What do you mean, no battery?
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Wii U Speculation thread IV: Photoshop rumors and image memes
- Thread starter Sadist
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What do you mean, no battery?
In the case of the latptop, it looses that "portability." It becomes tethered by the power cord, much like the Wii U Pad is tethered to the Wii U to be able to do anything. It's not a perfect example because it's easy to take your battery-less lappy out of your house, you just have to find a socket
GameplayWhore
Member
That was #14601: wsippel, "The latest pad (product id DK-DEV-V5) is wireless. Also looks like Nintendo uses Ni-Fi for the controller now (2.4 or 5GHz), so range shouldn't be limited to a single room - possibly not even just a single floor."
Mostly a bit of speculation there, but it seems reasonable.
Just watch the e3 reel for some ideas.
Informed Gamer perceived value is different from uninformed perceived value from my experience. I was a day 1 adopter of the 3DS. I saw the Value, I was blown away by the 3D, I liked the games coming out, I got Samurai Warriors as my launch game (still my most played game). I like that it was packed in with an SD card. I saw the value. But if I was to go by the 2 commercials the US was circulating at the time of Launch...I would've just thought that it was a DS, with 3D that could not be turned off and downgrade in screen size.
The 3DS would've fared better, IMO if it was communicated correctly. I still have customers to this day, that don't know the 3D can be turned off, they honestly don't know it has multimedia functionality, and that its graphics are indeed better than the DS.
Nintendo hit the Wii out of the park with their Advertising, they made it a catchy commercial and showed off the functionality. The 3DS "It's 3D without the need of Glasses".
Perceived value will come if Nintendo advertises it correctly.
Kacho
Member
Hmm. Is that one of the reasons why handheld gaming devices are so popular in Japan? If so, the Wii U has huge potential over there.
It's the rest of the world I'm concerned about. The console market isn't even that big in japan these days.
I thought so just didn't want to go dig through the thread. Thanks.
Have you never played a DS? It's honestly the same concept. I remember when the DS was announced there were a lot of articles saying how the mind cant comprehend 2 competing images at the same time. Honestly with most games, I wouldnt be surprised, yet would not mind, if the controller screen was simply used for HUD and real time item switching without pausing the game. That alone does wonders for almost any Genre.
it was kinda funny that the ds was derided for having two screens when one screen would just be a map screen and the other would be the game, but it wound up actually being pretty useful.AGITΩ;37454100 said:
not that that was how most games were, but the castlevania games certainly benefited from this.
That trailer didn't really inspire confidence.
AGITΩ;37454100 said:
I have played the DS and loved it, but on the DS you barely have to look away to see the other screen, so you can just keep playing your game. Aside from professor Layton I can't really remember any game that I say became better for having it. Also, having to look away from the tv to your controller only seems disorienting.
Agent Unknown
Member
It wouldn't be so bad if the article was titled more like "How much more will Wii U cost?" but of course IGN's gotta troll and pretend this is a burgeoning crisis of some kind for Nintendo. Seriously miss Matt and Craig.
To be honest, a good 95% of my handheld gaming is in my apartment. Portability still has it's uses (kids on long car trips), but I just don't see myself getting into a major game on a crowded bus, on a lunch hour, etc. Maybe simple stuff like Words With Friends or a round of Bejeweled (that's where my 5% comes in).
I see it taking off in Japan. Drawing conclusions on what others have said, many Japanese only have 1 TV or limited space so this is an ideal solution for families there. It's also cool for ADD individuals such as myself. In the U.S. it has a good chance too, I just hope that they take into account large houses in America, where the living room may not be near a bedroom. I'm sure there will be limits, but hopefully they really look into that because range could be a make-or-break feature in America.
i agree, but nothing in it IIRC is just showing a menu on the subscreen.
GameplayWhore
Member
I'm still stuck in the single screen portable ghetto. What did it do in particular?
never really encountered that many DS games with just the map screen at the bottom as the best games used it in conjuction with an inventory system
It's almost like IGN is saying, "Hey.. here's your daily reminder of how much we suck since those guys left." Enjoy!
Ace Attorney games benefited from a second screen.
idk... i think ghost trick would've been a better example since AA plays well on both the iPhone and the GBA... and the PC tbh.
The distance your eyes have to travel really isn't any more significant from the DS. I'd also think that its less disorienting to look at your map/inventory on the Pad screen than to pause the game and break immersion. There's still other practical uses, like extra buttons for example. Obviously you also have the streaming stuff which seems like it would be useful if you ever want to use the TV for something else.
Also there are plenty of games that use 2 screens well. TWEWY for example does it in an incredibly unique way and is considered one of the best games from the last few years.
handheld gaming is a very immersive experience compared to playing games on a tv.
if i had to guess, the more introverted people would favor playing on the wii u controller compared to playing on the tv if they had a choice of the same game!!!
some games used the two screens in conjunction with each other. the world ends with you might be the most popular game of this type, where you used the touch screen to fight on the bottom screen and the buttons to perform moves on the top screen (which was a different part of the fight). it's kinda hard to describe without seeing it and i didn't particularly like twewy.
many other games used the bottom screen as an input-center only. managing inventory and stuff like that. it freed up the top screen to be its own thing. most games did this, especially rpgs.
then in the case of 999, it was used in a completely original and fantastic way and at the time, it was the only system that game could have actually been made on. i don't know of anything else like it, but it was pretty imaginative.
of course there were other smaller things. actually closing the system was used to solve puzzles in about three separate games, from what i can remember. and other developers used the two screens to have more room to play with (yoshi's island ds, the sonic rush games, contra 4, and others). that's something that won't translate well to the wii u though.
Just put the map on controller and I will appreciate wholeheartedly.
Last time when AC3 was announced there was a discussion on how to use controller. And please Ubi don't try some "fancy new ideas" (they usually turn out to be bad) just put the map on the controller consistently then I will be a happy happy gamer.
Checking map is soooo tedious when I play AC2 on my PS3, and the loading time ahhhh...
And Oot 3DS definitely has superior control schemes, everything on the bottom screen nice and clean.
Last time when AC3 was announced there was a discussion on how to use controller. And please Ubi don't try some "fancy new ideas" (they usually turn out to be bad) just put the map on the controller consistently then I will be a happy happy gamer.
Checking map is soooo tedious when I play AC2 on my PS3, and the loading time ahhhh...
And Oot 3DS definitely has superior control schemes, everything on the bottom screen nice and clean.
AceBandage
Banned
Speaking of the whole two screen aspect....
WE NEED A NEW EBA ON THE WII U!
It would be amazing!
WE NEED A NEW EBA ON THE WII U!
It would be amazing!
Considering it wouldn't (shouldn't) be a graphically intensive game, I think the uPad should show the same thing that the main screen would show, so that other people in the room can watch the animations/dancing/cutscenes with ease while you play. There could also be Wiimote co-op for them to simply click on "bonus" cursors that only appear on the TV to add bonus points to your score.
but doesn't having a map screen at all times with all the pointer marks make the game it into a liner experience.
like you feel you just going from point a to point b.
Gahiggidy
My aunt & uncle run a Mom & Pop store, "The Gamecube Hut", and sold 80k WiiU within minutes of opening.
A big problem with that is the nature of the controller means you are not necessarily holding it in a position for the camera to pick up the sensor bar (held flat). Alot of the time the player will be holding it up with the IR thingy pointed at the ceiling. This is especially true when using the controller screen as a "free-look". So, in the end I think an IR camera would not be of much use.
* Simply having the clutter removed from the screen will be nice enough for most games.
* Inventory management via touch screen will be convenient.
* Streaming a full game with no TV will be nice. Or apps like Words With Friends.
* Touch screen only games like Angry Birds now become possible on consoles.
* Drawing games and apps, custom logo creations in-game via stylus control.
* Flinging things on the screen like the throwing star demo.
* Seeing a different, additional viewpoint like the golf demo or a rearview mirror in a driving game.
* Additional / alternate buttons mapped to touch pad.
* Hold the Wii U pad up to TV level to see hidden things, like the Mii Shooting demo. Another example would be walking into a dark room in a survivor horror game and using the Wii U as a flashlight / night vision.
Will it be a must have feature for most console games? No. But it will be unique and differentiate the Wii U from the competition.
Gahiggidy said:
But supposing I'm right about what that black square is on the top of the tablet, players would often be naturally pointing that directly at the screen. Still not sure what else that thing could be.
Shazam! That would be awesome - Elite Beat Agents is my favorite DS game.
Never played GT and I haven't played AA on those devices. I just know that I used both screens constantly while playing the series on the DS.
GameplayWhore
Member
The closing thing was in Zelda, I remember. Thank you for the info, but I was curious about what Castlevania did with it, since you singled it out earlier. But now that I read it, it looks like you were saying that it used the map on bottom screen method, which suited it well. I misread it earlier, then (S-ranking a class group project really takes it out of you).
Holy crap, I need to find that whatchamacallit that live-updates GAF and delivers post notifications. I remember hearing about it, and it'd make reviewing this thread so much easier. So, without further ado, I'm going to resurrect the Japan topic AGAIN.
No, they really don't. The only "perception problem" in Japan is "where are the types of games I played on my PS2? I want those too." This isn't a perception problem, this is a reality of the conditions of this generation, nothing more.
Sony didn't WIN developer support, they inherited it, as I previously explained. Why wouldn't developers bet on the market leader instead of the low-selling Nintendo?
It wasn't about the power, it was about the money and resources sunk into exploiting that power that weren't invested AT ALL in motion controls (because for those who forget, motion control in modern games was BRAND NEW at the time and few people really knew what to do with them except Nintendo)
Also, Japanese developers aren't really used to developing for such WILDLY different platforms. The generation before, the only wild difference between the two competing Japanese platforms was disc size and the GameCube controller's button layout.
First off, Sony WON developer support once. They've merely inherited it twice.
Tales games sell like shit under the best of conditions when compared to their competition, so using that as an example is a bit silly.
As for the "niche" developers, I will explain this the only way I can:
"Niche gamers" : Japan :: "Hardcore gamers" : the West
With one notable exception... niche gamers are outliers in the industry there. These niche gamers bought a PS3 because Lightning was their waifu. And when you have a group that dedicated that you KNOW owns a PS3 for that reason alone, it makes it easier to justify shelf space at retailers for your titles, which they would have to struggle to get the same space in the Wii section.
Niche gamers DO, however, buy a much larger library of titles than the average gamer in Japan. Hence why some games that hold a more niche-oriented appeal, like the Tales series, sell better on a system with more niche gamer ownership.
No, Konami is in business because they own real estate companies and fitness clubs, their primary revenue generator. They still makes games because it's their legacy, no matter how BAD they are at it right now. Like Sony and its portable music devices... how long was it before they gave up that ghost?
As stated, casual and core divide doesn't exist there. Even casual players play core content there in semi-large doses.
Yeah, you said it so I didn't have to.
----------
And now to take a shot across the port bow.
Saying someone at Giant Bomb knows about a WiiU name change is like saying an atheist can give you directions to Heaven,
Considering the assumptions people make about Nintendo already without anything to justify them, I think this article was necessary. I mean, people shat all over the Nintendo Network announcement, and now LOOK AT IT, it's got some of the greatest praise for its handling of DLC in Fire Emblem, of digital distribution of day-1 retail titles for the the first time.... people would use the lack of this being explicitly stated as confirmation that it wouldn't happen, just so they could say "this FUCKING company" or "it's Nintendo".
No, they really don't. The only "perception problem" in Japan is "where are the types of games I played on my PS2? I want those too." This isn't a perception problem, this is a reality of the conditions of this generation, nothing more.
Sony didn't WIN developer support, they inherited it, as I previously explained. Why wouldn't developers bet on the market leader instead of the low-selling Nintendo?
It wasn't about the power, it was about the money and resources sunk into exploiting that power that weren't invested AT ALL in motion controls (because for those who forget, motion control in modern games was BRAND NEW at the time and few people really knew what to do with them except Nintendo)
Also, Japanese developers aren't really used to developing for such WILDLY different platforms. The generation before, the only wild difference between the two competing Japanese platforms was disc size and the GameCube controller's button layout.
First off, Sony WON developer support once. They've merely inherited it twice.
Tales games sell like shit under the best of conditions when compared to their competition, so using that as an example is a bit silly.
As for the "niche" developers, I will explain this the only way I can:
"Niche gamers" : Japan :: "Hardcore gamers" : the West
With one notable exception... niche gamers are outliers in the industry there. These niche gamers bought a PS3 because Lightning was their waifu. And when you have a group that dedicated that you KNOW owns a PS3 for that reason alone, it makes it easier to justify shelf space at retailers for your titles, which they would have to struggle to get the same space in the Wii section.
Niche gamers DO, however, buy a much larger library of titles than the average gamer in Japan. Hence why some games that hold a more niche-oriented appeal, like the Tales series, sell better on a system with more niche gamer ownership.
No, it hasn't. Sales in Japan are but a pittance of development budgets at this point and should be much MUCH stronger overall.
No, Konami is in business because they own real estate companies and fitness clubs, their primary revenue generator. They still makes games because it's their legacy, no matter how BAD they are at it right now. Like Sony and its portable music devices... how long was it before they gave up that ghost?
As stated, casual and core divide doesn't exist there. Even casual players play core content there in semi-large doses.
Yeah, you said it so I didn't have to.
----------
And now to take a shot across the port bow.
Saying someone at Giant Bomb knows about a WiiU name change is like saying an atheist can give you directions to Heaven,
Considering the assumptions people make about Nintendo already without anything to justify them, I think this article was necessary. I mean, people shat all over the Nintendo Network announcement, and now LOOK AT IT, it's got some of the greatest praise for its handling of DLC in Fire Emblem, of digital distribution of day-1 retail titles for the the first time.... people would use the lack of this being explicitly stated as confirmation that it wouldn't happen, just so they could say "this FUCKING company" or "it's Nintendo".
-Pyromaniac-
Member
I'm honestly not even in the mood, just know that I deeply disagree with just about everything you said, up to and including Konami being in gaming because they own fitness centres and shit.
Just know it
And if you can't see how much japanese support PS3 got then you're flat out blind, simple as that. But I'll give guek the benefit of the doubt and assume he never looked into it much and wouldn't know. But they did get more japanese support. Lots more.
As for the reasons why, it's all semantics, point is they had it, and currently have it, and if the trajectory is pointing in any direction, it's them continuing to have it.
Just know it
And if you can't see how much japanese support PS3 got then you're flat out blind, simple as that. But I'll give guek the benefit of the doubt and assume he never looked into it much and wouldn't know. But they did get more japanese support. Lots more.
As for the reasons why, it's all semantics, point is they had it, and currently have it, and if the trajectory is pointing in any direction, it's them continuing to have it.
It looks like Walmart's running Goggle ads that list the Wii U at $349. Apparently, it did the same for Wii before the official price was announced. Who knows, it could still end up being $299.
http://wiiudaily.com/2012/04/walmart-sets-wii-u-price-at-350/
http://wiiudaily.com/2012/04/walmart-sets-wii-u-price-at-350/
I'm a little LTTP on this but did anyone else notice this in that IGN article:
LOLWUT???
Edit: I did some Googling and found some other sites which believe NFC can be used for AR. Huh? How can a communications technology with a practical range of 4 cm (1.57 inches) be used for AR?
GameplayWhore
Member
Well…
In the film Aliens, they had these little hand-held motion trackers that they occasionally turned their head towards. It didn't just appear in front of their face when they hit a button. They actually looked at it, and the rest of the world didn't pause around them or entirely disappear. Coincidentally, there's an Aliens game coming out. Instead of clicking a button and having the TV reorient your view so that it's looking down, you can actually just do what the people in the movie did and turn your head, because you know where the object with the motion tracking is. This is probably less disorienting that the television's POV rotating downward.
But I would like to add that there is a camera facing you, embedded in the top of the controller. It is capable of tracking your face. This means that it knows when you're looking down. Want to be bad ass Leon shooting the shit out of zombies? Well, the zombies no longer stop and wait for you when you want to play around with your briefcase like in RE4. And your guns no longer hover bizarrely in front of you like in RE5. Instead, having to turn away from the main view is a game mechanic. You have to take the risk of looking away and having only your peripheral vision looking at the TV while you try to figure out how to get a shotgun, a revolver, a pistol, six rounds of ammunition, and three herbs to fit together in a limited space (this here is actually a pretty good use of the touch screen, too), and the longer you wait, the bigger the chance that a monster will be there when you look up.
But, OH WAIT! Remember that camera detecting your face? Well, Capcom's programmers are dicks. Whenever they detect that you're looking down, they can at their leisure program a monster to creep up on you in the hopes that it can strike while you're not paying attention! Congratulations! Your reward for OCD is more frequent death!
Or you could put the BS graphicwhorey crap on the TV and just put the actual game of whatever you're playing on the DRC. That way, you can play the game, while the casuals can goggle at the fancy colours and sparkly lights on the TV.
Or in a scenario where two to four controllers can be streamed to at once, we have pretty much the only possible scenario in a local multiplayer game where it's possible to hide information from your opponents. Yeah, they might be able to figure out where you are by looking at your view in your corner of the screen, but they can no longer see your health or your gun/ammo layout or your radar or any number of critical information that might give them an unfair advantage.
Well, if just there being two screens to pay attention to isn't really enough for you, perhaps attend to the fact that the two screens are dramatically different. One is a large screen suited for a vast action field, while the other is smaller and has the capability to be more intimately interacted with.
Enter "Viral Attack!", a biological action puzzle game: The playing field on the TV starts sparsely filled with innocent cells. Over time, viruses of various shapes appear and start moving towards the cells. The viruses have simple, well defined shapes (many viruses in real life actually do, as they often have quasi-crystalline structure to them). Use the DRC to draw an "antibody" of the proper matched shape and "launch" it to the television screen, where you can use the analog directional and buttons to encapsulate each virus, preventing them from attaching to cells.
For each level, there is a bar indicating how healthy this area of the body is. If the health goes down to zero as viruses take over more and more cells, then you lose the game. If you destroy the viruses before health is depleted, you win the level and can go to the next stage, which contains more viruses, or fewer cells, or a wider variety of different virus shapes to defeat"
Or there's always the opportunity to bring the realm of Role Playing Games (and I mean Role Playing Games, the real kind, not the "jrpg" or "wrpg" or "arpg" where you're in an action-adventure with stats but never actually do any role playing. I'm talking about that social activity where you get together with friends and one describes a scenario and the others have to think their way out of it to a victorious ending. Well, the asymmetric nature of the one-DRC Wii U can work very well to digitize the classic RPG experience. The Game Master has the screen and can use it to dynamically create characters, type up bios, draw up locales and battle maps. The regular players use their remotes or classic controllers to move around on the TV playfield as the GM flicks monsters or NPCs to kill or interact with (or interact with then kill
or kill then interact with
Of course, the drawable nature of the screen makes it likely very good for making artwork, but what's the point of making great art
penises
Back to games, one of the ideas I was playing around with a few days ago is Spy Assasin: A stealth/action game not entirely unlikely like MGS (let's face it, Koji's not gonna bring it to the platform anyway). One of your primary tools is a mobile, hovering spycam. It works not unlike the one in (I think it was) Perfect Dark, except that the camera view is on the DRC while your normal player view is retained on the TV screen (eliminating a pretty major problem with that type of item). If the accelerometers are involved, then you could even continue to use the normal controls for your character on the TV (thus being able to continue evading enemies) while simple tilting can control the forward/backward and left/right rotation of the spycam).
It would be an interesting challenge to have to pay attention to both the feedback you're getting back from the handheld screen controlling your spycam while monitoring what's happening around your real body whenever possible and even controlling it at the same time. In real life, I do this all the time. I used to go for long walks during my lunch break from work while reading e-books. It was a really interesting experience, dodging things that I happened to notice in my peripheral vision at the last possible second while absorbing the incredible works of Terry Pratchett. This general idea is much like the Aliens game, I should note, but it involves simultaneous control in a way which I believe to be possible.
But then, there's also the fact that it might be nice to have a permanent top-view when you're running around in a 3D platformer. It would be much more disorienting to hit a button and have it switch the TV itself to a new perspective just for half a second of getting your character positioned just right, so I think it'd be nicer to just have the other perspective always there on the screen in your hands, especially since it's a facing-down view, and your controller's screen will pretty much be facing down, something that probably cannot be said of your television set.
I thought it would also be kind of interesting in a scenario involving two Display Remote Controllers (if this were possible) to have a "gun and shield" game where you have your DRC strapped to your hand in a way that it's facing your opponent. The two of you try to aim your Wii Remotes at each other, while trying to block the others' aim using the DRC. See, this would work because the DRC has a sensor strip on it, so the Wii U would be able to tell if it's close enough to the Wii Remote's center of aiming to be considered a "block". And then the DRC's screen could simply display something like a basic colour to let the opponent know if they're hitting or missing or even doing substantial damage. The TV could show the fight in a more cinematic manner for any guests watching the fight and wanting to see the lazer beams and electro-shield sparkliness in action.
But I guess mixing genres could be interesting. In a twist on "Pilotwings", a concept that I call Base Jumper Action Sim has you base jumping from orbit in your space marine armor (or perhaps just gliding down to the surface in a busted spacecraft). You can handle the heat of the fiery (and really impressively rendered) thermosphere, but you will not handle the landing. On the television screen, you control yourself as you nudge towards the area you wish to land (lunar-lander style, but in an above-viewish cover-shooter style perspective. On the DRC… is a remote, touchscreen RTS/sim where you have to quickly gather and assemble components to build a machine that can catch you when you finally approach the surface.
To make the television part less boring, maybe add in an action element. Every once in a while, there are things to avoid or shoot. So you have to simultaneously stay alive in the sky while preventing your seemingly inevitable demise on the ground.
But there are, I guess, a other potentially nice aspects to having one mobile screen and one static screen. Psychic Prey is a conceptual single player quasi-horror game. You are being hunted. Your character is psychic in that it can see through the eyes of the creature hunting it. You control yourself running around in a town/forest/maze/etc via the television screen in third-person, Zelda-style, and you can see the creature's progress from its point of view (like the invisible things in Evil Dead II) on the controller screen. The creature is unstoppable, and it will kill you unless you escape. Use the DRC as a way to guess where the creature is and how close it might be to you while moving your guy on the TV to hunt for an exit or tools that can help you to escape.
As I said back in #12425: There, you go. Happy already?
This is a small fraction of the ideas that have been set forth. They might all suck for all I know. Except for the one about split screen private info, that idea is gold no matter what.
edit:
tl;dr:
sometimes having to look away from the main action can be a useful game mechanic
sometimes, it's nice that the two screens have dramatically different roles (one can be written on, the other is a huge playfield)
sometimes, you need to have private information that other players in the game cannot see
sometimes, it might be possible to technically play two games at once if neither require insane attention resources
sometimes, a downward-facing view or looking at a physical object in your hand is less disorienting if you actually lower your head to look down instead of commanding the TV POV to rotate downward
GameplayWhore
Member
AR doesn't have to mean "overlaying a screen on a camera view". In their context, it means "using a real life object to interact with a game.
boiled goose
good with gravy
Yeah, I saw that trailer. I didn't realize that was categorized as AR. It can only work with things it can identify and can only present a "canned" (preprogrammed) image of them. Doesn't really seem like AR to me. It's just an alternative to typing in the name of the object manually (or picking it from a list). Oh well. Guess I need to "augment" my understanding of AR.
Thanks for explaining.
Edit:
Thanks. I should have Googled before posting. Lesson learned.
GameplayWhore
Member
Granted, I know that I'm giving them the benefit of the doubt. Every example given of AR in the Wikipedia entry is the definition that you were thinking of.
bgassassin
Member
I would be down for a Star Fox or Star Fox 64 remake for Wii U.
C'mon, man, we just got one for the 3DS.
Agent Unknown
Member
:O @ the supposed Walmart pricing info.
"Groovy technical gizmos"? What painfully childish writing. Is Colin Campbell always like this? And why didn't Rich George or Audrey write this piece since they're the Nintendo editors?
"Groovy technical gizmos"? What painfully childish writing. Is Colin Campbell always like this? And why didn't Rich George or Audrey write this piece since they're the Nintendo editors?
bgassassin
Member
I don't care for handhelds so I didn't experience that.
Gahiggidy
My aunt & uncle run a Mom & Pop store, "The Gamecube Hut", and sold 80k WiiU within minutes of opening.
Leading a group of Hocotate pilgrims who are there to colonize the Pikmin planet.
oh my - do want !!!
one of the comments
"Nintendo doesn't have what it takes to do anything this badass."
Nintendo: **challenge accepted**
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