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[Iced_Eagle]

Umm I do not believe this to be true, I have been able to do this on android and ios for years.

Just edited my post above, but here is the link to when Apple announced it at WWDC 2015: https://9to5mac.com/2015/06/08/ipad-split-screen-multitasking/

Google did not add support until last year as part of Android N (there was a *highly* experimental version in Android M but N is when they made it non-experimental). Previous to that, multi-tasking was not part of Android itself, and was something each OEM had to implement themselves if they wanted it. If you want to include Samsung specific multi-tasking, then sure

http://www.androidauthority.com/diving-into-android-n-multitasking-678918/

Feel free to source anything to the contrary to this if you can find it, but I'm pretty sure this was *the* marquee feature of Win8 on tablets for a while, and it took years before Apple or Google were able to add support on their OS'.

 

[zewone]

My assumption is that Microsoft wants the Scorpio to unseat the Xbox One as the main selling console as soon as possible. Those Pro sales indicate that that won't be happening anytime soon for Microsoft.

On the Plus side, Microsoft has a lot of time to adjust their strategy for Scorpio in terms of marketing and messaging. Hardware is locked obviously now. Also? These sales of the Pro all but confirm that Scorpio will not sell for a single dollar above $399. No fucking chance. Anyone still legitimately believing Scorpio will be higher than $399 (for an entry model) are more than likely "hoping" for a higher price.

At $399 they would have to be selling at quite a loss for the specs they announced, no?

 

[Jumeira]

Pro numbers are pitiful for being it's 2nd month during peak season. I think Sony botched the console's marketing and the console itself. If MS does a good job of showing the difference and actively show off 3rd parties looking superior then Scorpio will sell much better during the same months. All depends if the gap can be seen though.

Extremely impressive for MS though, well done Phil.

 

[SOR5]

Pro numbers are pitiful for being it's 2nd month during peak season. I think Sony botched the console's marketing and the console itself. If MS does a good job of showing the difference and actively show off 3rd parties looking superior then Scorpio will sell much better during the same months. All depends if the gap can be seen though.

Pro was always intended to be the niche product though that's the thing, and I think in sales and purpose its serving its role well

Scorpio (I THINK) will be pushed full speed ahead on a much different and significant level the potential is much bigger but that's all it is, potential, they can still colossally fuck it up

 

[saskuatch]

That Microsoft false advertisement doing work. I wonder how many are thinking they just saved a hundred bucks and can game in 4k on their 1s over the ps4pro.

 

[DocSeuss]

It has nothing to do with "Sony fans" we have history, no console that was more expensive, has sold better then the competition just due to power. Also Worldwide scorpio won't touch the pro, so I assume you mean just US?

PS4 sold better thanks to cost, exclusive marketing, and Microsoft's early-gen boondoggle. Few people are buying PS4 because they care about 900p vs 1080p. That's a tool used in console wars; it's not why Joe Consumer picks up a console.

That Microsoft false advertisement doing work. I wonder how many are thinking they just saved a hundred bucks and can game in 4k on their 1s over the ps4pro.

While it's possible consumers are buying the Xbox One S because it's a 4K blu-ray player, this section of the market is likely quite small (4K TV sales aren't that impressive yet, so we can safely assume that 4K is not a major driver of these sales). In other words, people may buy the S because it's a 4K player, but the majority of people are more likely to be buying it because: they already own a PS4 and are finally ready to pick up an Xbox, or because the price on the Xbox has been pretty great lately.

 

[therealbigrich]

Only way for Scorpio to be successful is if it basically marketed as a new gen console without being one . Meaning you can play all the X1 games that's out but make it sound like a new start.has to be 400 cause more than that and most won't touch it even if it's powerful. Has to push at least majority 4k native games and advertise the hell out of it

 

[Hendrick's]

PS4 Pro sales seem realistic if not higher than the ratio of those with 4K tvs vs 1080P sets. There is zero marketing on the pro (or any actual significant benefit) that would convince most without a 4K tv to pick one up.

 

[Bustanen]

Pro numbers are pitiful for being it's 2nd month during peak season. I think Sony botched the console's marketing and the console itself. If MS does a good job of showing the difference and actively show off 3rd parties looking superior then Scorpio will sell much better during the same months. All depends if the gap can be seen though.

Extremely impressive for MS though, well done Phil.

But what games will they show off? All major 3rd party games this fall have a marketing deal with Sony (presumably).

 

[cakely]

My assumption is that Microsoft wants the Scorpio to unseat the Xbox One as the main selling console as soon as possible. Those Pro sales indicate that that won't be happening anytime soon for Microsoft.

On the Plus side, Microsoft has a lot of time to adjust their strategy for Scorpio in terms of marketing and messaging. Hardware is locked obviously now. Also? These sales of the Pro all but confirm that Scorpio will not sell for a single dollar above $399. No fucking chance. Anyone still legitimately believing Scorpio will be higher than $399 (for an entry model) are more than likely "hoping" for a higher price.

Yep, I agree with you here, 100%.

 

[saskuatch]

PS4 sold better thanks to cost, exclusive marketing, and Microsoft's early-gen boondoggle. Few people are buying PS4 because they care about 900p vs 1080p. That's a tool used in console wars; it's not why Joe Consumer picks up a console.



While it's possible consumers are buying the Xbox One S because it's a 4K blu-ray player, this section of the market is likely quite small (4K TV sales aren't that impressive yet, so we can safely assume that 4K is not a major driver of these sales). In other words, people may buy the S because it's a 4K player, but the majority of people are more likely to be buying it because: they already own a PS4 and are finally ready to pick up an Xbox, or because the price on the Xbox has been pretty great lately.

not talking about the UHD player, if you seen any 1s commercials on TV it seems like the games will be in 4K at 100 bucks cheaper than ps4pro

 

[DocSeuss]

Only way for Scorpio to be successful is if it basically marketed as a new gen console without being one . Meaning you can play all the X1 games that's out but make it sound like a new start.has to be 400 cause more than that and most won't touch it even if it's powerful. Has to push at least majority 4k native games and advertise the hell out of it

I'd be really surprised if Microsoft described it as a new gen console since their messsaging is about console gens being over. They want to emphasize the software platform instead of the hardware one. They're likely to push the backwards compatibility angle, given its success on Xbox One so far. $400 is the likely price point, 8 TF isn't an unreasonable power assumption, and 4K... may take a back seat? Probably won't, but it might because that didn't work so well for PS4 Pro, and 4K TV adoption isn't as high as manufacturers would like right now. Discussion/consumer sentiment on 4K has somewhat cooled.

But what games will they show off? All major 3rd party games this fall have a marketing deal with Sony (presumably).

Stuff you don't know about. Unannounced games. Will likely be seeing some third party games demoed/announced on Scorpio. Microsoft has always announced somethin new at their E3 conferences, yeah? There's no reason to assume they won't have something new to show this year. You also said "presumably," but like... you don't really know, right? We do know that Microsoft has a partnership with, for instance, EA with Battlefield One. Microsoft doesn't have crucial Destiny/Assassin's Creed/Call of Duty/Grand Theft Auto partnerships this time, which is definitely not an enviable position to be in, but they do/have had partnerships, so there's no reason to assume they won't have any this year.

not talking about the UHD player, if you seen any 1s commercials on TV it seems like the games will be in 4K at 100 bucks cheaper than ps4pro

Yeah, that messaging isn't selling Xbox Ones.

 

[hanspampel]

nvm was i first page post i replied to ...

 

[onemanasylum]

Pro numbers are pitiful for being it's 2nd month during peak season. I think Sony botched the console's marketing and the console itself. If MS does a good job of showing the difference and actively show off 3rd parties looking superior then Scorpio will sell much better during the same months. All depends if the gap can be seen though.

Extremely impressive for MS though, well done Phil.

How is it extremely impressive for MS and not Sony? I don't think you understand what pro and scorpio are aimed at, even Spencer will tell you it's the high end, hard core gamer.

PS4 sold better thanks to cost, exclusive marketing, and Microsoft's early-gen boondoggle. Few people are buying PS4 because they care about 900p vs 1080p. That's a tool used in console wars; it's not why Joe Consumer picks up a console.



While it's possible consumers are buying the Xbox One S because it's a 4K blu-ray player, this section of the market is likely quite small (4K TV sales aren't that impressive yet, so we can safely assume that 4K is not a major driver of these sales). In other words, people may buy the S because it's a 4K player, but the majority of people are more likely to be buying it because: they already own a PS4 and are finally ready to pick up an Xbox, or because the price on the Xbox has been pretty great lately.

Yeah, that's what I said, you agreed with me..

 

[SOR5]

I'd be really surprised if Microsoft described it as a new gen console since their messsaging is about console gens being over. They want to emphasize the software platform instead of the hardware one. They're likely to push the backwards compatibility angle, given its success on Xbox One so far. $400 is the likely price point, 8 TF isn't an unreasonable power assumption, and 4K... may take a back seat? Probably won't, but it might because that didn't work so well for PS4 Pro, and 4K TV adoption isn't as high as manufacturers would like right now. Discussion/consumer sentiment on 4K has somewhat cooled.



Stuff you don't know about.

I really reaaaaally see things being vaguely simplified into just 'Xbox'

Especially their presence on PC

 

[zewone]

$400 is the likely price point, 8 TF isn't an unreasonable power assumption

6TFs at $400 will be tough for them and you're expecting 8TFs at $400? Not going to happen.

 

[GazzaGSi]

Hmm Pro numbers seem quite positive to me when it was up against the Slim that was bundled with a game or 2 for nearly half the price.
If they really want to push the Pro now, give it a bit of a discount and chuck a game in with it preferably a 'pro enhanced' title.

 

[Chris1]

. Also? These sales of the Pro all but confirm that Scorpio will not sell for a single dollar above $399. No fucking chance. Anyone still legitimately believing Scorpio will be higher than $399 (for an entry model) are more than likely "hoping" for a higher price.

yup

It's gonna be 399

 

[onemanasylum]

People keep going on about marketing...Sony has not started marketing it yet, it's early, they have no competition....they will, when scorpio is out and pro will be cheaper with a big third party game. 4k is still a tiny piece of the market yet.

 

[DocSeuss]

6TFs at $400 will be tough for them and you're expecting 8TFs at $400? Not going to happen.

I'm like... 60% certain that's the target they want to hit, yes.

How is it extremely impressive for MS and not Sony? I don't think you understand what pro and scorpio are aimed at, even Spencer will tell you it's the high end, hard core gamer.

Yeah, that's what I said, you agreed with me..

I misread you, sorry. I didn't parse your sentence structure.

I assume it's impressive for MS because they're perceived as doing poorly, so catching up in sales terms is pretty impressive for them. Sony doing well isn't surprising, because they've been doing well. MS improving is much harder to accomplish.

 

[onemanasylum]

I'm like... 60% certain that's the target they want to hit, yes.

It's OK to want things, but that's not reality, based on available parts and cost.

 

[King_Moc]

Yeah, I'm UK based and haven't seen any ads for it anywhere. If I didn't frequent gaming sites, I'd never have known it exists.

I think they've correctly assumed that they don't need to do traditional adverts for it. They've said they're after the PC crowd. Have you ever seen Nvidia advertising graphics cards on TV or at bus stops? Nope, their customers are generally informed enough to not need that kind of thing.

 

[GazzaGSi]

People keep going on about marketing...Sony has not started marketing it yet, it's early, they have no competition....they will, when scorpio is out and pro will be cheaper with a big third party game. 4k is still a tony piece of the market yet.

Yup, it's funny because in the lead up to Christmas I kept seeing PS adverts on TV starting with "the world's best selling console has been upgraded!" and I thought oh nice a Pro advert, then it would carry on with "slimmer, lighter etc" and it would an advert for the Slim.

 

[DocSeuss]

It's OK to want things, but that's not reality, based on available parts and cost.

If you'd like to show me a tech breakdown that explains why this is not possible, I'm happy to change my opinion on this, but I currently am leaning towards MS targeting 8 TF.

 

[onemanasylum]

If you'd like to show me a tech breakdown that explains why this is not possible, I'm happy to change my opinion on this, but I currently am leaning towards MS targeting 8 TF.

I am not using google for you, AMD's roadmap is out there. You are not getting 8 TF for 400, even 6 more be tough.

 

[Electret]

I'm like... 60% certain that's the target they want to hit, yes.

You've strained credulity so far with your recent posts on console sales outside the US (again, the PS4 has sold more outside it and the UK than in those countries) that I fail to see why anyone would take this post seriously.

If you'd like to show me a tech breakdown that explains why this is not possible, I'm happy to change my opinion on this, but I currently am leaning towards MS targeting 8 TF.

I'd say the burden of explanation is on you since you're the one that made the claim.

 

[CosmicQueso]

These sales of the Pro all but confirm that Scorpio will not sell for a single dollar above $399. No fucking chance. Anyone still legitimately believing Scorpio will be higher than $399 (for an entry model) are more than likely "hoping" for a higher price.

Truth. Truth that will be argued against and mocked. But truth nonetheless.

 

[Dee Dah Dave]

We at 8TF now? lol. Along with Zen CPU's and god knows what else.

Some possible clock tuning might get it to 6.5TF or so but anything else ain't happening.

OT- those Pro numbers are lower than I would have thought. But then there's 3 consoles to choose from, and soon to be 5...

 

[DocSeuss]

I am not using google for you, AMD's roadmap is out there. You are not getting 8 TF for 400, even 6 more be tough.

There's a potential for Scorpio to be using Vega, if so, this won't be an issue.

You've strained credulity so far with your recent posts on console sales outside the US (again, the PS4 has sold more outside it and the UK than in those countries) that I fail to see why anyone would take this post seriously.

I'd say the burden of explanation is on you since you're the one that made the claim.

I don't care whether or not people believe me. Since onemanasylum brought up "parts and cost," I figured he had more concrete info, and I was interested in seeing it. This isn't about proving anything. It's just information I'm interested in reading.

 

[zewone]

If you'd like to show me a tech breakdown that explains why this is not possible, I'm happy to change my opinion on this, but I currently am leaning towards MS targeting 8 TF.

Parts cost money.

Faster, more powerful parts cost more money.

Your ignorance of prices of components won't make your dreams a reality.

an 8TF machine at $400 would be sold at an incredible loss and would be horrible business for a company looking to make money.

 

[onemanasylum]

There's a potential for Scorpio to be using Vega, if so, this won't be an issue.

It won't be 400 then....you understand cost right? Better components cost more, why am I discussing with a guy who thinks US > rest of the world by a wide margin....I should know better.

 

[kadotsu]

60% certainty on a binary decision, lol.

 

[gundamkyoukai]

Truth. Truth that will be argued against and mocked. But truth nonetheless.

Well MS can always act crazy or go for the slow burn since they want to do away with gens .

 

[Beer Monkey]

I would have bought a Pro this season if it supported 4K Blu-Ray.

 

[Elandyll]

My assumption is that Microsoft wants the Scorpio to unseat the Xbox One as the main selling console as soon as possible. Those Pro sales indicate that that won't be happening anytime soon for Microsoft.

On the Plus side, Microsoft has a lot of time to adjust their strategy for Scorpio in terms of marketing and messaging. Hardware is locked obviously now. Also? These sales of the Pro all but confirm that Scorpio will not sell for a single dollar above $399. No fucking chance. Anyone still legitimately believing Scorpio will be higher than $399 (for an entry model) are more than likely "hoping" for a higher price.

It's not a matter of hoping, it's plain old logic.

The Pro is a nice step above a PS4, but with a very close architecture, a barely improved CPU (just a higher clock afaik) and 1 GB of "slow" ram.
With a 4.2TF GPU, we get a $399 machine (with a 1Tb HDD drive, and no 4K UHD drive).

The Scorpio, on paper, is a lot more ambitious in spite of still being, in theory, still part of the XB1 family.
The GPU jumps to 6TF (around a 980Ti, which right now retails at around $500ish I believe?), a "much" stronger CPU, more ram (12Gb?), possibly fast one, and of course a 4K UHD drive.

$399 would be with subsides, I have no doubt, and would go contrary to the idea of a premium console on which you should make money because the "mass market" is your entry level low cost product.

With the described and "expected" specs, a $499 just plain makes sense tbh.

 

[Papacheeks]

yup

It's gonna be 399

I think at this point it has to be 399$. I think the market data just proved what people are willing to pay.

If this thing comes in over $399 it is dead in the water no matter how premium it is.

 

[zewone]

It's not a matter of hoping, it's plain old logic.

The Pro is a nice step above a PS4, but with a very close architecture, a barely improved CPU (just a higher clock afaik) and 1 GB of "slow" ram.
With a 4.2TF GPU, we get a $399 machine (with a 1Tb HDD drive, and no 4K UHD drive).

The Scorpio, on paper, is a lot more ambitious in spite of still being, in theory, still part of the XB1 family.
The GPU jumps to 6TF (around a 980Ti, which right now retails at around $500ish I believe?), a "much" stronger CPU, more ram (12Gb?), possibly fast one, and of course a 4K UHD drive.

$399 would be with subsides, I have no doubt, and would go contrary to the idea of a premium console on which you should make money because the "mass market" is your entry level low cost product.

With the described and "expected" specs, a $499 just plain makes sense tbh.

Yes.

They're either going to have lower their initial target of 6TFs to hit $400 or charge $500 to get the 6TFs.

Or sell at quite the loss.

 

[Heshinsi]

Ghad dayum Pro is a bomba for the ages. That is fucking abysmal for December, like worse than Wii U bad.

Thirty percent of PS4 sales come from NA. Sony sold 1.5M consoles in the USA for Dec and sold over 6M WW. Reign in that hyperbole lol.

 

[Dre3001]

I honestly think the Scorpio is going to sell even worse than the Pro.

The pro is an amazing machine but the majority of people out there are finally upgrading to 1080p TV sets much less a 4K set.

 

[Papacheeks]

I honestly think the Scorpio is going to sell even worse than the Pro.

The pro is an amazing machine but the majority of people out there are finally upgrading to 1080p TV sets much less a 4K set.

And the fact Xbox division is putting all it's cards on the table with that is what worries me the most.

If Scorpio doesn't do well, XBox division will get even tighter on budget and less games outside of Forza, Halo, gears will get green-lighted.

 

[DocSeuss]

Parts cost money.

Faster, more powerful parts cost more money.

Your ignorance of prices of components won't make your dreams a reality.

an 8TF machine at $400 would be sold at an incredible loss and would be horrible business for a company looking to make money.

It won't be 400 then....you understand cost right? Better components cost more, why am I discussing with a guy who thinks US > rest of the world by a wide margin....I should know better.

I know things. Whether you believe me or not is up to you. I think Microsoft currently wants to target 8TF and $400 USD. I'm not sure they can achieve it, but I think that's their current goal. Hence the 60% certainty.

 

[BibiMaghoo]

$400 is the likely price point, 8 TF isn't an unreasonable power assumption

I agree that is likely the price point, however the latter part is very much unreasonable. That is putting it mildly. A GPU alone that approaches that figure is more than $400. It is completely unrealistic unless you expect them to take a hit on every single console sold.

 

[Bustanen]

Thirty percent of PS4 sales come from NA. Sony sold 1.5M consoles in the USA for Dec and sold over 6M WW. Reign in that hyperbole lol.

6M was Nov+Dec.

 

[onemanasylum]

I know things. Whether you believe me or not is up to you. I think Microsoft currently wants to target 8TF and $400 USD. I'm not sure they can achieve it, but I think that's their current goal. Hence the 60% certainty.

I know things too...how big is the rest of the world bro? 60% of the US?

 

[TetraGenesis]

So whats this Scorpio meme? Can someone please explain.

What is this meme?

Noted Xbox enthusiast Statham entered a thread about PS4 maybe a month ago and posted "Scorpio" just like that with no context or punctuation, almost like a threat or a warning, and everybody lost their shit over how funny and random it was. It's been a meme ever since.

I don't think Sony is very happy with those Pro numbers from a return on investment perspective. I hope they realize next gen that they don't need a mid-gen upgrade.

I hope they realize they do! I love the new concept mid-gen upgrades. Very pleased with my Pro and I'll enjoy Scorpio as well.

If Scorpio is priced at $400 and if the system automatically upgrades XB1 titles in some way (unlike Pro which needs a patch) then I could see a lot of Xbone users jumping over.

You're kidding yourself if you think that'll happen. There are technological reasons that a patch is necessary. It's one thing for an almost imperceptible bump like the XB1>XB1S, but if you think every XB1 game is gonna suddenly run unlocked on a console almost three times as powerful without any developmental oversight, you're going to be sorely disappointed.

 

[zewone]

I honestly think the Scorpio is going to sell even worse than the Pro.

It most certainly will.

Scorpio will launch at $400 or $500.

Pro's price will be cheaper by then.

 

[Chobel]

I know things. Whether you believe me or not is up to you. I think Microsoft currently wants to target 8TF and $400 USD. I'm not sure they can achieve it, but I think that's their current goal. Hence the 60% certainty.

You're insider now?

 

[Jaguar Victory]

How many times does it have to be said? Mass market doesn't care about 400-500 niche products if there is a 200 euro product already in the market that plays the same games.

Right. That's why new iPhones sell so shitty when people have old phones that can browse the web and make calls.

 

[kadotsu]

Right. That's why new iPhones sell so shitty when people have old phones that can browse the web and make calls.

How many iPhones are bought outside of a contract?

 

[BigPapi]

It's not a matter of hoping, it's plain old logic.

The Pro is a nice step above a PS4, but with a very close architecture, a barely improved CPU (just a higher clock afaik) and 1 GB of "slow" ram.
With a 4.2TF GPU, we get a $399 machine (with a 1Tb HDD drive, and no 4K UHD drive).

The Scorpio, on paper, is a lot more ambitious in spite of still being, in theory, still part of the XB1 family.
The GPU jumps to 6TF (around a 980Ti, which right now retails at around $500ish I believe?), a "much" stronger CPU, more ram (12Gb?), possibly fast one, and of course a 4K UHD drive.

$399 would be with subsides, I have no doubt, and would go contrary to the idea of a premium console on which you should make money because the "mass market" is your entry level low cost product.

With the described and "expected" specs, a $499 just plain makes sense tbh.

Considering this machine will most likely use an AMD chip 6TF is doable considering the RX 480 is 5.5 TF retails $199.99

The Scorpio is coming a full year after the PRO one year changes everything when it comes to tech. At $399 I expect 6 TF with not having a substantial subsidy yet if they go at a higher pricepoint I suspect 8 TF at $499 is not impossible.