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So what do you think of the 7570 as a possible performance level?
bgassassin
Member
As the foundation? Very possible. But Fourth Storm made a very interesting find. And it was virtually like I imagined a foundation GPU with extra functions on top would look like.
http://www.anandtech.com/show/4307/amd-launches-radeon-e6760
The main thing that sticks out is that it has a TDP of 35W.
You're right. Just the mention of FC being removed for usernames is good enough during the conference, but I would expect them to elaborate more in detail in interviews or during their roundtable.
Don't they tend to go over an hour every E3? I hope they spend enough time on the Wii U.
That is indeed a very interesting find. Similar in areas to a 4850 baseline performance though lacking in areas too compared to 4850 like nearly half the floating point operations. very low power and of course all the bells and whistles of modern architecture
Yeah, especially as speculation will ramp up the closer we get to E3. I wouldn't be surprised if we make it to Thread VII prior to E3.
I Stalk Alone
Member
What is so bad about friend codes as long as it is not the way Ｉｔ is used to exchange information by the user? STEAM has a 17 digit id "friend code" to identify its users as well as a steam profile page as well as a STEAM ID that is now over 51 million last i saw. You might never see the friend code but it will be there in the background when you exchange information.
I was going to post a reply to this...
... but BP beat me to it. Is anyone surprised anymore about Konami being totally and utterly STUPID? Name one smart thing they've done, and I can likely name 10 stupid things they've done to the exact same franchise.
Ahhhh, I remember when people "lol'd" at the idea of a Wii success this generation.
We never learn from history, do we?
....... OK. You just.... hang onto that.
More like 3DS friend code becomes your Nintendo Network account and has all the same features of a non-numeric account, PLUS the added bonus of not being able to call yourself by a "taken" name.
Ya know, I've always liked Kamek. I think I just admire his love/loyality to Bowser, how he sticks his neck out for that guy constantly and has raised him like a son since he was a baby. And he's always there to look after him when he's inevitably beat by Mario.
He truly is the Waylon Smithers to Bowser's Mr. Burns.
--------------------
SPECULATE: What would you guys say to a slight change in Miis? Specifically, giving them proper bodies, like we saw in the Fortune Street promo materials?
And we could dress them with clothes and accessories won in game achievements.
It's easier for people to remember words and letters than it is a bunch of digits. I could care less how they implement it. Also, by removing friend codes people might take them more serious.
bgassassin
Member
Yeah. I can see Wii U's GPU having fundamental similarities to that GPU. I'm anxious to learn what the final looks like and what it's capable of.
I'm confident in what it will be able to do, and at the same time that confidence has been based on a viewpoint that ignores the tweaks Nintendo had been making. So it should at least be slightly better than what I've been saying.
LOL. I hope the sixth thread does indeed last till E3.
Chet Rippo
Member
It is.
Gahiggidy
My aunt & uncle run a Mom & Pop store, "The Gamecube Hut", and sold 80k WiiU within minutes of opening.
He was cell shaded in Sunshine, which I thought was a subtle, but nice change from the rendered look of the promo material.
Christberg
Member
That IS a mighty interesting find. I could see Nintendo customizing the holy heck out of something like this with some general beefing up and a bunch of unique fixed function stuff. Final TDP could be 60-70W and it'd still smoke the holy hell out of your average current gen gaming console.
That low TDP is mighty impressive...
TheCongressman1
Member
This is really what I wanted from the start.
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
I thought it's Bowser who's gay
yes i do agree, but i really think the OS will have 2 different layouts:
1 - if you are using your U Pad
2 - if you are just using your wiimote
otherwise the OS would be unusable if for whatever reason you cannot have your U Pad with you...
Microsoft has technically done the avatar customization thing, but instead of incentivizing acheivements beyond the scorecard e-peen using these accessories, they make you PAY for what are essentially MARKETING MATERIALS FOR GAMES. It's ridiculous.
I really hope this is something Nintendo rolls with. And it'd certainly make the grind for clothing in Animal Crossing more worthwhile.
SaintMadeOfPlaster
Member
We still don't know if the Wii U is playable with just Wiimotes, so what you're saying isn't necessarily a given.
Lupin the Third
Member
Isn't he a Camelot character? Only Mario, Luigi, and Wario were created by internal Nintendo teams.
Obviously he is Nintendo-owned, but he is like, the least appealing or developed one out of the lot. You'd have to work pretty hard to make him an interesting character. Wario's fun because of his greed and gross habits. Luigi's a coward but he's physically capable. Mario's cheerful and plucky. Waluigi is...PURE EVIL...but Wario hangs out with him all buddy buddy anyway?
Sorry, I know Mario isn't "deep," but I just don't "buy" or really even "accept" Waluigi as a real "Mario" character. I have a similar problem with "Kamek," the name of which I consider to to be a translation choice for Yoshi's Island, and less the name of a single "devoted" Magikoopa (isn't "Kamekku" the Japanese name for Magikoopa? and isn't "Kamek" reportedly female according to one work?) I'm sure NOA just didn't want to have it say, "Magikoopa did this" or "Magikoopa did that" and decided on naming that specific Magikoopa (again, it's not like this in the original) to make it more interesting in writing.
I'm a huge Mario fan, but I just don't care for all the excess fluff characters that fanfiction embraces like they're gospel.
Sorry for the detour. I've said my piece.
I also think "Bowser" should still be called "Koopa" and I dislike that NOA name change to this day.
Ya know, I've always liked Kamek. I think I just admire his love/loyality to Bowser, how he sticks his neck out for that guy constantly and has raised him like a son since he was a baby. And he's always there to look after him when he's inevitably beat by Mario.
I hope for Mario Kart Wii U that Kamek is playable like he was in the beta version of Mario Kart 64 before they scrapped him.
If Wiggler and Honey Queen can be in Mario Kart 3DS, then Kamek deserves to be in it more than those 2.
Video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tYnWfkENKSk
Lupin the Third
Member
I'm not against it, but what would separate Magikoopa from Koopa Troopa? A different Special Item/Attack that transforms an opponent? His weight and handling would probably be about the same as Koopa Troopa though, wouldn't it? Did MK7 even still use character-related Special Items like Double Dash did? I don't even remember if the Wii version did....
fabricated backlash
Member
Microsoft is just clever. Vanity is a bitch and Nerds can be monetized when it concerns their own self presentation to hell and back. Truly, the Avatar marketplace was probably Microsofts smartest introduction.
I do like the idea though that some of the avatar items are tied to achievements. If Nintendo goes that route I'm in full support of that. It would also satisfy peoples e-peen addiction as you could have some very rare items for extra hard achievements.
I was thinking about ways how Nintendo could do their own version of a Gamercard. It would obviously be tied to a Mii character, but the idea that comes back to me is not just the obvious Achievements/Props, and Bio listed in the profile, but also a short exhibition of user generated content.
A small gallery of personal stuff like paintings, custom levels, track records, Animal Crossing Clothes etc...
I expect friend codes to stay, allthough I also expect them to make adding people easier, by having friend invites, and the ability to search for User names and IDs. Kinda like ICQ and similar services. This would solve the problem of unique user names as well as allow easy parental controls. (Friendcodes for minors would be handled just as now. Also no voice chat outside of friends if parental controls don't allow for it)
That 35watt TDP also includes memory right? it's also a 40nm chip, will be interesting to see how they could tweak something similar to that... just a gut feeling though, I think that they would choose 640 stream processors, it fits nicer to the original dev kits of project cafe and the bump in performance rumor also comes with what you were told about them finishing the chip in december/janurary... so maybe it's similar to something like a e6760 in design, but based on a slightly larger mobile gpu (the e6760 is based off of the 6700m series)
I'm really interested to hear if they are building the GPU on a 32nm or 28nm process, both are avalible to NEC and I would imagine that Nintendo is taking an approach to the chip similar to the Xbox 360 Slim which, if I'm not mistaken allowed for sharing the 10MB cache of Xenos with Xenon (though that isn't used as to allow compatibility to original 360s)
A little speculation: a 640sp 700mhz GPU with 32MB embedded memory share-able to a 3 core 6 thread ~3ghz IBM power7 related CPU all on a 32nm/28nm chip, would be a pretty strong performer, especially with 2GB ram. The chip could probably fit under 80watts TDP as well.
I also think Iwata might have increased the specs of the machine around the beginning of the year to match his "deeper" targets of Wii U.
Yeah I think the character would work best if he had some special abilities.
Mario Kart Wii U should have a focus on character specific abilities. It would make things more interesting I think. The current formula is becoming a tad bit stale.
I mean, the way I see it, magikooper/kamek has played a major villian role in Yoshi's Island, both Paper Mario games, and all 3 Mario & Luigi games. Also he was in Super Mario World (SNES), Super Mario 3D Land, was a boss fight in Super Mario RPG, was a boss fight in Super Princess Peach, playable in the Mario baseball games, and is in both Mario Galaxy games. And he's been in the Super Mario animated series. So he's not like Wart from Mario Bros 2 where he's only been in 1 or 2 games. The character has built a reputation through many classic games.
I'd argue magikoopa/kamek is a more important villian/character in the Mario universe than Waluigi or Wart ever were.
Video of cameo in mario rpg: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t12qQDM7jRc&feature=related
Thunder Monkey
Banned
So... GTA4 is a really long game. God... I put way too many hours into that game. I've already beaten the main story mode and did most of the side stuff... and it only took me 60 hours!
I see we have new GPU speculation courtesy of bg. And a thread that's about half way through. Truncate it for me guys! Has anything happened?
I see we have new GPU speculation courtesy of bg. And a thread that's about half way through. Truncate it for me guys! Has anything happened?
Franchuzas87
Member
Wow, I love how looks that.
Same here. If Nintendo doesn't have it front and center at their conference, I'd be quite quite upset. My hype for the title is uber-high. It'd be clear at that point that something has gone horribly wrong with development.
Gahiggidy
My aunt & uncle run a Mom & Pop store, "The Gamecube Hut", and sold 80k WiiU within minutes of opening.
How important is online in Pikmin for you?
Disorientator
Member
Makes sense.
But I can't imagine NOT being able to use the console because let's say the UPad is charging on its' cradle.
The fact that -unless a bomb drops- only 1 Upad will be packed-in the retail box, makes me think there must be another way to navigate the OS.
And while on the subject of charging, shouldn't we be worried about UPad's battery life? I mean the controller packs so many features it's scary!
Any educated guesses on the battery's capacity / estimated life?
Edit: Spoiled by AAs in previous controllers (WaveBird/Wiimote) - always had an extra pair charging.
A 2 player online mode in Pikmin would actually be pretty neat lol.
This is another reason why I think they should pack in a remote and nunchuck in the box.
fabricated backlash
Member
Judging from the patent files, the bay for the battery is enormous. I guess we're looking at a solid 10 to 15 hour battery life. The main drain is going to be the screen, and the wireless module transfering the image and input data. Given that the Upad has no need to power a cpu/gpu I'd say the battery life should be comparable to that of an Xbox360/Wiimote
Gahiggidy
My aunt & uncle run a Mom & Pop store, "The Gamecube Hut", and sold 80k WiiU within minutes of opening.
How about a 'Hunger Games' mode where 24 spacemen compete to survive a map with scarce resources and dangerous critters eating up the Pikmin. Each starts with 10 Pikmin and you have to rush to grow your army and than strategize to pick off the other player's Pikmin, build a nest to guard against the other players, lure deadly creatures to the opponent's camp, or just be a pussy and hide out in a cave. And to loose and go boom! is when you're last Pikmin expires. They could require each Wii U unit to have two players to further the Hungry Games parallel with an olimar and loogie from each district. You'd want to cooperate but in the end you still gotta kill off your partner to win.
Not the least bit important.
Then again, I care very, very little for online gameplay. If Nintendo crawled along with most online player-versus-player features for another decade, you wouldn't find me complaining very much.
But I openly admit that I'm very much out-of-touch with the tastes of most core gamers. My main wishes for online are:
- the ability to watch others play their games, be it live or archived in YouTube's "Let's Play _____" style. Sometimes I don't want the stress of playing, but still want to take-in a game as a spectator.
- the resurrection of the Nsider Forums in the form of a channel on the console itself, with integration of one's Club Nintendo profile with one's console profile (chances are very slim on this one, I think)
- more titles available for the Virtual Console, and transferability of my already-purchased titles from Wii to Wii U; I love playing old games!!!
- expansion of the Nintendo Channel. 24 hour programming. Advertising, previews, and honest reviews of new and upcoming titles, both first and third-party. Counselors' Corner programming (named in honor of the old Nintendo Power column).
But online gaming itself? Naaah. Not my cup of tea, although I understand how many folks are now convinced that it's a necessity for most games, so Nintendo "checking that box" is good for its long-term objectives. Too many developers skimp on the single-player experience and then point to the multiplayer as though it makes everything peachy. I don't buy that one bit.
I'm more of a single-player guy. Either that, or local multi-player. Like I said.. I'm out of touch. I'll openly admit it.
Disorientator
Member
Agreed but I (and think most Wii owners) wouldn't like to pay -again- for something we already own.
Ofcourse if it's a re-design bring it on!!
It would be amazing if it's anything close to that figure.
I guess at the end it all comes down to how all the different controller features will be used through-out the gaming session. (screen/vibration/speakers/camera etc)
That would be a huge relief. I'm more of a 12-to-16-hours per play session guy instead of a one-or-two-hours per day kind of guy. Big marathon sessions for me!
I wonder how bright or dim the screen gets; this could make a bit of a difference.
GPU talk was just some speculating. I mentioned the 7570 could be a good baseline to work from and BG pointed out the other chip which offers fantastic power usage with similar performance to a 4850 for a potential baseline to upgrade.
ColdBlooder
Banned
My exact opinion.
I am a 95% offline gamer. I like to just dive right into the gameworld by myself without a 12 year old a screaming and calling me a cheater (when i play good) or loser (when i perform bad).
But we are the minority and i totally acknowledge that Nintendo HAS to nail the online aspect this time. I also hope that they focus heavily on the social community aspect and not on the "e-pen*s" aspect. What you listed as online features is what i would like to see aswell.
Generally speaking I think they should maintain their actual ultra stylized form.SPECULATE: What would you guys say to a slight change in Miis? Specifically, giving them proper bodies, like we saw in the Fortune Street promo materials?
And we could dress them with clothes and accessories won in game achievements.
It would be a nice upgrade and the possibility to dress them but then the overall aspect will be always game dependet.
A model such the one you posted can't be used in all games genres for technical issue I think... have you ever tried Kinect sport games in example? Have you seen what a "full body render" can bring to the surface? Crossed legs and arms in very unutural way depending on your movements.
Two very important things about that chip should be noted.
1. It's 40nm and the Wii U GPU could very likely be made on NEC's 32nm process, or their 28nm process, which will drastically drop it's TDP to ~25watts.
2. The e6760 is embedded with memory and other unnecessary parts, so that chip would likely work under 20watts.
If that wasn't cool enough, it's based on the HD6570/HD6670 and the wattage needed to go from 600mhz to 800mhz on that chip was only 7 watts on the 40nm process, so using a similar chip at 32nm for instance (with only the GPU chip) you could assume 640sp @ even 800watts should be doable for 35watt TDP today, and that would give you 1024Gflops, Or the just over 1Tflop that we have heard from rumors and even BG in the past.
If Nintendo did this, it would be very interesting, but if they used only 480sp with some fixed functionality shaders, I could see them producing some really cool effects, but I'd rather have them create a SoC that is under 80watts that uses the 640sp @ 800mhz and a 3 core CPU ~ 3ghz on the 32nm chip with some fix functionality shaders, and 32MB embedded memory shared between the GPU/CPU.
Fantastic console specs even if they don't look amazing on paper, the Wii U wouldn't show it's age for years with the rumored PS4/720 specs where they are.
I have no problem with another remote in the box. I'm not too concerned about paying a couple extra bucks to make sure it's in there.
Here's the thing. No remote in the box pretty much guarantees that IR games won't happen. Which isn't good. Not everyone has motion plus and making sure a motion plus is in very box lets devs know every Wii U owner can play their game. Accessories that aren't packed in are pretty much destined to fail. Having one in the box just is a good way to make sure all the tools are there for multiple control schemes from day one.
The funny thing is that, for me, I don't care about the Wii Pad at all. I'm much more interested in more remote/nunchuck/motion games.
Disorientator
Member
Def. not a deal-breaker but wouldn't mind saving some € ;p
Could the exclusion of a WiiMote Plus + Nunchuck save ~€/$50 from the retail package?
€299.99 "feels" much better than €349.99 and of course €50 to spare could mean an extra game on launch!!
aeroslash
Member
Does this chip have a tessellator? I haven't seen anything about it.
Thunder Monkey
Banned
AI for at least two generations now has had more to do with what a programmer puts into it. Given the simplicity of most Nintendo AI models I would not expect them to do it well.
Well Nintendo does know that they need to add the Wiimote in the box, considering that Asymmetric game-play is a huge focus of them this time, it wouldn't surprise me. I also don't mind paying $10-$20 more for the controller to be in the box.
The Upad will be a pretty awesome device in itself, I'm looking forward to it, and if VC is playable on it, that alone makes it worthy of all the focus they will pay towards it.
Maybe I'm just weird but the Upad by its self, would be like the return of the Gameboy, and Nintendo's 3rd pillar strategy would be somewhat back. So I'm very fond of the Upad, even if I want a Classic Controller GCN edition, or heck even just a Wiimote adapter that allows you to plug the GCN controller into it's base.
Yeah, I'm pretty sure it would have one, even Xenos has tessellation, and the rumored HD 4800 series for the original dev kits, had tessellation, also even the HD 6670 (a very mainstream AMD chip from last generation) had tessellation and is also what BG's e6760 is based on. I just don't see a reason why they would possibly not have one.
Gahiggidy
My aunt & uncle run a Mom & Pop store, "The Gamecube Hut", and sold 80k WiiU within minutes of opening.
Guys, if the box really is limited to one and only one wuc, than anyone who ever wants to play a multiplayer game will have no choice but to pick up a wiimote. You're argument is akin to saying... "developers will never support multiplayer games on N64 due to there only being one controller in the box."
p.s. - I can't sleep.
p.s. - I can't sleep.
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