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[El-Suave]

What the hell.

No, what the fuck.

Everyone is entitled to their own opinions and likes or dislikes but I simply do NOT understand the almost universal hate for DS3.

DS 1 & 2 are some of my favorite games of this gen, more so for their survival horror attributes and audio design than anything else. I started DS3 expecting to be MISERABLE and OMFG MASS EFFECT SPACE OF DUTY DUDE BRO CO OP...and what I got instead...was Dead Space.

Wtf.

YES it isn't as scary and YES it does have more action sequences and YES there are areas that are locked behind co-op walls and that absolutely fucking blows but...its still dead space. You are never FORCED to co op, EVER. I played most of the game on my own and that feeling of dread and overwhelming isolation is still there. The voice acting was on point, the terror is still there and by all accounts the fact that you do end up facing A GREAT DEAL more enemies at once makes things all the more difficult.

And the game has Kain...KAIN. How can you hate?

Games don't exist in a vacuum. We've had multiple examples of games where the single player experience was impacted by the inclusion of co op and we've had games where the single player campaigns apparently were just glorified tutorials to lead you to the multiplayer, which was the feature that was advertised first and heavily.
It's good if what Visceral told us about the single player game was true, but you can't blame people of being sceptical when they've been burned in the past.
Even if co op or multiplayer is your biggest new feature - if you still have a good, full single player experience, then talk about that first if that's what made your games great in the past. I don't like the way they're marketing games like DS3 or the new God of War to me. As a result I won't buy them at launch.
I'm glad if the franchise is alive though.

 

[nel e nel]

I wonder how much this stuff adds to the cost of development, quite alot I would guess. Especially with it being added for the first time in DS3. How about the unwanted (by most people I'm guessing) multiplayer in DS2? If EA would just keep the scope of the game simpler and more DS1 style instead of trying to make it dude-bro shooter 57 they would be better off IMO.

Not as much as you would think is my guess. I've played through the game twice now, and have put in several hours in the co-op, and the majority of the cut scenes are exactly the same except that Carver is in a different location in the scene (most of the time it's inserting him off on the side, or removing him altogether). There are some extra flavor bits for Carter to make his co-op missions tie into the game more seamlessly, but they are very short.

There are only 3 co-op missions, and as per the complaints in the OT, most of the side quests are cut-and-paste variations of the same environments.

 

[.la1n]

I enjoyed Dead Space 3, not nearly as much as 1 and for the most part 2 but it was by no means a horrid game, just bogged down with shoveled in microtransactions and gears of war style gun play that was more frustrating than fun.

 

[nel e nel]

I enjoyed Dead Space 3, not nearly as much as 1 and for the most part 2 but it was by no means a horrid game, just bogged down with shoveled in microtransactions and gears of war style gun play that was more frustrating than fun.

How do you feel the microtransactions bogged it down? I keep seeing statements like this but no real explanation as to why people felt that way.

I've played through twice now (solo Impossible & Classic mode), and have put several hours into the co-op and haven't felt any decrease in the pacing because of them.

 

[electroshockwave]

Respect.

=========================================================



it makes sense now.

I hope EA stop the whole forced mainstreaming thing

Dude, cut this

=========================================================

shit out.

PEACE

 

[jello44]

How do you feel the microtransactions bogged it down? I keep seeing statements like this but no real explanation as to why people felt that way.

I've played through twice now (solo Impossible & Classic mode), and have put several hours into the co-op and haven't felt any decrease in the pacing because of them.

I don't know what game he played, but it wasn't DS3, in no way was I ever "bogged down" because of the barely noticeable Microtransactions. Hell, I probably would have never even known about them had the internet not made a big stink about them.

 

[jrcbandit]

Most of the complaints are from people who never played the game, or maybe only played chapter 1 ;p. Microtransactions are not noticeable and the only meaningful purchase can be bought using in game currency. I have played through the game twice and never used the roll or crouch/cover, and there really aren't very many battles against humans where necromorphs aren't also present. The Coop is completely optional and has no real impact on the story, the only unique aspect is the 3 optional side missions that tell some of carver's backstory and take place in the same type of structures as the other optional side missions...

It's a shame that there might not be a DS4 due to all the people hating on the new aspects of the game and writing it off. I do dislike some aspects of the game like the horribly lame love triangle, reuse of areas in side missions, backtracking in chapter 18, and I wish there was more variety in how the encounters happen with the necromorphs. But overall I felt it was a successful dead space game and quite fun solo or co-op. I enjoyed making all sorts of weapons and if they make sequels I hope this is kept except let one carry 3 or 4 of the hybrid weapons. I am not sure how I feel about universal ammo, there is probably some compromise that could be used to have some ammo limitations while allowing for the variety that crafting brings.

 

[GavinGT]

I don't doubt they're making another Dead Space, but I'm willing to bet DS3 sold like dogshit.

 

[luxarific]

I'm not sure who the source is for that article but much of it is completely false based on my knowledge.

Yes! Best news I've had all day. Think I will go celebrate by getting a bit further in my DS3 classic playthrough.

 

[nhlducks35]

The only sales info we have so far is that DS3 sales were down 26% from DS2 sales in its first week in the UK.

 

[Darkmakaimura]

I don't quite get all the hate for the game either, with maybe some exceptions like the save system. We've been through a spacecraft and a space station so the next step was a planet, with lots of natural caverns and whatnot. Everything in this game looked great and yeah, there was more action, but it was more like the Aliens of the two other 'Alien' DS games but with even a lot less "dudebro". Lots of people loved Extraction and it was far less scary and much more repetitive than any of the other mainstream games but I guess that, and the fact it was a Wii game gives it a pass. I might be the only one here who will say DS3 actually exceeded my expectations and given what we learned in DS2, ended pretty much how I expected it to.

 

[Deadbeat]

So are we in the stage now (like with DmC with the poor sales) where we start blaming gamers for avoiding a game they dont want?

I didnt buy Dead Space 3 because they took the game in a direction I dont want to play. Thats not my problem in the end.

 

[Quesa]

Dat dev laziness. I don't hear enough about it. Tell me more.

One time, at the multimillion-dollar corporation I worked for, I decided to take a break from my 50+ hour workweek for a quick look at r/clopclop and a trip to the toilet. When I got back, my boss told me they had axed the next game in the franchise I was working on because of my irresponsibility.

 

[drspeedy]

I'm not sure who the source is for that article but much of it is completely false based on my knowledge

I wanted nothing more than to read this in this thread. Very, very glad to get it direct from you, man.

 

[TheFLYINGManga_Ka]

Not surprised by the low sales if it's true.

It's not just the co-op, but I know the microtransactions might have had some negative impact on spreading the word about the game.

Also, for some reason I didn't feel the hype the 2nd one had. The first one was a sleeper hit that gradually became a classic because of word of mouth and good reviews. The 2nd one had a lot of hype. The third one really didn't scream out.

Wonder why. The co-op? Microtransactions? Franchise-fatigue and other releases?

 

[AppleMIX]

So are we in the stage now (like with DmC with the poor sales) where we start blaming gamers for avoiding a game they dont want?

I didnt buy Dead Space 3 because they took the game in a direction I dont want to play. Thats not my problem in the end.

Dead Space 3 is very much a Dead Space game. So yes, it is your problem for buying into the whole shoot-bang nonsense. If the game was radically different I could see a point, but it wasn't.

 

[ArkkAngel007]

Not surprised by the low sales if it's true.

It's not just the co-op, but I know the microtransactions might have had some negative impact on spreading the word about the game.

Also, for some reason I didn't feel the hype the 2nd one had. The first one was a sleeper hit that gradually became a classic because of word of mouth and good reviews. The 2nd one had a lot of hype. The third one really didn't scream out.

Wonder why. The co-op? Microtransactions? Franchise-fatigue and other releases?

Maybe folks should learn to focus on the mechanics and execution of such features, rather than shitting bricks at the mere mention of them?

Can't see how there would be franchise fatigue in a rather modest franchise, while there wasn't a ton at the time of release. This month there is, but nothing earth shattering near enough to make that much of an impact.

 

[bigdaddygamebot]

Dat dev laziness. I don't hear enough about it. Tell me more.

Have you played Dead Space 3?

Have you played the first two Dead Space games?

Something went wrong during the development cycle. It could be laziness as much as anything else.

I doubt we'll ever really get to find out.

 

[nephilimdj]

suffered from same problem as fear 3, trying to change it up after creating a fanbase on a niche.

still hope, still could remake dead space ios as a xbla/psn game.

 

[Pachterballs]

so EA is the good guy again guys?

 

[Valnen]

so EA is the good guy again guys?

They're that guy that's sometimes good but most of the time tries to screw to protagonist (consumer) over.

 

[BurnOutBrighter]

Universal ammo. What a horrible idea. Way to encourage weapon variation and different strategies.

 

[itzknickknac]

EA continues determined to kill every *good* series it has.

This is pretty much my impression of EA

 

[victimroyalty]

Stopped playing like a quarter of the way into the Second. Traded it in on Game Stop's 50 percent more bonus for Tomb Raider. Didn't care for it like I did the first one. Didn't even think of getting the third.

 

[CosmicGroinPull]

Hopefully not. I enjoyed it a lot more than 2, and loved the snow setting and changes it brought; along with the alien sheit.

Universal ammo sped up the game for me but screw the two weapon limit and clunky upgrade system.

 

[Replicant]

You are never FORCED to co op, EVER.

This is not true at all. Without using co-op, you're effectively denied from ever accessing those 3 sub-missions, thereby preventing you from ever completing the game 100% or even collecting some of the files/artifacts.

They told us that co-op wouldn't affect the SP but that's not true at all. I'm fine with co-op/MP but my 100% completion of the game should never be tied to whether or not I join a MP part of the game. But this is clearly not the case with DS3.

 

[Tacitus_]

This is not true at all. Without using co-op, you're effectively denied from ever accessing those 3 sub-missions, thereby preventing you from ever completing the game 100% or even collecting some of the files/artifacts.

They told us that co-op wouldn't affect the SP but that's not true at all. I'm fine with co-op/MP but my 100% completion of the game should never be tied to whether or not I join a MP part of the game. But this is clearly not the case with DS3.

But the co-op doesn't affect single player at all? Like you said, it affects 100% completion.

 

[TheOddOne]

Weird tweet by head of Yager (Spec Ops).

 

[Replicant]

But the co-op doesn't affect single player at all? Like you said, it affects 100% completion.

Let's not act like you don't understand what I'm talking about here. It is affect single player because the 100% completion is also related to the single-player experience. Many of the files and artifacts won't be available to you otherwise. And why should 100% completion tied to MP at all? Why am I buying a game where I am not allowed to access part of it unless I play co-op with someone? If the co-op had been clearly separated from the main storyline that would have been fine. But no, the anything that you don't do in the MP, affects your SP completion. Unless my SP completion said 100% then I am not going to be satisifed. And this is not the case with Dead Space 3 unless you also play the MP.

 

[Tunesmith]

Was this posted yet?

From this story:
http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articl...ce-4-cancelled-as-series-sales-decline-report

Comment #22 from a GAF favourite;

Standard, shoddy website journalism recipe, born out of a desperate need to increase click-thru rates to support advertising revenue. Fabricate a story using an "unnamed source", post it first thing in the morning, add the letters" EA" to the story (oh, and link it to micro-transactions - always a fan favourite) and then stand back and enjoy the vitriol which you turn into revenue. Rinse and repeat...

http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articl...-as-series-sales-decline-report#comment-62914

 

[Mario]

by fatigue you mean laziness from the devs?

I've never met a lazy dev.

 

[EYEL1NER]

It may have been fake, but it definitely reads like something that could have been true. I could easily see something using similar wording having come out for some of the other dead EA games that only sold, oh say 4.5 million copies instead of 5 million.

 

[captainnapalm]

Dead Space 3 is very much a Dead Space game. So yes, it is your problem for buying into the whole shoot-bang nonsense. If the game was radically different I could see a point, but it wasn't.

That's true. Visceral didn't deserve the dudebro jibes.

Anyway, I'm glad the original story is false.

 

[Tacitus_]

Let's not act like you don't understand what I'm talking about here. It is affect single player because the 100% completion is also related to the single-player experience. Many of the files and artifacts won't be available to you otherwise. And why should 100% completion tied to MP at all? Why am I buying a game where I am not allowed to access part of it unless I play co-op with someone? If the co-op had been clearly separated from the main storyline that would have been fine. But no, the anything that you don't do in the MP, affects your SP completion. Unless my SP completion said 100% then I am not going to be satisifed. And this is not the case with Dead Space 3 unless you also play the MP.

Yes, I'm being contrarian for the sake of being one, but why should 100% completion be tied to singleplayer alone? You ge the full singleplayer experience just fine, but to get everything, you need to dip into co-op for a couple missions.

 

[Replicant]

Yes, I'm being contrarian for the sake of being one, but why should 100% completion be tied to singleplayer alone? You ge the full singleplayer experience just fine, but to get everything, you need to dip into co-op for a couple missions.

Oh, it's good that you realize that. Because most people don't buy Dead Space to play MP game. Dead Space was originally a single-player game and the focus of this game still is a SP game. Why do you think there's so much complaining about the co-op if people actually want it? Why do you think people didn't even bother buying DS3 the minute they heard about the forced co-op?

If and when Dead Space becomes a full MP game, then that's when I and many others will quit buying the game. But as long as it is a mainly a SP game then I expect to be able to 100% complete the game playing on my own and not having parts of the game blocked unless I play MP.

 

[Moff]

That's true. Visceral didn't deserve the dudebro jibes.

Anyway, I'm glad the original story is false.

visceral dont need to be addressed, it was obviously EAs decision.
viscereal are the ones who need to be complimented that they still managed to deliver a good dead space game with those assignment.

 

[Tacitus_]

Oh, it's good that you realize that. Because most people don't buy Dead Space to play MP game. Dead Space was originally a single-player game and the focus of this game still is a SP game. Why do you think there's so much complaining about the co-op if people actually want it? Why do you think people didn't even bother buying DS3 the minute they heard about the forced co-op?

If and when Dead Space becomes a full MP game, then that's when I and many others will quit buying the game. But as long as it is a mainly a SP game then I expect to be able to 100% complete the game playing on my own and not having parts of the game blocked unless I play MP.

It's not really forced now, is it? Because additional side missions don't count as forced in my book.

 

[Replicant]

It's not really forced now, is it? Because additional side missions don't count as forced in my book.

Well, it counts as forced in my book because otherwise I can't 100% complete the game. They could have easily made that part playable only as Carver but no, you just have to play it with another person.

And you can spin it anyway you like but as long as players are not allowed to complete the SP by playing on their own without having to do MP then there'll be more and more people refusing to buy games like DS3. If you want to create a MP games then be honest about it upfront by making a full MP game so the rest of us who are not interested in MP games can skip the game completely and not waste our money. IF you're making a SP game then it should be able to be completed 100% without MP getting in the way.

 

[Massa]

Oh, it's good that you realize that. Because most people don't buy Dead Space to play MP game. Dead Space was originally a single-player game and the focus of this game still is a SP game. Why do you think there's so much complaining about the co-op if people actually want it? Why do you think people didn't even bother buying DS3 the minute they heard about the forced co-op?

If and when Dead Space becomes a full MP game, then that's when I and many others will quit buying the game. But as long as it is a mainly a SP game then I expect to be able to 100% complete the game playing on my own and not having parts of the game blocked unless I play MP.

You're acting like "Dead Space" is some immutable thing that was defined when you purchased the original game and all games for the rest of time have to follow that mold. That's now how things work.

Also I haven't seen any complaints about co-op in Dead Space 3 aside from a random poster here and there. On the contrary, I've seen quite a few people like it. The people who don't want it simply play it without co-op and managed to that just fine.

 

[Tacitus_]

Well, it counts as forced in my book because otherwise I can't 100% complete the game. They could have easily made that part playable only as Carver but no, you just have to play it with another person.

And you can spin it anyway you like but as long as players are not allowed to complete the SP by playing on their own without having to do MP then there'll be more and more people refusing to buy games like DS3. If you want to create a MP games then be honest about it upfront by making a full MP game so the rest of us who are not interested in MP games can skip the game completely and not waste our money. IF you're making a SP game then it should be able to be completed 100% without MP getting in the way.

But you can complete the SP by playing your own. You can't achieve total completion of the game by playing alone. Two different things.

 

[Replicant]

You're acting like "Dead Space" is some immutable thing that was defined when you purchased the original game and all games for the rest of time have to follow that mold. That's now how things work.

The game was sold on the premise that it's a horror game with some action in it. It worked so well in DS1 because the single experience intensify the terror that goes with playing it. If they're not going to change directions then be honest about it and don't deceive those who want to enjoy the game as it was.

And look at the majority of complaints in DS3. It's always the same thing about how the game is not scary because they lessened the solitary experience part of it. Also, changing the game to involve MP works so well in the case of DS3.....not. Look at the complaints about the save system, which was brought on due to the MP as well.

Also I haven't seen any complaints about co-op in Dead Space 3 aside from a random poster here and there. On the contrary, I've seen quite a few people like it specially if they're playing as Isaac (or the other one, can't remember). The people who don't want it simply play it without co-op and managed to that just fine.

It's like you purposely miss some of the threads when the MP was first revealed. Ditto with the OT and some of the comments in theis thread.

But you can complete the SP by playing your own. You can't achieve total completion of the game by playing alone. Two different things.

Some of the files and artifacts that are related to the storyline and no, they are not two different things on a game that advertised itself as a SP game.

 

[dr_rus]

DS2 lost the story of DS1, DS3 lost the vision of previous games. The game is so generic now that I see no point in continuing this series into next gen. Even if DS4 isn't cancelled they probably should cancel it - and let Visceral work on something new and unique instead. This series has ran out of steam a couple of years ago. That doesn't mean that DS3 is a bad game - it's not - it's just that that's right here is the point where they should stop beating that horse and go find a new way to travel.

 

[JehutyRunner]

Taken from GamesIndustry's story on the VG report.

 

[nel e nel]

Oh, it's good that you realize that. Because most people don't buy Dead Space to play MP game. Dead Space was originally a single-player game and the focus of this game still is a SP game. Why do you think there's so much complaining about the co-op if people actually want it? Why do you think people didn't even bother buying DS3 the minute they heard about the forced co-op?

If and when Dead Space becomes a full MP game, then that's when I and many others will quit buying the game. But as long as it is a mainly a SP game then I expect to be able to 100% complete the game playing on my own and not having parts of the game blocked unless I play MP.

Most people also don't buy games to appease their completionist/OCD tendencies either.

 

[Freki]

Videogamer gives a rundown of the events before and after their publication of these rumors:

link

 

[I NEED SCISSORS]

Taken from GamesIndustry's story on the VG report.

http://i.imgur.com/b0VklKW.jpg[/IM][/QUOTE]

Peter Moore is awesome.

 

[distantmantra]

Most people also don't buy games to appease their completionist/OCD tendencies either.

I'm glad I'm not the only one. Sure feels that way at times.

 

[Replicant]

Most people also don't buy games to appease their completionist/OCD tendencies either.

They may or they may not is irrelevant. A game that advertises itself as SP game has no right of expecting player to play MP to see all of the storylines. Isn't Carver part of the SP game? Yes. Do you know what his background story is about without playing the MP? NO.

 

[MulderWasTaken]

Why EA commented on the topic? I thought they don't comment on rumors. How come? So, a rumor is true if they don't comment on it.

 

[GrotesqueBeauty]

Whether you enjoy Dead Space 3 regardless of the changes in the franchise is obviously a subjective thing, but anyone claiming there hasn't been a real shift in focus from the original to its present incarnation either has a terrible memory or lack of analytical insight. You always shot at necromorphs is such a superficial and flimsy response to complaints about the balance of gameplay and story elements it hardly deserves a response. A lot of us "haters" were drawn to the series because of the thoughtful structure and relative restraint of the presentation in the first game.

Although a more reasoned argument could probably be made for the merits of the sequels as something different it doesn't negate that most of the changes, more fluid mechanics aside, are a dumbing down of the original formula for a more status quo focus on the same shit we get from the majority of blockbuster shooters throughout the generation. But I don't see those intelligent arguments coming from the people taking up the game's defence. If the current attitude is anything to go by they'd swallow anything they're given short of a complete shit show. I often hear it posed that to dislike the direction of the franchise means you're just a crotchety bastard who will rail unnecessarily against anything just because, but I'd like to flip that line of attack on its head and propse maybe some people just don't give the first game due credit for how good it really was, or recognize the definite and easily identifiable design choices that elevated it to cult status in a generation where technically competent shooters are a dime a dozen. But hey, maybe I'm just crazy and resource management, pacing, enemy patterns, persistent interactivity, narrative focus, suspense and atmosphere building are all incidental as long as pew pew pew.