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Sony, the masters of spoiling the party
- Thread starter Chittagong
- Start date
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Zerodoppler
Member
Spiegel said:
This is the worst bait and switch ever. I wanted to believe that the game would look pretty close to this, but then Nintendo delivered fucking Blue Storm.
besada said:
That's my big complaint.
Sony can do whatever they want. But the media has to call them out on it. Bring up their history of bringing talk to the table when another company is about to bring product, etc.
Question the suspicious announcements, the odd timing, push for actual shipping dates, maybe even use the phrase "so if this doesn't make it to market this year what else do you have lined up?".
And of course I don't mean they should do it just to Sony.
mambadragon
Banned
They all do this. Anyone who's been following for a while knew there wasn't going to be 2 HDMI ports on the PS3, Mario Galaxy and Smash Bros. weren't going to launch with the Wii, and there wouldn't be virtual clothing stores run by users on 360.
slicedking
Member
hc2 said:
First, tell me does this statement have any relevance to the conversation. Less gamers more analyst? I still don't get why you guys get riled up about this stuff. I mean, if you bought in to the hype and you're dissapointed, then you have an argument. But dissing a company just for kicks......
Pristine_Condition
Member
Night_Trekker said:
Wat?
The "Toy Story" comparison used in the Sony article is from a reporter.
The "Toy Story" quote used in the Microsoft article came directly from a Microsoft representative.
You honestly can't tell the difference? How can you post on a message board if you have such trouble with basic reading comprehension?
People have searched the web far and wide for this mythical Sony-"Toy Story" quote. FOR YEARS, ever since this myth started. NO ONE HAS EVER FOUND A DIRECT LINK TO SONY AND THE "TOY STORY" QUOTE. Yet the Microsoft link is easy to find, and was reported by more than one source.
Why is this lie still being told in 2008, when everybody knows the truth?
Diablohead
Member
haha first thing that came to mind when I read the thread title :lolSlamo said:
Yikes, GAF. Touchy, touchy.
I'm no fanboy of anything and I think the OP makes some valid points.
Even in the case of the Project Reality/N64, while there were plenty of blatant bullshots and overpromises, it was all pretty transparent proof-of-concept tech demo type stuff, they didn't really try to pass that virtual museum with framed Mario characters off as a full game or anything. I don't recall any really notable first-party vaporware coming out of the pre-hype. That Final Fantasy VI tech demo maybe misdirected some people, but if we're playing that game, PS3 did the exact same thing with FFVII, which is perhaps more damning because that time around, people in the west actually knew what FF was.
Every console has its vaporware, but with Sony it's been a bit more extreme than elsewhere. An installment in a bubillion-selling franchise like Gran Turismo Portable turning out to be smoke isn't even comparable to a niche offering like True Fantasy Live Online or Robotech: Crystal Dreams or whatever, it's on another level entirely. People bought a PSP for the eventual promise of GT Portable, and considering it was there in force at the system's unveil and even had mock-up UMDs made and shown front and center, I can't fault them; Sony treated it as though it was practically guaranteed.
Getaway and 8 Days are less egregious violations, but they were still 1st party showings whose footage got prime real estate at conferences. Potential high-profile apps for the system and now they don't exist. I don't really begrudge Sony that or anything fundamentally, cancellations happen, but they were definitely trotted out with much more force than, say, Project HAMMER.
I'm no fanboy of anything and I think the OP makes some valid points.
Even in the case of the Project Reality/N64, while there were plenty of blatant bullshots and overpromises, it was all pretty transparent proof-of-concept tech demo type stuff, they didn't really try to pass that virtual museum with framed Mario characters off as a full game or anything. I don't recall any really notable first-party vaporware coming out of the pre-hype. That Final Fantasy VI tech demo maybe misdirected some people, but if we're playing that game, PS3 did the exact same thing with FFVII, which is perhaps more damning because that time around, people in the west actually knew what FF was.
Every console has its vaporware, but with Sony it's been a bit more extreme than elsewhere. An installment in a bubillion-selling franchise like Gran Turismo Portable turning out to be smoke isn't even comparable to a niche offering like True Fantasy Live Online or Robotech: Crystal Dreams or whatever, it's on another level entirely. People bought a PSP for the eventual promise of GT Portable, and considering it was there in force at the system's unveil and even had mock-up UMDs made and shown front and center, I can't fault them; Sony treated it as though it was practically guaranteed.
Getaway and 8 Days are less egregious violations, but they were still 1st party showings whose footage got prime real estate at conferences. Potential high-profile apps for the system and now they don't exist. I don't really begrudge Sony that or anything fundamentally, cancellations happen, but they were definitely trotted out with much more force than, say, Project HAMMER.
gcubed said:
By fixating on only the most extreme positions you've decided that it's not worth discussing and also demonstrated you can only see this as a black and white issue. If you think the OP is wrong why not offer some sort of counter point that's not "grow up"?
Let me also assure you that the OP doesn't become true if you fail come in and insult it.
Mustaphadamus
Member
I thought the European version of the game had it?TTP said:
The OP has a valid point. Does anyone not remember the PS2 launch? That thing was hyped to be the second coming, and it launch with no big name title, yet it still sold like hot cakes. Their first party support was a joke for the first year.
Does any of that sound familiar? Oh yeah, the PS3 launched was almost exactly the same, except this time, not as many people were willing to pay $599 US dollars for a console with no games on it.
Does any of that sound familiar? Oh yeah, the PS3 launched was almost exactly the same, except this time, not as many people were willing to pay $599 US dollars for a console with no games on it.
Metalmurphy
Member
Nope, RR7 is true 1080p @ 60fps._dementia said:
There's some NBA game that's also 1080p60.
plagiarize
Banned
would microsoft have ever said it without the widely believed Sony story already being out there?Pristine_Condition said:
plagiarize
Banned
if you're talking about NBA Homecourt that's 1080p30... but i'm fairly sure VT3 is 1080p60 on both PS3 and 360.Metalmurphy said:
and the op was pretty clear in saying 'everyone does it, but sony do it best'... so all these examples of nintendo and microsoft doing it are kind of missing the point.
Metalmurphy
Member
No, I'm talking about the one that's exclusive to PS3.plagiarize said:
Oh and seems that Full Auto 2 is also 1080p60
*edit* It's NBA07/08
BruceWayneIII
Member
Wish that there would have been a thread called "Early insights - the good and the bad", but...
Try to imagine a games industry that:
- doesn't show early artwork
- doesn't interview people during pre-production
- doesn't show pre-alpha screenshots
- doesn't let people try out actual gameplay in alpha stage
- doesn't show prototypes and early concepts
- doesn't involve the public in their great visions and plans for the future
- only show games when they are 100% finished
all because the internet can't understand projects, hardware, concepts, services that get cancelled, revised, overhauled, scaled back, re-evaluated etc.
Personally, throughout my business career, I haven't seen a lot of very large scope projects go straight from concept to product without transforming a lot during the process. Most large companies have a portfolio of strategic projects and innovation projects and quite a few of these won't ever make it to the finish line. And they rightfully shouldn't - however, you don't know which ones until much further down the road.
Try to imagine a games industry that:
- doesn't show early artwork
- doesn't interview people during pre-production
- doesn't show pre-alpha screenshots
- doesn't let people try out actual gameplay in alpha stage
- doesn't show prototypes and early concepts
- doesn't involve the public in their great visions and plans for the future
- only show games when they are 100% finished
all because the internet can't understand projects, hardware, concepts, services that get cancelled, revised, overhauled, scaled back, re-evaluated etc.
Personally, throughout my business career, I haven't seen a lot of very large scope projects go straight from concept to product without transforming a lot during the process. Most large companies have a portfolio of strategic projects and innovation projects and quite a few of these won't ever make it to the finish line. And they rightfully shouldn't - however, you don't know which ones until much further down the road.
BruceWayneIII
Member
DP
slicedking
Member
Forgive me if I misunderstood. But still, my point remains.hc2 said:
'Toy Story graphics' is such an ubiquituous benchmark soundbite for 3D games that even if no one officially said it on the record, it's a fair bet that an employee somewhere mentioned it.plagiarize said:
Regardless of the whole whys and wherefores of that specific quote, it's a pretty clear-cut case that Sony promised a lot more of the Emotion Engine than what we actually got.
Son of Godzilla
Banned
Newsflash: I do not loathe whatever box sits underneath your television set. How you got that from what I posted, I have no idea.Ajax said:
slicedking said:
I would love for the PS3 to do well and bring out more games that I enjoy playing. It would be a win, win, win situation if all 3 consoles lived up to their respective "hype' for me-except financially (@ $60/game).
But how about quit promising and disappointing?
I remember Half Life took most people by surprise, I remember GTA being a pleasant surprise, I remember Halo surprising everyone, recently Bioshock and Mass Effect kind of surprised a lot of people.
What if Sony (and Microsoft and Nintendo) did some walking before starting the talking? I like surprises, and hope to be surprised again. No more "Alone In The Dark"'s or "Haze"'s please.
krypt0nian
Banned
They certainly haven't disappointed me, except maybe not continuing the Heavenly Sword ip.
Wasn't it the Mangod himself who said Killzone PS3 was a trailer before it was a game? Same with 8 Days and The Getaway. The difference is most publishers use CG trailers to reveal games in development that aren't ready to be shown. Sony uses CG to reveal games that don't exist.
Sony's use of this tactic to completely and utterly destroy Sega's Dreamcast is where it really grates my britches. People back then were so hyped up on Saddam Hussein steering missles with PS2 and ragging on the DC that they completely missed out on one of the best console lineups in history.
Now they're all buying Soul Calibur on Xbox Live Marketplace and have no idea how much has been chopped out of the original game or how crap it plays on Microsoft's shitty d-pad.
Now they're all buying Soul Calibur on Xbox Live Marketplace and have no idea how much has been chopped out of the original game or how crap it plays on Microsoft's shitty d-pad.
plagiarize
Banned
i'm saying that going 'BUT IT WASN'T SONY IT WAS MICROSOFT' that said it isn't telling the whole story.TheBranca18 said:
we don't know if Microsoft would have said it if it wasn't widely believed that Sony had... and it certainly isn't Microsoft's fault that everyone thought it was a claim Sony made.
has Sony ever denied that claim? did they know it was out there and not shoot it down?
a lot of gaf posters like to see one company as evil and one as guiltless, but the truth is far from that.
of course that doesn't mean we shouldn't complain when any company engages in shady or anti consumer tactics. i don't care if they all do it or not. i don't like it ever.
speculawyer
Member
Sony bailed on LA Noire . . . but Rockstar picked it up. I suspect it will become dual-platform now. I can't see any other way for Rockstar to re-coupe their investment.
slicedking
Member
Understood... But the talking and blatant boasting will never cease as long there is a business running.hc2 said:
dave is ok
aztek is ok
I never believed 8 Days was going to come out. I remember thinking that as I was watching the trailer
theBishop said:
Posts like this make you realize just how long certain people have been paying attention to the gaming industry if at all. I don't know how many times it has to be repeated in this thread but if it'll help I'll repeat it again.
All three current console makers have, at one point or another, used cg trailers to market future games. It's even become the trend in the industry for not just the console makers but for studios. That Gears of War 2 teaser? CG. That Resistance 2 teaser? CG. Go back even further, and you'll see worse examples. They do it to build up hype, plain and simple. Don't believe for a second that this is some kind of new phenomenon in gaming. It's been here since 2 generations ago.
plagiarize
Banned
the problem has always been CG pretending to be gameplay. i don't think anyone would have confused that Gears of War 2 teaser for gameplay.Baha said:
commariodore64
Member
And why was I banned last week for 5 days for making a joke about Sony causing lowered expectations in the industry? Yet - this topic and subsequent posts are fine!?
Mods please explain?
Mods please explain?
Death_Born
Banned
Holy shit, mind blown!
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