-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Steve Kent blasts Nintendo, 7 rules for fixing nintendo
- Thread starter Random_Hajile
- Start date
God's Hand
Banned
Doesn't look like his writing. Would be surprised...
OK I'm not a fan of RPG games but slamming them the way you did is so not cool. Any game can be slammed like that because every game will never be as realistic as well, real life. Faults can therefore be found in every genre and every title. Games are a form of escapism, a way to have fun so get a grip and enjoy gaming. 
You should move to Canada because a lot of the Gamecube commercials really have me ----> :lol
TomthebombServo said:
You should move to Canada because a lot of the Gamecube commercials really have me ----> :lol
TomthebombServo
Banned
GamerDiva said:
Are they Sega '90s funny? Got a link where I can see some?
TomthebombServo said:Are they Sega '90s funny? Got a link where I can see some?
www.goodcowfilms.com has some, I think, and yes, they're good.
Here's a better link: http://www.goodcowfilms.com/farm/games/commercials/
Warm Machine
Member
GamerDiva said:OK I'm not a fan of RPG games but slamming them the way you did is so not cool. Any game can be slammed like that because every game will never be as realistic as well, real life. Faults can therefore be found in every genre and every title. Games are a form of escapism, a way to have fun so get a grip and enjoy gaming.
It isn't about slamming a genre. I'm identifying the concepts that rarely have changed even since the days of pen and paper Dungeons and Dragons.
The weapons upgrade thing can be pretty funny though...Here is your fathers sword do him proud by it until you can go to a shop and buy a new one.
Yeah, I don't see how slanting RPGs (or any genre) towards extreme realism is going to make them better or any more entertaining. A single slash from someone else's sword should completely debilitate me? By extension, a single bullet should cripple me in any FPS? No thanks. Even if you did implement this stuff people would either cheat their way around it with quicksave or completely give up on the game.
Ignatz Mouse
Banned
Wow, we got into the Japanese vs Western game debate again. I don't know what to say-- I've never understood people who primarily like games from one region. BUt surely even an Eastern game fan can see that the Western game market is booming compared to Japan? And that it would behoove Nintendo to take notice?
Well, I suppose not if you think that people are "casuals" or "idiots" or whatever for liking what they like. All I can say to that is that is-- distiguish preference from quality. Just because you can't see how Halo or GTA are great games doesn't mean they aren't great games.
Well, I suppose not if you think that people are "casuals" or "idiots" or whatever for liking what they like. All I can say to that is that is-- distiguish preference from quality. Just because you can't see how Halo or GTA are great games doesn't mean they aren't great games.
Random_Hajile
Member
Yes it was...
The article comes from www.vgtm.com You could contact Kent if you think it is fake.
Here's the link to the pdf w/ the article:
http://www.vgtm.com/images/Mojo-VGT-Vol.2.pdf
TomthebombServo
Banned
Thanks, anihawk.
And after a poor night's sleep and feeling cranky I am now convinced Matt C kidnapped Kent and is causing him to post threatening messages as this has to be the only bad article I have ever read from him. I guess everyone has a writing misstep.
And after a poor night's sleep and feeling cranky I am now convinced Matt C kidnapped Kent and is causing him to post threatening messages as this has to be the only bad article I have ever read from him. I guess everyone has a writing misstep.
Who says they aren't using their IP power to the fullest? The number of Mario games and the number of collaborations on the Gamecube have been overwhelming in the last little while. IT ISN'T ENOUGH. Plus it's a testament to the Mario mystique that the guy hasn't gotten overexposed but there is a limit and Nintendo is skirting it.DrGAKMAN said:
And who says that Nintendo isn't providing an alternative to the competition? Frankly it's difficult to differentiate the GC anymore from the PS2 and the Xbox then it already is. Is it so hard to accept that the 'Nintendo Difference' Iwata has been espousing for 3 or so years now just isn't compelling to gamers?
If Nintendo gets the gamers, the 3rd parties will come. That's the only way to attract and keep that kind of support. Every other way of doing it is artificial and temporary.
They're following the NDS because it's a successor to the very successful gameboy advance and Nintendo has a built in hand held audience, due to their being market leaders, that 3rd parties want to take advantage of. That's it. The unique features are incidental to 3rd party interest in the system, it's the audience they're after
The exclusives don't stay exclusive because the audience isn't very large. And the only way that Revolution can make a compelling case for exclusives is if they go after a huge userbase and the only way they can do *that* is if they buck for first place.
I hate this really I do, but your strategy will be the death of Nintendo.
Look, collaborations are all well and good, but it doesn't provide enough games for a diverse library or to appease bored gamers. There's only so many collaborations possible.
Secondly Dammit Nintendo used to take CARE of its franchises, its star series were protected with only spectacular huge updates that came out when they provided a stunning impact and That. Is. Lost. It got lost when Nintendo was forced into relying heavily on their I.P at the end of the N64 and it has only intensified since then. Nintendo games were EVENTS dammit, but the last one to do that was Ocarina of Time. That era is OVER and that hurts me more than you can imagine. But it's done. Doing it more and more will just cause whatever mystique is left in Nintendo brands to die out with a a whimper.
Mario's well of goodwill is wide and deep but it is NOT limitless. The character CAN get burned out and WILL if Nintendo keeps on throwing the poor bastard into every third party game Nintendo needs to do well. Nintendo used to take care of the little guy but they're not anymore.
YES you're right Nintendo has to build a huge audience on their own but look Nintendo's hope for the Gamecube was that they (Intelligent System, HAL, EAD etc.) would make a lot of smaller simpler games (the "SIMPLAR IS BETTAR WITH HUGE A BUTTON" idiotic drool Iwata loves to spew), while Rare, Retro and Silicon Knights would provide great Western I.P to back them up. Unfortunately that strategy failed on execution in the Western front (Rare become a liablity, Retro had to be shrunk to one team to become viable, and SK turned out mediocre, as did NST) and just plain failed in the Eastern front(Luigi's Mansion no impact, Pikmin became only a 2nd tier franchise, Sunshine was late and a dissapointment critically, financially. People don't seem to want smaller simpler games Iwata GET OVER IT).
But the only way to counteract is (and I have been saying this for years now) is that Nintendo has to LEAD FROM THE FRONT in creating the games that will get the huge audience. Nintendo first party software has always defined Nintendo hardware and Nintendo first party software has to pick up the slack in creating the kind of games that would attract the audience that GTA, sports, FPS, RPG, game developers can make a living selling to. Are they being a PS clone in doing this? No, they're just connecting with their audience for a change. They can differentiate themselves from the market by providing the huge brilliant Mario at launch, and the huge epic Zelda 1.5-2 years into the Revolution cycle to empathically reclaim the title of 'Premier game creators bar none' that they have LOST with the Gamecube and make Nintendo games industry shaking events again. Plus they also have to go online, :sigh: Online isn't something that *helps* anybody too much, but not having it hurts like crazy. In the GC era EAD didn't adapt to the changing market (something they've never had to do before, they used to dicate the market to a large degree), and thus Nintendo diminished.
Can Nintendo come back? I doubt it. The next Zelda on GC isn't going to be what Ocarina was and the loss of mindshare that the Rev is going to have to contend with is something the GC never had going against it. Microsoft is entrenched and bucking to be at the very minimum a strong challenger to the PS brand. Both Sony and MS would be happy to squeeze Nintendo out of the market to gain marketshare in their manoevers against each other. Both have more online experience, Sony has the brand, MS has momentum and best online strategy. Both are willing to take a financial hit by selling hardware below cost at launch and MS is also willing to provide Xbox Live for pennies. Nintendo's one and only trump card, its I.P, has never been weaker.
Nintendo never found a Pokemon this gen, :sigh:.
Er, bad example. Pikmin is actually a genre fusion of more mission based RTS (Command & Conquer, etc) with Nintendo style adventure solving puzzle design (Metroid, Zelda, etc). It's shares almost nothing in it's core deign with Lemmings besides superficial aspects like "small cute creatures are used" and "puzzles are solved". Using that broad standard, I could relate almost any two videogames together, from Pokemon to Halo.Warm Machine said:
Random_Hajile
Member
Kent has been a Nintendo fan for many years... I am sure he wrote this to get Nintendo's attention and I am sure Steve hopes Nintendo will once again be great. I wonder if Nintendo employees ever visit the Gaming Age message boards?
SomeDude said:
Yeah, it is. Some of the things in the original topic starters post were very unlike Kent. I mean "Forget the bottom line", versus "Forget(or atleast temporarily disregard) the bottom line" is a huge difference.
I agree with most of the things he says, but the GBA comment was just plain ridiculous.
Warm Machine
Member
jarrod said:
True, it most certainly does have elements of C&C or RTS games as well. Give me an oppurtunity and I could break it down into more pieces. I'm not berrating Pikmin as I think it is a very good game and a breath of fresh air.
As far as the one hit sword thing...obviously the stock combat system would have to be changed to suit such a concept. Suddenly what armor and the condition of the armor the player is wearing would become pertinent. A hit against the armor wouldn't damage the player. With such a system, setting characters to defensive posture becomes more than a lower the damage I take game. Turns could be broken down into smaller moments of time so that something as slow as a troll may take 3 turns to actually get an attack off and in that same period the player could strike once, move into a new position, and get into a defensive position. Another combat system all together could be approached and used as well even without the one hit kill but something that drastically alters the core methodology.
People used to think that multiplayer FPS games would suck if once you got killed you'd stay dead until the end of the round...then Counterstrike was made and became a phenomenon. I remember talking to a bunch of Quake fans and players who were wanting to make an FPS and they all thought that concept was a terrible idea. They just wanted to put in bigger guns and crazier characters. After Counterstrike was loaded on their machines it was all they played.
Taken at face value, any new ideas seem wrong. Think them through to their own logical conclusions and you'll probably figure out a way they can be implemented. People scream for new ideas and approaches yet get nervous when they hear about their use as it changes games for them.
I'm not suggesting and I don't think the future of automobile design is putting the steering wheel in the trunk. I'm not realism whoring either. Just bring something new to the table with whatever game you make and attempt to rethink stale concepts that exist for the sake of their existance in previous games.
Regardless, this has gotten far off topic
Random_Hajile
Member
Over the years that Steve has written about videogames he typically knows what he's talking about. He has better access to what is going on at Nintendo than anyone on these boards. He is an avid gamer, and has covered this industry for over a decade if not longer.
You have to agree that the GBA is obsolete - it's old hardware, it is more or less a SNES.
Of course it has sold millions, but from a tech standpoint it will not stand up well against the PSP. Just wait until you see Ridge Racer on PSP if you think I am crazy.
Nintendo needs to change! Right now they own the handheld market. But as they did with the PlayStation the PSP could take that market away from Nintendo if they are not careful. I loved the N64, but really the PlayStation took away lots of Nintendo fans.
A MS/Nintendo alliance would be smart. I heard they were speaking to one another last E3, I bet they would both like to see PS3 fail... I wonder if Nintendo sees MSFT as the lesser of two evils?
You have to agree that the GBA is obsolete - it's old hardware, it is more or less a SNES.
Of course it has sold millions, but from a tech standpoint it will not stand up well against the PSP. Just wait until you see Ridge Racer on PSP if you think I am crazy.
Nintendo needs to change! Right now they own the handheld market. But as they did with the PlayStation the PSP could take that market away from Nintendo if they are not careful. I loved the N64, but really the PlayStation took away lots of Nintendo fans.
A MS/Nintendo alliance would be smart. I heard they were speaking to one another last E3, I bet they would both like to see PS3 fail... I wonder if Nintendo sees MSFT as the lesser of two evils?
Azih...
Thanks for the responce again. I agree with you on some of your points...but some of your *opinions* I disagree with.
Sure LOZ:TWW for GCN wasn't as big of an "event" as LOZ:TOOT for N64 was...doesn't mean you should enjoy it less. Yeah, Mario 64 was a revolution while Sunshine was merely an evolution...even Nintendo admits this, but it doesn't mean the Nintendo magic is gone.
Alot of people seem to think that #'s = everything. If GCN had bigger userbase #'s it would somehow be better. If Nintendo's 1ST party games had higher #'s they would be better. Does Nintendo having better #'s here and there make their games better? Is it 'cos you feel that with these #'s your purchase is more justified and Nintendo is more respected? Guess what...some people just aren't gonna play or buy or beleive in Nintendo's magic wether their systems/games sell well or not, so why does that matter to you? Yes, Nintendo should aim to do better...hell...go for #1 even, but do they *really* have the money/resources to outperform the likes of Sony & MS...who are willing to do whatever they can (better than Nintendo) to win? Maybe you feel that if Nintendo goes for #1 they'll gain more respect and with that they'll gain that "magic"? Guess what, no matter what you think, or what #'s say, some developers are NOT gonna make games for Nintendo and some people are NOT gonna buy Nintendo systems/games regardless of #'s. At the end of the day the # that matters the most to Nintendo is the money. If that means they're gonna have to lose money before they "fight back" or "wake up" then so be it...nothing we can do until then. If they're still making money then why should it matter what their mindshare, marketshare or magicshare is? Just be happy with what you bought, and if you're not there's two other choices out there.
You, as a gamer should only care about ONE #...and that's the # of great games you can get on a system. It sucks that sadly, Nintendo get's the least ammount of games and the least support this generation...but I try to look at it like this: it's WAY BETTER than what the N64 got. Did I get more games on GCN than I did on N64? YES! And I know you feel that that Nintendo is "whoring" their characters out...to me I don't see Mario Baseball or a Mario DDR as "whoring" 'cos really I sorta wanted them...and if it's the only way we're gonna get a DDR or a Namco (forgot the name of that old NES one they did, but I heard the same team is working on Mario Baseball) baseball game so be it...as long as they're good games. Now Mario in NBA Street...hmmm...it's sorta fitting with the "EA Big" theme yet at the same time "whoring", but I'd rather they do that then try making a "Nintendo basketball" featuring only Mario characters (which would also cut into EA's already small amount of sports space they have left on GCN)...so it's better that way. At this point in the GCN's life cycle I sorta see Nintendo just trying to fill it out 'cos they know they're losing support (not to mention with these kind of "filler" games I see them saving the "big stuff" for when it'll make a bigger differance for them: Revolution). Plus with these collaborations it free's them up to do more internal stuff which leads to more Nintendo games. In the U.S. Nintendo has introduced new stuff as well as brought back Metroid. Did N64 have Metroid? NO! Plus there's Advance Wars, Fire Emblem, Custom Robo, Animal Crossing, Pikmin, etc. More new stuff! Hopefully Nintendo really can grow more of that next generation too so they can get back to the glory days of the NES. Again, the best # Nintendo should go for to make us happy isn't game sales or system sales...it's the # of great games that can be had on a Nintendo system...and they improved on that compared to the N64!
You quoted me above saying how Nintendo can use their IP's to their fullest. I wasn't just talking about whoring out more Mario collaborations. Nintendo has alot of stuff they're sitting on...if Revolution and them losing support/marketshare pushes them to pull them back out again...GREAT. I want the glory days of the NES again...Punch Out!, Kid Icarus, Mach Rider, Clu Clu Land, etc., etc. If collaborations will either open oppurtunities to create new franchises or work on old ones...or at least allow them to make it themselves then hell yes collaborations are good. Certainly better than trying to contract them or pay for exclussives that don't stay exclussive. Nintendo really isn't flexing this to it's fullest just yet, but I think they will next generation thanks to this vigor they seem to have about the "revolution" of playing games in new ways.
I agree that Nintendo has to do it THEMSELVES and build that foundation THEMSELVES with THEIR OWN games just as they did in the NES days and *then* 3RD parties will follow if they garner enough of a userbase to get attention! My point in this post is not to really worry about what other people buy or how much support Nintendo get's...those #'s don't really matter...what matter's is how many great games will be had on Revolution. Hopefully Nintendo will themselves work to increase that number with their own games/collaborations and the rest will fall into place. And I hope they not only increase output but *also* diversify their own software too as they did *both* in the NES days as well. 3RD parties make multiplayer, fun, cutesy, cartoony games for GCN...'cos Nintendo that's what Nintendo themselves do!!! If Nintendo made THEIR OWN sports, online & mature games THEN 3RD parties would too!
Thanks for the responce again. I agree with you on some of your points...but some of your *opinions* I disagree with.
Sure LOZ:TWW for GCN wasn't as big of an "event" as LOZ:TOOT for N64 was...doesn't mean you should enjoy it less. Yeah, Mario 64 was a revolution while Sunshine was merely an evolution...even Nintendo admits this, but it doesn't mean the Nintendo magic is gone.
Alot of people seem to think that #'s = everything. If GCN had bigger userbase #'s it would somehow be better. If Nintendo's 1ST party games had higher #'s they would be better. Does Nintendo having better #'s here and there make their games better? Is it 'cos you feel that with these #'s your purchase is more justified and Nintendo is more respected? Guess what...some people just aren't gonna play or buy or beleive in Nintendo's magic wether their systems/games sell well or not, so why does that matter to you? Yes, Nintendo should aim to do better...hell...go for #1 even, but do they *really* have the money/resources to outperform the likes of Sony & MS...who are willing to do whatever they can (better than Nintendo) to win? Maybe you feel that if Nintendo goes for #1 they'll gain more respect and with that they'll gain that "magic"? Guess what, no matter what you think, or what #'s say, some developers are NOT gonna make games for Nintendo and some people are NOT gonna buy Nintendo systems/games regardless of #'s. At the end of the day the # that matters the most to Nintendo is the money. If that means they're gonna have to lose money before they "fight back" or "wake up" then so be it...nothing we can do until then. If they're still making money then why should it matter what their mindshare, marketshare or magicshare is? Just be happy with what you bought, and if you're not there's two other choices out there.
You, as a gamer should only care about ONE #...and that's the # of great games you can get on a system. It sucks that sadly, Nintendo get's the least ammount of games and the least support this generation...but I try to look at it like this: it's WAY BETTER than what the N64 got. Did I get more games on GCN than I did on N64? YES! And I know you feel that that Nintendo is "whoring" their characters out...to me I don't see Mario Baseball or a Mario DDR as "whoring" 'cos really I sorta wanted them...and if it's the only way we're gonna get a DDR or a Namco (forgot the name of that old NES one they did, but I heard the same team is working on Mario Baseball) baseball game so be it...as long as they're good games. Now Mario in NBA Street...hmmm...it's sorta fitting with the "EA Big" theme yet at the same time "whoring", but I'd rather they do that then try making a "Nintendo basketball" featuring only Mario characters (which would also cut into EA's already small amount of sports space they have left on GCN)...so it's better that way. At this point in the GCN's life cycle I sorta see Nintendo just trying to fill it out 'cos they know they're losing support (not to mention with these kind of "filler" games I see them saving the "big stuff" for when it'll make a bigger differance for them: Revolution). Plus with these collaborations it free's them up to do more internal stuff which leads to more Nintendo games. In the U.S. Nintendo has introduced new stuff as well as brought back Metroid. Did N64 have Metroid? NO! Plus there's Advance Wars, Fire Emblem, Custom Robo, Animal Crossing, Pikmin, etc. More new stuff! Hopefully Nintendo really can grow more of that next generation too so they can get back to the glory days of the NES. Again, the best # Nintendo should go for to make us happy isn't game sales or system sales...it's the # of great games that can be had on a Nintendo system...and they improved on that compared to the N64!
You quoted me above saying how Nintendo can use their IP's to their fullest. I wasn't just talking about whoring out more Mario collaborations. Nintendo has alot of stuff they're sitting on...if Revolution and them losing support/marketshare pushes them to pull them back out again...GREAT. I want the glory days of the NES again...Punch Out!, Kid Icarus, Mach Rider, Clu Clu Land, etc., etc. If collaborations will either open oppurtunities to create new franchises or work on old ones...or at least allow them to make it themselves then hell yes collaborations are good. Certainly better than trying to contract them or pay for exclussives that don't stay exclussive. Nintendo really isn't flexing this to it's fullest just yet, but I think they will next generation thanks to this vigor they seem to have about the "revolution" of playing games in new ways.
I agree that Nintendo has to do it THEMSELVES and build that foundation THEMSELVES with THEIR OWN games just as they did in the NES days and *then* 3RD parties will follow if they garner enough of a userbase to get attention! My point in this post is not to really worry about what other people buy or how much support Nintendo get's...those #'s don't really matter...what matter's is how many great games will be had on Revolution. Hopefully Nintendo will themselves work to increase that number with their own games/collaborations and the rest will fall into place. And I hope they not only increase output but *also* diversify their own software too as they did *both* in the NES days as well. 3RD parties make multiplayer, fun, cutesy, cartoony games for GCN...'cos Nintendo that's what Nintendo themselves do!!! If Nintendo made THEIR OWN sports, online & mature games THEN 3RD parties would too!