-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
The South Carolina Democratic Primary thread (Obama 2:1 over Clinton)
- Thread starter VALIS
- Start date
- Status
grandjedi6
Master of the Google Search
ToxicAdam said:
Triple post!
ConfusingJazz
Member
avatar299 said:
Yes we are crazy....CRAZY FOR OBAMARAMA!
And think, this is a left leaning board, imagine how the rest of the country views her.
WickedAngel
Banned
avatar299...I think you're missing the point. Nobody is saying that Obama, in terms of policy, would be a better candidate that would do everything differently than Hillary would.
The point is that you have two candidates that are, by and large, very similar. The difference is that one is divisive and one is very likable (For people on both sides of the fence). The President has to be able to work with the Senate and Congress to get things done and their personality is going to play a large part in whether or not that happens, regardless of whether you like it or not.
The simplest analogy I can think of here is a choice between nearly identical cars. They're the same model and drive the same but one has a new paint job/interior and one has worn paint and smells like shit inside. If you are picking between the two, which will you pick?
The point is that you have two candidates that are, by and large, very similar. The difference is that one is divisive and one is very likable (For people on both sides of the fence). The President has to be able to work with the Senate and Congress to get things done and their personality is going to play a large part in whether or not that happens, regardless of whether you like it or not.
The simplest analogy I can think of here is a choice between nearly identical cars. They're the same model and drive the same but one has a new paint job/interior and one has worn paint and smells like shit inside. If you are picking between the two, which will you pick?
grandjedi6
Master of the Google Search
ConfusingJazz said:
No, this is a youth left leaning board with an internet addiction. We are verr far on the love Obama, hate Hillary spectrum.
ConfusingJazz
Member
grandjedi6 said:
My "Crazy for Obamarama" Theory still stands then!
Mr.Squirrel
Tom
Jswanko said:
even tho i hope obama wins, i'm still really fuckin sick of politics and the govt man. every election we here the same shit (healthcare, the economy, dc needs changing for the better) and every year not a god damn thing changes.
no matter who wins itll be business as usual because once big business starts throwing big money your way the democratic process is fucked
worldrunover
Member
Jswanko said:
Bush didn't act very republican-like, and had the worst staff that could have possibly been assembled. I think if a competent GOP candidate wins (if there is one in the feild right now) things could be ok...
Jswanko said:
It's pretty hard for anyone not to have an anti-Bill "bias" these days. I used to adore the guy, went to his campaigns in 1992, liked him a little less as time went on, then started really questioning him after he left office and basically became a tacit voice of support to nearly every post-9/11 Bush agenda. And now add the games he's been playing lately. Oh Bill.
Obama will probably be a dirty SOB akin to Bill in 15 years, too; it seems pretty impossible to remain a player in large scale politics while keeping your idealism and objectivity, but at least he isn't now, which is what makes it feel like Bill '92 all over again to me.
grandjedi6
Master of the Google Search
Cheebs said:
If you are a liberal at least. A conservative would support that
worldrunover
Member
Cheebs said:
That's the one area I didn't think Bush did a terrible job in. Other than Harriet Myers. But she was voted down quicker than Dennis Kucinich was for president.
worldrunover
Member
Cheebs said:
What have they ruled on that is so egregious to liberals?
avatar299 said:
Dude, you really should save this for if Hillary wins the nomination and there are still a large amount of GAFers saying they won't vote for her.
Because after the angst of Obama losing/Hillary winning fades, and once she regularly starts debating McCain or Romney both officially and via the press, and the Republican media launches into a savage full out attack, I don't think there will be too many people left saying the same things then as they are now.
CowboyAstronaut
Banned
bdizzle said:
I don't think that will hold true for Obama. He graduated from Columbia University and could've made big money, but instead chose to work as a community organizer in neighborhoods that were in need of serious help. He helped the kinds of kids and families that usually suffer as a result of bad policy and unfulfilled promises.
He knows what its like firsthand to be fighting for something only to see that politicians don't give a damn. There is a reason he took so much offense to Hilary trying to belittle his willingness to fight tough fights. He has shown in his past that he believes in helping people.
A small taste of the kind of person he is.
http://www.thenation.com/doc/20070416/moberg
CowboyAstronaut
Banned
Cheebs said:
I don't know about that. I'm pretty disgusted with Hilary and her campaign at this moment. She better change her tactics from here on out or else there is no way in hell I'm voting for her.
Bill Clinton is already being a complete dick with his
"Jessie Jackson won South Carolina too" comment.
It really is quite impressive how I've gone from a total Bill Clinton fanboy to totally detesting the guy in such a short period of time.
I rather have things harder as opposed to voting for someone I don't believe in. It's one thing to agree with a specific candidate more than another and then ending up having to vote for the one you don't agree with quite so much because the one you prefer is no longer running, but I simply can't respect Hilary after the totally dishonest and undignified campaign tactics she has used.
I also suppose the fact that I'm an African American that didn't at all appreciate what hilary, her campaign and Bill Clinton attempted to do prior to the South Carolina primary by accusing Obama of playing the race card in an attempt to weasel her way out of the idiotic statement she made regarding Martin Luther King. Then accusing him of supporting Ronald Reagan's policies knowing full well they weren't for the good of the African American Community. The total hypocrisy shown regarding the Tony Rezko situation
Then the outright lie of a Radio ad. Now some people believe they were doing this in hopes of winning the black vote? Not necessarily. Hilary and her campaign and especially Bill Clinton knew that by successfully dragging Obama into the disgusting back and forth about race like they did it would potentially accomplish one very important thing. What is that?
Explicitly designate Obama as the "Black" candidate in hopes that it would work against him and play to their favor. It was all a dirty political strategy whose purpose was to drive a wedge between white and black voters in hopes that Obama would lose significant support among white voters an area the Clinton campaign didn't at all originally suspect Obama would challenge them. They weren't at all surprised to see Obama win the African American vote, but they hoped the race talk had lay the groundwork for Obama to lose support among white voters.
It was so funny seeing Bill Clinton answer the question of that frustrated lady at one of his speeches in South Carolina when she vented her frustration that race was being brought into this whole thing when it should've been left out. He answered the question almost as if they had nothing to do with it and it's something they were trying to avoid doing. He tried to scapegoat Obama for something that was of their own doing.
Why else do you guys think he made that telegraphed statement afterwards to a CNN reporter about stating something to the effect of "What the people of South Carolina care about wont be on the news because you don't care about. It's unfair for you to try to take this from them. The Obama campaign puts this stuff out there because they know you all live for this stuff"
It was something like that, but the general message he was trying to get across is that the Obama campaign was playing the race card in hopes that it would take the attention of the media and they (the clinton campaign) had nothing to do with it and only care about the people of south carolina's issues.
It was funny to see Hilary try to paint Obama as having ties with a slumlord only to see her and her husband not only take a picture with that slumlord, but to talk about who has dirty ties. Obama's campaign only received $85,000 from Rezko all of which was donated to charity. It was funny to see Hilary of all people bring up something like that when she received up to $850,000 from Norman Hsu who was put in prison for fraud.
It's a weird charge to hurl at someone especially when she's much worse off in that regard. The Clinton Campaign even knew this man had a 15 year old warrant on him and were even warned about it yet still took money from him. Even though 250+ contributers that they took money from have ties to this person that was put in prison the Clinton Campaign hasn't revealed their identities.
Obviously there is something questionable about the fact that she is returning money to over 250 donors whose identity she isn't revealing.
grandjedi6
Master of the Google Search
thefro said:
:O Ted Kennedy is following in his niece's footsteps!
It does make sense too.
Ted Kennedy ran a VERY close, very bitter primary battle against the establishment candidate (Jimmy Carter) and faced extremely harsh personal attacks constantly. He must see a lot of himself in 1980 in Obama.
Bobby Kennedy Jr. endorsed Hillary though. Kinda disappointing since Bobby is probably the smartest of the Kennedy clan alive today. Though his endorsement makes sense. If Hillary wins the Gov. of NY is very likely to appoint Kennedy to Hillary's senate seat. He has his own aspirations in this.
Ted Kennedy ran a VERY close, very bitter primary battle against the establishment candidate (Jimmy Carter) and faced extremely harsh personal attacks constantly. He must see a lot of himself in 1980 in Obama.
Bobby Kennedy Jr. endorsed Hillary though. Kinda disappointing since Bobby is probably the smartest of the Kennedy clan alive today. Though his endorsement makes sense. If Hillary wins the Gov. of NY is very likely to appoint Kennedy to Hillary's senate seat. He has his own aspirations in this.
grandjedi6
Master of the Google Search
Cheebs said:
Ted Kennedy was complaining to Bill about his harsh attacks towards Obama the other day. I guess Bill really did go over board
grandjedi6
Master of the Google Search
So what Democratic Big wigs do we have left? The only other potential ones after Kennedy seems to be Carter and Gore.
grandjedi6
Master of the Google Search
thefro said:
If I were Carter I would endorse someone just for the hell of it since it might be my last DNC. Plus its not like Carter hasn't popped his head into politics at random points lately. Wishful thinking I guess
Out of curiosity have people counted Bill Clinton in Hillary's super delegate count? Because he is a voting delegate.
Carter and the Clintons do not get along well at all. If he endorsed it would be Obama, but I doubt he is going to get involved. He got the DNC pissed off last time by inviting Michael Moore to the 2004 convention. :lol
grandjedi6 said:
Carter and the Clintons do not get along well at all. If he endorsed it would be Obama, but I doubt he is going to get involved. He got the DNC pissed off last time by inviting Michael Moore to the 2004 convention. :lol
grandjedi6
Master of the Google Search
Cheebs said:
Yeah, everyone has been counting him as one of Hillary's superdelegates
Cheebs said:
:lol
Mrs. Manky
Banned
RubxQub said:
You had me until that bolded question.
Let's talk about other parts of the world.
Let's talk about Margaret Thatcher, Indira Gandhi, Benazair Bhutto, Angela Merkel, Cristina Fernández de Kirchner...
It looks like the rest of the world is just fine with having a woman in charge(whether that woman is good or not is judged on a case by case basis). Okay, there are exceptions, but for you to toss that "second class citizen" comment as if the rest of the world was like The Handmaiden's Tale is really bad.
For the record, I'm pro-Obama, but if Hillary Clinton is the Democratic nominee for President, I will hold my nose and vote for her. Better the devil I know who at least pretends to have my best interests at heart than one of the devils that I believe will make things worse. Yes, even McCain. When I saw the pic of him hugging Bush I knew he was a lost cause.
figure i'll just put this thought in here. Huckabee's on CNN now and i'm curious if anyone else is watching
Huckabee wants to end the recession by increasing the interstate by two lanes? it sound he wants to reinvest the money back into American products (steel, concrete) and infrastructure, but i thought FDRs public works program was an anathema to fiscal conservatives. he also points to some study that shows urban workers lose ~40 hours a year stuck in traffic. if that's the case, wouldn't improved mass transit be a better solution?
Huckabee: Iraq must have had WMDs because Saddam said he had them.
at least he's backing off from his Jordan remarks.
Huckabee wants to end the recession by increasing the interstate by two lanes? it sound he wants to reinvest the money back into American products (steel, concrete) and infrastructure, but i thought FDRs public works program was an anathema to fiscal conservatives. he also points to some study that shows urban workers lose ~40 hours a year stuck in traffic. if that's the case, wouldn't improved mass transit be a better solution?
Huckabee: Iraq must have had WMDs because Saddam said he had them.
at least he's backing off from his Jordan remarks.
Stoney Mason
Banned
scorcho said:
Huckabee has a real populist streak in certain areas which is why "real" Republicans think he is a Democrat in disguise. Not my sort of candidate for most of his platform but he deserves some respect in a few areas like when he attempts to cross over to black voters.
BenjaminBirdie
Banned
thefro said:
The money shot is really in the ABC interview:
Bams said:
it seems like he's trying to toe that line, however - http://www.mikehuckabee.com/?FuseAction=Issues.View&Issue_id=5
BenjaminBirdie
Banned
scorcho said:
Yes.
Did all these come out today? Paper endorsements for Bams:
Arizona Republic
San Francisco Chronicle
Seattle Times
Chicago Tribune
oops - previous response was to APF.
it's interesting, but probably meaningless that the Kennedy's have given Obama their seal of approval. i also don't know if a message of 'change' necessarily corresponds with him receiving so much institutional support from Democratic Senators.
it's interesting, but probably meaningless that the Kennedy's have given Obama their seal of approval. i also don't know if a message of 'change' necessarily corresponds with him receiving so much institutional support from Democratic Senators.
BenjaminBirdie
Banned
scorcho said:
It signals to his supporters that the establishment is serious about his message and approach and it signals to apprehensive democrats that Bams won't be met with indignancy when he gets to Washington.
Stoney Mason
Banned
scorcho said:
Well the Kennedy daughter post means nothing. America could care less what the daughter of someone says about who should be president. Ted Kennedy is more important in that he presents a huge name in the liberal establishment going with Obama. Not that it tips the scale either way of course.
CowboyAstronaut said:You know what's surprising about that?
I believe an Obama, Hilary ticket would be guaranteed to take the white house, but I get the feeling Hilary due to being sour over the whole primary would never accept it. I'm making these judgments based on the type of person I've come to believe she is based on what I've been seeing.
I believe if Hilary asked Obama to be her running mate as her Vice President I legitimately believe he would accept if it came down to the point where he had to do what was best for the country. I don't view him as the type that would hold a serious grudge and be bitter over the loss, but I suspect Hilary is just that.
I still remember how she practically insulted the voters of Iowa just because she didn't win stating that Iowa has never made a difference anyway or something to that effect. That right there is like a slap in the face to the people that DID vote for her.
Wow I've been so caught up in politics that I completely lost track of time and now I only have 2 hours of sleep before I need to leave
I honestly think Obama is the best candidate because the GOP would have far less dirt on him. They can't hope to use his Reagan comment like Hilary did because they worship Reagan :lol
If anything Obama giving a small nod to Reagon only helps him. There is a lot of anti-clinton people out there that are so strong in their conviction that I simply don't believe Hilary can win. She isn't Bill Clinton, she can't survive it and honestly after the escapades of this primary I think even the might Bill Clinton has stained himself. The best chance I think she has, if she gets the nomination, is if Obama is her vice president. Hilary has a truckload of negatives it isn't even funny. Mark my words the Republican party wants to run against Hilary not Barack Obama.
There is nothing the GOP can say about Obama that wasn't already said in this Primary. The dirtiest and most ugly of the bunch have already been made public. The biggest of them all revealed by Obama himself in his book. Anything that could be said would already have a healthy dose of available information disproving it. They would bounce of him like nothing, but Hilary... good lord where do I begin.
I agree.
I agree with many others of you in this thread as well. I said it before and was flamed: I'll vote for britney spears or not vote at all before I vote for Billary Clinton. Everything about her and bill is a major turn off. The mudslinging at a candidate in their own party is disgusting and vile. Almost 300,000 people voted for Senator Obama in SC and they all split the white vote pretty evenly which is saying something for the south. It's time for change people if you aren't ready well 4 more years of a bush-esque president won't kill us. Our economy and Good-Will, will be total shit by then but hey you can take a horse to water but you can't make it drink. I'll be voting for Obama or for no one at all, fuck this.
Edit: for spelling.
BenjaminBirdie
Banned
Stoney Mason said:
It's been running on the MSNBC ticker all morning. So it's a pretty loud nothing.
- Status
Similar threads
- Locked
- Locked