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The Zelda TP spoiler thread: ALL SPOILERS IN HERE OR ELSE (late game spoilers itt)

PkunkFury

Member
Branduil said:
Z- Lock-on, center camera

C- First-Person view


Thanks. And A/B on the remote? I figured B would be lock, but I guess that is something else? Seems strange Nintendo would remove camera controls completely, particularly since the Wii has more options for controlling it than the GC controller had. Also strange that a sensor bar error would cause the camera to turn. My guess is the code is there and either it was locked out for the demo so they could redesign it, or the guy playing the game didn't figure it out. Do we have imformation from any news sites that camera control was removed?

I'd expect them to do it like Marvel Allience or whatever where you tilt the nunchuck to move the camera, or perhaps tilt the wiimote with a button held down so as to separate the that input from sword attacks
 
NSider said:
EAD is now more experienced in 3D than the N64 days. The camera will be much better than OoT and MM, trust me. You won't need even need the camera controls, even if they didn't remove them completely and moved them to "button press + nunchuck tilt" instead (hey, that's not a bad idea..).

From the impressions given about SMG, the camera hasnt been much of an issue at all. I agree with you about the N64 days. Just look at the game structures and environment differences between OOT and WW for example. They're arent the same thing. How would they even implement a WW camera control into how TP's areas are built? I could see the camera being used for TP's outdoor environments, but the dungeons arent the same system. How would you zoom out(pressing down on the Cstick) without going through the floor or roof above you?

Branduil said:
I have a rotating avatar, you'll have to be more specific.

The one where the girl is shaking her head(throwing her shoulder back and grinning).
 

Branduil

Member
PkunkFury said:
Thanks. And A/B on the remote? I figured B would be lock, but I guess that is something else? Seems strange Nintendo would remove camera controls completely, particularly since the Wii has more options for controlling it than the GC controller had. Also strange that a sensor bar error would cause the camera to turn. My guess is the code is there and either it was locked out for the demo so they could redesign it, or the guy playing the game didn't figure it out. Do we have imformation from any news sites that camera control was removed?

I'd expect them to do it like Marvel Allience or whatever where you tilt the nunchuck to move the camera, or perhaps tilt the wiimote with a button held down so as to separate the that input from sword attacks

B is your bow or another item. A is the Action button like always.
 

PkunkFury

Member
NSider said:
You won't need even need the camera controls, even if they didn't remove them completely and moved them to "button press + nunchuck tilt" instead (hey, that's not a bad idea..).

No it isn't a bad idea, and it supposedly works very well according to some previews of the Marvel game:

Gamespy said:
With that in mind, it's little surprise that one of the best elements of this game is something small that most people wouldn't think about: camera control.

By tilting the Nunchuk, players will have full control of the camera. No, it's not the first thing that most people will think about when they wonder about MUA on Wii, but it's a crucial gameplay element that many people take for granted. With a turn left or right, players can shift the focus around the map with the same ease that they will be able to do on any other version of the multi-SKU MUA. Without something so innovative, one shudders to think of how the game would have turned out. Also, upon playing it, not only does it feel rather smooth and natural, but it probably will set the standard for camera control on Wii for a long time. Other innovations will undoubtedly come, but odds are that this will be the standard for any third-person action games on the new system.
 
AniHawk said:
Hey, HEY HEY!!

300px-P_billy01.jpg


Smiles and Cries said:
I do understand french but this guy speaks too much play dammit
http://youtube.com/watch?v=IF3rC02uiqY

French is my first language and I think this makes listening to this guy even more annoying.
 

NSider

Member
Beezy said:
But SMG takes place on a bunch of tiny planets. Zelda doesn't. Just saying.

Have you seen the whole demo? There are big planets with hills, enemies, giant robots and mazes. The camera is great.

My point is: inferior camera control =/= inferior camera. Could be quite the contrary actually. Giving too much camera control to the player makes the developer lazy about watching for auto camera glitches. If there's no or little control, the developer will make sure you don't even need it. WW had a nice mix of free camera control and excellent automatic camera. Some didn't even use the camera controls much.

EAD can only improve the auto camera (since TP's engine is a modified version of WW's engine, and looking at SMG's perfect camera). Thus, camera control becomes less important, and that's why it's really okay with me if they go back to the old camera control.
 
The whole reason EAD took out the fully manual camera in the Wii version is because they added motion-controlled sword fighting. They made a decision between sword control and camera control, and the former won out...that's the reason. They didn't just wake up one morning and go "Hey, you know...we should take out the manual camera, no one wants it!" At the end of the day, this is pretty much a non issue, really. Judging from the positive impressions of the new sword fighting mechanics, it sounds like EAD made the right decision.

EDIT: As for Mario Galaxy, using spherical worlds pretty much eliminates all the camera issues right off, and was probably a major reason for going in that direction in the first place.
 
MadraptorMan said:
The whole reason EAD took out the fully manual camera in the Wii version is because they added motion-controlled swordfighting. They made a decision between sword control and camera control, and the former won out...that's the reason. They didn't just wake up one morning and go "Hey, you know...we should take out the manual camera, no one wants it!" At the end of the day, this is pretty much a non issue, really. Judging from the positive impressions of the new sword fighting mechanics, it sounds like EAD made the right decision.

EDIT: As for Mario Galaxy, using spherical worlds pretty much eliminates all the camera issues right off, and was probably a major reason for going in that direction in the first place.

That's a good point. It would be easy to do with GC's controls. But with how the Wii-remote is set up, wouldnt trying to control the camera be akward as well?

T minus 2 days until Matt sets the internet on fire. Twilight Princess impressions serving up!
 

Branduil

Member
Smiles and Cries said:
watch the video above can anyone pic out camera issues?

Only camera control issues I saw were with the idiotic JF cameraman.

Also, I think having 4 available item slots in Wii TP outweighs the controllable camera but 2 item slots in GC TP.
 
gamergirly said:
That's a good point. It would be easy to do with GC's controls. But with how the Wii-remote is set up, wouldnt trying to control the camera be akward as well?

T minus 2 days until Matt sets the internet on fire. Twilight Princess impressions serving up!

The way I would have done it, you would have held the C button (or whatever is currently used for first person mode) and you'd move the Nunchuk the way you want the camera to move, or thrust up slightly to go in to first person.
 

NSider

Member
TheGreatDave said:
The way I would have done it, you would have held the C button (or whatever is currently used for first person mode) and you'd move the Nunchuk the way you want the camera to move, or thrust up slightly to go in to first person.
Hey, don't steal my ideas!
You would go first person if you tap C once and get full control if you hold it.
 
NSider said:
Hey, don't steal my ideas!
You would go first person if you tap C once and get full control if you hold it.

Even better.

Hopefully, people just don't know the controls properly playing the demo and didn't realise they could control the camera. I really want to be able to.
 

dreamkats

Member
Branduil said:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=UV3lH9qWmks

Right at the beginning.

Nice impressions, by the way. Sounds like the first demo was calibrated wrong.



Amir0x am cry. :lol

I'm pretty sure the GC version doesn't have direct shield control either.


and look at my post:

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=4694569&postcount=238


Last thing: I've never seen anyone mentioning this... so... it's impossible to swim freely under water, the system is the same as in OOT. I hope this will be fixed, Aonuma stated multiple times that we would be able to go underwater.
 

dreamkats

Member
gamergirly said:
I dont think it matters what type of camera TP ends up having. Somebody is going to complain.



Can you answer my question about the camera or you dont know?


Look up, there was NO WAY to control FREELY the camera :)
 

dreamkats

Member
you're damn right! but, since then, the Twilight Zone (this name always reminds me of DDR, wtf) isn't black and white anymore...


Hope nothing changed
 

Scrow

Still Tagged Accordingly
dreamkats said:
I hope this will be fixed, Aonuma stated multiple times that we would be able to go underwater.
The OOT method still allows you to go underwater.
 
EDGE Mag Preview Quotes...

"The message is clear, this time Nintendo has made a game unafraid to stand tall beside those two previous titles (OOT, LTTP) widely regarded as the greatest in a series of greats. This is no 'what if' whimsy like the WW or the minish cap. TP is Zelda by the book and there's every sign that it's the most involved, the most ambitious, the just plain biggest zelda there's ever been."

"The sheer amount of content in TP is overwhelming. It throws new skills, items and intriguing twists at you far faster than any zelda before it."

"Epona is no slender pony this time, instead a solid, gigantic, invincible animal."

During the first 6 hours you will have done more than the equivalent of 3 dungeons in on any other zelda game in terms of new items, skills etc.

The first dungeon reminiscent of the forest temple is

"though hardly hard, it's probably as involved and suprising as any other initial zelda dungeon, if not more so."

"you begin to get a sense of the sheer dizzying scope of TP, it threatens to be absolutely immense, an epic seldom rivalled in scale outside the rpg form (and never by another launch game) and loaded heavier than ever with items, details and possibilities as yet unseen in a test that made 6 hours feel like 6 minutes."

"It's almost forbidding, TP is certainly no populist rethink of zelda, in tune with the popular all cuddly all access Wii. It is instead an all guns blazing assault on the hardcore, a fanboys wet dream (if there's any worry at all it's that it might overburden itself)"

"That's reflected in the involved controls of the wii version, though not as off putting as the E3 demo, when introduced and gradually relaxed into over time, they are delicate, sometimes demanding and occasionally frustraing. Attack gestures flow beautifully, but are sticky to start and jumping to pointer aiming can be awkward and dis-orientating. However they more than make up for it with tremendous tactile excitement, the shrill thrill of the speaker effects and the very real and seriously welcome freedom and comfort that comes from having your hands attached by 3 feet of wire, not 3 inches of plastic. . Factor in the Wii only widescreen support -no small consideration- and it's clear which version is a must have."

"The questions it answers are the important ones. Is it a challenge? Is it a mystery? Will it make your heart stop? Is it Zelda? Yes, yes, yes and yes."
 

Y2Kev

TLG Fan Caretaker Est. 2009
Smiles and Cries said:
EDGE Mag Preview Quotes...

Very excited here. I just hope I get that feeling that I got when I played OOT...the feeling that makes you not want to stop.
 
Smiles and Cries said:
it reads like a fanboy wrote it :(

Edge hardly suck Nintendo's cock. They're pretty high on them in terms of the innovation factor of their consoles, but their games haven't been the ones getting the high scores lately.
 

Johnas

Member
Smiles and Cries said:
EDGE Mag Preview Quotes...

Hype + infinity. A little wordy, but I like what they have to say.

Seems like Zelda: TP is poised to be the game of the generation for PS2, Xbox, and GC. What a way to end the generation. (Only God of War II left until next year)
 
TheGreatDave said:
Edge hardly suck Nintendo's cock. They're pretty high on them in terms of the innovation factor of their consoles, but their games haven't been the ones getting the high scores lately.

Good to know... Someone here had an Edge mag with this featured story but was too chicken to take one for the team... I sure would like to read more
 

Kangu

Banned
Smiles and Cries said:
EDGE Mag Preview Quotes...

So the controls are dissorienting and unresponsive, but they make up for it because the controller is in two pieces? And it has a speaker?

Other than that... HYPE + 10 billion.

It sounds like Nintendo is completely set to deliver on the content side.
 

BorkBork

The Legend of BorkBork: BorkBorkity Borking
Kangu said:
So the controls are dissorienting and unresponsive, but they make up for it because the controller is in two pieces? And it has a speaker?

You forgot the tactile excitement bit.
 
Kangu said:
So the controls are dissorienting and unresponsive, but they make up for it because the controller is in two pieces? And it has a speaker?

Other than that... HYPE + 10 billion.

It sounds like Nintendo is completely set to deliver on the content side.

When did they say unresposive? They just said it's hard to get used to...which comes without saying.
 

unifin

Member
BrandNew said:
When did they say unresposive? They just said it's hard to get used to...which comes without saying.

The disorientation probably comes from having to suddenly be aware of the pointer's direction after having it in a relaxed position most of the time.
 

Johnas

Member
BrandNew said:
When did they say unresposive? They just said it's hard to get used to...which comes without saying.

It might be just me, but for some reason I get a very slight nagging feeling in the back of my mind that reviewers are going to overlook controller problems in the face of the "epicness" of the game. I'm not trolling the controls at all (I am waiting for the Cube version though) but I have yet to see a report on the controls that doesn't include some slight hint at problems.

I'm definitely inclined to think what you said, about it taking time simply due to the fact that it's all new, and I'd love to see both versions do great, but I can't help but be a tiny bit skeptical there.
 

Johnas

Member
fly high ~ayunite~ said:
The article on the series as a whole is really good too, discusses Zelda's status as "the greatest games series ever".

Although it's not my favorite series, I always have thought of Zelda as the quintessential videogame series.
 
Kangu said:
So the controls are dissorienting and unresponsive, but they make up for it because the controller is in two pieces? And it has a speaker?

Other than that... HYPE + 10 billion.

It sounds like Nintendo is completely set to deliver on the content side.
please don't say things like that unless you read the article. they praise the controls, as they are brung in better in the game, than they ever can a demo.
they can be as you determined to begin, but become natural.
the article is fantastic , as is the Wii suplement, really nice photography. although the magazine cover front and rear is all kinds of kickass. fully CG modeled shield up front and master sword at the rear.
480p confirmed for Europe too by the sounds of it.
there's also a background to the Zelda series article which is extremely well written about how Zelda never fully reached its full potential (in sales volumes) yet it is used as a yardstick by which many games are measured, and largely its formula is uncopied yet as a character Link has never been whored (Mario has been in over 150 games) and everyone knows who he is.
 
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