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[KtSlime]

LOL!! I've said this once and you guys continue to ignore it. So I can modify a semi auto AK to full auto? I can buy a computer and stash some child porn on it? I can buy thermite and some other shit and make a bomb out of it?

NO NO NO NO NO.


OH LOOK THE IDIOTS ARE HAVING FUN WITH THIS NOW!! Refresh page every five minutes, get a new thread!]

Those things are determined by the GOVERNMENT not Sony. There is no ruling by the government that I can't run homebrew on my PS3, we are about to find that out. :lol

 

[phosphor112]

I'm getting the feeling that you're just here to tell us things we already knew, or to shit on our intelligence. Your professor simply said something wrong, it's no big deal.

I'm sure he didn't give me a proper explanation because he has a life at home he wants to go to, but I'm sure he's not an idiot about his own field either.

 

[JudgeN]

*FACEPALM* @ people QQuoting the video

So because its old that makes it suck less or unimportant?

 

[Tenkei]

It's obvious none of you guys make anything you plan on selling.

Hmm, I write commercial software for a living, including products on your precious console. It's obvious that you do not know what you're talking about.

 

[Jobiensis]

What is the security code for?

It's for the top secret vault under my bed where I keep the gold. God damn it you hackers (mugurumakensei), there is no way you figured out the algorithm, I'm calling my attorney.

It's obvious none of you guys make anything you plan on selling.

I own a software company, but I have no delusions that I have any rights to screw over customers.

You are making an argument that has already been settled, source code is protected speech, even if it has keys, codes or pins in it.

 

[wolfmat]

It's obvious none of you guys make anything you plan on selling.

Hi, software developer here. Doing commercial stuff. On closed systems. Don't just make things up about people, it's insulting.

 

[test_account]

So because its old that makes it suck less or unimportant?

Online cheating still sucks indeed, but i guess that he probably just ment to say that making this cheat was possible before the PS3 encryption keys were given out.

It's for the top secret vault under my bed where I keep the gold. God damn it you hackers, I'm calling my attorney.

Hehe ok You decided to give out your own code by free will though, so it is a bit different (yes, i know that it's only a joke hehe ).

 

[jonezer4]

the removal was never a cost saving measure. other os works in slims, all that is needed is a software modification.

the cost of maintaining the feature has to be close to zero.

This. 0verflow explicitly mentioned in their presentation that it was obvious that the "cost saving measure" was a completely bogus cop out. They were tacitly attempting to downgrade their customers' access to the system and it backfired in the worst possible way.

 

[iammeiam]

LOL!! I've said this once and you guys continue to ignore it. So I can modify a semi auto AK to full auto? I can buy a computer and stash some child porn on it? I can buy thermite and some other shit and make a bomb out of it?

NO NO NO NO

Unless I'm wrong, you can modify your AK into a useless statue. You can buy a computer from Apple and store anti-Apple tirades on it. You can buy thermite, put a wig and novelty glasses on the package, and pretend it's your BFF. You are allowed to do things the manufacturers did not intend.

What you are not allowed to do is modify those objects in ways that are inherently illegal--you may not store child porn on your PS3, and you may not legally use it to blow up a building. This has Jack shit to do with Sony's EULA, or Sony's preferences, and everything to do with the actual law. Modifying the PS3 to run LINUX again is not legally the same as using it to pirate, even if both piss Sony off.

 

[ClovingWestbrook]

Hey GAF, my security code is

53 75 63 6B 6D 79 44 69 63 6B

You are all accessories and have broken the corporatist's law. Keep your hands off my gold! Be ready for your summons tomorrow morning.

By reading this post, you agree to my EULA of giving me all your money if you break my terms and read my code, disassemble or reverse engineer it and you may get triple damages. I also may send over a buddy to kick your ass just cause. The cat is out of the bag

:lol :lol :lol

 

[Tylahedras]

LOL!! I've said this once and you guys continue to ignore it. So I can modify a semi auto AK to full auto? I can buy a computer and stash some child porn on it? I can buy thermite and some other shit and make a bomb out of it?

NO NO NO NO NO.

Wow, what an apt comparison. I suppose that if he had turned his PS3 into an illegal gun, an explosive or placed child porn on it you might have a point.

But he didn't. And you don't.

 

[wolfmat]

I'm sure he didn't give me a proper explanation because he has a life at home he wants to go to, but I'm sure he's not an idiot about his own field either.

He surely isn't an idiot. Professors are usually pretty bright people. It's rather hard to get there if you're lacking in the head department.

I didn't mean to disrespect your prof by any means. He surely didn't research the topic immediately before you guys had that chat.

 

[XiaNaphryz]

It's obvious none of you guys make anything you plan on selling.

Riiiiight. I'm sure you're an expert in all the places I've worked at. :lol

 

[The Faceless Master]

serious question here. have any of you ever brought your own food and/or drinks into a movie theater that has a sign that bars outside food and drinks?

 

[Raist]

Unless I'm wrong, you can modify your AK into a useless statue. You can buy a computer from Apple and store anti-Apple tirades on it. You can buy thermite, put a wig and novelty glasses on the package, and pretend it's your BFF. You are allowed to do things the manufacturers did not intend.

What you are not allowed to do is modify those objects in ways that are inherently illegal--you may not store child porn on your PS3, and you may not legally use it to blow up a building. This has Jack shit to do with Sony's EULA, or Sony's preferences, and everything to do with the actual law. Modifying the PS3 to run LINUX again is not legally the same as using it to pirate, even if both piss Sony off.

I'm fairly sure you can turn your PS3 into a useless statue as well, however you're not allowed to modify its firmware and distribute it, or use a modified version of its firmware.

 

[wolfmat]

I'm fairly sure you can turn your PS3 into a useless statue as well, however you're not allowed to modify its firmware and distribute it, or use a modified version of its firmware.

Can you quote the global law that makes it so? It would settle a lot of arguments I tend to run into with other nerds.

serious question here. have any of you ever brought your own food and/or drinks into a movie theater that has a sign that bars outside food and drinks?

Nope, and I hate myself for paying for the overpriced food. I'm a pussy with those things, to be honest.

 

[KtSlime]

I'm fairly sure you can turn your PS3 into a useless statue as well, however you're not allowed to modify its firmware and distribute it, or use a modified version of its firmware.

When did Geohot distribute a modified firmware!?!?! Oh that's right, he did not infringe on Sony's copyright in any way.

And we don't know if we are or aren't allowed to use the modified firmware. That is for the government to determine, not for Sony to write in a TOS/EULA.

 

[The Faceless Master]

It's obvious none of you guys make anything you plan on selling.

that's a hilarious position to take as many game devs right here on GAF say that many of their fellow game developing co-workers are some of the biggest pirates!

 

[Jobiensis]

I'm fairly sure you can turn your PS3 into a useless statue as well, however you're not allowed to modify its firmware and distribute it, or use a modified version of its firmware.

Can you show one case or law to support this statement? Some of you are really confusing what you want vs. what is reality.

Edit: I'm slow, slow, slow

 

[The Faceless Master]

Nope, and I hate myself for paying for the overpriced food. I'm a pussy with those things, to be honest.

oh... just asking because i did it all the time, at first hiding stuff, but eventually blatantly having 42oz cups and bags of fast food in my hands and i was never stopped.

 

[ClovingWestbrook]

I'm fairly sure you can turn your PS3 into a useless statue as well, however you're not allowed to modify its firmware and distribute it, or use a modified version of its firmware.

Except not everybody agreed to such an agreement. AND, AGAIN, EULA's are NOT law. Just because Sony says you cannot do something doesn't mean legally you are not able to. It ALSO depends on what country you're from. So this whole black and white you cannot do this crap needs to die. The correct statement is 'Sony has stated that if you use our system and accept our EULA you are then not allowed to do A, B, and C'. That is different than saying categorically and unequivocally that you're not allowed to do A, B, and C.

Its very sad that so many people are willing to throw out their rights for the big corporations. Consumer rights truly is absent for many of you.

 

[phosphor112]

He surely isn't an idiot. Professors are usually pretty bright people. It's rather hard to get there if you're lacking in the head department.

I didn't mean to disrespect your prof by any means. He surely didn't research the topic immediately before you guys had that chat.

Thanks for the clarification, and yeah he hadn't researched the topic. It was a quick chat after class. One thing he is familiar with is with copyright laws (though they have been changing constantly). He's familiar with laws of the US, Canada, and several European countries.

 

[XiaNaphryz]

Has charlequin posted in this thread yet? And where's the rest of legal-GAF?

 

[ClovingWestbrook]

that's a hilarious position to take as many game devs right here on GAF say that many of their fellow game developing co-workers are some of the biggest pirates!

Not to mention we had a developer in this very thread who said he uses homebrew and many of his coworkers do as well AND yet DO NOT PIRATE. That homebrew has been and continues to be very valuable for developers. But Phosphor apparently would argue they are not in the business of developing software that is to be protected.

 

[phosphor112]

that's a hilarious position to take as many game devs right here on GAF say that many of their fellow game developing co-workers are some of the biggest pirates!

They are clearly hypocrites then. I'm sure other developers have higher standards, especially since if they get caught, they will lose their jobs.

 

[The Faceless Master]

So because its old that makes it suck less or unimportant?

because it's old, it predates F0F/GH. it doesn't suck less and isn't unimportant in the scheme of "people who cheat in online games suck" it just has nothing to do with this thread.

 

[Jocchan]

They are clearly hypocrites then. I'm sure other developers have higher standards, especially since if they get caught, they will lose their jobs.

Of course.

 

[Relix]

serious question here. have any of you ever brought your own food and/or drinks into a movie theater that has a sign that bars outside food and drinks?

Yep. Mostly candies.

 

[Zoe]

This thread is getting boring. Nobody cares to discuss this?

I've obtained the response filed by geohot's lawyers: http://www.thesangreal.net/gaf/hotz.zip

It would be cool if we could discuss the actual lawsuit instead of yet another thread on the merits of homebrew vs. piracy

 

[wolfmat]

They are clearly hypocrites then. I'm sure other developers have higher standards, especially since if they get caught, they will lose their jobs.

Piracy is generally being frowned upon in the developer community. People in the business sometimes do it anyway, be it out of laziness or because they got used to it at some point. Some peeps also obsessively download everything. And get away with it because, you know, he's a buddy and all, and it's just that one guy and stuff…

It's a sad state of affairs. Especially when people have the money to not do it. Which is usually the case among developers, it's a pretty well-paid job.

 

[KtSlime]

serious question here. have any of you ever brought your own food and/or drinks into a movie theater that has a sign that bars outside food and drinks?

Totally, 12 bucks for a movie after a crappy 1 dollar academic discount, AND I have to buy 3d glasses each time? If I can't bring in free free water, then the can fuck themselves.

 

[XiaNaphryz]

This thread is getting boring. Nobody cares to discuss this?

Actual discussion gets derailed once someone repeats an earlier stance on piracy and the circle of life resumes again.

 

[Atomski]

serious question here. have any of you ever brought your own food and/or drinks into a movie theater that has a sign that bars outside food and drinks?

Yep, heck I will bring healthy snacks to movie theaters to avoid the temptation of salty buttered popcorn.

 

[Shaneus]

Actual discussion gets derailed once someone repeats an earlier stance on piracy and the circle of life resumes again.

"Life" is a pretty loose term. Replace it with "bullshit" to get a more suitable statement :/

 

[expy]

serious question here. have any of you ever brought your own food and/or drinks into a movie theater that has a sign that bars outside food and drinks?

Naw, usually eat before or after the movie (lots of restaurants nearby).

 

[Zoe]

Naw, usually eat before or after the movie (lots of restaurants nearby).

Or eat your meal during the movie.

<3

 

[Raist]

Can you quote the global law that makes it so? It would settle a lot of arguments I tend to run into with other nerds.

wtf is a global law , anyways?

When did Geohot distribute a modified firmware!?!?! Oh that's right, he did not infringe on Sony's copyright in any way.

I really doubt his 3.21OO firmware or the 3.55JB one were written from scratch and completely different from Sony's. It's a patched, thus modified version.

 

[wolfmat]

This thread is getting boring. Nobody cares to discuss this?

Still reading. Lots of typos.

wtf is a global law , anyways?

I have no idea.

 

[KtSlime]

wtf is a global law , anyways?

That's the point. :lol

 

[Cruzader]

LOL!! I've said this once and you guys continue to ignore it. So I can modify a semi auto AK to full auto? I can buy a computer and stash some child porn on it? I can buy thermite and some other shit and make a bomb out of it?

NO NO NO NO NO.


OH LOOK THE IDIOTS ARE HAVING FUN WITH THIS NOW!! Refresh page every five minutes, get a new thread!

Wow.

 

[SonOfABeep]

My opinion is that if CFW makes the PS3 experience as awesome as it made my PSP and PSPgo experiences I hope these guys get off scot free and sony has to pay their legal charges and apologize. :lol

 

[Zoe]

Still reading. Lots of typos.

It always amazes me when I see typos and grammatical errors all over legal documents. Surely these people are typing them up in some kind of word processor! :lol

 

[Raistlin]

Hi, software developer here. Doing commercial stuff. On closed systems. Don't just make things up about people, it's insulting.

Ya'rly. Professional dev here as well.

 

[phosphor112]

Not to mention we had a developer in this very thread who said he uses homebrew and many of his coworkers do as well AND yet DO NOT PIRATE. That homebrew has been and continues to be very valuable for developers. But Phosphor apparently would argue they are not in the business of developing software that is to be protected.

I'm not against homebrew. I've said this many times. I'm an open source fanatic. I use Firefox, Gimp, Blender, Open Office, all of that. Even when I have and equivalent of those free from my university. It's the publication of the key that easily allows anyone with programming knowledge to make programs for easy pirating. It's the not giving a single fuck about the millions of dollars the companies invest simply to have a certain feature. Should have sony taken out OtherOS? No, should they protect their investments? Yes, they are a fucking company.

 

[Raist]

That's the point. :lol

If that meant "universal", as in valid in every single country in the world, then there is no such thing. If that meant an actual law, enforced by a government, well...

3. In accordance with the provisions of the Berne Convention for the protection of Literary and Artistic Works, the provisions of this Article may not be interpreted in such a way as to allow its application to be used in a manner which unreasonably prejudices the right holder's legitimate interests or conflicts with a normal exploitation of the computer program.

(c) any act of putting into circulation, or the possession for commercial purposes of, any means the sole intended purpose of which is to facilitate the unauthorized removal or circumvention of any technical device which may have been applied to protect a computer program.

That's an EU law regarding decompilation of software when the goal is interoperability (which one could argue to be a legitimate -and legal- goal for a CFW). I don't think the patched 3.55FW doesn't clash with these articles.

 

[Dreams-Visions]

It's for the top secret vault under my bed where I keep the gold. God damn it you hackers (mugurumakensei), there is no way you figured out the algorithm, I'm calling my attorney.



I own a software company, but I have no delusions that I have any rights to screw over customers.

You are making an argument that has already been settled, source code is protected speech, even if it has keys, codes or pins in it.

bravo.

 

[ClovingWestbrook]

I'm not against homebrew. I've said this many times. I'm an open source fanatic. I use Firefox, Gimp, Blender, Open Office, all of that. Even when I have and equivalent of those free from my university. It's the publication of the key that easily allows anyone with programming knowledge to make programs for easy pirating. It's the not giving a single fuck about the millions of dollars the companies invest simply to have a certain feature. Should have sony taken out OtherOS? No, should they protect their investments? Yes, they are a fucking company.

Are you in favor of them bricking consoles if they were able to?

 

[angelfly]

I really doubt his 3.21OO firmware or the 3.55JB one were written from scratch and completely different from Sony's. It's a patched, thus modified version.

He distributed a patch and nothing more

 

[Boombloxer]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1f7NDx_EX94&feature=player_embedded


this fucking blows.. i can see this being an issue with future multiplayer games and for this reason i hope SONY perm bans any jail broken console connected to the PSN

Yea, fuck this. No modified console should ever be allowed to connect to the PSN.

 

[phosphor112]

Are you in favor of them bricking consoles if they were able to?

Negative. That's like saying you speed in a car, and the company that made the car has a right to brick your car. Fuck that. Just perma disable them from the internet on that device to prevent any hacking activity on the PSN. Sony probably (not familiar with law related to this aspect) don't have the right to brick your console. I mean.. maybe if they find out you are doing something really illegal and brick it + reporting it to the police or something....