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[ashecitism]

edit: see posts 42 and 43

Thread from last year where it seemed they would.UT forum link, because the one in that OP doesn't work. He hasn't been online since last October.

Then yesterday someone posted an alleged mail they got from van den Bos

Hi Josh,

We haven't contributed and won't be contributing to the new UT. I barely get by as it is and I'm simply not giving my music away for free, especially not to a huge company like Epic.

My ideas for Unatco are not a simple remix. I'm only taking very specific bits of the original and turning it into a 10-15 minute suite. Also, the Kickstarter project is only partially a remix thing, a lot of it will be new music.

Cheers,
Michiel

https://forums.unrealtournament.com...andon-won-t-be-contributing-to-the-soundtrack

Was searching for what KS he could be talking about, but only found a cancelled one where he and Brandon were planned to contribute.

I dont know. There's no proof for the mail, but just in case made the thread. Would be too bad. Was looking forward to new UT tracks by them.

 

[Nokterian]

Man that sucks Goddamn it epic why are you doing this? Those 2 guys defined UT with the music.

 

[Ouren]

Awww maaaaaannnnnnn

 

[Stitch]

There was music in UT?

 

[lazygecko]

They wouldn't be getting paid for their work? That's messed up. Good on them for not undervaluing their contributions.

 

[Teknopathetic]

There's pretty much no reason why these guys shouldn't be contributing. Epic can afford to pay these guys for some music, mindboggling that they won't.


"There was music in UT?"

Quite a bit.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i_0G6WPuss4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3otKIBNqciw

 

[diffusionx]

Why would they be expected to contribute for free? Has Epic fallen so far down that they can't pay people to produce content for them?

 

[ashecitism]

There was music in UT?

One of the best.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i_0G6WPuss4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BSjFTNfrYGo

 

[ApharmdX]

Didn't they used to be called Straylight? I always thought that the Unreal/UT composers were seriously underrated. The music in Unreal especially was awesome!

Epic should just pay them for the music.

 

[Stitch]

Can't remember any of those.

Probably turned it off. I don't need music in MP or botmatches 😎

 

[Sciz]

Baffling. For a game that's all about being for and by the fans, surely the bean counters can justify a little cash to handle the audio side of things right.

 

[ashecitism]

Didn't they used to be called Straylight? I always thought that the Unreal/UT composers were seriously underrated. The music in Unreal especially was awesome!

Yeah, though van den Bos wasn't part of it. Brandon was. It was Straylight + van den Bos on Unreal and Deus Ex. For UT only Brandon and van den Bos got credited.

 

[Xater]

I never liked the UT music. I also just turned it off.

 

[lazygecko]

Didn't they used to be called Straylight? I always thought that the Unreal/UT composers were seriously underrated. The music in Unreal especially was awesome!

Epic should just pay them for the music.

Michiel van den Bos, Alexander Brandon and Andrew Sega were part of a tracker scene music group called Five Musicians. I had heard their music before playing the first Unreal and was completely blown away by how good it was.

Necros (Andrew Sega) - Tangerine Fascination

 

[OverdriveOtaku]

"There was music in UT?"

Just curious, but is there a specific reason why you always quote posts like that?

And yes, UT's music was really cool, helped give the game it's identity imo.

 

[giant_frying_pan]

I didn't even notice any music. As with Q3A, it's the SFX that matters.

(With all due respect to the composers of both games)

 

[gondwana]

One of the best.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i_0G6WPuss4

Channeling LTJ Bukem/Good Looking Records there. So good.

 

[chronic_archaic]

Damn. Facing Worlds is still stuck in my head to this day. Always set the mood with it being at night time and all.

 

[aerts1js]

The music in UT was great; these guys should contribute and get paid for it.

 

[PixyJunket]

I absolutely LOVED how Epic MegaGames used demoscene musicians and .mods back then, it put their stuff on another level for me.

Star Control 2 as well.

Ah, now I'm doing memories of recording stuff from modarchive.org on cassettes for road trips.

 

[Coulomb_Barrier]

Music in UT was amazing.

But who made the music in the original Unreal? That is genuinely the G.O.A.T game music for me.

EDIT: Ok cool explained above.

 

[ashecitism]

But who made the music in the original Unreal? That is genuinely the G.O.A.T game music for me.

Yeah, though van den Bos wasn't part of it. Brandon was. It was Straylight + van den Bos on Unreal and Deus Ex. For UT only Brandon and van den Bos got credited.

namely

Alexander Brandon
Andrew G. Sega
Dan Gardopée
Michiel van den Bos

edit: see your edit

 

[Neuromancer]

There was music in UT?

Yes and it was fantastic. I guess not everyone paid attention but for me it was a huge part of the experience.

 

[JeremyEtcetera]

I think the game's soundtrack will be fine if they can find someone who does a close enough/great enough job. The Halo 5 composers did an amazing job of mixing old with new.

 

[NumberThree]

Just curious, but is there a specific reason why you always quote posts like that?

It's cause they're not so good with computers.

You could say they're

Spoiler

Teknopathetic

 

[QuantumZebra]

Wait so the people behind the music for Deus Ex = the same ones for UT??


IT ALL MAKES SO MUCH SENSE NOW!!!

 

[Mupod]

UT has maybe one of the most memorable main menu themes of all time IMO.

Also I've been an Alexander Brandon fan as far back as Tyrian so that original gaf thread really had me hyped. I wonder if there's still some way to get them on board.

 

[Sciz]

Wait so the people behind the music for Deus Ex = the same ones for UT??


IT ALL MAKES SO MUCH SENSE NOW!!!

Alexander Brandon was absolutely on fire from 1995 up through 2000 or so. Everything he worked on has the same sort of signature sound all over it.

 

[Synth]

See... this is why when those "Japan vs West" thread pop up everyone act like nobody outside of Japan makes decent game soundtracks. It's simply a case that the industry doesn't value their contributions enough to keep them around consistently.

 

[Teknopathetic]

"See... this is why when those "Japan vs West" thread pop up everyone act like nobody outside of Japan makes decent game soundtracks. It's simply a case that the industry doesn't value their contributions enough to keep them around consistently."


Well, I'd also say that half of those posters wouldn't acknowledge anything made outside of Japan as being good regardless of that fact.

 

[AuthenticM]

They should get Frank Klepacki to score the game.

 

[Synth]

"Well, I'd also say that half of those posters wouldn't acknowledge anything made outside of Japan as being good regardless of that fact.

Well that's true as well I guess... but it's certainly not helping when many of the best composers have to look outside of the industry, just to make ends meet. I remember reading Tim Follin's blog a while back, and he mentioned creating a jingle for an call answering service.... I mean, what the fuck?

 

[The Boat]

Damnit Epic, just pay up!

 

[Deleted member 80556]

Just curious, but is there a specific reason why you always quote posts like that?

Oh God, this is going to bother me a lot now.

 

[nikos]

That's disappointing. UT had one of the best soundtracks of all time. I still listen to it on occasion.

I actually started a concept for the new game a few months ago. It's still early in production, and completely different than what I'm used to producing, but you can check it out here:

https://soundcloud.com/nikostoscani/ut4wip/s-lwwVU

 

[Nzyme32]

I have nothing else to say

 

[vocab]

There was music in UT?

dude. What? The music was amazing. The title music. Deck 16, ORGANIC. A lot of great tracks.

 

[Granadier]

 

[lazygecko]

Other games Five Musicians members worked on:

Crusader: No Remorse & No Regret (Apart from Wasteland this series was the other big inspiration source for Fallout with its isometric ultra violence)
Age of Wonders (Even recycles some of the melodies and segments heard in Unreal)
Unreal 2 (This is one of the only tracks in the soundtrack actually made by Alexander Brandon, and is unsurprisingly the best one in the game.)

Nighthawk is a contemporary tracker musician who may as well have been part of the Unreal/UT soundtracks.

 

[BHK3]

See... this is why when those "Japan vs West" thread pop up everyone act like nobody outside of Japan makes decent game soundtracks. It's simply a case that the industry doesn't value their contributions enough to keep them around consistently.

I want to say its more of our sci-fi being more into atmosphere and feel rather than anything else. Unreal, Deus Ex, Mass Effect have deep heavy and droning tones to it. I can't think of anything japan related that has Ambient/Trance hop music in it aside from some Ghost in the Shell.

UT2K4 - Tokara Forest
Championship 2 - Desencion

These songs for example wasn't made by the original UT'99 composers, so can't they try to get Kevin Riepl, Starsky Partridge or Will Nevins who composed unreal championship 1/2 to UT2K4? Even Jesper Kyd and Da Gawd himself Rom Di Prisco helped with UT3's ost which shifted more back to electronica. We don't have a name yet but basically if they get any of the people above we're not gonna be in for a bad ride...though I would prefer the original composers.

UT3 Rom Di Prisco & Jesper Kyd - Mekalopolis ugh just so good

 

[ApharmdX]

Michiel van den Bos, Alexander Brandon and Andrew Sega were part of a tracker scene music group called Five Musicians. I had heard their music before playing the first Unreal and was completely blown away by how good it was.

Necros (Andrew Sega) - Tangerine Fascination

Yeah, though van den Bos wasn't part of it. Brandon was. It was Straylight + van den Bos on Unreal and Deus Ex. For UT only Brandon and van den Bos got credited.

Thanks for the clarification. Yeah, these dudes did good work. And I also think that game composers in the West don't get nearly enough credit.

 

[ashecitism]

Brandon posted in tlast year's thread

https://forums.unrealtournament.com...l-UT-Composer)&p=208029&viewfull=1#post208029

Greetings everyone,

It's easy to get confused if communication doesn't take place. So to clarify, Michiel and I wrote a revised title theme and submitted it. Whether it is in, I'm not sure. But we won't be providing additional music. This isn't because we don't want to, or that we demand unreasonable things, or that our "time is gone" (both of us have written quite a bit of music since, just not for UT, and things just change, it's the way of this and other industries... Alexander Courage was the original composer for Star Trek but half a dozen composers have taken on Star Trek scores since then). It's because this is a community built game, and compensation to us wouldn't be fair to the other community composers. I totally understand this, Michiel understands this, Epic understands it. And yes, the difference between the community writers and us is that this is our living and how we pay our bills.

Having said that I can't lie: it's a huge, huge bummer. But we understand and accept the rationale and look forward to playing the great new content being developed by a new breed of developer, and hope you continue to listen to our tunes, as we will never stop writing!

-Alex

https://forums.unrealtournament.com...l-UT-Composer)&p=208123&viewfull=1#post208123

There is an alternate route that still gets the fans new music, still under discussion.

 

[ashecitism]

Van den Bos also posted

https://forums.unrealtournament.com...l-UT-Composer)&p=209573&viewfull=1#post209573

Someone told me this thread hadn't died yet, and some clarification was needed. I see Alex has beaten me to the punch, so I'll just mirror his sentiments. When this is your job, and it's not like I'm raking in the dough or anything, I'll provide some music for free if I have the spare time to make any tunes between jobs. Giving it away to a company that has the means to compensate us fairly just feels...wrong, especially when you do this to pay the bills which is an obligation I have to meet through paid work.

It's a gigantic letdown, because I was absolutely psyched to revisit Unreal Tournament. I wasn't just a composer on the original, but I've played particularly UT99 and UT2k4 completely to death, so I'm also a huge fan of the franchise. I doubt I'll be able to rack up frags today with my diminished reaction-skills but that's beside the point

Maybe Epic will come around, maybe they won't, but this iteration of UT looks stunning and I'm happy to see so much talent on display.

Like Alex said, we're going to be doing our own thing soon. Details will follow at a later date. If you wish to stay updated, give us a Like:

https://www.facebook.com/mvdbos/
https://www.facebook.com/Alexander-Brandon-96845182620/

I want to thank each and every one of you for the overwhelming, largely positive response to this topic. It's a shame it didn't pan out, but stay tuned.

Jim Brown responded

Just for the sake of clarity, we did have many long conversations with the UT composers; some chose to contribute, some did not. With those that did not contribute, we did discuss several forms of compensation, but were unable to come to terms that satisfied everyone involved. AFAIK there's no bad blood, and we have stayed in touch on and off through the months (often just on a personal note - we're fans here as well, and I look at some of these guys as friends after our years of working together). And of course, we'd openly welcome their involvement in the future, especially once we're out of pre-alpha and have more established systems in place.

and van den Bos again

Yeah, should have mentioned that there is no bad blood whatsoever. Everything was handled amicably and dialogue between us and Jim/Steve was well handled. We just didn't reach an agreement that suited all parties. Hopefully things will change in the future. Thanks, Jim!

Cheers,
Michiel