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[Dreams-Visions]

LoL is taking a different, and largely more conservative approach. I assume this means Riot plans to build upon League of Legends for...a decade? Maybe even more? That is to say, we should never really expect a League of Legends 2. Instead, we would expect to see engine updates, visual enhancements that reflect better baseline hardware over the years, and continual content additions.

The only flaw in this approach is that the game is entirely dependent on Riot. If Riot imploded, there would be no way for players to continue playing the game.

Also, Dota 2 won't have a problem with the crowd funding. The game is only a fraction of the size of League of Legends (player base), so there is plenty of room for them to continue to grow. Further, the items they offer for the crowd-funding rewards continue to provide killer value for those who buy them. There's no reason to assume that the Dota 2 population won't continue to grow or that Valve will stop providing good value for Compendium purchasers, so there's no reason to assume they won't see $10,000,000 annual prize pools. And regardless, TI has a base line of $1,000,000.00 which is always there. Everything else was always just icing on the cake. But it creates community, which is something Valve has proven themselves to be extremely adept in creating and understanding the value of. People feel like they're a part of something in Dota 2. That will give the game a quality of life atypical in gaming.

That said, their assertion that Valve is "begging" anyone is either a gross misunderstanding of how Valve's TI economy model works (which would be a pretty embarrassing revelation, as that company should be closely examining the business models of competitors to see what they can adapt to their own model), or it's unconstructive PR dodging. Either way, Riot needs to do better than that.

 

[Firemind]

Warcraft 3 TFT:
-->Dota All-Stars (DotA 1) -Custom map of War3
---->League of Legends (LoL) - new game with dota mechanics / dev
---->Heroes of Newerth (HoN) - new game with dota mechanics / dev
---->Dota 2 - new game with dota mechanics / dev
---->Heroes of the Storm (Blizzard All-Stars) - new game with dota mechanics

I see. Riot/Blizzard are the devs of LoL and Dota2 respectively. So why is Valve sponsoring the event? And ten million dollars at that? Crazy.

 

[DeadManWalking]

Valve knows how to make money. They have build all the other shit around dota. There needs to be some sealing on prize pool. Every year increasing it in not a great idea.Winners really needed 5mil??

 

[Beelzebubs]

I see. Riot/Blizzard are the devs of LoL and Dota2 respectively. So why is Valve sponsoring the event? And ten million dollars at that? Crazy.

Valve made DoTA 2.

 

[lightning2k3]

He has a point. Does anyone really care if Newbie won a million or five million dollars? Wouldn't it be better to have more frequent events than waiting a year for the next one? Shouldn't Valve just give up on Dota 2, and back Counterstrike: GO instead?

Big events make for more excitement. Look at the super bowl, the NBA finals or the World series in the US, or the Olympics and the World Cup around the world. They get non fans to tune in because of all the hype. If you had a weekly series you wouldn't have the same kind of effect.

 

[Armaros]

I see. Riot/Blizzard are the devs of LoL and Dota2 respectively. So why is Valve sponsoring the event? And ten million dollars at that? Crazy.

What? Dota2 is wholly owned by Valve and they own commercial trademark for Dota altogether. There is no Blizzard Dota, there is Heroes of the Storm.

 

[Squishy3]

LoL is taking a different, and largely more conservative approach. I assume this means Riot plans to build upon League of Legends for...a decade? Maybe even more? That is to say, we should never really expect a League of Legends 2. Instead, we would expect to see engine updates, visual enhancements that reflect better baseline hardware over the years, and continual content additions.

The only flaw in this approach is that the game is entirely dependent on Riot. If Riot imploded, there would be no way for players to continue playing the game.

Also, Dota 2 won't have a problem with the crowd funding. The game is only a fraction of the size of League of Legends (player base), so there is plenty of room for them to continue to grow. Further, the items they offer for the crowd-funding rewards continue to provide killer value for those who buy them. There's no reason to assume that the Dota 2 population won't continue to grow or that Valve will stop providing good value for Compendium purchasers, so there's no reason to assume they won't see $10,000,000 annual prize pools. And regardless, TI has a base line of $1,000,000.00 which is always there. Everything else was always just icing on the cake.

That said, their assertion that Valve is "begging" anyone is either a gross misunderstanding of how Valve's TI economy model works (which would be a pretty embarrassing revelation, as that company should be closely examining the business models of competitors to see what they can adapt to their own model), or it's unconstructive PR dodging. Either way, Riot needs to do better than that.

Also the fact Valve made an obscene amount of money from the compendium, considering they get $7.49 out of each compendium purchase. There's no way some of that money won't make its way back into the prize pool next year.

 

[Opiate]

Not sure how it would be a disaster if TI5 had a smaller prize pool than TI4. It is crowdsourced so no one can point to it and claim it is unfair on behalf of Valve for not fronting up all the money.

This is all about perception.

Why does a 10M prize pool matter in the first place? Because we all subconsciously (or in some cases consciously) place value on the size of that pool to justify our interest. If this were just great teams fighting one another over 1000 dollars, it would get viewers but not nearly as many as The International gets with a 10M+ prize pool.

Similarly, a 9M prize pool next year would create the subconscious (or in some cases conscious) impression that this new year is less important than last year. And that's a really bad impression for a sport to give.

 

[Goon Boon]

"Begging"
Wow that spin is fucking stupid.

We got multiple immortal cosmetics (never to be rereleased, unlike Riot being jackasses and re-releasing their "limited" skins) , fantasy league challenges, a BP boost which means more cosmetics, community votes on the next major cosmetics to enter the game, animated chat emoticons, more features added to the game itself, and more.

They offered a great value bundle of neat stuff that also happened to increase the prize pool of the biggest tournament of the year.

 

[LiquidNarwhal]

This thread is already going places that it shouldn't. The real thing to gather is that they're two different companies with two different business strategies and Riot is shit talking their competition.

 

[Arkanius]

I see. Riot/Blizzard are the devs of LoL and Dota2 respectively. So why is Valve sponsoring the event? And ten million dollars at that? Crazy.

The fuck?
No

Valve makes Dota2 (Hired IceFrog who works on the mod and bought the rights). Dota 1 was a Warcraft3 mod. Blizzard never owned anything.
League of Legends was loosely based on the Warcraft3 mod.

 

[Dreams-Visions]

Also the fact Valve made an obscene amount of money from the compendium, considering they get $7.49 out of each compendium purchase. There's no way some of that money won't make it's way back into the prize pool next year.

I wouldn't be surprised if Valve's contribution to the baseline is $3,000,000 next year.

Also, I'd be really surprised and disappointed if Riot doesn't figure out a way to implement their own Compendium of sorts. PR talk aside, someone's in their executive suite ensuring that their new UI will support that sort of functionality. Take that to the fucking bank, boys.

This thread is already going places that it shouldn't. The real thing to gather is that they're two different companies with two different business strategies and Riot is shit talking their competition.

I don't think anyone missed that.

 

[riceandpea]

The question is, will it get an increasingly larger sum each year and - if so - will that become an expectation to beat? Cause invariably there will be a decline.

It's interesting to hear Riot talk of a weekly-basis for matches though. A league would be much more compelling to watch in this team type game. Championships are better (imo) for versus like StarCraft, but a league is good for getting behind a particular team.

I don't think it'll happen, but you never know.

 

[Shining Sunshine]

All of Riot's points are very good.

Also add the fact that the 10 million prize pool didn't really affect DotA2's popularity. League is still constantly beating DotA on Twitch by double. League's weekly tournament matches works better in the long term.

 

[Beelzebubs]

Big events make for more excitement. Look at the super bowl, the NBA finals or the World series in the US, or the Olympics and the World Cup around the world. They get non fans to tune in because of all the hype. If you had a weekly series you wouldn't have the same kind of effect.

How do people become fans in the first place? In the case of the SuperBowl, NBA, World Series etc, the majority of people will be following their own teams they watch on a weekly basis.

The World Cup and the Olympics is national pride really although I know a lot of the players from the World Cup as I follow Football in the UK so know most of the players. I know bugger all about people in the Olympics though so you raise a good point.

 

[dave is ok]

"Begging"
Wow that spin is fucking stupid.

We got multiple immortal cosmetics (never to be rereleased, unlike Riot being jackasses and re-releasing their "limited" skins) , fantasy league challenges, a BP boost which means more cosmetics, community votes on the next major cosmetics to enter the game, animated chat emoticons, more features added to the game itself, and more.

Weather effects being another huge one.

If LoL ever added Weather Effects, it'd be 20 dollars per effect easily.

 

[Arkanius]

All of Riot's points are very good.

Also add the fact that the 10 million prize pool didn't really affect DotA2's popularity. League is still constantly beating DotA on Twitch by double. League's weekly tournament matches works better in the long term.

Are you serious?

 

[Einbroch]

Because there's more consistency in the teams, the production, the interviews, the highlights pretty much the way it's structured. All of this and they are done much more regularly than the official DoTA2 tournaments.

It's all personal preference. I just prefer to watch LoL because it feels more personal.

Wait, did you say that there's more consistency of the teams? TSM is the most popular team and they're all over the place.

January 27th, Nightblue3 is announced as a substitute.
February 4th, MegaZero is announced as a substitute.
April 27th, Xpecial moves to sub.
May 3rd, TheOddOne steps down and becomes a coach. Amazing becomes the new jungler.
May 4th, Gleebglarbu replaces Xpecial.
May 27th, Nightblue3 leaves.
June 9th, Locodoco joins as coach.
July 22nd, Lustboy joins, while Gleebglarbu moves to sub.

That's just 2014. Other teams have similar looking changes.

 

[Ikuu]

Also add the fact that the 10 million prize pool didn't really affect DotA2's popularity.

How do people become fans in the first place?

Watch the event and pick a team you like based on any number of reasons?

 

[Aaron]

It makes it a huge event and a spectacle, why not have the World Cup every year?

Because it would nearly impossible to organize. Meanwhile LoL is still much bigger than Dota 2, and they don't limit themselves to one big event a year.

 

[Candescence]

LoL is taking a different, and largely more conservative approach. I assume this means Riot plans to build upon League of Legends for...a decade? Maybe even more? That is to say, we should never really expect a League of Legends 2. Instead, we would expect to see engine updates, visual enhancements that reflect better baseline hardware over the years, and continual content additions.

The only flaw in this approach is that the game is entirely dependent on Riot. If Riot imploded, there would be no way for players to continue playing the game.

Also, Dota 2 won't have a problem with the crowd funding. The game is only a fraction of the size of League of Legends (player base), so there is plenty of room for them to continue to grow. Further, the items they offer for the crowd-funding rewards continue to provide killer value for those who buy them. There's no reason to assume that the Dota 2 population won't continue to grow or that Valve will stop providing good value for Compendium purchasers, so there's no reason to assume they won't see $10,000,000 annual prize pools. And regardless, TI has a base line of $1,000,000.00 which is always there. Everything else was always just icing on the cake. But it creates community, which is something Valve has proven themselves to be extremely adept in creating and understanding the value of. People feel like they're a part of something in Dota 2. That will give the game a quality of life atypical in gaming.

That said, their assertion that Valve is "begging" anyone is either a gross misunderstanding of how Valve's TI economy model works (which would be a pretty embarrassing revelation, as that company should be closely examining the business models of competitors to see what they can adapt to their own model), or it's unconstructive PR dodging. Either way, Riot needs to do better than that.

Fucking bingo.

As long as Valve provides plenty of value with the compendium every year, and continually updates the game and provides new reasons for players to keep playing, well, I sincerely doubt DOTA2 will falter anytime soon. They're simply taking a different and still very much valid approach.

 

[Leafhopper]

Also add the fact that the 10 million prize pool didn't really affect DotA2's popularity.

Really son? And even if it some how didn't affect its popularity, I am sure it being on ESPN sure was.

 

[Armaros]

All of this talk ignores the fact that most other major non-Ti tournaments have taken after Valves model and have greatly increased their prize pools.

Many major tournaments before and after ti4 had and are going to have sizable prize pools compared to in the past. Some went from 50k to 200k in the span of a year.

 

[Beelzebubs]

Wait, did you say that there's more consistency of the teams? TSM is the most popular team and they're all over the place.



That's just 2014. Other teams have similar looking changes.

Consistency in the teams playing. Because you're following a weekly league, you are watching the same teams for the LCS season. Hence consistency.

Again aside from each of us nit picking it's all personal preference as to why you prefer certain models.

 

[Skinpop]

That's actually more money than Valve provides every year.

depends on how you see it. LoL provides money made through their in game store. As such the compendium money is the same thing, it's provided by valve but paid by the community.

He has a point. Does anyone really care if Newbie won a million or five million dollars? Wouldn't it be better to have more frequent events than waiting a year for the next one? Shouldn't Valve just give up on Dota 2, and back Counterstrike: GO instead?

That would cannibalize on independent organizers. You have to remember that outside of the international valve doesn't host any Dota 2 tournaments and that's a good thing.

Even though other tournaments can't match the price pool of TI, prize money has increased a lot over the last 3-4 years. After first TI 10k was a pretty big deal, the year after 30k, this year we've been seeing up towards 250 k. It wouldn't surprise me to see a 1 mil tournament before the next international so the scene is very healthy, almost too healthy considering how packed the schedule can be at times,

 

[collige]

It's worth pointing out that Dota 2 does, in fact have league, just not ones sponsored by Valve. G-1 League, Dreamleague, and Starladder are all good examples.

 

[Squishy3]

All of Riot's points are very good.

Also add the fact that the 10 million prize pool didn't really affect DotA2's popularity. League is still constantly beating DotA on Twitch by double. League's weekly tournament matches works better in the long term.

I don't know if you've ever looked, but most of those streams are also filled with bots. Dota has been on a constant stream of growth ever since it entered beta. League still gets high viewership, but people are obsessed with proving the popularity of their game and will make bots to watch streams.

 

[lightning2k3]

I wouldn't be surprised if Valve's contribution to the baseline is $3,000,000 next year.

Also, I'd be really surprised and disappointed if Riot doesn't figure out a way to implement their own Compendium of sorts. PR talk aside, someone's in their executive suite ensuring that their new UI will support that sort of functionality. Take that to the fucking bank, boys.



I don't think anyone missed that.

Valve spends more than just the 1.6 million they put into the prizepool. They have to pay taxes on the sales of the compendium, which probably cuts at least 25% off the top. They also pay for the venue and all the organizational / production fees, like booking hotels, flights, and casters. I bet they still make money but not a killing like some of you are suggesting. The biggest value add for Valve is more people playing dota and therefore more people on steam, not the profit from a few compendiums.

 

[Arkanius]

Because it would nearly impossible to organize. Meanwhile LoL is still much bigger than Dota 2, and they don't limit themselves to one big event a year.

Know what also Riot has done?
Killed the other leagues other than the LCS

Valve takes the stance that it should be the community and third parties to organize tournaments throughout the year, and so it is. Dreamhack, ESL, Starladder are getting bigger and bigger and with their compendiums as well. Valve can do a "World Cup" a year and still make the scene prosper.

Riot is being an overprotective mother of the League scene. If Riot messes up, the scene dies with it.

Completely different strategies.

 

[Dreams-Visions]

The question is, will it get an increasingly larger sum each year and - if so - will that become an expectation to beat? Cause invariably there will be a decline.

I don't think it matters. Hypothetically, if next year's final Compendium total prize pool is $9,000,000...it's still NINE MILLION DOLLARS.

It's not like the prize pool will suddenly drop to $6 million or something. As long as Valve provides a proper baseline, it's fine. They could increase the base line to $2 million or $3 million. They're still matching Riot's top offering...before Compendium money starts rolling in.

Let Riot PR pretend they're ignoring entertaining a Compendium of their own. I'm not buying it. They're not that stupid.

Valve spends more than just the 1.6 million they put into the prizepool. They have to pay taxes on the sales of the compendium, which probably cuts at least 25% off the top. They also pay for the venue and all the organizational / production fees, like booking hotels, flights, and casters. I bet they still make money but not a killing like some of you are suggesting. The biggest value add for Valve is more people playing dota and therefore more people on steam, not the profit from a few compendiums.

lol. They're making a killing.

 

[scitek]

Yep, that's PR speak.

Yeh

 

[firehawk12]

Similarly, a 9M prize pool next year would create the subconscious (or in some cases conscious) impression that this new year is less important than last year. And that's a really bad impression for a sport to give.

This is how the WSOP top prize fluctuated after ESPN started televising the event. It has a meteoric rise before coming back down again. I don't think having it go down matters, unless it drops precipitously. Sure, fewer people probably watch it now than when it was at its peak, but there's still enough interest in Poker for ESPN to keep televising it every year. They even built the tournament around the TV airing.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Series_of_Poker#Main_Event_results

2003 Chris Moneymaker 5♦ 4♠ 2,500,000 839 Sam Farha J♥ 10♦
2004 Greg Raymer 8♠ 8♦ 5,000,000 2,576 David Williams A♥ 4♠
2005 Joe Hachem 7♣ 3♠ 7,500,000 5,619 Steve Dannenmann A♦ 3♣
2006 Jamie Gold Q♠ 9♣ 12,000,000 8,773 Paul Wasicka 10♥ 10♠
2007 Jerry Yang 8♦ 8♣ 8,250,000 6,358 Tuan Lam A♦ Q♦
2008 Peter Eastgate A♦ 5♠ 9,152,416 6,844 Ivan Demidov 4♥ 2♥
2009 Joe Cada 9♦ 9♣ 8,547,042 6,494 Darvin Moon Q♦ J♦
2010 Jonathan Duhamel A♠ J♥ 8,944,310 7,319 John Racener K♦ 8♦
2011 Pius Heinz A♠ K♣ 8,715,638 6,865 Martin Staszko 10♣ 7♣
2012 Greg Merson K♦ 5♦ 8,531,853 6,598 Jesse Sylvia Q♠ J♠
2013 Ryan Riess A♥ K♥ 8,361,570 6,352 Jay Farber Q♠ 5♠

The difference is that WSOP has a lot of other smaller tournaments to support the actual player community, and there are hundreds of other opportunities for poker pros to make money at other events. So I understand the advantage of being a consistently good LoL player, since you are probably - on average - drawing more income annually than a typical player who needs to count on the International for a big pay out.

 

[lightning2k3]

How do people become fans in the first place? In the case of the SuperBowl, NBA, World Series etc, the majority of people will be following their own teams they watch on a weekly basis.

The World Cup and the Olympics is national pride really although I know a lot of the players from the World Cup as I follow Football in the UK so know most of the players. I know bugger all about people in the Olympics though so you raise a good point.

I disagree. People don't become fans by tuning in to regular matches if they are never exposed to the sport. People become fans once they start watching a game or two and become interested and continue to follow the scene. In this case, most people probably don't even know what dota is. However, due to valve's 10 million dollar prize pool, the event was featured on ESPN2 and ESPN3, which probably exposed it to people who never watched or played eSports before. Some of them might become interested and investigate further.

 

[Beelzebubs]

I don't think it matters. Hypothetically, if next year's final Compendium total prize pool is $9,000,000...it's still NINE MILLION DOLLARS.

It's not like the prize pool will suddenly drop to $6 million or something. As long as Valve provides a proper baseline, it's fine. They could increase the base line to $2 million or $3 million. They're still matching Riot's top offering...before Compendium money starts rolling in.

Let Riot PR pretend they're ignoring entertaining a Compendium of their own. I'm not buying it. They're not that stupid.

Actually they sort of have a compendium. They sell team icons to help fund the LCS.

 

[Armaros]

All of Riot's points are very good.

Also add the fact that the 10 million prize pool didn't really affect DotA2's popularity. League is still constantly beating DotA on Twitch by double. League's weekly tournament matches works better in the long term.

When it goes tounament vs tournament viewers, LoL barely doubles Dota's twitch numbers yet has 7x the active population. (If you believe Riot's numbers)

Dota has a higher population to viewership ratio compared to League. And that ignores the fact that more and more people are watching matches from inside the client.

Sc2 has even higher ratios but that is because Sc2 can be punishingly difficult.

 

[Beelzebubs]

I disagree. People don't become fans by tuning in to regular matches if they are never exposed to the sport. People become fans once they start watching a game or two and become interested and continue to follow the scene. In this case, most people probably don't even know what dota is. However, due to valve's 10 million dollar prize pool, the event was featured on ESPN2 and ESPN3, which probably exposed it to people who never watched or played eSports before. Some of them might become interested and investigate further.

You're disagreeing after I said you raise a good point?

Anyway. I'm out of this topic as I'm done trying to argue personal preference.. Just a reminder again for the fourth time. It's all personal preference as to which one you prefer to watch. Both models have good and bad points.

 

[dave is ok]

The difference is that WSOP has a lot of other smaller tournaments to support the actual player community, and there are hundreds of other opportunities for poker pros to make money at other events. So I understand the advantage of being a consistently good LoL player, since you are probably - on average - drawing more income annually than a typical player who needs to count on the International for a big pay out.

Dota also has a lot of other smaller tournaments. LoL has none. It's LCS or nothing.

That's the main difference between the two games, Riot "owns" the LoL tournament scene. The pro players aren't allowed to play in non-Riot tournaments.

 

[danmaku]

How do people become fans in the first place? In the case of the SuperBowl, NBA, World Series etc, the majority of people will be following their own teams they watch on a weekly basis.

You can do that in Dota2 too, there's always a bunch of tournaments going on all the time. Usually, I can go home and watch some tournament game every day, with all the top teams. Production values can vary a lot between them, though.

Actually, I saw people arguing that there were too many tournaments and top teams should only be allowed to play in the bigger ones, to make room for smaller teams and avoid big games (like "el clasico") to get devalued.

 

[Lucidforest]

Didn't watch much of The International this year but from what I heard, the finals were totally boring and lame. This is likely because everyone is playing it safe because they want that money.

The money does overshadow that event.

 

[Einbroch]

I don't think it matters. Hypothetically, if next year's final Compendium total prize pool is $9,000,000...it's still NINE MILLION DOLLARS.

It's not like the prize pool will suddenly drop to $6 million or something. As long as Valve provides a proper baseline, it's fine. They could increase the base line to $2 million or $3 million. They're still matching Riot's top offering...before Compendium money starts rolling in.

Let Riot PR pretend they're ignoring entertaining a Compendium of their own. I'm not buying it. They're not that stupid.

Would make so much dosh. They already do it in a way with Championship skins and Championship ward skins.

Bundle a limited skin, a limited ward skin, a two-four week IP boost, and let the user choose a team icon. Doesn't have to be anything fancy. Make it 1350 RP. $2 from every bundle goes to prize pool. Don't need a compendium or anything complicated. Just a bundle.

Would sell gangbusters.

 

[Pureauthor]

Actually they sort of have a compendium. They sell team icons to help fund the LCS.

That's more of the indirect funding of the same sort that the USD 7.50 that the rest of the compendium does.

I think it generate a different feeling when you can see a purchase make a direct tick on the increasing prize pool.

 

[firehawk12]

Dota also has a lot of other smaller tournaments. LoL has none. It's LCS or nothing.

That's the main difference between the two games, Riot "owns" the LoL tournament scene. The pro players aren't allowed to play in non-Riot tournaments.

Oh really? I didn't know that.

Well, I guess I should just ask... who makes more money, the average LoL player or the average Dota player?

 

[Pureauthor]

Didn't watch much of The International this year but from what I heard, the finals were totally boring and lame. This is likely because everyone is playing it safe because they want that money.

The money does overshadow that event.

The finals were indeed boring and lame, but not for the reason you stated.

 

[dave is ok]

Oh really? I didn't know that.

Well, I guess I should just ask... who makes more money, the average LoL player or the average Dota player?

Depends.

Top 5 Dota teams probably make more than the top 5 LoL teams, but the 'average' LoL player probably takes home more.

 

[lightning2k3]

You're disagreeing after I said you raise a good point?

Anyway. I'm out of this topic as I'm done trying to argue personal preference.. Just a reminder again for the fourth time. It's all personal preference as to which one you prefer to watch. Both models have good and bad points.

I'm not trying to start an argument. I agree that both models have their advantages and disadvantages. I was just specifically referring to reaching out to non-traditional viewers, which is what big events are good for. Look at the Super Bowl in the US for example. Tons of people who never watch American football will watch the Superbowl, because it has almost become a cultural status thing.

 

[Einbroch]

Oh really? I didn't know that.

Well, I guess I should just ask... who makes more money, the average LoL player or the average Dota player?

That depends if you get top three consistently.

Unofficial numbers put LoL pros earning ~40k a split from Riot. Two splits a year. Obviously better teams and more famous individuals get more, but some of the lower teams and no-names get less, so it's about 40k. Then sponsors and free food/housing (obviously both of these apply to Dota 2 pros as well).

I mean, if you're a top tier team in Dota 2 you make more. If you're not a part of that top tier (top 20% of the teams), you likely make less.

 

[Beelzebubs]

Oh really? I didn't know that.

Well, I guess I should just ask... who makes more money, the average LoL player or the average Dota player?

No clue on that one, I do know that Riot pays the players wages in the LCS and they all seem to have team houses paid for, travel costs etc. they do also get sponsorship money plus whatever they make from Twitch/Youtube.

Not sure if the people who play in the challenger series are paid by Riot though as they play in other tournaments.

 

[Balb]

Oh really? I didn't know that.

Well, I guess I should just ask... who makes more money, the average LoL player or the average Dota player?

I would guess that the average LoL player makes more because they are given salaries by Riot in addition to sponsorship and stream revenue they earn on their own. I would imagine the top Dota players make more than the top LoL players because of tournament prize money.

 

[firehawk12]

Depends.

Top 5 Dota teams probably make more than the top 5 LoL teams, but the 'average' LoL player probably takes home more.

That depends if you get top three consistently.

Unofficial numbers put LoL pros earning ~40k a split from Riot. Obviously better teams and more famous individuals get more, but some of the lower teams and no-names get less, so it's about 40k. Then sponsors and free food/housing (obviously both of these apply to Dota 2 pros as well).

I mean, if you're a top tier team in Dota 2 you make more. If you're not a part of that top tier (top 20% of the teams), you likely make less.

Yeah, I'm thinking of the grinders more than the champions. I assume a game needs a healthy tournament scene in order to make playing professionally worth it. Is that an average 40k per team or per person? If it's per team, you might as well go work at Walmart and play these games as a hobby.

 

[Shorty11857]

Didn't watch much of The International this year but from what I heard, the finals were totally boring and lame. This is likely because everyone is playing it safe because they want that money.

The money does overshadow that event.

It had nothing to do with playing it safe, everything to do with the loser being completely outplayed and just trying and failing with the same strategy over and over again