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The state of NeoGAF
- Thread starter EviLore
- Start date
- Status
kaname-san
Member
]blacky[;252780624 said:So glad NeoGAF is back!
Is it back?
near
Gold Member
Holy shit I was wondering why GAF was down for so long, I've missed this place for the last few days and I'm glad we're back up. Having read ELs OP I can't believe the community reacted in such a way, presumably without all the facts. From what I understand about Evilore he's a standup guy, a cool dude and an intelligent human being. I hope you pull through this tough period and your reputation is restored. I will continue to support GAF for what it's worth and not pass judgement on matters I do not completely understand. On the topic of members harassing other members they need to be flushed out.
NHarmonic.
Member
I'm glad this is back but, tbh, how long can you ban political discussion? In the end it's part of everybody's life, there's going to be trump threads and discussion because it affects the world, these are universal topics, hell even videogames have politics in them.
I don't know, i really don't want gaming to become the typical alt-right gaming board... i already have some doubts about it now...
Miss the people from the manga, one piece, mha, and other off topic communities...
I don't know, i really don't want gaming to become the typical alt-right gaming board... i already have some doubts about it now...
Miss the people from the manga, one piece, mha, and other off topic communities...
psychowave
Member
Dont wanna have people be too sympathetic towards women, which could in turn make them unsympathetic towards EviLore.
For what its worth, here's the opinion of one guy who lurked around, barely posted, but was on here most days.
Firstly, in regards to the controversy, its not my place to say much on the actual issue, it doesn't really involve me, but I would like to say that I personally think Malka needs to separate his comments on himself and his situation from the comments on NeoGAF, the community and its situation. I understand this forum is his baby, but I feel it has outgrown him as a person, and kicking off a 'The State of NeoGAF' thread with 'The State of Tyler Malka' sends the wrong message. Yes, Tyler should absolutely address the allegations, but I don't think it should so intrinsically be linked with addressing the future of this forum.
That all being said, I'm going to address the situation for me in regards to NeoGAF as a whole. I like the communities I frequent here - not just the gaming ones, but ones for a bunch of other hobbies / interests / etc I have. I feel that GAF's strongest point is these, and I hope they continue.
I never ventured into anything too political, mostly because I'm not American and could not care less about American Politics, so I can't speak of the toxicity that may or may not have occurred in there, but I feel like a blanket banning of discussion on politics really isn't the way to go about things - a lot of the news of the day is, inherently linked to politics, and people are going to have strong opinions. I think a forum is actually a good 'safe space' to have these discussions, as long as they are not inciting hate, so if the discussion gets political and heated, within reason, I don't see it as a problem.
That being said, perhaps the 'easiest' way to allow users who do not wish to be subjected to these politics is to split the forum into three - the already existing Gaming Discussion, and then Entertainment Discussion (covering TV, movies, books, comics, music, sports, technology, and similar) and a News Discussion. Gaming and Entertainment could be, as much as possible, banned from any political discourse, and act as supporting their roles as 'escapes' for our daily lives. A News discussion forum would obviously be constantly updating with the type of things you would traditionally see in the newspaper, and therefore civil political opinions, when relevant to the topic, could be shared there. It wouldn't be perfect, but to me its a starting point.
Firstly, in regards to the controversy, its not my place to say much on the actual issue, it doesn't really involve me, but I would like to say that I personally think Malka needs to separate his comments on himself and his situation from the comments on NeoGAF, the community and its situation. I understand this forum is his baby, but I feel it has outgrown him as a person, and kicking off a 'The State of NeoGAF' thread with 'The State of Tyler Malka' sends the wrong message. Yes, Tyler should absolutely address the allegations, but I don't think it should so intrinsically be linked with addressing the future of this forum.
That all being said, I'm going to address the situation for me in regards to NeoGAF as a whole. I like the communities I frequent here - not just the gaming ones, but ones for a bunch of other hobbies / interests / etc I have. I feel that GAF's strongest point is these, and I hope they continue.
I never ventured into anything too political, mostly because I'm not American and could not care less about American Politics, so I can't speak of the toxicity that may or may not have occurred in there, but I feel like a blanket banning of discussion on politics really isn't the way to go about things - a lot of the news of the day is, inherently linked to politics, and people are going to have strong opinions. I think a forum is actually a good 'safe space' to have these discussions, as long as they are not inciting hate, so if the discussion gets political and heated, within reason, I don't see it as a problem.
That being said, perhaps the 'easiest' way to allow users who do not wish to be subjected to these politics is to split the forum into three - the already existing Gaming Discussion, and then Entertainment Discussion (covering TV, movies, books, comics, music, sports, technology, and similar) and a News Discussion. Gaming and Entertainment could be, as much as possible, banned from any political discourse, and act as supporting their roles as 'escapes' for our daily lives. A News discussion forum would obviously be constantly updating with the type of things you would traditionally see in the newspaper, and therefore civil political opinions, when relevant to the topic, could be shared there. It wouldn't be perfect, but to me its a starting point.
iPaul93
Member
Not completely but hopefully in time it will be.
Sad to see that this is how you chose to handle this. I'd say I lost my respect for Evilore after this, but there wasn't much left of it after how he behaved in the past.
Since this seems to be an option, please perma-ban and/or delete my account. Whatever you can do. I don't want to be associated with this place in any way anymore.
Since this seems to be an option, please perma-ban and/or delete my account. Whatever you can do. I don't want to be associated with this place in any way anymore.
The website, yes. The community that made the website... mhm. A lot of good people opted to go to Reset and other successors or just plainly other sites.
Chuck Norris
Banned
Yeah he sounds real cool. I mean, everything he has done in the past few days has been super cool
Did you even bother reading the first post?
Honestly, I've always thought people on gaf took the political side of things a little too far over the edge, and it created a "you're with us or against us" mindset. If you didn't agree with the majority, you were dogpiled and that dogpiling discouraged the rest with differing opinions from speaking up. You didn't even have to have some outlandish opinion to get dogpiled either, even stuff like "punching people is bad, even if they're Nazis" got people on your ass. That mindset was indeed an issue.
However, shutting down all discussion of politics and ignoring the issue altogether is not the right way to approach this. You're not solving anything like that, you're just pretending like the problem doesn't exist.
Trying to remove what little transparency the mods previously had is equally problematic. There's already been evidence of mods trying to cover things up and banning people without good reason, this can only serve to make those situations more likely. If anything now is the time to have a more open dialogue between the moderation team and the userbase.
Regardless, with all the evidence stacking up against EL (for those of you saying "we don't know the facts", please do some more research. Information is out there and it does not point in his favor) and this weak response, I can't in good conscience stick around. My favorite part of neogaf was always the community around the games I love and it looks like most of the people I recognize from those communities have moved on as well, so I'll be following them to discord and beyond.
It's been a good 4 years.
However, shutting down all discussion of politics and ignoring the issue altogether is not the right way to approach this. You're not solving anything like that, you're just pretending like the problem doesn't exist.
Trying to remove what little transparency the mods previously had is equally problematic. There's already been evidence of mods trying to cover things up and banning people without good reason, this can only serve to make those situations more likely. If anything now is the time to have a more open dialogue between the moderation team and the userbase.
Regardless, with all the evidence stacking up against EL (for those of you saying "we don't know the facts", please do some more research. Information is out there and it does not point in his favor) and this weak response, I can't in good conscience stick around. My favorite part of neogaf was always the community around the games I love and it looks like most of the people I recognize from those communities have moved on as well, so I'll be following them to discord and beyond.
It's been a good 4 years.
Seraph_Nicholas
Member
I thoroughly examined how much I cared, which was not at all, then proceeded to state that I didn't care. Did I miss some subtle facet of my own apathy that would cast a new light on this entire debacle? Do enlighten me!
PhantomThief
Banned
Its not just about the shower incident its how the communication was handled also in regards to pedo Amirox arrest and no subsequent discussion on that topic.
Mods didnt take kindly to not being able to discuss this, lies from Malka about him not knowing Amirox's name and so forth.
Dont stay ignorant and believe one side of the story. If he thought she was mentally unstable why was he friends with her and later have sexual relations?
Now she comes out with the shower stuff and all Malka has to say is that she's mentally unstable.
Wow that is not a good defence my bro. If he did try to hit it and misunderstood signals during the shower night he should have just said that. I misunderstood the signals, I fucked up there. But we had sex a few months later anyway. So i might have been reading signals right anyway.
Mahadev
Member
The kind of "good people" that became judge, jury and executioner against a person because of a fucking facebook post. Good riddance to that kind of "good people".
LeroyPantwether
Member
Lol . I think I just fell in love .
DaytimeWhiskey
Banned
Lmao, jesus
If you think it's all due to *one* facebook post then you're naive.
this is an interesting thought
His Majesty
Banned
I will probably stick around on the gaming side of the forums. I have never been a fan of the jury-judge-executioner mentality on display on the OT forum so I cannot in good conscience condemn Evilore. What I will say though is that from his posting history it is clear that Evilore is a pompous and pretentious person who relishes in putting people down in a rude and degrading manner. If his internet persona is a reflection of his real personality, then I am currently more inclined to believe the woman's version of events.
eXistor
Member
I'm glad Gaf is back up. I suspect lots of people will migrate to different places, that's fine. In my personal experience, GAF has been nothing short of courteous; you just have to look in the right places. I never mingled in the politically-tinged threads, they always just come down to the same thing; people being angry at each other. I come here for enthusiasts who share a common love: videogames. This is what drew me to GAF and that's why I'm staying here.
I hope we can rediscover that and let's hope this is a new start for GAF.
I hope we can rediscover that and let's hope this is a new start for GAF.
Mahadev
Member
OK, please provide more evidence on the case. Are there photos? Testimonies from other people confirming it? Maybe a recording?
PhantomThief
Banned
Its not just these allegations that the mods and community are in arms about. Maybe read more.
Dr. Black Jack
Member
Fuck you Tyler. OT politicking isn't the problem. You are the problem. People like you are what's wrong with gaming culture. You don't get to waltz back with "she lyin" and pretend that everything will be better. You're the worst kind of two-faced scumbag. See you never.
near
Gold Member
I dont know what happened in the end all will be clear with all the details laid out, until then I won't make a comment on it because as you state I'm ignorant to it, as you are and the rest of GAF. When all is clear and the facts are evidently facts then it's only fair to state how I feel about it all. I'm not easily gullible or swayed either way.
lol photos.
Did you ask for photos in the Weinstein case? While Im still finding out new details in this thread, it doesnt seem like it was some mentally ill woman that decided to slander a famous philanthropist.
Reveling in your own ignorance is about what I expected, so we're on the same page in that regard actually.
IrishNinja
Member
right then, done copying some of my efforts over to slaent, so here goes:
this is cowardice.
let's be clear: much of the gaming community, as it were, is a dumpster fire. you'd be hard pressed to find a decent corner to talk about culture & games without hearing basement dwellers bemoan SJW's, diversity/representation in gaming, etc.
one of the only things separating GAF for years was its zero tolerance for gamergate, and for the most part (let's be honest, the late aughts were rough here & most places), bigotry, misogyny (hello friends), homophobia, transphobia, etc.
we literally watched the cesspool that was gg bleed into the alt-right. harassment of women & minorities continues to this day, and we exist in a timeline with open white supermacists in the white house. you don't get to straddle the fence with shit like this. this is literally why dudes like boogie (rightfully) got chased out of here with pitchforks: you stomp these things out & deny them a platform, or you sit back and quietly co-sign them, standing for nothing.
evilore: you handled this in the worst possible way.
we all know your past, and why you weren't given the benefit of the doubt here. you built a fantastic base of people to run things here - stumpkapow, y2kev, xander, eatchildren, blackace & so many others - and you left all that by the wayside, because you'd rather nuke any talk of your personal conduct from orbit until it's too large, and then just half victim-blame instead of simply owning something & standing for the progressive values you parade when it's convenient & walk back when it's not. at least now your ego can stay front & center and you won't feel the dissonance from having to front as riding for something you're not about.
to those of you just wanting to talk vidya games: literally every other corner on the internet allows this. i realize a few threads/posts here & there on why supporting people down with hateful garbage is momentarily inconvenient, but this place was something because it fostered input from circles usually unwelcome in gaming communities.
that's gone now, because anyone (myself included) who cared about social/racial/etc justice isn't comfortable abiding a serial sexual assaulter who saw the ad revenue here & met a chance to be about something with a slap in the face to what he'd built. alamo drafthouse'd, if you will - so yeah, you likely won't hear from many people who aren't white males anymore, enjoy that.
this place stands for nothing now. i'm grateful for my time here when that wasn't the case. take care, all.
oh, and for posterity:
^^
always, in all ways
this is cowardice.
let's be clear: much of the gaming community, as it were, is a dumpster fire. you'd be hard pressed to find a decent corner to talk about culture & games without hearing basement dwellers bemoan SJW's, diversity/representation in gaming, etc.
one of the only things separating GAF for years was its zero tolerance for gamergate, and for the most part (let's be honest, the late aughts were rough here & most places), bigotry, misogyny (hello friends), homophobia, transphobia, etc.
we literally watched the cesspool that was gg bleed into the alt-right. harassment of women & minorities continues to this day, and we exist in a timeline with open white supermacists in the white house. you don't get to straddle the fence with shit like this. this is literally why dudes like boogie (rightfully) got chased out of here with pitchforks: you stomp these things out & deny them a platform, or you sit back and quietly co-sign them, standing for nothing.
evilore: you handled this in the worst possible way.
we all know your past, and why you weren't given the benefit of the doubt here. you built a fantastic base of people to run things here - stumpkapow, y2kev, xander, eatchildren, blackace & so many others - and you left all that by the wayside, because you'd rather nuke any talk of your personal conduct from orbit until it's too large, and then just half victim-blame instead of simply owning something & standing for the progressive values you parade when it's convenient & walk back when it's not. at least now your ego can stay front & center and you won't feel the dissonance from having to front as riding for something you're not about.
to those of you just wanting to talk vidya games: literally every other corner on the internet allows this. i realize a few threads/posts here & there on why supporting people down with hateful garbage is momentarily inconvenient, but this place was something because it fostered input from circles usually unwelcome in gaming communities.
that's gone now, because anyone (myself included) who cared about social/racial/etc justice isn't comfortable abiding a serial sexual assaulter who saw the ad revenue here & met a chance to be about something with a slap in the face to what he'd built. alamo drafthouse'd, if you will - so yeah, you likely won't hear from many people who aren't white males anymore, enjoy that.
this place stands for nothing now. i'm grateful for my time here when that wasn't the case. take care, all.
oh, and for posterity:
^^
always, in all ways
RobotNinjaHornets
Banned
So let me get this straight
You get accused of sexual assault
The mods leave
NeoGAF goes down
You spend the time it's down coming up with some bullshit statement
You pretend the mods left through stress because OT was too toxic, and so shut down OT so people don't dicuss you being a disgusting wankstain of a human
To cover up the fact that there are no mods, you claim mods are going undercover
Sound about right? I mean I can always chevk with someone who might be able to corroborate, like, oh I dunno, an ex-mod?
Oh and fucking lmao at people claiming this was a far left forum. Oh you little babies, this was lib as shit, try hanging out with some literal communists like me some time. I mean, don't actually do that because we'll all think you're twats, but still. Unless you have regular arguments between anarchists and Marxist-Leninists arguing about the USSR and jokes about the kulaks deserving worse, you are a long way from far left
Anyway, as I imagine I'm probably getting banned for this, I think I'll say my final goodbye.
Fuck you Tyler. Hope you enjoy your new right-wing shithole of apologists for sexual assault. Have a shit life, and fuck off.
Believe? Believe Women.
You get accused of sexual assault
The mods leave
NeoGAF goes down
You spend the time it's down coming up with some bullshit statement
You pretend the mods left through stress because OT was too toxic, and so shut down OT so people don't dicuss you being a disgusting wankstain of a human
To cover up the fact that there are no mods, you claim mods are going undercover
Sound about right? I mean I can always chevk with someone who might be able to corroborate, like, oh I dunno, an ex-mod?
Oh and fucking lmao at people claiming this was a far left forum. Oh you little babies, this was lib as shit, try hanging out with some literal communists like me some time. I mean, don't actually do that because we'll all think you're twats, but still. Unless you have regular arguments between anarchists and Marxist-Leninists arguing about the USSR and jokes about the kulaks deserving worse, you are a long way from far left
Anyway, as I imagine I'm probably getting banned for this, I think I'll say my final goodbye.
Fuck you Tyler. Hope you enjoy your new right-wing shithole of apologists for sexual assault. Have a shit life, and fuck off.
Believe? Believe Women.
Herr Schwarz
Banned
I should hope not otherwise it could seem like a huge goal post move. after the first article they left...
Then another article that elucidated things came out and made EL look good.
But it's really those other things actually.
That's lucky.
psychowave
Member
Same here, especially because it was a place where misogyny and general bigotry wouldn't permeate gaming discussion, which is what I was mostly interested in.
Did any of those Weinstein accusers get back with him and have consensual sex after being sexually harrassed/abused/traumatized? I highly doubt it.
Darkstorne
Member
If you think this is true, you need to google Evilore and "sexual harassment". This is not the first time these allegations have been made, this likely won't be the last time they're made, and if you choose to defend the guy and support him with further ad revenue then that says a lot about you as well. If Evilore is sticking around then I'm 100% out. I refuse to lower myself to extreme language like a lot of account suiciders are doing, but I also refuse to lower myself by hanging around this forum and financially funding someone who has repeatedly harassed women sexually.
ResetEra is being launched, probably today, by all the folks who have left GAF (seems to be the vast majority). I hope to see you all there so we can start anew without the perpetrator getting away with this crap yet again.
Well I have to say I was willing to at least hear out Evilore and let this play out.
When neogaf came back online, with no advertising, I was willing to stick around and see how things played out.
Now that advertising seems to be back on, before getting to a place of if not unity, at least a place of community, I give up.
Despite the guilt or innocence of the owner, this has been handled poorly.
All of the hardcore mods have left.
I have been a member for over ten years now... A lot of good times a lot of shaky times. A lot of friends made. But doing ads so shortly after this shitstorm?
Sorry but I am out. I hope all of this is bull shit. But please remove me as a member of Neogaf. Making money off the back of this discussion is beyond the limited rope I was willing to give an hour ago.
I still have no real opinion on the whole sexual assault matter. But the lack of just general common sense and the ability to read the room makes you a bit of an alien in this world Evilore.
When neogaf came back online, with no advertising, I was willing to stick around and see how things played out.
Now that advertising seems to be back on, before getting to a place of if not unity, at least a place of community, I give up.
Despite the guilt or innocence of the owner, this has been handled poorly.
All of the hardcore mods have left.
I have been a member for over ten years now... A lot of good times a lot of shaky times. A lot of friends made. But doing ads so shortly after this shitstorm?
Sorry but I am out. I hope all of this is bull shit. But please remove me as a member of Neogaf. Making money off the back of this discussion is beyond the limited rope I was willing to give an hour ago.
I still have no real opinion on the whole sexual assault matter. But the lack of just general common sense and the ability to read the room makes you a bit of an alien in this world Evilore.
I was temp banned before but (Wasn't serious anymore about GAF, so couldn't care less):
When you point to politics and social issues being the issue and embrace the fans that use "Gaming only!" (which happens to be the exact false moniker that GG uses btw). Then you sir, Mister Malka, are the problem.
Offtopic will only get back with "nerdy topics" they say, so drooling about objectifying gifs of Gal Gadot? Was fiiiiiiiine, it's those damn LGBTQ+, Black People and Womenthat are the problem. Let's remove their topics, so we can keep drooling about 8 year old anime avatars with Dolly Parton sized boobs. /sarcasm
Fuck it ban me, I'm through. I do NOT need fixing Malka!
But keep telling yourself that it was the "social topics" and those nasty minorities that don't shut up. You are here for gaming and gaming only. Go have your safe space Malka and be happy in your new home that is about "Gaming/Geek Topics Only" aka "Mah hobbies are being hijacked by them pesky minorities!".
But I'll apologize to one person: Sorry to have mentioned you on GAF Dolly, I still love ya.
When you point to politics and social issues being the issue and embrace the fans that use "Gaming only!" (which happens to be the exact false moniker that GG uses btw). Then you sir, Mister Malka, are the problem.
Offtopic will only get back with "nerdy topics" they say, so drooling about objectifying gifs of Gal Gadot? Was fiiiiiiiine, it's those damn LGBTQ+, Black People and Womenthat are the problem. Let's remove their topics, so we can keep drooling about 8 year old anime avatars with Dolly Parton sized boobs. /sarcasm
Fuck it ban me, I'm through. I do NOT need fixing Malka!
But keep telling yourself that it was the "social topics" and those nasty minorities that don't shut up. You are here for gaming and gaming only. Go have your safe space Malka and be happy in your new home that is about "Gaming/Geek Topics Only" aka "Mah hobbies are being hijacked by them pesky minorities!".
But I'll apologize to one person: Sorry to have mentioned you on GAF Dolly, I still love ya
.GenericJoe
Member
Getting rid of political talk is pretty much the best decision you could make to improve the site.
I'm a bit iffy on the anonymous moderation, but as far as I know, the mods that abused their position like Besada and Y2Kev have jumped ship so I'll keep an open mind on it.
I'm a bit iffy on the anonymous moderation, but as far as I know, the mods that abused their position like Besada and Y2Kev have jumped ship so I'll keep an open mind on it.
Maroon Gamer
Member
I am glad that the forum is back. I don't think that you had to close the offtopic threads, it was a good place with some interesting stuff.
Seraph_Nicholas
Member
Apathy is not ignorance. I am aware. I just don't care. I'm sorry to have to be the one to teach you that different people have different value systems, but I hope this will help you be a more functionally empathetic person in your future endeavors.
Seven4sses
Member
Welp, it was fun while it lasted. This isn't going to end well.
I'm out.
I'm out.
Screaming Meat
Unconfirmed Member
Actually, yes.
Muffin1611
Banned
This is not the first time. There are posts from 2012, and also things about revenge porn EL supposedly did.
Only now in 2017 that people seem to be growing a spine stuff like that is pulled into the public.
So let me get this right .. are you seriously suggesting that the shower move was ok based on the follow up events?
Seriously? Or are you trolling me?
Honestly this is all news to me.
The Strokes
Banned
If you get banned after this it just proves how gross and incredibly sad the new state of Gaf is gonna be like.
No one will care now, the people that made Gaf what it was are all gone, the most toxic side of the forum was the gaming one, not OT.
But oh well, this it what it's gonna be now, just another, more exclusive, 4chan.
In this instance, sexual misconduct=/=sexual assault.
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