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[Cookychan]

Oh God, did I really just lurk through all of that?
Anyhoo, the idea of Wii U being weaker than a 360 is even more stupid than Hyoyeon's stylist in SNSD. Hrmf.

 

[Lord Ghirahim]

Don't forget about those two Link riding Epona statues (one Original, one Gold). How many meals did you have to skip for that ):

Let me check when those are coming out...
I foresee plenty of skipping in my not-so-distant future!

Speaking of skipping, what is skip Ltd. up to? I really enjoyed Captain☆Rainbow.

 

[ViewtifulJC]

 

[IceDoesntHelp]

wow at this thread just wow

you guys were not trolled you were grossly violated

I feel violated ):

Oh God, did I really just lurk through all of that?
Anyhoo, the idea of Wii U being weaker than a 360 is even more stupid than Hyoyeon's stylist in SNSD. Hrmf.

What. Did. I. Miss?

 

[antonz]

Good points.

Seeing exactly what happened to Wii support partially because of a lack of power, it would be so surprising for Nintendo to go with considerably underpowered hardware again.

Especially when Iwata has spoken to the fact the hardware gulf was an issue that hurt the Wii long term.

Wii U basically has 2 possible paths. Pretty Similar to the current consoles and banking on their replacements being 2014 and not sooner. If they come sooner Nintendo gets screwed and would rightfully deserve it for being so shortsighted.

or

Wii U is the moderate Upgrade we mostly expect and its in position to be a factor in the next gen of consoles

 

[EatChildren]

The wii was not exactly more powerful than the Xbox. It was better in some areas, yet weaker in others.

The Wii is a weird one, as compared to last gen there's plenty of grunt under the hood, but not using traditional shaders holds it back, unlike the Xbox which was a mini-PC through and through.

As for my own personal opinion on this matter, I don't distrust Arkam. I've had a few chats with him now and I have no reason to label him a fake or a troll. I also don't feel his posting history indicates malicious behaviour. He's been quite polite, and elaborated where necessary, especially when he first made statements about the Wii U floating around Xbox 360 power levels. His timeliness with replies is irrelevant given not everybody has the time to spend several hours a day on GAF bending over for a demanding community (his posting history suggests he is not a regular poster at all), and many of these demands seem to come from people frustrated with what he's saying and looking to take him down a peg. Scepticism is warranted, especially before he verified his employment, and though nobody has to believe him at all, the aggressive attacks and belittling is really quite inappropriate, and shows the insecurities of the people attacking moreso than any flaw in what Arkam is saying.

People need a little refresher on what, exactly, he has stated. He openly specified he does not know the final specs, and only the bits and pieces of a recent kit. He clarified, again openly and up front, that by 'less powerful' he means Xbox 360 and PlayStation 3 game would have to be 'scaled back' to run on the Wii U. For specifics, he stated the system features a tri-core out of order CPU, 1GB of 'pretty slow RAM', and a 'decently featured' GPU that 'lacks raw muscle'. He also stated it is 'good and efficient', and that when it ships performance will be 'give or take a little' in the ballpark of the Xbox 360 and PlayStation 3.

He's not once said that the hardware is a blanket downgrade from the 360/PS3. He has not pointed to any specific piece of technology and said "this is worse than the 360". He has not discredited the possibility that some part of the Wii U is superior to current gen systems (if anything he endorsed this). What he said was that porting a 360/PS3 game directly to the Wii U would require scaling back the game due to hardware difficulties, and he gauges this as 'less powerful'.

It is strange that he is the only leak to openly and blatantly claim the hardware is very similar to current generation systems. But again, there are a whole host of reasons he might think this, regardless of whether he is wrong or right.

Those expecting a bit of grunt under the hood should maybe take a step back though, because numerous reports have suggested otherwise. Not just Arkam, but basically everybody other than IGN. We'll see come launch.

 

[boiled goose]

Especially when Iwata has spoken to the fact the hardware gulf was an issue that hurt the Wii long term.

Wii U basically has 2 possible paths. Pretty Similar to the current consoles and banking on their replacements being 2014 and not sooner. If they come sooner Nintendo gets screwed and would rightfully deserve it for being so shortsighted.

or

Wii U is the moderate Upgrade we mostly expect and its in position to be a factor in the next gen of consoles

The question is, which outcome would be funnier? A moderate upgrade is the most boring outcome.

The Wii is a weird one, as compared to last gen there's plenty of grunt under the hood, but not using traditional shaders holds it back, unlike the Xbox which was a mini-PC through and through.

For specifics, he stated the system features a tri-core out of order CPU, 1GB of 'pretty slow RAM', and a 'decently featured' GPU that 'lacks raw muscle'. He also stated it is 'good and efficient', and that when it ships performance will be 'give or take a little' in the ballpark of the Xbox 360 and PlayStation 3.

He's not once said that the hardware is a blanket downgrade from the 360/PS3. He has not pointed to any specific piece of technology and said "this is worse than the 360". He has not discredited the possibility that some part of the Wii U is superior to current gen systems (if anything he endorsed this). What he said was that porting a 360/PS3 game directly to the Wii U would require scaling back the game due to hardware difficulties, and he gauges this as 'less powerful'.

Those expecting a bit of grunt under the hood should maybe take a step back though, because numerous reports have suggested otherwise. Not just Arkam, but basically everybody other than IGN. We'll see come launch.

Sounds like a Wii-like system to me.
Definitely not clearly superior to current gen.
Perceptions are extremely important as evidenced in pretty much every generation. If the WiiU is labeled as a not-gext-gen system at the start, it will be difficult for these first impressions to change.

 

[lednerg]

I see all hell has broken loose in here, lol.

Even if the Wii U ended up being no more 'powerful' than a 360, it wouldn't really matter to me. If it 'only' has around 1GB of RAM, a streamlined architecture, and modern shader support, then fine. Just add Nintendo 1st/2nd party titles and I'll get on board.

How close to 'diminishing returns' do we need to acheive? When you get to the point where adding more and more into a console just basically amounts to less 'jaggies' and some more buildings on screen, then don't even bother. Let the PC guys sperg out over that bullshit. I just want to play video games.

It already takes tens of millions of dollars and multiple years to make games that barely manage to appease graphics whores. If people are honestly expecting nothing but Pixar from the next gen, then have fun bankrupting half the gaming industry and turning the other half into slave labor camps. Say what you will about casuals 'ruining the industry'; at least they're in a sustainable market.

 

[Cookychan]

What. Did. I. Miss?

Spoiler

Everything up until The Boys.

Arkam's back (with a vengeance.)

 

[HylianTom]

My name is HylianTom. I produce 3D data and manipulate it for research purposes. I do this in conjunction with a major electronics company, a well-respected university, and a sizeable federal grant. The mods approved me a long time ago.

All true statements.. but very, very vague.

This is fun!

 

[IceDoesntHelp]

Spoiler

Everything up until The Boys.

Arkam's back (with a vengeance.)

Oh, fair enough. I think she looked great in Oh! but to each his own.

Oh and to stay OT, uhh the Wii U will be great and stuff. Yeah.

 

[Hiltz]

I'm trying to find a recent quote from Iwata. I think it's from January where he says that the Wii U's graphics are in line with the 360 and PS3's.

 

[IceDoesntHelp]

I'm trying to find a recent quote from Iwata. I think it's from January where he says that the Wii U's graphics are in line with the 360 and PS3's.

What the...? I don't see Iwata coming out and saying that..ever.

Spoiler

nor have I ever heard him say it

 

[Instro]

I'm trying to find a recent quote from Iwata. I think it's from January where he says that the Wii U's graphics are in line with the 360 and PS3's.

Hm, can't say I recall anything being said like that.

 

[Lord Ghirahim]

I'm trying to find a recent quote from Iwata. I think it's from January where he says that the Wii U's graphics are in line with the 360 and PS3's.

That never happened though.

 

[Hiltz]

I remember reading it the other day while I was doing a summary of Nintendo's January comments on Wii U. It could have just been stated as such in a press release statement but I'll try to search for it.

 

[IceDoesntHelp]

I swear I remember reading about it.

You have weird dreams man.

 

[Dreamwriter]

Closest I can find is this translation from Miyamoto:

Talking about the Wii U, it is going to be compatible with high-definition TV sets, which are now widespread and, with the graphics capabilities catching up to the general trend, some people consider it to be the "next-generation Wii." On the other hand, as far as graphics capabilities are concerned, there are already other hardware systems with similar functions. Therefore, we have designed the Wii U to be recognized as being different from any other hardware system.

 

[Dreamwriter]

And this from Iwata, though he's talking about software, not hardware:

As we will showcase the Wii U at E3 in June this year, the detailed announcements must wait until then, but we are aiming to make a system which shall not be forced into competing with the others where the contenders can fight only with massive developer resources and long development times as their weapons. Having said that, however, as I mentioned, it is true that, in some software areas, we need to be engaged in the power games. Take The Legend of Zelda franchise, for example, the fans must be looking for the graphic representations that they do not see as cheap at all when the title is released for the Wii U. When it is necessary, we do not hesitate to role out our resources

 

[Smiles and Cries]

The Wii is a weird one, as compared to last gen there's plenty of grunt under the hood, but not using traditional shaders holds it back, unlike the Xbox which was a mini-PC through and through.

As for my own personal opinion on this matter, I don't distrust Arkam. I've had a few chats with him now and I have no reason to label him a fake or a troll. I also don't feel his posting history indicates malicious behaviour. He's been quite polite, and elaborated where necessary, especially when he first made statements about the Wii U floating around Xbox 360 power levels. His timeliness with replies is irrelevant given not everybody has the time to spend several hours a day on GAF bending over for a demanding community (his posting history suggests he is not a regular poster at all), and many of these demands seem to come from people frustrated with what he's saying and looking to take him down a peg. Scepticism is warranted, especially before he verified his employment, and though nobody has to believe him at all, the aggressive attacks and belittling is really quite inappropriate, and shows the insecurities of the people attacking moreso than any flaw in what Arkam is saying.

People need a little refresher on what, exactly, he has stated. He openly specified he does not know the final specs, and only the bits and pieces of a recent kit. He clarified, again openly and up front, that by 'less powerful' he means Xbox 360 and PlayStation 3 game would have to be 'scaled back' to run on the Wii U. For specifics, he stated the system features a tri-core out of order CPU, 1GB of 'pretty slow RAM', and a 'decently featured' GPU that 'lacks raw muscle'. He also stated it is 'good and efficient', and that when it ships performance will be 'give or take a little' in the ballpark of the Xbox 360 and PlayStation 3.

He's not once said that the hardware is a blanket downgrade from the 360/PS3. He has not pointed to any specific piece of technology and said "this is worse than the 360". He has not discredited the possibility that some part of the Wii U is superior to current gen systems (if anything he endorsed this). What he said was that porting a 360/PS3 game directly to the Wii U would require scaling back the game due to hardware difficulties, and he gauges this as 'less powerful'.

It is strange that he is the only leak to openly and blatantly claim the hardware is very similar to current generation systems. But again, there are a whole host of reasons he might think this, regardless of whether he is wrong or right.

Those expecting a bit of grunt under the hood should maybe take a step back though, because numerous reports have suggested otherwise. Not just Arkam, but basically everybody other than IGN. We'll see come launch.

the way you are presenting this in some way making this sound all rational and sensible like... but on a business standpoint it does not sound very good for Nintendo's chances. You don't have to be a rabid fanboy to see that WiiU joining current generation hardware is a cruel joke. It better come out at $149 is the only rational answer to something like this. So let us just blame it on the devkit and walk away slowly. I don't see how Nintendo would get away with passing this off as Next-Gen. We never needed a warning about Wii U not having grunt force or great power but on par with current gen is a mind melting idea to entertain.

 

[stupidvillager]

People need a little refresher on what, exactly, he has stated. He openly specified he does not know the final specs, and only the bits and pieces of a recent kit. He clarified, again openly and up front, that by 'less powerful' he means Xbox 360 and PlayStation 3 game would have to be 'scaled back' to run on the Wii U. For specifics, he stated the system features a tri-core out of order CPU, 1GB of 'pretty slow RAM', and a 'decently featured' GPU that 'lacks raw muscle'. He also stated it is 'good and efficient', and that when it ships performance will be 'give or take a little' in the ballpark of the Xbox 360 and PlayStation 3.

He's not once said that the hardware is a blanket downgrade from the 360/PS3. He has not pointed to any specific piece of technology and said "this is worse than the 360". He has not discredited the possibility that some part of the Wii U is superior to current gen systems (if anything he endorsed this). What he said was that porting a 360/PS3 game directly to the Wii U would require scaling back the game due to hardware difficulties, and he gauges this as 'less powerful'.


Those expecting a bit of grunt under the hood should maybe take a step back though, because numerous reports have suggested otherwise. Not just Arkam, but basically everybody other than IGN. We'll see come launch.

This we know isnt the case though. Every developer has said that they do not have to scale their games back and in some cases look better. Other sources are saying that it is pretty powerful, besides, everybody just links to the same articles. Even Develop who said the whole 2x thing couldnt confirm that but they have sources that say it is substantially more powerful than expected and that echo IGNs 5x claim.

 

[EatChildren]

the way you are presenting this in some way making this sound all rational and sensible like... but on a business standpoint it does not sound very good for Nintendo's chances. You don't have to be a rabid fanboy to see that WiiU joining current generation hardware is a cruel joke. It better come out at $149 is the only rational answer to something like this. So let us just blame it on the devkit and walk away slowly. I don't see how Nintendo would get away with passing this off as Next-Gen. We never needed a warning about Wii U not having grunt force or great power but on par with current gen is a mind melting idea to entertain.

My post was less about the Wii U's specs and how I feel about them, and moreso with how Arkam has presented his information. People are oh so quick to write him off as a uncooperative troll without actually reading what he said and the manner in which he said it. I think he is somewhat mistaken, either due to devkit limitations and/or a miscommunication of hardware details, and still believe the Wii U will edge out current generation systems. But this is irrelevant.

This we know isnt the case though. Every developer has said that they do not have to scale their games back and in some cases look better. Other sources are saying that it is pretty powerful, besides, everybody just links to the same articles. Even Develop who said the whole 2x thing couldnt confirm that but they have sources that say it is substantially more powerful than expected and that echo IGNs 5x claim.

Right, which is why I believe the above. The point is that if people don't want to believe Arkam's information and feel there are inaccuracies then sure, fine, believe and discuss that. But don't attack Arkam himself. He presented his case quite clearly and maturely. Read what he actually posted, and go from there.

 

[RedSwirl]

For $600 all of the original games listed in that post would have to be in the ballpark of Samaritan, or at the very least at the level of what TW2 and BF3 look like on PC.

 

[EDarkness]

This we know isnt the case though. Every developer has said that they do not have to scale their games back and in some cases look better. Other sources are saying that it is pretty powerful, besides, everybody just links to the same articles. Even Develop who said the whole 2x thing couldnt confirm that but they have sources that say it is substantially more powerful than expected and that echo IGNs 5x claim.

This is kind of where I'm at and echos my feeling on the subject. I would accept the idea that other devs were blowing smoke up our ass due to PR BS. Doesn't matter, though. We'll find out soon enough.

 

[royalan]

Wow, walk away from this thread for a few hours and come back to a mini explosion.

 

[IceDoesntHelp]

Wow, walk away from this thread for a few hours and come back to a mini explosion.

Too bad it wasn't any real news ;_;

 

[Smiles and Cries]

Arkam does not deserve attacks at all... we should be thanking him for even sharing a bit of the puzzle. Yet if he is not mistaken or something is wrong with his devkit's info I am sure to be pissed at Nintendo for playing this game again. I am sure not going to support such a thing

 

[TheExplodingHead]

the way you are presenting this in some way making this sound all rational and sensible like... but on a business standpoint it does not sound very good for Nintendo's chances. You don't have to be a rabid fanboy to see that WiiU joining current generation hardware is a cruel joke. It better come out at $149 is the only rational answer to something like this. So let us just blame it on the devkit and walk away slowly. I don't see how Nintendo would get away with passing this off as Next-Gen. We never needed a warning about Wii U not having grunt force or great power but on par with current gen is a mind melting idea to entertain.

Contrary to what you or I would endorse, Nintendo seems to be paving it's roads (business wise) with relatively cheap and "trendy" hardware and ideas. Of course this focus comes at a real cost to us, but it isn't overwhelming factual to imply it comes at a massive risk for Nintendo or business in general. If anything, what it would imply is very little risk (short and long term, easy to recoup costs/generate profit) and very snarky business sense. Which is very Nintendo currently, I personally think the 3DS will be the last time we see Nintendo launch aggressive price wise, at least in the near future.

I'm not a fan of Nintendo as a policy maker or their rationale's for HW/SW and meeting current consumer demands. But the bottom line is a $250 priced Wii U with 360-level power/performance is a very good fiscal bet in 2012, regardless of fans, ports and third parties. Which in my opinion is Nintendo biggest current historical mistake, not taking to absolute priority the wishes and demands of fans, ports, and third parties. But it'll effect us more than them, that's the sad part.

 

[antonz]

Arkam does not deserve attacks at all... we should be thanking him for even sharing a bit of the puzzle. Yet if he is not mistaken or something is wrong with his devkit's info I am sure to be pissed at Nintendo for playing this game again. I am sure not going to support such a thing

Thats my stance on the matter really. Especially after they gave the whole spiel on realizing a serious gap in system power etc led to poor support etc.

If they launch an Xbox 360 in 2012 it will be the first Nintendo console I dont buy.

 

[Smiles and Cries]

Contrary to what you or I would endorse, Nintendo seems to be paving it's roads (business wise) with relatively cheap and "trendy" hardware and ideas. Of course this focus comes at a real cost to us, but it isn't overwhelming factual to imply it comes at a massive risk for Nintendo or business in general. If anything, what it would imply is very little risk (short and long term, easy to recoup costs/generate profit) and very snarky business sense. Which is very Nintendo currently, I personally think the 3DS will be the last time we see Nintendo launch aggressive price wise, at least in the near future.

I'm not a fan of Nintendo as a policy maker or their rationale's for HW/SW and meeting current consumer demands. But the bottom line is a $250 priced Wii U with 360-level power/performance is a very good fiscal bet in 2012, regardless of fans, ports and third parties. Which in my opinion is Nintendo biggest current historical mistake, not taking to absolute priority the wishes and demands of fans, ports, and third parties. But it'll effect us more than them, that's the sad part.

True. The more I read and think about this the more I see Nintendo's DNA in this making it more and more real. I am sure they can get away with a $250 current gen powered WiiU this fall with a lot of fanboy complants but still selling like hotcakes.

So again no "Samaritan" dreams for you, guys!

I was much happier with 4x 360

 

[guek]

True. The more I read and think about this the more I see Nintendo's DNA in this making it more and more real. I am sure they can get away with a $250 current gen powered WiiU this fall with a lot of fanboy complants but still selling like hotcakes.

So again no "Samaritan" dreams for you, guys!

I was much happier with 4x 360

Iwata did say to not expect a cheap console, referencing the wii's launch price specifically.

But I think that was before the 3DS bailout

 

[royalan]

Contrary to what you or I would endorse, Nintendo seems to be paving it's roads (business wise) with relatively cheap and "trendy" hardware and ideas. Of course this focus comes at a real cost to us, but it isn't overwhelming factual to imply it comes at a massive risk for Nintendo or business in general. If anything, what it would imply is very little risk (short and long term, easy to recoup costs/generate profit) and very snarky business sense. Which is very Nintendo currently, I personally think the 3DS will be the last time we see Nintendo launch aggressive price wise, at least in the near future.

I'm not a fan of Nintendo as a policy maker or their rationale's for HW/SW and meeting current consumer demands. But the bottom line is a $250 priced Wii U with 360-level power/performance is a very good fiscal bet in 2012, regardless of fans, ports and third parties. Which in my opinion is Nintendo biggest current historical mistake, not taking to absolute priority the wishes and demands of fans, ports, and third parties. But it'll effect us more than them, that's the sad part.

Nintendo's already facing an uphill battle going into next gen. If the Wii U offers no discernible power advantage over the PS360, I think that hill becomes a mountain. It's going to be next to impossible to sell that console to all but the most hardcore of Nintendo fans, and it's not guaranteed that lightning will strike twice with the casual audience. I think going with an under-powered console twice in a row is a very real financial risk.

 

[Smiles and Cries]

Thats my stance on the matter really. Especially after they gave the whole spiel on realizing a serious gap in system power etc led to poor support etc.

If they launch an Xbox 360 in 2012 it will be the first Nintendo console I dont buy.

THIS is where I am at.

If this proves true, and this is NINTENDO after all... They will try to hype the hell out of the UPad as the next big thing and may even become another crazy game changer. But really I am tired of supporting this type of thing so I hope that MS/SONY copies the Upad at launch of the next gen consoles. I'm sure one of them can find some ways to improve on it.

The best lesson a Nintendo fan can learn is to be a gamer first buy other hardware or invest in decent PCs so you wont miss out on great 3rd Party games. Because Nintendo rides the "special" bus when it comes to hardware

 

[antonz]

THIS is where I am at.

If this proves true, and this is NINTENDO after all... They will try to hype the hell out of the UPad as the next big thing and may even become another crazy game changer. But really I am tired of supporting this type of thing so I hope that MS/SONY copies the Upad at launch of the next gen consoles. I'm sure one of them can find some ways to improve on it.

The best lesson a Nintendo fan can learn is to be a gamer first buy other hardware or invest in decent PCs so you wont miss out on great 3rd Party games. Because Nintendo rides the "special" bus when it comes to hardware

Yeah I accepted the Wii because they were kinda right as far as it being a large transition period for the overall technology window with HDTVs etc. They had good games but in the end they lost out on alot of great games.

I am a PC gamer so I didnt lose out on some of those great games but Nintendo is going to have to go way the hell out of its way to design a system thats basically a 360 and if they do that I have no respect for that decision.

 

[StreetsAhead]

http://andriasang.com/con01b/sakura_smash_bros_research/

I wasn't around for the original 'dojo' but it sounds like a shit storm of terror.

 

[Instro]

I really hope the dojo returns in some form. So much fun.

 

[nordique]

My post was less about the Wii U's specs and how I feel about them, and moreso with how Arkam has presented his information. People are oh so quick to write him off as a uncooperative troll without actually reading what he said and the manner in which he said it. I think he is somewhat mistaken, either due to devkit limitations and/or a miscommunication of hardware details, and still believe the Wii U will edge out current generation systems. But this is irrelevant.



Right, which is why I believe the above. The point is that if people don't want to believe Arkam's information and feel there are inaccuracies then sure, fine, believe and discuss that. But don't attack Arkam himself. He presented his case quite clearly and maturely. Read what he actually posted, and go from there.

This is logical

THIS is where I am at.

If this proves true, and this is NINTENDO after all... They will try to hype the hell out of the UPad as the next big thing and may even become another crazy game changer. But really I am tired of supporting this type of thing so I hope that MS/SONY copies the Upad at launch of the next gen consoles. I'm sure one of them can find some ways to improve on it.

The best lesson a Nintendo fan can learn is to be a gamer first buy other hardware or invest in decent PCs so you wont miss out on great 3rd Party games. Because Nintendo rides the "special" bus when it comes to hardware

This is emotional



Please consider the last several things bg, EatChildren, wsippel, and yes even Arkam have been saying....none of us truly know what the hardware is yet. So just relax. Prepare for the worst but hope for the best. I still think bg's target specs from way back are the most accurate representation because they make the most sense, given what we logically can deviate from rumours and little bits of inside information...not to mention he got a little peak at some info from an early kit. Arkam shouldn't have been flamed so hard because he shared something; not very classy how people shat the internet flames all over him.

More so, given what he said, we should also consider the context of what was said. But that's already been brought up by several posters now.

We shouldn't jump to any rash conclusions.

Is this a common GAF cycle? The raging, collective emotional roller coaster drowning out the few sensible posters? Kinda scary

 

[guek]

Contrary to what you or I would endorse, Nintendo seems to be paving it's roads (business wise) with relatively cheap and "trendy" hardware and ideas. Of course this focus comes at a real cost to us, but it isn't overwhelming factual to imply it comes at a massive risk for Nintendo or business in general. If anything, what it would imply is very little risk (short and long term, easy to recoup costs/generate profit) and very snarky business sense. Which is very Nintendo currently, I personally think the 3DS will be the last time we see Nintendo launch aggressive price wise, at least in the near future.

I'm not a fan of Nintendo as a policy maker or their rationale's for HW/SW and meeting current consumer demands. But the bottom line is a $250 priced Wii U with 360-level power/performance is a very good fiscal bet in 2012, regardless of fans, ports and third parties. Which in my opinion is Nintendo biggest current historical mistake, not taking to absolute priority the wishes and demands of fans, ports, and third parties. But it'll effect us more than them, that's the sad part.

I think you're both right and wrong. The main thing I'd stress is that nintendo isn't dumb. They make mistakes, but through the slew of iwata asks and other interviews, they've always been really good at pointing out where they went wrong and what might be improved. While the wii has seen incredible success in its lifetime, nintendo seems fully aware that it could have turned out even better. Furthermore, they even point directly to the inability to run 3rd party games as a major stumbling block in this generation.

Now, whether or not they intend to ensure 3rd party support in the coming years by putting out a decent box that developers can scale down to or if they feel simply matching the current gen will satisfy developers remains to be seen. Things like Nintendo Network and direct statements from developers lead me to believe that they're going to try to do as much as they can to satisfy the needs of the next generation. Of course that's going to be tempered by nintendo's profitability model and their reluctance to price too high. I really hope they find the right balance.

 

[Hiltz]

And this from Iwata, though he's talking about software, not hardware:

I specifically remember the words "in line" being used to compare Wii U's HD graphics with the Xbox 360 and PS3. This is going to drive me crazy trying to locate the comment.

 

[lordfroakie]

http://andriasang.com/con01b/sakura_smash_bros_research/

I wasn't around for the original 'dojo' but it sounds like a shit storm of terror.

Aww you missed japan time updates. Best one was "walking" and Sonic

 

[Smiles and Cries]

I'm still keeping my fingers and toes crossed for at least 5x as powerful at 360 whatever that means... as long as the WiiU does not fall into this current gen placeholder. Gimmicks be dammed Nintendo makes some great software. So I do wish them well. just not going to support anything less than reasonable this time around.

http://andriasang.com/con01b/sakura_smash_bros_research/

I wasn't around for the original 'dojo' but it sounds like a shit storm of terror.

I thought they would take a vacation or something before they start on that monster
I am not looking forward to JAPAN Time. I have Brawl and don't even play it much because I have no one to play it with. Single player is not as fun in Brawl as it was in older versions.

 

[Jackano]

http://andriasang.com/con01b/sakura_smash_bros_research/

I wasn't around for the original 'dojo' but it sounds like a shit storm of terror.

They did a great job with the website too.
Let's do this again, Masahiro!

 

[StreetsAhead]

They did a great job with the website too.
Let's do this again, Masahiro!

I thought basically revealing every aspect of the game before release was on of the reasons Nintendo titles don't get a 'media blowout' until ~1 month prior to release now.

 

[Smiles and Cries]

This is emotional

I don't play games for logic dude

 

[nordique]

I don't play games for logic dude

fair enough but you know what i mean

no need to overreact when you don't know for sure what is in the kit. don't set yourself up for disappointment, is all I'm getting at

 

[guek]

More so, given what he said, we should also consider the context of what was said. But that's already been brought up by several posters now.

We shouldn't jump to any rash conclusions.

Is this a common GAF cycle? The raging, collective emotional roller coaster drowning out the few sensible posters? Kinda scary

Yeah, it's pretty typical GAF.

Not that the flaming should be excused or anything, but I still feel it could have all been circumvented if he simply better explained the nature of his claims and perhaps his connection with the dev kit, or at least explained why he could seemingly elaborate on some things but not others. Hit and run posting controversial and somewhat befuddling info for an info-starved crowd and then vanishing was bound to lead to a shitstorm.

 

[TheExplodingHead]

Nintendo's already facing an uphill battle going into next gen. If the Wii U offers no discernible power advantage over the PS360, I think that hill becomes a mountain. It's going to be next to impossible to sell that console to all but the most hardcore of Nintendo fans, and it's not guaranteed that lightning will strike twice with the casual audience. I think going with an under-powered console twice in a row is a very real financial risk.

But a lot of this comes down to the assumption that if Nintendo made a uber/moderately-powerful console...it would be a financial blockbuster. Which isn't a clinched argument either. In fact if you're a CEO looking across the spectrum of what's happened since the HD consoles launched (skyrocketing production costs, less focus on gameplay, costs to recoup, risks involved in new ip, risks to entire studis), you might as a conservative CEO come to the conclusion that a huge HW bump isn't ideal for your company long term. That a slight advantage (miniscule performance bumps in practice) over comp is a honest price for a honest service coupled with a new play idea. I think the assertion that a 5-10x power jump would be great for Nintendo, is a fallacy. Just as the power bump in HD consoles in terms of evolving gameplay and ideas, has really gotten us nowhere except prettier pictures. It has not improved performance across the board, we wait longer for loading screens and screen transitions than ever, which is my "true next gen" estimate.

And the "horsepower appetite" is something I think we need to seriously re-examine as gamers and dev's. As it pertains to pictures and IQ, we're far enough that we can focus more on gameplay, art and performance over tech. People who clamor for "real next-gen" have some explaining to do as to how that pertains to what the experience, craft and gameplay will gain from a huge jump in visuals. And what we gain from a market and development burden as well in that environment. So I'm more than willing to except a slight advantage over the 360/PS3, if Nintendo is willing to aggressively pursue features/online/exclusives/third parties and change their thinking as a company to make these things a pillar of their business...not just if it's good for Nintendo, but if not fuck you. They need to make a console that supports everybody, and specs are only a part of that equation probably the smallest and easiest part.

 

[Xellos]

He clarified, again openly and up front, that by 'less powerful' he means Xbox 360 and PlayStation 3 game would have to be 'scaled back' to run on the Wii U.

This is the part that interests me. Assuming this is accurate, what kind of current-gen game would need to be scaled back for Wii U, and why?

 

[antonz]

But a lot of this comes down to the assumption that if Nintendo made a uber/moderately-powerful console...it would be a financial blockbuster. Which isn't a clinched argument either. In fact if you're a CEO looking across the spectrum of what's happened since the HD consoles launched (skyrocketing production costs, less focus on gameplay, costs to recoup, risks involved in new ip, risks to entire studis), you might as a conservative CEO come to the conclusion that a huge HW bump isn't ideal for your company long term. That a slight advantage (miniscule performance bumps in practice) over comp is a honest price for a honest service coupled with a new play idea. I think the assertion that a 5-10x power jump would be great for Nintendo, is a fallacy. Just as the power bump in HD consoles in terms of evolving gameplay and ideas, has really gotten us nowhere except prettier pictures. It has not improved performance across the board, we wait longer for loading screens and screen transitions than ever, which is my "true next gen" estimate.

And the "horsepower appetite" is something I think we need to seriously re-examine as gamers and dev's. As it pertains to pictures and IQ, we're far enough that we can focus more on gameplay, art and performance over tech. People who clamor for "real next-gen" have some explaining to do as to how that pertains to what the experience, craft and gameplay will gain from a huge jump in visuals. And what we gain from a market and development burden as well in that environment. So I'm more than willing to except a slight advantage over the 360/PS3, if Nintendo is willing to aggressively pursue features/online/exclusives/third parties and change their thinking as a company to make these things a pillar of their business...not just if it's good for Nintendo, but if not fuck you. They need to make a console that supports everybody, and specs are only a part of that equation probably the smallest and easiest part.

The issue is 4-5X current gen doesnt break the bank. Thats doable with 4-5 year old technology. If they cut corners and settle for a me too console in 2012 they deserve to fail.

 

[guek]

Only way I'd be excited for a repackaged 360 with a tablet is if it was <$250. Then it's back to PC+Nintendo gaming for me!

This is the part that interests me. Assuming this is accurate, what kind of current-gen game would need to be scaled back for Wii U, and why?

That's the part for me that makes zero sense for me in relation to numerous other dev statements. We've heard plenty of rumors on power ranging from an overclocked 360 to 5x but never to the point where porting would be at all difficult.