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[BurntPork]

I am talking about the Wii U screen controller.

And what should they make in its place? Also why do you hate it? If you say "bulky" or "uncomfortable", get out until you read some impressions.

You're still chicken littling about something we are only speculating on.

We don't know what kind of power is under the hood of even the WiiU, let alone the Loop. If its even a half step from the PS3, you're still looking at something that should (if the engines are built to be scalable) play all of the other two consoles games. With compromises sure. But 720p and 30fps isn't a huge burden to bear. Sure hasn't hurt the 360.

Wii U won't get 720p and 30FPS because that's what the other consoles will get. When XB3 gets a 720p 30FPS game, Wii U will get a 540p 25FPS game, for example.

 

[Gaborn]

And what should they make in its place? Also why do you hate it? If you say "bulky" or "uncomfortable", get out until you read some impressions.

Fuck impressions, I want him to watch the Ghost Recon Online segment from the Ubisoft round table and say that. I haven't heard ONE PERSON having watched that video segment come back and not see the point to it.

 

[BurntPork]

Fuck impressions, I want him to watch the Ghost Recon Online segment from the Ubisoft round table and say that. I haven't heard ONE PERSON having watched that video segment come back and not see the point to it.

... Then why didn't you post it?

 

[Javier]

And what should they make in its place? Also why do you hate it? If you say "bulky" or "uncomfortable", get out until you read some impressions.

I find it hilarious that you demand for impressions on something we at least know something about, yet you have no problem making up these silly "DOOMED" scenarios with no backup whatsoever.

 

[Gaborn]

... Then why didn't you post it?

True. Here

 

[PetrCobra]

Yeah, post it, I want to watch it for the third time (seriously)

Edit: oh great, thank you

 

[Thunder Monkey]

And what should they make in its place? Also why do you hate it? If you say "bulky" or "uncomfortable", get out until you read some impressions.


Wii U won't get 720p and 30FPS because that's what the other consoles will get. When XB3 gets a 720p 30FPS game, Wii U will get a 540p 25FPS game, for example.

OH NO!

Well that just ruined the generation for me and the millions that played CoD on the 360.

 

[BurntPork]

OH NO!

Well that just ruined the generation for me and the millions that played CoD on the 360.

CoD runs at 60FPS, which improves the experience enough that it doesn't matter. If CoD ran at 15-25FPS, it would not be a popular game at all.

 

[blu]

You're forgetting something VERY important. Witcher 2 runs at 1080p+ at 60FPS with AA and high-end DX11 effects on PC, while the 360 version is 720p (or even less, since I'm not really sure) with no AA at 30FPS. A situation like this would have Wii U running the game at SD resolutions on the equivalent of lowest settings on PC. And gets even worse than that. What happens to 600p CoD? We might end up seeing Wii U games that run at sub-480p! The gap is power really does matter and it will cause ports to sell so horribly that they'll stop coming after a year or two.

Are you pulling a Roger Kint on us, Burnt?

 

[monome]

Can adding a more powerful graphics solution and a bigger pool of ram be a feasible thing to do to prevent WiiU from not getting on-par ports of next-gen games?
Or the sillicon used in WiiU is already so customized that late in the planning spec bumps are out ouf the question.

I don't mean they would change partners, but could they for exemple make a bigger box to accomodate more sillicon power?

They could trim down the box later in the life cycle.

But a new XBOX getting out at the same time as WiiU is a living nightmare for Nintendo if developpers choose not to downport their games. And what would reviewers say about lagging behind WiiU versions of COD games? WiiUmote is cool but graphics, performance, online are what people care about.

 

[Thunder Monkey]

Are you pulling a Roger Kint on us, Burnt?

At this point I'm honestly not sure.

It's getting kind of irritating though. And I should know. Few are better at irritation than me.

 

[m.i.s.]

watch the Ghost Recon Online segment from the Ubisoft round table and say that. I haven't heard ONE PERSON having watched that video segment come back and not see the point to it.

Yeah, I saw it. I just didn't like it.

That's not to say I'm not sold on a controller on a screen idea. It's just that the concept has been explored before in a limited form and it just didn't capture the imagination of the masses of people out there.

 

[BurntPork]

I find it hilarious that you demand for impressions on something we at least know something about, yet you have no problem making up these silly "DOOMED" scenarios with no backup whatsoever.

You mean other than the confirmation that it's underpowered? -.-

Are you pulling a Roger Kint on us, Burnt?

Who?

At this point I'm honestly not sure.

It's getting kind of irritating though. And I should know. Few are better at irritation than me.

But this thread would be so much more boring without me encouraging discussion!

 

[Thunder Monkey]

You mean other than the confirmation that it's underpowered? -.-


Who?


But this thread would be so much more boring without me encouraging discussion!

Have you ever smoked pot?

I think it could either help or exacerbate your current mental state.

It stopped me from becoming a complete schizophrenic mess. Mileage may vary.

 

[walking fiend]

I guess Wii U being underpowered, or to say it better, other consoles being $500+ consoles, won't hurt Wii U really.

In a situation that there's no price difference, I guess a lot of current owners will chose the successor of their current system. But if Wii U get's out being cheaper than the others, it won't be that clear. A lot of those who are currently buying cheap 360s and PS3s may also move there, but not if Wii U is not cheap, or only as cheap as other consoles

 

[monome]

Have you ever smoked pot?

I think it could either help or exacerbate your current mental state.

It stopped me from becoming a complete schizophrenic mess. Mileage may vary.

Clearly Nintendo is following Thunder Monkey's train of thought, they have figs in their respectable japanese rectums.

Who wants another underpowered Nintendo console?

 

[walking fiend]

Clearly Nintendo is following Thunder Monkey's train of thought, they have figs in their respectable japanese rectums.

Who wants another underpowered Nintendo console?

Who want's a Nintendo that sustain loss for 80% of the next gen?

 

[BurntPork]

Nintendo's biggest issue is their lack of an account-based system. It'll make it hard for them to keep customers.

 

[monome]

Who want's a Nintendo that sustain loss for 80% of the next gen?

I do!
I love Nintendo <3 but if they cannot produce harware on par with MS and SONY, cannot create a compelling online experience themselves (or not buying a competent company to do so), cannot make a sexy design console (more white fridges?) then I could not care less for their results. Their IPs will end up somewhere anyway.

 

[codhand]

All they need is a first party lineup, in HD, at launch and they can take my currency.

 

[Donnie]

Yeah, but they'll need to do that to work on PS4 and XB3 after two years. The gap in power might cause the graphics to be downgraded too much for third-parties to bother. Also, I highly doubt that Epic will put UE4 on Wii U.

They'll put Unreal Engine 4 on Iphone/Android, which will take a hell of a lot more downgrading then for WiiU.

 

[monome]

All they need is a first party lineup, in HD, at launch and they can take my currency.

Mario Kart HD at launch is a no-no since its next year.
Mario Galaxy HD is a no-no with mario Land just out.

Possible showcase could be :

Yoshi's story HD, sluuuurrrrpppp
Metroid HD, but if launched next christmas it will probably be raped by COD and HALO
Pikmin HD, hardly a system seller (sorry)

So...

 

[Gaborn]

Nintendo's biggest issue is their lack of an account-based system. It'll make it hard for them to keep customers.

I would say that's their biggest current issue. It's impossible to know if that issue will remain with the Wii U. I'm not saying I'm hopeful for a fix but I wouldn't be surprised either, that has to be something third parties have been telling Nintendo.

 

[Donnie]

I was wondering how powerful will the Wii U be... considering in terms of graphics power Nintendo seem to be 1 generation behind...

Nintendo Wii = PS2
Nintendo 3DS = PSP
Nintendo Wii U = Xbox 360/PS3?

Nintendo Wii and 3DS are quite a bit more powerful than PS2/PSP, but I suppose they're much closer to that generation than the next (especially since XBox was also that same gen). WiiU will be significantly more powerful than 360/PS3, and much closer to next gen than Wii was. However we don't know exactly how close at the moment.

 

[LegendofJoe]

I do!
I love Nintendo <3 but if they cannot produce harware on par with MS and SONY, cannot create a compelling online experience themselves (or not buying a competent company to do so), cannot make a sexy design console (more white fridges?) then I could not care less for their results. Their IPs will end up somewhere anyway.

Less competition is a bad thing, unless you work for Sony or MS it's stupid to root for Nintendo to fail.

 

[BurntPork]

Mario Kart HD at launch is a no-no since its next year.
Mario Galaxy HD is a no-no with mario Land just out.

Possible showcase could be :

Yoshi's story HD, sluuuurrrrpppp
Metroid HD, but if launched next christmas it will probably be raped by COD and HALO
Pikmin HD, hardly a system seller (sorry)

So...

Why would it compete with CoD or Halo? You must be lying about liking Nintendo if you made a comment that stupid.

 

[Fantastical]

Mario Kart HD at launch is a no-no since its next year.
Mario Galaxy HD is a no-no with mario Land just out.

Possible showcase could be :

Yoshi's story HD, sluuuurrrrpppp
Metroid HD, but if launched next christmas it will probably be raped by COD and HALO
Pikmin HD, hardly a system seller (sorry)

So...

Nintendo was showing New Super Mario Bros Mii at E3 last year. I would be very surprised if that is not a launch game (or close to it). You seem to discount a Mario game because Mario Land 3D came out this year, but Nintendo put out New Super Mario Bros Wii in November 2009 and Galaxy 2 in May 2010.

EDIT: But I suppose the Galaxy team made Mario Land 3D Land, right? So you probably have a point about Galaxy HD.

 

[Thunder Monkey]

Clearly Nintendo is following Thunder Monkey's train of thought, they have figs in their respectable japanese rectums.

Who wants another underpowered Nintendo console?

I'm of the mindset that visuals are close to last on a long line of checklists I must fill to buy a console.

First and foremost it must have games that make my nether regions tingle. That's why the Wii was the first console I bought this gen.

 

[HylianTom]

Less competition is a bad thing, unless you work for Sony or MS it's stupid to root for Nintendo to fail.

Rooting for Nintendo to fail is a old, old hobby for some. They'll never learn.

 

[herzogzwei1989]

I just cannot wait to see my favorite Nintendo IPs in HD. I've been waiting since 2005 when Xbox 360 launched.

 

[fabricated backlash]

And if I were Nintendo, I would money-hat, either with publishing deals, or straight up start up cash, to get that young (or old) creative pool of indie game designers to go nuts with the tablet. Because most mainstream third parties will not simply go that extra mile to support innovation if they cannot reap the $$$ right back.

That is why Nintendo had no choice but to introduce the controller even when their hardware was not really ready. They had to give those third parties time to contemplate ideas for the controller.

I think so too. But I think what's more important is that Nintendo needs consumers to get the idea and to demand creative implementations of the screen beyond the usual map and inventory bullshit.
3rd parties are going to complain like the little bitches they are, about how the WiiU audience isn't reacting to their innovative menu on screen implementation. You've seen it with Wii countless times. Then one company gets a runaway hit (Rabbids, Just Dance) and everyone and their dog runs in that direction.

Really my oppinion on 3rd parties being creatively bankrupt (at least in the projects they greenlight) is solidifying itself even more these days.

 

[Man God]

There has been something crazy like 5 Mario games in 5 years on the DS/Wii.

New Super Mario Bros. 2006
Super Mario Galaxy 2007
New Super Mario Bros. Wii 2009
Super Mario Galaxy 2010
Super Mario 3D Land 2011

Pretty sure if they wanted to they could have a game ready for Wii U's launch.

 

[Thunder Monkey]

I think so too. But I think what's more important is that Nintendo needs consumers to get the idea and to demand creative implementations of the screen beyond the usual map and inventory bullshit.
3rd parties are going to complain like the little bitches they are, about how the WiiU audience isn't reacting to their innovative menu on screen implementation. You've seen it with Wii countless times. Then one company gets a runaway hit (Rabbids, Just Dance) and everyone and their dog runs in that direction.

Really my opinion on 3rd parties being creatively bankrupt (at least in the projects they greenlight) is solidifying itself even more these days.

Though it is funny watching them try to come up with ideas for Kinect.

They had trouble understanding a controller with a stick and buttons, no input at all?

Flopping around like Magikarp.

 

[Bluemercury]

I was wondering how powerful will the Wii U be... considering in terms of graphics power Nintendo seem to be 1 generation behind...

Nintendo Wii = PS2
Nintendo 3DS = PSP
Nintendo Wii U = Xbox 360/PS3?

This is not appliable at all in the portable consoles. Sony being Sony upped the specs of psp to match ps2 as close as possible.
NDS was akin to the N64 so it was a normal jump tech wise.
In case of home consoles it was only with the wii that Nintendo went for the underpower tech option..

 

[JGS]

All they need is a first party lineup, in HD, at launch and they can take my currency.

This is me. As long as they have their franchises near par with the other systems, they will have their hardware sales. Honestly, I'll be pretty distraught if the Wiimote goes away.

I'm still not seeing how people are deducing it's even going to be underpowered considering it'll be nearly 2 years from the time we learned about the thing before it's launched and everything they showed was tech demos to show off the controller. The graphics are fine and dandy from that bird demo they did, so I'll be happy if it achieves that which it will.

 

[word up]

I do!
I love Nintendo <3 but if they cannot produce harware on par with MS and SONY, cannot create a compelling online experience themselves (or not buying a competent company to do so), cannot make a sexy design console (more white fridges?) then I could not care less for their results. Their IPs will end up somewhere anyway.

I have to ask why every console has to be almost identical? Nintendo could do some (a lot of!) things better certainly, but is not a bit of variety a good thing?

 

[megashock5]

I have to ask why every console has to be almost identical? Nintendo could do some (a lot of!) things better certainly, but is not a bit of variety a good thing?

I've been saying this since 2006. There's actually a compelling reason to own multiple consoles this gen other than exclusive titles.

 

[TwilightPrincess]

I know that one of the IBM chip designers working on the Wii U CPU shifted to a 32nm VLSI project (GPU integration) a few months ago. Seems related, as IBM usually tries to keep the console teams seperated during development. I guess it's possible Nintendo dropped the plans to go with two discreet chips and a CPU at 45nm in favor of a 32nm SoC project, or that the 32nm VLSI isn't integrating CPU and GPU, but GPU and I/O controller instead. Either way, if Wii U related, we're probably looking at a 32nm GPU designed by AMD, IBM and Nintendo, and considering the timeline, I don't think there's any remotely final GPU to put in devkits yet.

Interesting, thanks for sharing this information and thoughts. 32 nm gpu would be a good thing, i assume. Does anyone know when publishers get the final devkits?

 

[wsippel]

Looked a bit deeper into the iGware deal, and it seems iGware and BroadOn are one and the same. Which makes the fact that Acer bought them quite a bit weirder, as Nintendo is not only a major client, it actually seems they're iGware's only client.

The whole buyout thing is strange. BroadOn/ iGware was a company founded by Wei Yen for Nintendo. Nobody really knows all that much about the company - their website tells you absolutely nothing at all, not even what business they're in. I don't remember them ever issuing a single press release, giving any interviews or attending any trade shows. They were never mentioned in any Nintendo press release, either (but their logo is on the Hollywood heat spreader). The whole company is a mystery. Then all of a sudden, Acer announces the buyout. Now why would they buy a company nobody knows, a company that seemingly only has a single customer? This is where things get interesting: Wei Yen is not only the founder of BroadOn/ iGware, he's also a member of the board at Acer. So Acer knew about the company, they knew what they were doing and who their main/ only customer is. Nintendo is supposedly happy with the buyout, and it's guaranteed they knew about the move up front, they probably even greenlighted it. But why?

 

[monome]

Why would it compete with CoD or Halo? You must be lying about liking Nintendo if you made a comment that stupid.

As a Nintendo afficionado, I must confess I have a crisis of faith.

I'm not the biggest Metroid Prime fan, it's true but I played the games on NES/SNES and Wii but was not interested in the FPS style of Prime so don't hate me and by Metroid HD I refer to a game with FPS controls and I can hardly see a Metroid HD not being pimped in some sort of way as a great MP experience on WiiU. Selling the adventure and exploration is not exactly the way marketing goes these days.

 

[monome]

I'm of the mindset that visuals are close to last on a long line of checklists I must fill to buy a console.

First and foremost it must have games that make my nether regions tingle. That's why the Wii was the first console I bought this gen.

I think it's great to go for something you lust over rather than a mere iteration of something you liked.

I am a bit alarmed at the recent news of a soon-to-be next-gen and wouldn't mind a few more years so thaht developpers are encouraged to innovate rather than play on visuals strenghts to get me interested. I was schooled in gaming by NES/SNES etc...so I do care about gameplay.

That said, money is on COD these days, and if Nintendo wants a share they have to play the game.

 

[Shin Johnpv]

I know that one of the IBM chip designers working on the Wii U CPU shifted to a 32nm VLSI project (GPU integration) a few months ago. Seems related, as IBM usually tries to keep the console teams seperated during development. I guess it's possible Nintendo dropped the plans to go with two discreet chips and a CPU at 45nm in favor of a 32nm SoC project, or that the 32nm VLSI isn't integrating CPU and GPU, but GPU and I/O controller instead. Either way, if Wii U related, we're probably looking at a 32nm GPU designed by AMD, IBM and Nintendo, and considering the timeline, I don't think there's any remotely final GPU to put in devkits yet.

Wasn't there some talk from NEC about something being fabbed at 28nm for the Wii-U?

 

[Lonely1]

Wasn't there some talk from NEC about something being fabbed at 28nm for the Wii-U?

It was about 28NM EDRAM.

 

[radioheadrule83]

Looked a bit deeper into the iGware deal, and it seems iGware and BroadOn are one and the same. Which makes the fact that Acer bought them quite a bit weirder, as Nintendo is not only a major client, it actually seems they're iGware's only client.

The whole buyout thing is strange. BroadOn/ iGware was a company founded by Wei Yen for Nintendo. Nobody really knows all that much about the company - their website tells you absolutely nothing at all, not even what business they're in. I don't remember them ever issuing a single press release, giving any interviews or attending any trade shows. They were never mentioned in any Nintendo press release, either (but their logo is on the Hollywood heat spreader). The whole company is a mystery. Then all of a sudden, Acer announces the buyout. Now why would they buy a company nobody knows, a company that seemingly only has a single customer? This is where things get interesting: Wei Yen is not only the founder of BroadOn/ iGware, he's also a member of the board at Acer. So Acer knew about the company, they knew what they were doing and who their main/ only customer is. Nintendo is supposedly happy with the buyout, and it's guaranteed they knew about the move up front, they probably even greenlighted it. But why?

Acer would be a useful friend to have. Their expertise in tablets, phones, laptops and desktops could be useful to draw on in future handheld generations for example - and if iGware has growth potential providing some kind of cloud storage solutions for Nintendo, then maybe its simply a money making investment.

 

[fabricated backlash]

Though it is funny watching them try to come up with ideas for Kinect.

They had trouble understanding a controller with a stick and buttons, no input at all?

Flopping around like Magikarp.

The problem is simple. Their business modell isn't centered around innovation. Their business model is centered around following the current trends (design and gameplay) and making carbon copies of popular concepts with different skins and Hans Zimmer Soundtracks.

You have some few publishers and developers who actually spend the time and resources into R&D and those usually deliver amazing experiences that extend to UIs as well.

I expect EA in particular to be the biggest underachiever when it comes to the tablet integration on WiiU. I actually expect some interesting ideas coming from a few Ubisoft teams, but for the most part I can see small developers on the future E-shop to actually use the tablet.

I mean watching Ken Levine talking about playing Bioshock infinite on the Tablet in Bed right next to his wife, and acting like that was some sort of amazing idea for the uses of the tablet is quite telling. As much as I love Bioshock and the world they created. If that is what excites someone who I regard as one of the more creative heads in gaming, then you know it's going to be very bleak.

 

[Luckyman]

Have what? A comment based on what was originally thought of about Wii U? Says nothing about how it will compare to the other new consoles.

LOL. Denial was funny with the Wii. Now its just..

 

[bgassassin]

V1 and V2 has the same problems with graphic card, is not that is "underclocked", the problem is that if you use all the "power" the system is unstable or freezes. But the hardware is there.

Yesterday I saw some info about V3 hw (latest) and is the same ... minor changes.

V3 is more stable right?

An old IGN article I saw indicated Wii had five dev kit versions and it sounds like Wii U is on a similar path. Any indication of when you might get V4? And you might have missed an earlier question I have (or didn't and couldn't answer), but are they currently using some generic looking box for the kit or is it something closer resembling the console?

LOL. Denial was funny with the Wii. Now its just..

Totally different situation. No one really expected Nintendo to do what they did with Wii. Most have an idea of what they are doing with Wii U.

 

[Thunder Monkey]

LOL. Denial was funny with the Wii. Now its just..

Meanwhile your schtick has never been funny.

 

[disap.ed]

Wasn't there some talk from NEC about something being fabbed at 28nm for the Wii-U?

That's what I am curious about too: This was about 1T-SRAM, but the question was if this will be memory on an external die or embedded, because the latter would mean a 28nm GPU (which doesn't fit together with the 32nm SOC idea wsippel brought up)

Actually we know nothing, the CPU could be both 45nm (original planing) or changed to 32nm (according to wsippel's source) and the GPU could be everything from 45nm (SOC acc. original planing) to 40nm (current customer GPU process) to 32nm (wsippel's SOC again) to 28nm (next years customer GPU process).

 

[P90]

Less competition is a bad thing, unless you work for Sony or MS it's stupid to root for Nintendo to fail.

Bad for the worldwide economy as well.