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"Save Our SIFTD"

Darturas

Neo Member
Shane, you talk about the value your community provides and the need for it to grow, so I think it's important you understand how unpleasant it is to read your user comments section. They're organized in such a way that people can't follow responses clearly.

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- It's unclear whether the newest comment is added to the top or bottom of the comments section.

- Direct "replies" to a comment get placed directly under that comment, resulting in a sandwich of old comments above and below the new one. The GT comments section under a video worked much better than this. Newest comment is at the top and any reply would just quote the comment being replied to.

- there is no time stamp to a comment. Just "x hours ago" up until 24 and then "x days ago." Looking at your "SOS" article, almost everything says "2 days ago" and feels very unspecific.

- If I feel this confused trying to read the comments section and you have only 50-100 active users who have posted in comments of that article, god forbid we ever see how the confusing mess that section would be if you had the "few thousand" you need to be sustainable.

- As a preemptive response, if you're to argue that deep discussion is not meant to happen in comments and that's what your forums are for, then I feel your mind is in a place that's not open to feedback. Stop excusing your poor design/business decisions with solutions that assume users will jump over 2-3 extra hurdles, as you have multiple times in this GAF thread, already.
 

Alucrid

Banned
I get that people fall into habits and human nature keeps them from wanting to break them, but a lot of the feedback I see about the site shows that people haven't actually used it. For instance, folks saying there's nothing that explains what the site does. Aside from the about page, there's a huge link in the header that says "Start Here." It explains everything the site does. It appears we need to look for a way to make it more visible, though. Or people saying it's no different from an RSS feed or a message board. It's simply not true. You may eventually get the same thing from those other vehicles, but you're going to spend a lot more time doing it. Again, I realize that many young folks do not yet look at their time as money or just simply like the community where they get their news and are willing to spend the extra time.

why does the "start here" link lead to a "pro tips" section? it doesn't even explain what siftd is in the introductory paragraph. it's also a lot to expect someone to read through to get the gist of how to use the site in a format that's really not all that pleasing to browse.
 

Stumpokapow

listen to the mad man
Personally, as a married guy in his 30s, if I suddenly had less time to read gaming sites, here's what I would do:
- Follow @Wario64 for gaming deals (Free: Business model is Amazon affiliate revenue)
- Follow @RobotBrush for gaming news (Free: Business model is having a day job)
- If I really want more gaming news, follow @NESbot_feed (Free: No business model)
- Bookmark metacritic.com/games/ and check once a week or so (Business model: Uh, advertising I guess? I don't know?)
- Probably use the front page of the stores of the console I own or Steam's front page (Business model: They make money off of you buying games)

Maybe a good jumping off point is "How does my site improve on the above?"

I would think that a site marketed towards serious adults who don't have time to mess around on gaming websites all day would have to offer a value add over doing what I suggested above. Interviews, reviews, and previews don't add value at all -- the whole point of not having enough time to mess around is that you don't have enough time to mess around. I definitely wouldn't want to talk part in a message board because, again, the whole point of not having time to mess around is that you don't have time to mess around. Put another way: I don't think personalities or writing or content is a value add to the target demographic of people who already confess to not having the time to follow existing personalities or writing or content.

Probably the only way I see a website being able to improve on the above would be a site that has thumbs up and thumbs down buttons and uses machine learning to deduce what games I care about and thus filters the above feeds to only show me things I care about. The value add would have to be algorithmic. You seem to recognize this, because the SIFTD pro tips page says you can select genres you like, but this is the 1995 prehistoric way of interpreting what users like and don't like -- if I knew a way to specify what content I wanted, I would have need for content aggregation, because I'd already find it. The ideal thing would be a site that reads my mind and only shows me the things I want to see. Use behavioural measures to update your beliefs about what a given user wants.

Most of the other stuff on the pro tips page seem to directly undermine the site's core point and turn it into a power user thing. Power users are people who have enormous amounts of time and want to use their time to control their experience. Your pitch was for people who have very limited time and need a quick overview of what's going on in gaming. So that seems like maybe the issue is actually that it's not clear who the audience ought to be at all. I don't really see any way that there can be a value add for power users because they already have bookmarks and RSS feeds and Twitter and Twitch and...

As it is right now it seems like the site is more designed to be a replacement for the old GameTrailers community, just without the budget to produce as much original content and so relying on external curation to plug the gaps. That's fine, I know a lot of people loved GameTrailers, but I didn't really use it much. My impression from what I saw at GameTrailers is that it had two unique selling points: 1) It was all video at a time where a lot of sites were text; 2) It had personalities and shows built around personalities. I don't think either of those are unique selling points anymore, which is why I think GameTrailers doesn't exist anymore and I don't think a revival is likely to work.

Just from a quick 5 second check, Siftd is not a responsive website. The menu bar tries to be, I guess, but the body content isn't. I also clicked E3 2017 from the menu and then the page it brought me to lost the main navigation bar so I had to go back to the home page to navigate again. Of course all the platform navigation requires an account, so I don't actually know what any of it does. Then I clicked bookmarks and it brought me to a full screen login page with no navigation. So I pressed back on my browser and got trapped in a loop where I couldn't escape the login page. Same thing happened when I tried to press back from the registration page. I tried looking into the community section to see whether it had the promised land of mature non-confrontational discussion but I have to register to read so I can't actually know, and I don't plan on registering for a website. Also your website isn't HTTPS. Just generally trying to spend time on the site it wasn't that intuitive and I ran into a bunch of little things pretty quickly.

The design is also sort of goofy. Grey and black as the dominant colours, the two main fonts clash a bit, the css border-radius corners on everything, the reaction counts below the stories don't have tooltips to say what they refer to, the huge full-banner overlays of READ or WATCH on the stories don't seem to add value commensurate with the space they take up. I dunno. I just felt like it didn't really pop to me in terms of conveying the information.
 

Justinh

Member
Yeah the only good content on Siftd is Pachter Factor and I just watch that on Youtube for free (I did follow him on Twitter as requested). Where is the rest of this content? It's not like they're gonna be the next EZA or Noclip, and if the content they are putting out is all locked behind a paywall then why should I even care? Not even sure if it was a good idea, the tech seemed solid but the execution was poor. Good luck to them but I just see no value in their original content and or paying for their aggregation services.

I find it telling that you say that Pachter Factor is the only good content they make, as it's their only show that goes free.

As I say in the comments page linked in the OP, I think the podcast should go free after a week at the very least (meaning I think other shows should go free too).

I like the shows they make, namely GIFE (kinda like a show where Mr. Satterfield goes over recent thoughts in his head on camera, it's always interesting), and Dossier, which is basically GT's Release Calander with some metrics imposed on it like one for amount of buzz coming from the SIFTD community and one for "editor's feel" or however they call it. Those ratings have had me go back and check out games I was basically ignoring, and while my opinion hasn't changed on an upcoming game it has got me to actually give a game a better, more informed look before I dismissed it.

I think more shows should be released publically, especially the podcast because it's expected these days (and it's my fav gaming podcast) and Dossier because it's actually useful.

Really though, I'm paying to support the curation (accounts for curation is free now, though). Because of articles that show up in my sift, I'll read articles that I've found interesting that I would've never seen otherwise (I ain't going to Polygon or Kotaku on my own...). The Oral History of FF7 I saw because of SIFTD. (I did see a thread on GAF for this one the day later, though.) There was also like... a series of articles of gaming around the world that I found interesting and one that eurogamer did about like... "shooter arcades" in Japan
 

Kysen

Member
With some YTs making it in only their bed rooms there is no reason to be blowing so much cash on a studio. Also site aggregation isn't worth paying for.
 
Pretty sure virtually all the comments are on the original videos and not articles that are content aggregated. All the stories are already up on the IGNS and so forth.

The videos are not bad. Gameface is pretty good. I find it much more interesting than watching children shriek like Banshees over every terrible game. But I think completely forgoing children as your audience in a videogame world is a tough thing to do.

I think Shane needs to atleast make a free podcast out of his gamefaces, and should probably try to secure some big guests. A podcast would put his name and site out there. Paywall thing is a good idea for people who have a big or loyal fanbase, not sure if its the way to go for SIFTD though.
 

Megasoum

Banned
P
- Follow @Wario64 for gaming deals (Free: Business model is Amazon affiliate revenue)

Wait... Wario uses Affiliate links for all his amazon deals tweets?

lmao I never realized that (I can't use them since I'm not in the US so I never click on them).

That's brilliant, I never thought of that. Good on him!
 

bjork

Member
I just don't understand

With just a couple thousand more Premium subscribers I would make enough money to cover my expenses and expand the site's content to a point where we could generate continual new subscribers

So move someplace cheaper to lower your expenses, then maybe you can expand content. But I don't see the how any content guarantees continual new subscribers. Everything doesn't always go up in unison.
 

Alucrid

Banned
Wait... Wario uses Affiliate links for all his amazon deals tweets?

lmao I never realized that (I can't use them since I'm not in the US so I never click on them).

That's brilliant, I never thought of that. Good on him!

it's in his bio so i got no qualms about using his links
 

massoluk

Banned
My news aggregate is Twitter. Fact is, I am enthusiast about video game industry, but I don't just follow game industry exclusively. Twitter just served me better as a working adult.

Now you might say "Well, SIFTD isn't for YOU." Well, duh.
"But we have other stuffs." Which are? I don't know. I don't care enough to go past registration screen to find out.
 

-hadouken

Member
I follow the podcast for my invisible walls fix - glad the site introduced us to Matt Keil (always insightful). Not enough interest in general video game news to use an aggregator, I'm afraid.
 
I used to watch Shane a lot back on Invisible Walls on GT but SIFTD never really clicked with me. I'm just not a fan of subscription websites, although a free option was made available, I had lost interest by then.

Part of the problem seems to be exposure to the site because even for someone like me, who reads and watches a lot of videogame content, SIFTD never comes to mind (apart from when a thread pops up on here, which isn't very often) and that seems to be the case for a lot of people from the look of it.

EZA and Kinda Funny get much more exposure because their content is available to more people, simple as that really. I think it would be a good idea if Shane made more content available on YouTube, so more people can see what SIFTD offers and he should set up a Patreon too, as people like the flexibility that Patreon offers, over a fixed subscription.

Hopefully Shane can figure it out though, good luck to him.
 

Billfisto

Member
First impression: deciding to see what the site actually looked like, I tried going to siftd.com. I was greeted with a domain squatting page offering to sell me the domain.

Maybe you should have cleared up the domain availability before deciding to commit to building up a new brand.
 
I've been a subscriber to help out and also support Pachter's show. It pretty much is the only thing I watch though. The site is a little confusing for me to find the new episode. Sometimes it's there, sometimes it's not so I wound up watching on YouTube a week later like everyone else.

Forums and where to leave questions are also feeling a bit scattered to me.

I have not renewed yet. I just find the site a little scattered.
 

D3VI0US

Member
I find it telling that you say that Pachter Factor is the only good content they make, as it's their only show that goes free.

I said that because I like Pachter even though he gets a lot of shit from GAF. For me Shane on the other hand is the Eeyore of gaming personalities and he's just not entertaining enough to pay for his opinions.
 

satterfield

BIGTIME TV MOGUL
Lots of great feedback here so thank you very much. If you guys are going to take the time to really dig in I'm going to respond to all of it. I want to preface this by saying that I'm not trying to make excuses for anything. Obviously, the site needs to change to be a success. But at the same time, many commenters are assuming that zero thought went into the site and nothing could be further from the truth. I know many on the Internet tend to assume the worst so I've taken that into account. But I think if you know why the site works/is designed the way it is it will help in shaping constructive feedback. Here goes:

Not Really Taking Feedback to Heart
Absolutely not true. Prioritizing all the feedback. Updating a Twitch page that no one is going to visit until Monday is not an immediate priority. I didn't "pimp" our Twitch page. I included a link so people can join the summit tomorrow night.

What's the Original Content? Why would I pay for it?

Someone asked why they would pay for our original content when there's so much free content out there. Why does anyone pay for any content then? Our content mantra is if we can't do something differently we won't do it at all and that plays right into this way of thinking. I think you can see that from our roster:

Pachter Factor: Everyone knows this one. Still no other show like it even though the concept is old.

GameFace: Weekly three-hour videocast with (my opinion) production values that are very high compared to most.

GIFE: An opinion show that tries to tackle crossovers between gaming and culture. Also very weird/different.

PlayView: A crossover of traditional video previews and Let's Plays.

Dossier: A monthly roundup of all the games coming that month with hype ratings from SIFTD editorial and its users.

Bad Dudes: A final boss review show.

Shane's Addiction: I look at piping hot (addictive) games like PUBG and ultimately decide whether they're truly addictive over the long haul or just a flash in the pan.

SIFTD Hangout: Our Let's Plays. Definitely the one series we create that's not especially innovative, but every pub needs to do these in 2017.

Game Evals: Our take on the game review that gives users a custom review score based on their tastes.

Begging for Donations

Not begging for anything. Asking people to subscribe. Would be stupid not to include a donation link in the article. Why is this considered begging but other publications posting Patreon links is not? Just curious if it's a perception thing.

Marketing

We have a marketing plan and have had one from the beginning. It's easy to market when you have money, but we don't, so we've had to be very crafty. Pachter Factor free on YouTube, paid/targeted marketing on social media, SIFTD referral program where you get free Premium for bringing users to the site, GIFTD where you can buy subs for others, etc. We're trying to do the most we can with what we've got. I'm open to suggestions on other cheap marketing tactics. Someone suggested that paying someone to handle social media marketing is cheap. If they have someone willing to do it for a pittance please send them my way. I've yet to find someone who doesn't want a huge salary. Every piece of content has social media links. We can't force our users to use them. The idea that with social media marketing is easy and cheap is absolutely false. There's too much noise to cut through and it's often for minimal gain. Only paid programs have moved the needle at all for us. We also have a co-branded marketing campaign with LootCrate and have released merch.

Why Would I Use SIFTD?
Again, I feel like people who are saying they get the same thing from Reddit/RSS Readers/Social Media haven't used the site for longer than five minutes. In addition to just giving people what they want in one click it's a great discovery tool for content creators and products. You'll never miss a thing using SIFTD and it literally takes less than five minutes to register and set your sift preferences.

I saw posts where people were like, "I would just follow these six Twitter accounts. Or I would just set up and use an RSS reader. Or I would just blah, blah, blah." All of that takes a ton of time and discovery. How does the average person even know the six Twitter accounts to follow? Setting up an RSS reader to get relevant results is a pain in the ass and extremely time-consuming/tech-heavy. Why would you do that when you can sign up and set your sift preferences in five minutes and let us do all the heavy lifting? I can't understand this way of thinking. It's like someone trying to convince themselves that what they've been doing it all along is the right way to do it instead of looking at alternatives for someone who's coming into it fresh.

SIFTD also does tons of stuff no other site does. Where else can you find all the trailers that came out in the last 24 hours, 48 hours, week or month? Where else can you find all the coverage of Japanese games from those time periods? Where else can you find sales numbers for games in both the West and Japan with two clicks? Where can you find all the latest information just on JRPGs or over 60 other categories with a single click? Using the publication pages on SIFTD is better than using the native sites We have on-site leveling and achievements. Private forums called Crews. I could go on and on. I think SIFTD's biggest problem is that you don't start to truly understand its power until you've used it for awhile. I'm open to any suggestions on how to fix that.

Should be Easier to Use
Everything can and should be easier to use. I would love to incorporate machine learning into the site. Totally agree what we should do that, but that's development money we don't have. That said, our interface is very easy and kind of fun if you ask me. Hopefully we end up having enough money so that we can completely ditch the interface, though.

Using Content Curation as a Trojan Horse for Premium
Yes, we use the site's unique functionality as a marketing tool to get folks to the site. Then they experience our original content during their free Premium trial and hopefully convert to paid subs. However, the content is not discrete from the curation. We mention curation on GameFace every single week and our show Dossier is specifically driven by the curation metrics.

Having to Register
Not sure where people are getting that you have to register to use the site. You can view any piece of non-Premium content without ever registering. The only time you're prompted to register is if you try to comment or use the forums (how do you comment without a username) or access Premium content. Seriously, go use the site. You can view everything without registering.

Comments
Our comments are built just like Reddit. Most upvoted comments bubble to the top, most downvoted to the bottom. Comments that have just one 1up are stacked based on replies, and from there it's chronological. The big difference is that replies are not collapsed by default. You have to do it manually, but we set it up that way from the beginning because we didn't have a ton of users so comments sections would look empty if they were all collapsed. If the site grows to a place where it's an issue we will change it to collapsed by default. I agree that we need an option for people to see newest first if they want. Comment timestamps are hourly until 24 hours, and then it shows how many days it's been. Do you need more detail than this? If so, please share why.

Every Website Has the Same Content
For the most part this is true. No one knows this better than us because we sift through it all every day. However, if you use SIFTD you will discover new content providers on almost a daily basis and shows that you never knew existed that you'll love. The other difference is that gaming sites do not like to promote competitors. So, for example, you're not going to go to IGN and see GameSpot's content. I feel like I'm trying to defend social media here. If there was no value in pulling in everything sites like Twitter and Facebook wouldn't exist. To use an analogy, SIFTD is like a Facebook for gaming without your feed being filled with cat videos and pictures of food. You're also not missing anything. Many of the major sites are using us to find stuff they missed the next day. It's totally fine, but that shows how comprehensive our curation is.

Power Users/Pro Tips Article
Someone said that the site is set up for Power Users. That's not true. If you take five minutes to set your preferences you're going to get a great content feed tailored to your tastes. Sure, the site does a ton of stuff under the hood that power users will make use of, but it would be stupid not include some hidden depth for those who want to dig. The Pro Tips article is even set up so that the most basic stuff is at the top and features grow more obscure as it goes on. How can we improve this?

Usability
Stumpokapow gave some feedback on the functionality/look of the site. The look of a site is subjective to a point. I like the look of it, some don't. That's totally fine. I doubt any site is going to be aesthetically pleasing to every single user. Definitely open to more feedback on this.

His/her feedback is from a drive-by and not actually using it, though. I appreciate that you took any time at all to look at it, but for instance, there is absolutely a channel nav on the E3 page. It's just farther down than normal because of the featured content at the top of the page. Agree in hindsight that the bar should have been above the featured content and it will be changed for Gamescom, but that's just one page out of tens of thousands. It's a special page for conventions. We create like six of them per year. We want to feature the important content from conventions so folks can easily find the really big stuff, but even if you move the nav above it, then you still have to scroll past the featured content to get to the results. No easy answer. Maybe we should just drop the featured content from that page altogether?

Rounded corners are not unique to SIFTD. Not sure why it's so bad when it's on our site. Agree 1000 percent that mouseover tooltips would be a help, but I think most people know what a comment icon looks like and it's pretty obvious that 1ups are our likes. The save for later option could really use it, though.

Not sure what you mean that the site is not responsive. It's lightning quick for me and we've never had a single user complain about the speed of the site. It's crunching a TON of data at this point. After just two years it's sifting 43K pieces of content. The read/watch overlays in no way impede anything or take up any extra space. They're just overlays on the thumbnails that prepare users to know whether something is a text-based or video-based. On mobile where some people are watching their data usage it's relevant in my opinion and not all content has a title that clearly says whether it's video or text. Just explaining our thinking behind it.

Giving Away Premium Content
This is something we're going to start doing more of. I'll admit that I've been too concerned about making sure we're not screwing our paying subscribers by giving away the content for free. Our subscribers have spoken over the last two days and say they're OK with it because they want the site to survive more than anything, so we'll be shifting our strategy.


I think that's it. With the context I provided hopefully it will help folks supply even more meaningful feedback going forward. Hope to see you all on the stream tomorrow night. It takes a lot of time to go back and forth with text. Should be a much more constructive conversation on the stream.

Oh, and in before the obligatory, "Said he wasn't going to make excuses. Made excuses." post.
 

satterfield

BIGTIME TV MOGUL
I've been a subscriber to help out and also support Pachter's show. It pretty much is the only thing I watch though. The site is a little confusing for me to find the new episode. Sometimes it's there, sometimes it's not so I wound up watching on YouTube a week later like everyone else.

Forums and where to leave questions are also feeling a bit scattered to me.

I have not renewed yet. I just find the site a little scattered.

Mouse over the SIFTD logo on the top left of the page. All your questions answered. Every piece of original content we publish is also promoted in the massive image carousel at the top of the page. Thank you for your support!
 

El-Suave

Member
I participated in the first sign up phase when the site was originally introduced. I think everything was free for a short time before payment was required. That's why I signed up knowing I probably won't stick around because I don't have a use for the site's core feature. Checking it out didn't hurt.
Anyway, my point is my e-mail should be in some SIFTD database as a lapsed subscriber or something. So why didn't the site try to reach out to win me back over the years it has been operating? That's free and easy marketing. Don't spam people of course but advertise your new features or intiatives to those who have shown interest or at least awareness in the past.
 

satterfield

BIGTIME TV MOGUL
I participated in the first sign up phase when the site was originally introduced. I think everything was free for a short time before payment was required. That's why I signed up knowing I probably won't stick around because I don't have a use for the site's core feature. Checking it out didn't hurt.
Anyway, my point is my e-mail should be in some SIFTD database as a lapsed subscriber or something. So why didn't the site try to reach out to win me back over the years it has been operating? That's free and easy marketing. Don't spam people of course but advertise your new features or intiatives to those who have shown interest or at least awareness in the past.

We did send out an email when we changed our pricing structure. You should have received it. We got a ton of angry emails in response to the effect of, "I already decided I didn't want to subscribe. Leave me alone."
 

gohanrage

Member
First impression: deciding to see what the site actually looked like, I tried going to siftd.com. I was greeted with a domain squatting page offering to sell me the domain.

Maybe you should have cleared up the domain availability before deciding to commit to building up a new brand.

its siftd.net
 

Billfisto

Member
its siftd.net

Yeah, I found that, but people expect whatever.com. Even if you're buying .net for stylistic purposes, you should still redirect .com towards it. If you can't buy all the major domain variations maybe you should think of a different brand.
 

Coldsun

Banned
Not sure what you mean that the site is not responsive. It's lightning quick for me and we've never had a single user complain about the speed of the site. It's crunching a TON of data at this point.

The site isn't responsive. You're thinking in terms of speed, but when people are talking about a website's layout, responsive means something entirely different. It doesn't respond to the user's display or device.

Responsive Web Design is a web design approach that allows for webpages to respond to restrictions such as screen size or web browser. You may want to look into Mobile first, or progressive enhancement.

Simply put, if someone resizes the window, does the 2 column collapse into a single col? Does the image sizes change based on the viewport? How does the website function on an phone? A tablet? a laptop screen? All of these can be changed and tailored for optimal effect by simply using css media queries and proper site construction.
 

Justinh

Member
I said that because I like Pachter even though he gets a lot of shit from GAF. For me Shane on the other hand is the Eeyore of gaming personalities and he's just not entertaining enough to pay for his opinions.
Just to be clear, I wasn't out to make a dig or you or something, I was more going along with this idea...
Giving Away Premium Content
This is something we're going to start doing more of. I'll admit that I've been too concerned about making sure we're not screwing our paying subscribers by giving away the content for free. Our subscribers have spoken over the last two days and say they're OK with it because they want the site to survive more than anything, so we'll be shifting our strategy.
 

gohanrage

Member
The site isn't responsive. You're thinking in terms of speed, but when people are talking about a website's layout, responsive means something entirely different. It doesn't respond to the user's display or device.

Responsive Web Design is a web design approach that allows for webpages to respond to restrictions such as screen size or web browser. You may want to look into Mobile first, or progressive enhancement.

Simply put, if someone resizes the window, does the 2 column collapse into a single col? Does the image sizes change based on the viewport? How does the website function on an phone? A tablet? a laptop screen? All of these can be changed and tailored for optimal effect by simply using css media queries and proper site construction.

I cannot answer Tablet or Phone since I don't own a Tablet or Smart phone but I use siftd on my Dell Inspiron 15 laptop. I have one of those TABLE-MATE tables as seen on TV. I have my laptop on it and I sit on the living room couch and pull the table right up to me. the legs of the table slide under the couch.
 

satterfield

BIGTIME TV MOGUL
The site isn't responsive. You're thinking in terms of speed, but when people are talking about a website's layout, responsive means something entirely different. It doesn't respond to the user's display or device.

Responsive Web Design is a web design approach that allows for webpages to respond to restrictions such as screen size or web browser. You may want to look into Mobile first, or progressive enhancement.

Simply put, if someone resizes the window, does the 2 column collapse into a single col? Does the image sizes change based on the viewport? How does the website function on an phone? A tablet? a laptop screen? All of these can be changed and tailored for optimal effect by simply using css media queries and proper site construction.

Ah, gotcha. I don't have problems with that. Everything scales fine for me on my iPhone and iPad.
 

Linkura

Member
Ah, gotcha. I don't have problems with that. Everything scales fine for me on my iPhone and iPad.

If you own a website, it's your responsibility to make sure it looks good on ALL modern, commonly-use devices, not just the ones you own. This is literally common sense.
 

MazeHaze

Banned
The name is probably part of it. Acronyms are terrible. Hell, it took multiple posts in this thread before I could even figure out what SIFTD is.
 

gohanrage

Member
The name is probably part of it. Acronyms are terrible. Hell, it took multiple posts in this thread before I could even figure out what SIFTD is.

and NeoGAF is such a great name huh? what is a NeoGAF anyway? what kind of Acronym is that?

All I know is I am supposed to "BELIEVE!"
 

gohanrage

Member
So you're going to try to insult me as opposed to actually explaining your post.

Right.

Why are you even bringing up Smart Phones and Tablets if you don't even own one?

also Your not the only one I think is miserable posting here.

when something feels like an attack I will bite back.
 

Linkura

Member
Why are you even bringing up iPhones and Tablets if you don't even own one?

also Your not the only one I think is miserable posting here.

Because a huge percentage of SIFTD's potential customer base use them and it is important for a website that wants to grow a userbase to work on things people use.

And I do own an iPhone. You asked if I owned Android, I answered that I did not.
 

Stumpokapow

listen to the mad man
and NeoGAF is such a great name huh? what is a NeoGAF anyway? what kind of Acronym is that?

All I know is I am supposed to "BELIEVE!"

NeoGAF is a name that made sense at the time when it needed to -- when the site was young and needed growth to be sustainable. At that time, it was named NeoGAF to emphasize both its independence from Gaming Age and its historical connection to Gaming Age ("GAF" stands for "Gaming Age Forum"). Of course that hasn't really been relevant for the site in a decade or so now. But the point of people saying they don't think the name scans well is because siftd is a site that is not growing or sustainable, and so the topic of conversation has naturally turned to what might help.

The two criticisms people have brought up are: 1) it's literally difficult to check out the site because it doesn't have siftd.com and it's not immediately clear verbally what the site's spelling or name is. 2) If you don't know what the site is, it's difficult to get something evocative out of the name. My guess would be that "siftd" is supposed to convey that the site's staff sift through gaming content online -- i.e. that it is an aggregator. But in this thread, there's been a bunch of confusion about whether or not aggregation is the primary purpose of the site. None of this seems to have anything to do with whether or not NeoGAF is a good name.

If your position is that the problems with the site don't relate to the name, and instead are deeper and harder to fix, then I think many people here would agree.
 

Alucrid

Banned
and NeoGAF is such a great name huh? what is a NeoGAF anyway? what kind of Acronym is that?

All I know is I am supposed to "BELIEVE!"

it's funny because you posted this exact same argument on the last page after which people gave you your answer that you apparently never read
 

gohanrage

Member
Because a huge percentage of SIFTD's potential customer base use them and it is important for a website that wants to grow a userbase to work on things people use.

And I do own an iPhone. You asked if I owned Android, I answered that I did not.

If you own a website, it's your responsibility to make sure it looks good on ALL modern, commonly-use devices, not just the ones you own. This is literally common sense.

when the answer that it works perfectly on iPhone and iPad wasn't good enough I figured you owned an android. iOS and Android are the most popular
 

gohanrage

Member
it's funny because you posted this exact same argument on the last page after which people gave you your answer that you apparently never read

Actually I did. people keep posting the same thing about SIFTD being a bad acronym so I just repeat the same thing NeoGAF is also a bad acronym
 

gohanrage

Member
NeoGAF is a name that made sense at the time when it needed to -- when the site was young and needed growth to be sustainable. At that time, it was named NeoGAF to emphasize both its independence from Gaming Age and its historical connection to Gaming Age ("GAF" stands for "Gaming Age Forum"). Of course that hasn't really been relevant for the site in a decade or so now. But the point of people saying they don't think the name scans well is because siftd is a site that is not growing or sustainable, and so the topic of conversation has naturally turned to what might help.

The two criticisms people have brought up are: 1) it's literally difficult to check out the site because it doesn't have siftd.com and it's not immediately clear verbally what the site's spelling or name is. 2) If you don't know what the site is, it's difficult to get something evocative out of the name. My guess would be that "siftd" is supposed to convey that the site's staff sift through gaming content online -- i.e. that it is an aggregator. But in this thread, there's been a bunch of confusion about whether or not aggregation is the primary purpose of the site. None of this seems to have anything to do with whether or not NeoGAF is a good name.

If your position is that the problems with the site don't relate to the name, and instead are deeper and harder to fix, then I think many people here would agree.

Thank You very much for the detailed history I appreciate it
 

Stumpokapow

listen to the mad man
I saw posts where people were like, "I would just follow these six Twitter accounts. Or I would just set up and use an RSS reader. Or I would just blah, blah, blah." All of that takes a ton of time and discovery. How does the average person even know the six Twitter accounts to follow? Setting up an RSS reader to get relevant results is a pain in the ass and extremely time-consuming/tech-heavy. Why would you do that when you can sign up and set your sift preferences in five minutes and let us do all the heavy lifting? I can't understand this way of thinking. It's like someone trying to convince themselves that what they've been doing it all along is the right way to do it instead of looking at alternatives for someone who's coming into it fresh.

I don't need to convince myself that my current routine is working fine. You need to convince people that you have a value add to their routine. I agree that the average person doesn't know about @Wario64, but is the average person your audience? Is your site built to reflect that? Are you reaching the average person? I would say the average person isn't a gamer, the average gamer sticks to IGN, the average hardcore gamer stumbles a bit beyond that and finds stuff like Kotaku or CheapAssGamer or reddit GameDeals or reddit Gaming or whatever and then either sticks with that for game deals, or they find @Wario64 through those sites and then stick with him. I would say your target audience for this to not be a totally mindless endeavor is probably something closer to a hardcore gamer. Earlier it sounded like you were pitching this at people who used to be hardcore gamers, but now don't have the time, and need help getting a quick hit on what's going on in the gaming world.

Not sure where people are getting that you have to register to use the site. You can view any piece of non-Premium content without ever registering. The only time you're prompted to register is if you try to comment or use the forums (how do you comment without a username) or access Premium content. Seriously, go use the site. You can view everything without registering.

I went to the site and clicked "Microsoft" on the front page and got a registration prompt. Then I clicked the menu and clicked Community and got a registration prompt. Then I tried to change the filter on the front page to 48 (hours, presumably) instead of 24 (hours, presumably) and got a registration prompt. I don't know if there are ways around this, but I also don't really care. I assume your bounce rate for first time users is really high because of the account registration walls. With respect to the forums, I didn't want to reply to the forums, I wanted to read them. Something like 90% of GAF's traffic is people without accounts -- it might actually even be more than that. You want people reading even if they don't want to participate.

His/her feedback is from a drive-by and not actually using it, though. I appreciate that you took any time at all to look at it, but for instance, there is absolutely a channel nav on the E3 page.

The feedback you need is presumably "Why are people not coming to my site?", not "What would make people who currently like my site like it more?" If you want the latter, ask the comments section of your site, but one presumes that if your current audience was large enough, you wouldn't be in a financial crunch. It should worry you that this thread gave a whole bunch of people who had never been to your site exposure to it, and you got feedback like mine that boils down to "I went on it for a few seconds and I couldn't figure out the point or get it to work and I probably wouldn't go back."

Not sure what you mean that the site is not responsive. It's lightning quick for me and we've never had a single user complain about the speed of the site.

I don't mean to be rude, but you run what you expect to be a large commercial website so it's time to learn something about web development, because "responsive" doesn't mean fast, it's a specific technical term.
 

gohanrage

Member
and that's going to help out the site how?


I leave that stuff up to much smarter people. I know I am not all that smart. I am probably just reaching the intelligence of a person who finished high school finally. I'll be 37 on July 30th. I have a Learning Disability. English was never a strong subject I barely past. I spend all my waking days online. I love that anything that pops in my head I can quickly find the answer.

I cannot help that certain things people say feel like an attack.

even though I am 37 almost I feel my sprit is much younger. everyone grew up. have families or at least a partner I never have and in my opinion never will

If it wasn't for this thread here. I wouldn't even be on NeoGAF. I have no idea what special thing I need to do so I can create my own thread. the fact that I can't is the reason I never come here.

I'm Done. I wish I could delete this last post but I cannot figure out how. I would think I could delete A post I made. bye
 
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