Revelations said:
They have a facility with a huge vault of documents that have been engraved various times to preserve their heritage. Scientology is full of new age nut jobs.
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Scientology contract leaks (get ready for some major nutfvckery)
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They have a facility with a huge vault of documents that have been engraved various times to preserve their heritage. Scientology is full of new age nut jobs.
gutter_trash
Banned
LOL! Jumbo Jets into volcanos, nukes, thetans, Xenu, e-meters, vitamins oh yeah, same thingalternade said:
thetechkid
Member
Tamanon said:
Sounds like a great movie, when does it come out?
polyh3dron
Banned
Didn't take long for the broken sarcasm detector train to arrive.Rekwest said:
There's no denying that Scientologists are fanatics who are probably dangerous as well.
But I can't have a double standard. Pretty much every organized religion out there has plenty of irrational fanatics who are potentially dangerous.
I couldn't care less how messed up a religion/cult's rituals and practices are, so long as they don't break the law. If they break the law, they get punished by it like anyone else.
But I can't have a double standard. Pretty much every organized religion out there has plenty of irrational fanatics who are potentially dangerous.
I couldn't care less how messed up a religion/cult's rituals and practices are, so long as they don't break the law. If they break the law, they get punished by it like anyone else.
BlueTsunami
there is joy in sucking dick
sikkinixx said:
Libertarians natural Scientologists confirmed
Megadragon15 said:
LOL, so this "religion" is fake, but the others are "real"?
"your god Xenu is false, haha. My god was a burning bush who sent his son to Earth, but his son was really him. Then he tortured his son and killed him, but it's ok the son, who was really god, was reborn to rule the universe forever in heaven. did I also mention this god-man could walk on water and do other parlor tricks?"
genjiZERO said:
It might not be enforceable but there's probably a good chance anyone who goes against it will get harassed nonstop. An insider will probably know the full extent of what these people will do so I imagine fear is an even better way to deter these people than an unenforceable legal document.
LiveFromKyoto
Member
Asmodai said:
You know that Scientology has pretty much been breaking dozens of laws for the last 40 years straight right?
It's an insult to legitimate religions to put them in the same bucket as these crooks.
I was coming home from a break in Scotland last Saturday and they had a stand up at the Callander highland games. Big yellow tent full of yellow shirted "volunteer ministers" giving people touch-assists! Of course, no mentioning of Scientology as a church anywhere, says alot about how much they keep from potential marks like the contracts. Didn't have the guts to go over and have a goold old troll, if I saw this earlier it might have given me a little ammunition about how much financial security is required.
perfectchaos007
Member
50+ posts and no one has flat out said "lol religion" good for you GAF. there is a difference between cults and religions.
I'm Baptist and I haven't given money to the church in years and don't get offended when somebody mocks christianity, yet according to my belief I'm still going to heaven.
Scientology forces you to give money and if someone mocks the cult like on southpark, the cult members speak out and quit, then later mysteriously die.
Totally agree. No cult or religion should be above the law. Nor should any cult or religion use their teachings to make something illegal. i.e. drawing a picture of Muhammad. If muslims make it against their religion to draw muhammad thats fine, but if I do it as a non-muslim I don't want to get punished.
I'm Baptist and I haven't given money to the church in years and don't get offended when somebody mocks christianity, yet according to my belief I'm still going to heaven.
Scientology forces you to give money and if someone mocks the cult like on southpark, the cult members speak out and quit, then later mysteriously die.
Asmodai said:
Totally agree. No cult or religion should be above the law. Nor should any cult or religion use their teachings to make something illegal. i.e. drawing a picture of Muhammad. If muslims make it against their religion to draw muhammad thats fine, but if I do it as a non-muslim I don't want to get punished.
vandalvideo
Banned
LiveFromKyoto said:
So have other religions. It isn't like Scientology has a monopoly here. Not to mention you're using a fallacy of division. Just because it may be true of the top doesn't mean that all of Scientology breaks laws.
DeadGzuz said:
Not that I disagree that his wording may have been clumsy, but there's a distinction to be made between a real religion and a religion who's claims are real. The claims that both Christianity and Scientology make may be equally false, but there are legitimate reasons to put Scientology into a different category than Christianity, Judaism, etc.
TheRagnCajun
Member
LiveFromKyoto said:
quite right.
LiveFromKyoto
Member
vandalvideo said:
You're comparing genuinely spiritual people who devote their lives to helping the sick and poor to an organization which exists to exploit is own members for profit, and extorts and ruins the lives of anybody who questions them as a matter of policy.
TheRagnCajun
Member
vandalvideo said:
I think the bottom line for me is, while other religions have their dark streak, there is an idealology there. There are followers there that stand up and 'yeah what they did there wasn't right, this is what our faith is really about" which is great. You can look at Christianity and Islam and see some darkness there, but also some redemption from that.
Scientology, in its current form, is thorougly corrupt. The day that belief system has its reformation and people depart from the corruption is the day I will acknowledge it as a legitmate religion, even if it does sound like something straight out of a 50's sci fi movie.
LiveFromKyoto said:
If Scientologists aren't being punished for their alleged crimes, that is the fault of the justice system. Same as if any other religious or non-religious person or organization was not being punished for its crimes.
The Catholic church,for example, has been killing and torturing people for thousands of years. And yet, somehow I feel they would qualify as one of your "legitimate" religions who should not be "insulted" by comparing them to Scientology, right? What a joke. They are in the same bucket as Scientologists because there are religious people of every possible religion who are just as irrational, just as criminal, and just as dangerous as Scientologists are.
My point stands. I don't care WHAT someone's religion believes in. I don't care if it believes in the giant spaghetti monster. I don't care if it's been around 5000 years or 15 minutes. I don't care if there are 3 followers or a billion.
Follow the rule of law like everyone else. Noone is above it, no matter what religious beliefs they may hold.
Jarate said:
Like what, out of curiosity?
Remember, terrorism is violence directed toward a political end.
And of course, many, many religions throughout history were terrorists under that definition. As well as genocidal.
Fanatics of organized religion have committed innumerable crimes throughout human history. Why is Scientology any different? Sure, their members are probably more fanatical on average than the members of say the Catholic Church.
But we aren't here to stereotype. All that matters is that if they break the law, they pay the price the same way as anyone else would.
vandalvideo
Banned
LiveFromKyoto said:
I would love to see evidence, if you had it, that the majority of people in charge of Scientology, and not just a relative minority of the upper echelon, actually engage in such frivelous attempts to extort the people that are their parishioners.
A lot of what Scientology teaches can be applied and practical. The basics of it (E-meter auditings and personality tests) can help someone out with their own discovery. The thing is that Scientology will perform these tests in a fashion that makes the person feel completely lost and alone without the CoS behind them to help them. That's why there's groups out there that use very similar ideals as the CoS reincorporating Hubbard Tech for free and with much less hate speech, like the Freezoners.BananaBomb said:
There are over 100 religions saying they're the one true religion. By using 1st grade logic I come to the conclusion that at least 99 are false. If 99 false religions can be taken as seriously as the truth then I don't see any reason scientology can't be part of the 99. Scientology is just as real as any other religion, it's either all or none. Take your pick.
You are right, you are using 1st grade logic.Kipz said:
Seriously, the level of misunderstanding of religion on GAF is just baffling.
I will not get into that whole argument again, but there's a huge difference between "real" religion and Scientology.
All mainstream religions have moral basis, even if you ignore the mythology (and seriously, the mythology is a very small part of the big 3 monotheistic religions) they still have merit, in fact, especially if you ignore the mythology (and most people who peruse those religion do ignore it to an extent).
Scientology doesn't, it's about making money.
firehawk12
Subete no aware
Chichikov said:
Okay, I'm going to break Godwin's law, but whatever. Isn't that a bit like saying Hitler had great ideas except for the whole antisemitism thing?
When you have a dude who tells people that condoms are the work of the devil because it violates some mythology in a book, that's not just being quaint - that's fucking dangerous.
LiveFromKyoto
Member
vandalvideo said:
You know what? No. If you're seriously that head-in-the-sand about this, go and do some research yourself, it'll do you some good. Scientology has been involved in dozens upon dozens of far-reaching immoral practices over the years that have been reported in just about every mainstream news outlet and go way beyond a couple of people, even if the rot starts at the top - they're practically a matter of scripture. If you don't know about that then frankly the onus is on you to go and find it out.
HamPster PamPster
Member
That doesn't sound so bad
I had to sign a religious contract by chopping off part of my penis
Stupid Genesis 17:14
I had to sign a religious contract by chopping off part of my penis
Stupid Genesis 17:14It's more because the Church of Scientology which is an organization has legally locked down the religion of Scientology to the extent that anyone who wishes to practice Scientology outside of the control of the CoS can't even use the term Scientology. Hence the FreeZoners can't call themselves Scientologists.ToxicAdam said:
You broke Godwin's for that?firehawk12 said:
But let me answer this -
If you think that there is a religion out there that its morality is mostly evil then fuck it, it should die, like Scientology.
But attack its morality, not its mythology.
The essence of the big 3 is not the mythology, it's the morality.
You want examples? I got examples:
- Of the 10 commandments, only 3 (and a half) deal with God or any supernatural element.
- Hillel the Elder said - "That which is hateful to you, do not do to your fellow. That is the whole Torah; the rest is the explanation; go and learn."
- The Good Samaritan.
And I can go on forever.
Sure, it's funnier to say "LOL zombie Jesus" but it really misses the point.
firehawk12
Subete no aware
You think being condemned to burn in hell because you "worship false idols" isn't a problem? That's inherently linked to the morality of the religion - believe in me and only me or die. And then there's all the bullshit that's in Leviticus that people conveniently ignore.
Well, except for Jehovah's Witnesses, where giving a girl blood transfusions is evil - so it's better to let her die "pure" than being "corrupted".
The funny thing is, I don't really care what people believe and how they believe. But to say that the dogma and the mythology isn't inherently tied with the "morality" of a religion is almost ridiculous.
I mean, the very fact that Genesis has a "retcon" - where Lilith, Adam's "equal", is removed because women should be inferior to men - that in itself is a "moral" judgment invoked by the men who "transcribed God's word" in the first place.
Well, except for Jehovah's Witnesses, where giving a girl blood transfusions is evil - so it's better to let her die "pure" than being "corrupted".
The funny thing is, I don't really care what people believe and how they believe. But to say that the dogma and the mythology isn't inherently tied with the "morality" of a religion is almost ridiculous.
I mean, the very fact that Genesis has a "retcon" - where Lilith, Adam's "equal", is removed because women should be inferior to men - that in itself is a "moral" judgment invoked by the men who "transcribed God's word" in the first place.
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