Gentleman Jack
Member
Lots of people (including Notch) get called out for being assholes.
Doesn't substantiate the claims of payola.
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'Some' YouTubers approach indie developer asking for sales revenue of his game.
- Thread starter komplanen
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Lots of people (including Notch) get called out for being assholes.
Doesn't substantiate the claims of payola.
Wait, what's the problem then? The Youtuber is dumb, but this is hardly extortion.
Aquamarine
Member
Never mind.
ThatsMytrunks
Member
I've had no-name YouTubers ask me for copies of my game and also for me to pay them to make a review video. It's a thing. I realize that a channel with a million subscribers playing your game could be worthwhile, but at that point it's just buying an advertisement.
Stratostar
Member
Fucking YouTubers. Get a real job.
John Harker
Definitely doesn't make things up as he goes along.
Influencers make a video of something they are passionate about. Its self funded and they have total creative control and they post it to their 5mm subscribers and it gets 10 million views. People are happy. Dev/Pub reaches out to them, 'hey that video was great! Thanks for being a fan, we didn't know. Here's a free copy of the game, maybe we can work together next time, clearly your audience responds well to our content"
Influencers response: " yes absolutely! That'll be $60k for the next one please."
Pub/Dev is a bit taken aback... But does the ROI anyway and either sees a) that they can't buy 10mm imps for $60k anywhere else and its a great deal, here you go or b) damn you crazy son, that was almost my whole game budget. Have fun making money off my stuff anyway.
Either way, both have become fairly standard practice. Its not always bad, lots of really cool stuff gets made. Sometimes people can be scummy tho.
.
The Broken Ska Record
Member
The amount of hate YT content creators get is ridiculous. Sure some people are scummy but that's true with every industry.
And I hope the guy doesn't name names. He's taking the high road in this stance and he should keep it that way.
And I hope the guy doesn't name names. He's taking the high road in this stance and he should keep it that way.
PhoenixFyre
Member
Yeah, I'm not a fan of it. I talked about this on my own channel a while back ago, about how much influence YouTubers were getting and how paying for positive coverage seemed more and more likely.
It bugs the hell out of me because there are precious few venues to trust as is.
shacklesmcgee
Member
Oh c'mon, you know the conversation was essentially "it would be a shame if your game didn't get a video by us". I totally can see some idiots on YouTube thinking they have power and saying "or else..." to indie devs.
Aquamarine
Member
Indeed. Many of these large YouTubers have an agency, a company... or are part of a corporate machine. They're genuine advertising companies at this point.
For example:
Yogscast Ltd. is a 28-person-large registered company in the UK. It has shareholders, general managers, CEOs, business developers, etc.
They also have their own website, store with Yogscast-branded merchandise, other forms of revenue stream diversification, etc.
For business inquiries, you visit contact@yogscast.com and have a chat with their PR representative.
Company revenue through YouTube:
It makes sense that these sort of massive corporate institutions would reach out to indie developers and offer payment plans for advertising / celebrity endorsement on their channels.
DAREALGUMMY
Member
I totally read this wrong until I read some of the replies. What a shitty thing to ask for.
yurinka
Member
There's one people who works for months or years and another who works for a few hours.
The money that gets the one who works a few hours depends 100% on the other one. The one who works for months or years almost doesn't depend on the other.If there is someone who has to pay the other, it's the guy who works just a few hours.
So fuck the youtuber who claims you money, he's the one who should give the dev a share of his earnings. And if not, don't allow him to use your game and report the video where appears your game claiming the copyright.
The money that gets the one who works a few hours depends 100% on the other one. The one who works for months or years almost doesn't depend on the other.If there is someone who has to pay the other, it's the guy who works just a few hours.
So fuck the youtuber who claims you money, he's the one who should give the dev a share of his earnings. And if not, don't allow him to use your game and report the video where appears your game claiming the copyright.
cosmicblizzard
Banned
Here is the kind of money they make from ONE YouTuber:
They make WAY too much money off of these suckers to want to stop monetization.
The more YouTubers monetize game videos = The more money Google makes.
I've heard from quite a few people that Socialblade numbers are completely inaccurate and super inflated.
Doesn't mean Pewdiepie isn't rich as fuck though.
piratethingy
Self professed bad raider
Did you know you can rent out the whole front page of gamefaqs?
Aquamarine
Member
The PewDiePie® brand is now owned by Disney ($500 million purchase of Maker Studios). If a successful corporation like Disney wants PewDiePie, you can bet that he's filthy rich.
Phrozenflame500
Member
Yuk. That kind of demanding is unacceptable. I can stand channels refusing coverage if they don't get review/free copies, but demanding a share of the revenue is horrible. This sort of garbage makes everyone look bad, and weakens the whole transformative work argument that's used to defend YouTube monetization in the first place.
Part of me wants him to name names, but I know it's just going to descend into stupid internet drama that gives the channel more attention that it deserves.
Part of me wants him to name names, but I know it's just going to descend into stupid internet drama that gives the channel more attention that it deserves.
Phreakuency
Banned
Until you name names, I don't believe it.
As it is, it's going to get featured on a bunch of sites now and for something that could be made up, is going to get this dev a bunch of free advertising.
As it is, it's going to get featured on a bunch of sites now and for something that could be made up, is going to get this dev a bunch of free advertising.
SenjutsuSage
Banned
I want a share of whatever revenue the OP generates from this thread. 
Messofanego
Banned
What decent discussion? There's no debate in my eyes, it's just wrong.
Aquamarine
Member
Considering the above...
For the major YouTubers, it's just advertising companies (under the guise of "YouTubers") reaching out to developers for potential business deals. I don't think it's inherently scummy for two businesses to negotiate or throw offers out there.
For the big channels, what I hate is when they do this:
"Hey bros, my name is PewDiePie! Subscribe to become a bro! I'm just a guy from Sweden who likes to laugh and make other people laugh."
I don't like when these channels try to downplay their corporate identity. It feels deceitful, like when massive corporations establish a shell subsidiary for all of their copyright branding...so they can deceive people into thinking that they're not supporting a huge corporation. That's more of a personal annoyance with them. Sometimes, these YouTubers just feel so fake and manufactured.
Flame Lord
Member
You know, I think I remember someone mentioning them doing that once before a long ass time ago. I could be remembering wrong though.
Edit: This was what I was thinking of. Not quite the same thing, but still douchey behavior.
element
Member
I have talked with people about this.
It is amazing that Youtubers are getting to the point of triple dipping. Getting upfront to cover a game, getting the money from Youtube for views, and now trying to get part of the revenue on the game.
I've heard some Youtubers won't talk about Kickstarter projects unless they are cut in somehow.
Sadly because many of them don't identify as press, they don't adhere to any ethics other than views, subs, and profit. Someone like TotalBiscuit has attempted to make a clear distinction between his own material and paid appearances, but sadly majority of Youtubers/Streamers make no effort to do this. So one video could be for fun while the next video they could have been paid $50,000 to do.
It is amazing that Youtubers are getting to the point of triple dipping. Getting upfront to cover a game, getting the money from Youtube for views, and now trying to get part of the revenue on the game.
I've heard some Youtubers won't talk about Kickstarter projects unless they are cut in somehow.
Sadly because many of them don't identify as press, they don't adhere to any ethics other than views, subs, and profit. Someone like TotalBiscuit has attempted to make a clear distinction between his own material and paid appearances, but sadly majority of Youtubers/Streamers make no effort to do this. So one video could be for fun while the next video they could have been paid $50,000 to do.
Sounds dirty, but these generalizations here are astounding. Not all Youtubers are greedy corporate bastards who feed off revenue, and there's probably a good portion of paid Youtubers who are greedy and some that aren't greedy. You guys sound like rabid dogs, jealous that people get paid for playing video games, and spending 5-9 hours a day editing and compiling usable footage into a 20.00 minute video, and depending on the type of content, countless production values such as, scripts, props, actors, lots of planning and the equipment needed to record footage. That's tedium.
And then we trash the most popular (PDP), and portray him as this smug douchebag who has no interest in gaming whatsoever, despite him playing various first person shooters before signing on with Youtube. Most likely, none of you guys have ever SEEN a Youtuber in person, so you have no merit to judge their personality based off video dedicated to their viewer base. He's an entertainer, and like it or not, he wouldn't be the most subscribed to person on Youtube if no one liked his personality. Don't like him, cool, I'm not fond of him either, not anymore.
But back to the topic at hand, I agree, this whole debacle is a disgrace, and shames those who actually enjoy playing video games who make little to no revenue and those who make substantial revenue. Youtubers shouldn't go out of their way and ask for money from game developers, I wouldn't go out of my way to scum cash off my co-workers or clients when their dues are paid.
And then we trash the most popular (PDP), and portray him as this smug douchebag who has no interest in gaming whatsoever, despite him playing various first person shooters before signing on with Youtube. Most likely, none of you guys have ever SEEN a Youtuber in person, so you have no merit to judge their personality based off video dedicated to their viewer base. He's an entertainer, and like it or not, he wouldn't be the most subscribed to person on Youtube if no one liked his personality. Don't like him, cool, I'm not fond of him either, not anymore.
But back to the topic at hand, I agree, this whole debacle is a disgrace, and shames those who actually enjoy playing video games who make little to no revenue and those who make substantial revenue. Youtubers shouldn't go out of their way and ask for money from game developers, I wouldn't go out of my way to scum cash off my co-workers or clients when their dues are paid.
PhoenixFyre
Member
I never understood the whole "you're just jealous" thing. Like it or not, some people just don't like some personalities. It's not jealousy, it's not being a rabid dog, it's not gang mentality, it's just not liking something someone else likes.
I do YouTube videos and I've been vocal about my opposition to some "personalities" and practices. Like above, I don't like the trend of YouTubers now being glorified ad wings. YouTube used to be the last place you could go for actual, unbiased information and looks at video games. And now that's going away.
As for the aforementioned PDP, there's nothing wrong with liking or disliking his personality. I find him annoying, unwatchable and I greatly regret that he's the standard most LPers get held to. It's nothing to do with jealousy, it's simply not enjoying having such an annoying person be crowned the face of my favorite hobby.
We're viewers, or in YT's eyes, consumers, and YouTubers are the producers of what we consume. So yes, we have merit to judge their personalities. And my personality. The personalities are the product.
Winter John
Gold Member
I agree. People who engage in this behavior are pretty low, but we're not all greedy, money hungry scumbags. I have a tiny YT channel, I don't monetize any of the videos I do because it's just something I do for my own enjoyment. I don't ask people to rate,comment or subscribe. I don't even do commentaries because I think the games should be the focus, not the person playing them. I expect it means zero views forever, but that's ok. I'm happy just doing my wee videos and watching them on my tv
John Rabbit
Banned
thread title makes it sound like they're just asking for the figure (as in, how much was made). the fact that they're asking for a SHARE in the revenue is completely fucking disgusting.
digoutyoursoul
Member
This.
digoutyoursoul
Member
Should say who they are, I wouldn't protect shitbags like that
The whole "you're just jealous" isn't being upheld to those who aren't fond of personalities, but those who make comments that "Youtube isn't a real job." I'm not trying to tell you who can and can't like, I just find the whole debate ridiculous.
I respect you're opinion about ad revenue and how it's turned transformed Youtube into a friendly site-based community into the corporate hellhole it is now. I probably should have stated that yeah, some people are overpaid, but I don't think revenue should be reprimanded completely, the money coming from a Youtube position should go to the costs concerning the channel, and some left over for providing basic needs. Making millions off Youtube is ridiculous.
Youtuber personalities are stitched into the channel, and are completely different when not on camera. Not saying their personalities are fake or unhinged, but you don't see the complete person from watching their videos. I don't think you should judge people's personalities off of Youtube, by what their viewerbase requests.
So basically, you're saying YouTubers are just like celebrities?
PhoenixFyre
Member
My bad on misunderstanding.
They kind of are. Just watching a YouTube personality do his thing can cause you to form an attachment to that personality. I don't quite understand it myself, but a lot of times Internet personalities sort of take on almost accessible celebrity status.
Why should he be entitled to part of the revenue if the devs/publisher never agreed to his service? If I mow your lawn while you're out, without asking, can I demand payment?
Wolves Evolve
Member
Twitter scuttlebutt says Yogscast but I don't see how plausible that is, no offense to the team there either way.
I dont think its them.
Somebody's reputation is about to get hyperfucked and those who talk about the free market will get am object lesson in the free market of reputation. Once it comes out, backpedalling and apologies and a silently closing steel door.
I dont think its them.
Somebody's reputation is about to get hyperfucked and those who talk about the free market will get am object lesson in the free market of reputation. Once it comes out, backpedalling and apologies and a silently closing steel door.
I also know it's an ad when i see it.
You know, it's required by law to disclose something as an ad or when it's being sponsored.
A youtuber taking money from the dev for making videos and not disclosing it is illegal.
Karak
Member
That makes no sense whatsoever. Fuck them.
As someone who has their own channel its a fucking blessing half these people have the time to show you stuff or share their work. Even if I was much larger I would still never do that. The content itself, even if not monotized, is worth putting it up and a review or Lets Play should be because of a desire to show something not just make fucking cash from people who are working harder and longer hours than many of us.
I just do reviews so maybe its more of a "Lets Play" thing but its still despicable.
As someone who has their own channel its a fucking blessing half these people have the time to show you stuff or share their work. Even if I was much larger I would still never do that. The content itself, even if not monotized, is worth putting it up and a review or Lets Play should be because of a desire to show something not just make fucking cash from people who are working harder and longer hours than many of us.
I just do reviews so maybe its more of a "Lets Play" thing but its still despicable.
Ewwwwwww.
Raitosaito
Member
We found something that adheres to even a lower rules of ethics than game journalist.
Youtubers
Youtubers
Cave Johnson
Member
I'm actually flabbergasted by this. I thought there was this unspoken agreement that the YT/Indie promotion would ideally use their content for the purpose of promotion. YT's get content from indie, and indie gets promotion. So? Why on earth are they trying to upset this commitment by demanding more WHILE using content they don't fucking own in the first place.
I really cannot put in words how disgusted I am with this revelation. Aren't companies flagging YT for using their content and now they have the gall to demand more from the only ones who are capable of supporting them? I... just... can't... what? I mean, did it occur to them that this is the only BRIDGE they have to maintain their lifestyle? And if that got burned down how are they supposed to support themselves? The dumbfuckery here and shortsightedness is astounding... what, fucking bullshit ---- who are this people? Give us names!
I really cannot put in words how disgusted I am with this revelation. Aren't companies flagging YT for using their content and now they have the gall to demand more from the only ones who are capable of supporting them? I... just... can't... what? I mean, did it occur to them that this is the only BRIDGE they have to maintain their lifestyle? And if that got burned down how are they supposed to support themselves? The dumbfuckery here and shortsightedness is astounding... what, fucking bullshit ---- who are this people? Give us names!