushing a stroller or carrying keys.

At a local park Monday night, town officials heard the crowd's concerns over out-of-state residents venturing across the New York border into Mahwah.

The township acted Friday by ordering the South Monsey Eruv Fund to cease building the boundary, arguing it violates township zoning regulations that prohibit signs on utility poles. The group has until Aug. 4 to remove the eruv or face summonses.

Mahwah Strong, a Facebook group that organized the meeting, will serve as a check and balance for Mahwah to enforce its ordinances, said creator Robert Ferguson.

The group has amassed 3,000 members in six days.

“I don’t view this as a hostile takeover of the town,” Ferguson said of the Monsey group. “All I want is for them to follow the law and stay within the bounds of the ordinances that exist."

An online petition titled “Protect the Quality of Our Community in Mahwah” emerged last week, calling for the eruv’s removal to “prevent further illegal incursions into our community." Its creator, former town Councilman John Roth, said he closed the petition shortly after reaching 1,200 signatures, due to inappropriate comments made on the web page.
Click to expand...

HUH
 
R

RumbleHumble

Banned
Resident_UA said:
I still don't get how these two are connected... Does anyone really think that this show will portray white people in good light? If anything this is something that white nationalists should see to finally understand what their fucked up idea of utopia looks like.
Click to expand...

It's not necessarily that they're connected out and out or anything, it's just people watching the show will already know that the Confederacy is bad and the people who don't will just be enjoying some racism porn. We've got plenty of media providing lots of both, and given how GOT already handles things like race/sex/violence, there's lots of skepticism that the new show will contribute meaningfully in any way.
 
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