• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

Sony sues George 'geohot' Hotz and fail0verflow over PS3 jailbreak.

Status
Not open for further replies.

Clear

CliffyB's Cock Holster
Tinfoilhatman said:
LOL at the haters in this thread, Sony F'd up BIGTIME blame them not the hacking\opensource\homebrew community. Then they just made themselves a larger target by removing Linux, NOW their making themselves even a BIGGER target by going after FailOverflow, good thinking Sony team just keep going further down the black rabbit hole.

Folks the fact is the proverbial genie is out of the bottle and no amount of lawsuits can stop the free flow of information on the internet, this has been proved time and time and time again the fact that some people fail to understand this is proof of how delusional some of you are.

Yeesh. I really was hoping to restrain myself from posting in this thread -opinions are so entrenched on both sides there's very little debate to be had- but this comment is so perfectly asinine I had to respond.

Dear Tinfoilhatman,
the world does not solely revolve around you, and exist to serve your interests and desires. For those of us with no particular interest in Linux, homebrew or piracy, all GeoHot and his fellow hackers have achieved is to create a colossal mess that is in no way going to enrich our enjoyment of our PS3's.

In fact, the need for heightened network security is quite likely to do the reverse. Everything in business has a cost attached, and if time/resources are being spent bolstering defences (both legal and technical) those funds will have been diverted from elsewhere. In simple terms, every user is going to feel the impact even if its the simple inconvenience of being forced to install additional firmware updates that would otherwise not be neccessary.

Why is this happening again? Sony may well have been planning to remove OtherOS support, but the impetus to patch it out so suddenly was demonstrably driven their desire to prevent hacker attacks. You can't point the finger of blame at Sony in isolation for this - frankly their desire to protect their business seems like a far more reasonable rationale than the desire to prolong service of a feature that -at least to my knowledge- had produced precisely nothing of general public interest for over 3 years.

Is it really so unreasonable after spending billions of dollars developing a system that has barely started to turn a profit that they Sony should want to protect their investment at all costs? I mean its not like they are the industry dominating super-power of years gone by, they are the ones struggling this generation. Desperate times demand desperate measures and all that.

Your comments also strongly indicates that you feel Sony should be in deathly fear of the hackers, is that *really* such a desirable situation for, well, anybody? It surely doesn't seem like a sweet deal for regular users like me who also payed good money for his console and now apparently should be looking forward to buying a new system because this one is "finished". Great. Mind if I bill you for my replacement PS4?

After all, there is -according to you- nothing that Sony can do at this point. Going after the hackers via the courts is just going to make things worse, because they are beyond the law apparently... Sheesh I wish these all-powerful people would use their revolutionary superpowers to do something generally constructive like bring peace to the middle-east or something... as opposed to bringing a system *I LIKE* to its knees in a gaudy display of people power (or Terrorism if you're a fan of the Patriot act <rolls eyes>).

Seriously though, Geohot's blatant self-promotion in publically disseminating the crypto-keys and pushing out his custom firmware kit so visibly is just begging to elicit a legal response from Sony. For such a "smart" kid it seems extraordinarily naive for him to expect anything less. And that being the case isn't it completely cut-and-dried as to who is driving this debacle forward? It isn't Sony.

Call me old-fashioned but I expect my Hackers like other "outlaw" types to wear masks, ore at least a leetized pseudonym. From where I sit he couldn't have made himself a more obvious target had he painted a bullseye on his skinny ass.

If he's done nothing wrong, or he's really as smart as he thinks he is, let him prove it in court. Seems fair enough to me.

The bottom-line is this: The ability to run unlicensed code is not just about free-warez and the media center of your dreams. Its about being constantly concerned that Sony will somehow detect your modified system and kick you off PSN. Its about being cockblocked by "surprise" OFW releases that need to be modded by some enterprising hacker and downloaded from some uncertain source before you can enjoy their benefits.

Its a big bag of arseholes, Tinfoilhatman. Its hassle, and worry, and for what exactly? You will never be able to use PSN with the same level of confidence and carefreeness that a legit user will.

One last thing. It doesn't matter whether you believe EULA's are legally binding or not. You should be in absolutely no doubt that Sony believe they are, and will take steps to enforce their view in any and all business transactions with them. If you don't like the deal, you should take your custom elsewhere. Taking the cavalier attitude that you can choose to ignore the terms they have been at pains to lay out for you is not honourable in any way. Its just the kind of legalistic dickery you are complaining that big-business is guilty of.

You really don't have the moral high-ground you think you have.

Peace & Love.

PS. I have absolutely no intention of posting again in this thread. So don't bother calling me out on any of my cranky opinions - I just needed to get this off my chest.
 

Htown

STOP SHITTING ON MY MOTHER'S HEADSTONE
Jobiensis said:
Yeah, but the don't bother responding cause I'm going to abandon my post is stupid.
nobody writes something that long and doesn't read the responses. he's here.
 
FLEABttn said:
You're above this.
no, not really.

Clear said:
corporate ballwashing
sheep like you sicken me, and as one of those people you deemed expendable because your corporate overlords decided that a feature i used was fine to remove, i don't think you deserve to be called human or deserve to have the same human rights as the rest of us.
 
expy said:
The keys are out, they'll never be removed from the public space. The arena is WIDE open, the hackers are going at it, you won't stop them.
4400110:jpeg_preview_medium.jpg


Dear Sony You'll never find me.

I'm a member of the super secret nighthawk commandos.

Shadow section, ghost platoon.

You didn't see me. I wasn't here.
 
The Faceless Master said:
sheep like you sicken me, and as one of those people you deemed expendable because your corporate overlords decided that a feature i used was fine to remove, i don't think you deserve to be called human or deserve to have the same human rights as the rest of us.
You're right, you have rights, and as such you could have gotten your money back if you weren't happy with them removing OtherOS. I did when they removed PS2 support.

This however, has NOTHING to do with your little problem.
 
Clear said:
PS. I have absolutely no intention of posting again in this thread. So don't bother calling me out on any of my cranky opinions - I just needed to get this off my chest.
Thank God I read the last line before I read the rest of the post, saved me having to read it.

If you're not going to discourse with other posters then there's no point in posting at all.
 
Metalmurphy said:
You're right, you have rights, and as such you could have gotten your money back if you weren't happy with them removing OtherOS. I did when they removed PS2 support.

This however, has NOTHING to do with your little problem.

Nobody in the US was able to get their money back for OtherOS. I didn't even know that there was even recourse for the removal of PS2 BC.
 
Clear said:
Dear Tinfoilhatman,
the world does not solely revolve around you, and exist to serve your interests and desires. For those of us with no particular interest in Linux, homebrew or piracy, all GeoHot and his fellow hackers have achieved is to create a colossal mess that is in no way going to enrich our enjoyment of our PS3's.
Well said, the whole thing really.

From the perspective of a PS3 gamer who has no interest in homebrew there are no upsides to be found in any of this.

Customers should get compensation for the removal of OtherOS though. How was this handled?

Metalmurphy said:
There's proof right here on GAF that says otherwise.

The correct statement is: Almost nobody cared.
Really? Care to elaborate? or point me in the right direction?
 
captmcblack said:
Nobody in the US was able to get their money back for OtherOS. I didn't even know that there was even recourse for the removal of PS2 BC.
There's proof right here on GAF that says otherwise.

The correct statement is: Almost nobody cared.
 
Metalmurphy said:
There's proof right here on GAF that says otherwise.

The correct statement is: Almost nobody cared.


Can you link me to where people were able to do this?
I would've applied for money back, but the only thing I saw is people in the UK getting money back from Amazon, and some people filing a class action lawsuit.
 

iammeiam

Member
Clear said:
PS. I have absolutely no intention of posting again in this thread. So don't bother calling me out on any of my cranky opinions - I just needed to get this off my chest.

People really should put that kind of thing at the start of their posts, not the end, since it's basically declaration that they're only interested in the part of discussion revolving around the sound of their own voice.
 
Metalmurphy said:
There's proof right here on GAF that says otherwise.

The correct statement is: Almost nobody cared.
getting money was never an acceptable compromise for me. AsbestOS sounds great though! so does native XMB homebrew. thanks Sony for making it all possible!!!
 

FLEABttn

Banned
The Faceless Master said:
no, not really.

I'm sure you're not that unreasona...


sheep like you sicken me, and as one of those people you deemed expendable because your corporate overlords decided that a feature i used was fine to remove, i don't think you deserve to be called human or deserve to have the same human rights as the rest of us.

Oh. Well, I clearly missed the mark on you.
 

Speevy

Banned
Sony should have sent him a gift basket. His contributions to the future of game development, design, and indeed the entire industry are monumental.

I hope everyone on this forum becomes a key decision maker in a mult-billion dollar corporation, so when a situation like this arises, you can look the other way.
 

Arsenic

Member
Clear said:
intelligent Post
I do wish you can respond to future posts here

It's pleasant to read reasonable and well-thoughtout posts like yours here in this sensitive topic, and I hope we get the equivalent quality post opposing your thoughts
 

Dunlop

Member
Vinci said:
Okay. Now that we've narrowed it down. Which developer has lost his or her job undoubtedly due to piracy in the 'PSP camp'?


First there is Bob from accounting at Ubisoft...what are you expecting as an answer here?

You are posting like I am the anti CFW advocate, I loved the homebrew on my PSP but I live in the really real world where there are consequences. I wont cry myself to sleep over it, but I don't turn a blind eye to it either

No doubt PSP sales of many many games underperformed due to the insane as shit piracy problems on the platform and you need to recoup losses somehow

Does CFW = Piracy, nope
Does it facilitate it, hell yes
 

Vinci

Danish
Metalmurphy said:
Getting their console opened to piracy was never an acceptable compromise for Sony.

....

Given the nature of how the hack was perpetrated, that's less clear than you think.
 

Vinci

Danish
Dunlop said:
First there is Bob from accounting at Ubisoft...what are you expecting as an answer here?

You made a statement as if something were fact. I asked for evidence, which you appear unable to provide. So I'm asking where you are getting this idea from.
 
Dunlop said:
First there is Bob from accounting at Ubisoft...what are you expecting as an answer here?

You are posting like I am the anti CFW advocate, I loved the homebrew on my PSP but I live in the really real world where there are consequences. I wont cry myself to sleep over it, but I don't turn a blind eye to it either

No doubt PSP sales of many many games underperformed due to the insane as shit piracy problems on the platform and you need to recoup losses somehow

Does CFW = Piracy, nope
Does it facilitate it, hell yes
know what else facilitates piracy? designing, producing, manufacturing and making videogame hardware and software available to the general populace. if they didn't do it, it couldn't be pirated!

AND YET, THEY CONTINUE TO DO SO WHEN THE OUTCOME IS INEVITABLE
 
The Faceless Master said:
know what else facilitates piracy? designing, producing, manufacturing and making videogame hardware and software available to the general populace. if they didn't do it, it couldn't be pirated!

AND YET, THEY CONTINUE TO DO SO WHEN THE OUTCOME IS INEVITABLE
wow... just wow...

:lol
 

Jomjom

Banned
The Faceless Master said:
know what else facilitates piracy? designing, producing, manufacturing and making videogame hardware and software available to the general populace. if they didn't do it, it couldn't be pirated!

AND YET, THEY CONTINUE TO DO SO WHEN THE OUTCOME IS INEVITABLE

Errr... if I read you right, you are saying that the simple act of creating something facilitates piracy. I think you need to look up the definition of the word "facilitate".

I guess no one should ever create anything new ever again unless they are just simply satisfied with allowing it to be pirated.
 

zoku88

Member
jling84 said:
Errr... if I read you right, you are saying that the simple act of creating something facilitates piracy. I think you need to look up the definition of the word "facilitate".

I guess no one should ever create anything new ever again unless they are just simply satisfied with allowing it to be pirated.
I think he is arguing against the view that CFW facilitates piracy.

Ie, he's trying to show how silly the view is by using the same logic and apply it to other places.
 
Speevy said:
Judging by the last 5 years of downsizing, piracy may become a thing of the past before you know it.
the last time i checked, the videogame industry has been growing every year. now, i know that the retail console industry has been shrinking slightly the past 2 years, but this is more than offset by the rapidly growing sectors in online casual gaming and mobile gaming.
 

XiaNaphryz

LATIN, MATRIPEDICABUS, DO YOU SPEAK IT
I swear, this thread is like an endless loop. Which is pretty much par for the course for any CFW-related PS3 thread it seems. :lol
 
jling84 said:
Errr... if I read you right, you are saying that the simple act of creating something facilitates piracy. I think you need to look up the definition of the word "facilitate".

I guess no one should ever create anything new ever again unless they are just simply satisfied with allowing it to be pirated.
Amen! (no Theist)
 

Jobiensis

Member
jling84 said:
Errr... if I read you right, you are saying that the simple act of creating something facilitates piracy. I think you need to look up the definition of the word "facilitate".

I guess no one should ever create anything new ever again unless they are just simply satisfied with allowing it to be pirated.

Correct, Sony facilitated the pirates by implementing ECDSA without understanding how it works, not by designing the console.

phosphor112 said:
Being able to reverse engineer a program takes a lot of skill and programming knowledge. It's a test of what you know all things related to programming.

??

I mean how does this in any way relate to the statement you made. The original ?? was probably how they would use it to teach without making it public. But professors like to figure out how things work and then tell everybody how they did it.
 
XiaNaphryz said:
I swear, this thread is like an endless loop. Which is pretty much par for the course for any CFW-related PS3 thread it seems. :lol
It feels like the PS3 cfw topics should get their own forum section along with it's own sub sections.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top Bottom